On 3 Mar 2007 10:37:18 -0800, "Day Brown" wrote:


I've tried the 900mhz wireless transceiver. which needs a clear LOS
(Line of Sight). I like living in the woods; and I'm not going to
clearcut just so I can get a clear line of sight to the ISP
transmitter tower. Hello?

For usable throughput at reasonable power you definitively need the
LOS path.

To get LOS, all you need is to move your antenna high enough. Towers
up to several hundred meters high are available commercially. Less
reliable solutions are flying the antenna under a kite or a balloon.

If this is too expensive, I would suggest moving to a more densely
populated area. You will have to find an optimum for the cost_of_land
+ cost_of_telecommunication.

As others have suggested, it might be enough if you have a LOS path to
your neighbour and they have a LOS path to their neighbour and finally
one neighbour have LOS contact to the ISP.

One other solution would be to move a repeater to a hilltop visible
both from your site and from the ISP, but there is the problem of
powering it. Solar cells might be an option, unless you live North of
the Arctic circle or the sky is cloudy all the time.

A passive reflector at the hilltop might also be possible, but this
will require very narrow beams, which will require large antennas at
both ends of the link, in practice in the upper microwave bands or
even IR or visible light. However, at these frequencies clouds etc.
will disrupt the communication.

Paul OH3LWR

Of course, I already had the power strip. My point was that the power
supply was designed by engineers who didnt think about where it would
be used. I have other power supplies, like for the printer and scanner
that have both input and output cords that dont crowd out anything
else on your UPS.

And of course, part of the reason I ended up living out here was that
it was so cheap. Even now, land can be had for less than 1000$/acre.
Hardly any of the real estate ads are for homes & property over 250k.
Lotsa other old hippies in the woods who never made much money, never
will, but we can afford to live here.

There's lotsa 34 ft TV antenna masts laying around behind the barns
since folks put in the dish TV. Lotsa 12' foot booms for Yagis too, to
be had for scrap metal prices.

I can see where you all with your licenses and equipment mite be
worried about the FCC, but not out here. Its 100 miles to Little Rock
if you wanna take a Ham exam. Why should the bureacrats runnin the FCC
these days be any more competent than those running FEMA or The VA?
And if I make this thing cheap enuf, there wont be any *money* in it
for them coming out to get me. My ass aint worth anything, and I dont
have clear title to the land. All they'd get would be 20$ worth of
scrap metal.

Back when we used CB radios to talk to each other, we bitched to the
FCC about jerks in urban areas putting *1000* watts on a CB channel.
Where was the FCC then? No, man, out here, we are off the radar map. I
dont expect any help from the Arkansas public service either. We dont
have the votes, and we dont have the money, so they dont care what we
do.

The way electonic parts prices have fallen, it'll prolly cost me more
to put up the antennas. And without a tuned yagi, none of the
commercial tuners will pick up anything. If anyone has a more
appropriate forum to raise these questions in, I'd be grateful, and
quit bothering you.

"Day Brown" wrote in message
s.com...
My point was that the power
supply was designed by engineers who didnt think about where it would
be used.

I very much doubt that -- it's much more likely they simply decided that
saving a little money was worth more than adding a little user convenience.

And if I make this thing cheap enuf, there wont be any *money* in it
for them coming out to get me.

Again, I disagree. If you make it so cheap it really catches on, sooner or
later it *will* be used in an area such that it intereferes with someone with
deep pockets and you'll get sucked into a lawsuit. If you're going to so
flagrantly ignore FCC regulations, you should simply publish *plans* for your
design so that you can't personally be convicted of selling non-type-accepted
equipment... unless you do want to have bars for windows for some time. :-)

Back when we used CB radios to talk to each other, we bitched to the
FCC about jerks in urban areas putting *1000* watts on a CB channel.
Where was the FCC then? No, man, out here, we are off the radar map.

The FCC does still routinely bust retailers for selling CB band linear
amplifiers and rigs that can transmit outside the CB frequencies.

I still think your best bet it to use 2.4GHz WiFi gear linked "house to house"
with cheap dish antennas on towers. Get that amateur radio license and you
can legally run enough power that you'll easily make the distances, and no one
will question why it is you're buying, e.g., 10W 2.4GHz amplifiers. Those
dish antennas are probably going to be a lot cheaper than a bunch of Yagis
anyway...

---Joel

Joel Kolstad wrote:
I still think your best bet it to use 2.4GHz WiFi gear linked "house to house"
with cheap dish antennas on towers. Get that amateur radio license and you
can legally run enough power that you'll easily make the distances, and no one
will question why it is you're buying, e.g., 10W 2.4GHz amplifiers. Those
dish antennas are probably going to be a lot cheaper than a bunch of Yagis
anyway...

The FCC allows 4 watts EIRP for fixed point to point WiFi links. At 2.4gHz
this is a lot of power, usually created by focusing the output of a
regular router or similar device with a small dish or Yagi.

For example, the well publicised "Pringles Can" antenna can be easily
modified to put out that much from a 100mw source. You need line of site,
but if you figure a two routers, antennas, wires, etc can be purchased in the
U.S. for less than $200, you can set up a whole relay system.

The latency will be much too high for VoIP and video conferencing, but
websurfing and file downloading would be fine.

Geoff.

--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel N3OWJ/4X1GM
IL Voice: (07)-7424-1667 Fax ONLY: 972-2-648-1443 U.S. Voice: 1-215-821-1838
Visit my 'blog at http://geoffstechno.livejournal.com/

On Mar 6, 8:07 pm, "Joel Kolstad"
wrote:
"Day Brown" wrote in message

s.com...

My point was that the power
supply was designed by engineers who didnt think about where it would
be used.

I very much doubt that -- it's much more likely they simply decided that
saving a little money was worth more than adding a little user convenience.

And if I make this thing cheap enuf, there wont be any *money* in it
for them coming out to get me.

Again, I disagree. If you make it so cheap it really catches on, sooner or
later it *will* be used in an area such that it intereferes with someone with
deep pockets and you'll get sucked into a lawsuit. If you're going to so
flagrantly ignore FCC regulations, you should simply publish *plans* for your
design so that you can't personally be convicted of selling non-type-accepted
equipment... unless you do want to have bars for windows for some time. :-)

Back when we used CB radios to talk to each other, we bitched to the
FCC about jerks in urban areas putting *1000* watts on a CB channel.
Where was the FCC then? No, man, out here, we are off the radar map.

The FCC does still routinely bust retailers for selling CB band linear
amplifiers and rigs that can transmit outside the CB frequencies.

I still think your best bet it to use 2.4GHz WiFi gear linked "house to house"
with cheap dish antennas on towers. Get that amateur radio license and you
can legally run enough power that you'll easily make the distances, and no one
will question why it is you're buying, e.g., 10W 2.4GHz amplifiers. Those
dish antennas are probably going to be a lot cheaper than a bunch of Yagis
anyway...
Even if its cheap, it aint *easy*. a 180 mhz Yagi on a 30 foot pole
compared to the soup can users would take to in shorter range high
density regions where they need more channels.

But in any case, whether you all know the technical issues or not, I'm
not going to get that feedback here, so I'll quit bothering you.
My address is 1984 Kirkendoll rd, Clinton AR, 72031. you have my email
addy. send it to the FCC for all I care. That's how much I think they
will give **** what goes on out here. Besides, there is a whole world
out there of remote areas that are not served well beyond the reach,
whatever that is, of the FCC or their ass kissing agenda to big media.
It this takes off, by the time the FCC figures it out, it'll be like
trying to get CB users to register. snurk

Hi Day,

"Day Brown" wrote in message
ps.com...
My address is 1984 Kirkendoll rd, Clinton AR, 72031. you have my email
addy.

That doesn't appear to be nearly so much in the "boonies" as I would have
thought. As the crow flies you're only something like 5 miles from I-65,
right? I'd predict that within a decade you'll be able to come up with some
reasonably high-speed, reasonably cheap solution based on the cell service
providers rolling out high-speed data services along the interstate there, if
you don't already have the option of getting a cable modem or DSL just as soon
if you're willing to pay for the cable back to highway 16.

---Joel