wrote:

I became a ham at age 13, mostly through what I learned from ARRL
books. The big attraction was that Radio in general and Amateur Radio
in particular looked like a lot of fun to me. And for more than 40
years, it has been.

Me too. But I do think that we have increased competition these days
from other outlets for prospective hams, and other things that "look
like a lot of fun". Computers and such gadgets are a part of daily life
for young folks these days; it's only natural that they gravitate in
that direction. I suspect that the vast majority of them have not been
exposed to ham radio at all.

I had a good buddy when I was that age who was interested in radio and
electronics, and peer pressure being what it is, I followed his lead.
Those people are fewer these days.

I think there is a sense that, back in the Old Days, there were young
hams (high school and younger) all over the place. In my experience as
a young ham (1960s-70s), however, that was not the case at all. Ham
radio was a niche thing back then, same as now, even without
computers, cell phones, etc.

Yes, I agree. I do remember more young hams back then, though. It was
mostly a hobby for older people, but I do think there were more young
hams then.

There were a few curmudgeons back then who had no time for young hams.
But they were only a few. And a considerable number of young hams
dropped out because equipment was expensive, antennas were huge
compared to their houses, and/or they got interested in other things.

A considerable number of old hams dropped out for similar reasons,
sometimes providing a source of equipment for the new folks.

One big "hook", for me was that except for those few curmudgeons I was
not treated as an inferior - particularly on the air. A big part of
this was due to the mode I used - Morse Code. With Morse Code (and
text modes), no one knows your age or gender unless you tell them.
Operating skill, QSO content and signal quality established one's on-
air reputation, not how deep or gravelly your voice was.

This was a very important consideration for me, too. Even for the
operation that I did on phone, by and large people treated me as an
equal, and if I demonstrated skill they recognized that skill without
regard to my age. Even in traditional in-person interactions like club
meetings and Field Day operations, I was treated as an equal if I could
demonstrate that I deserved to be treated that way. Generally speaking
the local ham community was eager to reach out and teach me if it was
obvious that I needed teaching.

I can't think of another hobby where I could have gained access to such
a community of people who were often peers of my parents.

To speculate wildly, it might be that one cause for curmudgeon-ness is
the fear of what advancements/accomplishments the young folks might
actually make.

I think you give this segment of our hobby too much credit grin.

There are always going to be folks who simply have no social skills or
prefer not to deal with "kids". There will be people who enjoy building
or experimenting, but they have no desire to interact with other humans.
That's their prerogative.

It's a shame when they make newcomers feel unwelcome, but it's going to
happen in any group. Other members in the group must compensate.

The core value of Amateur Radio is "radio for its own sake". Some
folks get that, most do not. The task is to spread that word to all,
publicize the wide variety of things hams do, welcome those who are
interested, and help them with what *they* find interesting.

Spreading the word is more important these days than ever before. We
can't expect people to become interested in something that they don't
know exists.

Oddly enough, a lot of the young hams I have met are fascinated by
Morse Code, simply because it is unique and outside their experience.
That doesn't mean it's the only thing to show them, or that all new
hams must start out one and only one way. But it does mean we cannot
assume young hams are only interested in "new" things.

But CW is new to them. It's different. Unique.

Ham radio is never going to appeal to everyone. Never has; never will.
The majority of people, young and old, tend to go with what has the
interest of the mainstream. Hams have always been somewhat "different",
and the hobby has always appealed to a segment of the population that
wasn't interested in doing whatever the fashionable thing might be at
the moment.

Some ideas:

1) Presentations at the middle-school and even elementary-school level
- including the parents.

Getting the teachers involved would be ideal. Teachers are an
incredibly important influence on their students.

2) Identify local hams who are available to be Elmers. (I suspect that
some of the curmudgeon-ness is due to the fear of being expected to be
an Elmer).

This is indeed key. It's what made the hobby so important for me as a
younger ham.

3) Subtle helps to prospective young hams, such as a ride to a club
meeting, Field Day or hamfest, the loan of a rig, the gift of a box of
"old wire" that happens to contain all the parts needed to build an
antenna, etc.

And the help to actually put it together.

4) Inclusion and acceptance. This means being considered an equal, or
at least a potential equal. For example, put new hams or prospective
hams to work with FD setup, logging, etc. (That means knowing how to
do things the right way, though!)

I do think this is the most important aspect. I'm not suggesting that
we coddle people simply because they are young, or fawn over them. But
we should give them the opportunity to contribute as equals, with
appropriate encouragement and assistance. Breaking into the "old boys'
network" can be impossible if the old boys don't make an effort to be
inclusive.

73, Steve KB9X

Steve Bonine wrote:
wrote:

I became a ham at age 13, mostly through what I learned from ARRL
books. The big attraction was that Radio in general and Amateur Radio
in particular looked like a lot of fun to me. And for more than 40
years, it has been.

Me too. But I do think that we have increased competition these days
from other outlets for prospective hams, and other things that "look
like a lot of fun". Computers and such gadgets are a part of daily life
for young folks these days; it's only natural that they gravitate in
that direction. I suspect that the vast majority of them have not been
exposed to ham radio at all.

You have to admit that there were always things which looked like a lot
of fun. In our day it was guitars, skateboards, stereo equipment,
photography, sports and GIRLS. Not many of us were exposed to amateur
radio in terms of percentages of young people.

I had a good buddy when I was that age who was interested in radio and
electronics, and peer pressure being what it is, I followed his lead.
Those people are fewer these days.

I had an old Zenith tabletop radio with shortwave which covered 5.5 to
18 MHz. I used it initially to listen to broadcast radio. Then I
discovered the shortwave broadcasters and finally the 40 and 20m hams
using AM. Luckily for me, I heard a ham who was in our town and he lit
the fire for me.

I think there is a sense that, back in the Old Days, there were young
hams (high school and younger) all over the place. In my experience as
a young ham (1960s-70s), however, that was not the case at all. Ham
radio was a niche thing back then, same as now, even without
computers, cell phones, etc.

Yes, I agree. I do remember more young hams back then, though. It was
mostly a hobby for older people, but I do think there were more young
hams then.

There were lots of young hams and young SWLs who were interested in
becoming hams. They read Pop'tronics and EI. Most of the Novices I
worked were in my age group. K8CFT administered Novice exams to a
number of junior high and high school aged boys. At one time, the
little town of Oak Hill, West Virginia (population 7,000) boasted seven
young Novices along with six or seven higher class radio amateurs. Of
those seven hams, five are still licensed and active. One dropped out
of amateur radio and one (who was active) died last year. The key was
that *we were interested*. No one can make someone spend his leisure
hours doing something in which he has no interest.

There were a few curmudgeons back then who had no time for young hams.
But they were only a few. And a considerable number of young hams
dropped out because equipment was expensive, antennas were huge
compared to their houses, and/or they got interested in other things.

A considerable number of old hams dropped out for similar reasons,
sometimes providing a source of equipment for the new folks.

Quite a number of those who were teenage hams dropped out because of
their interest in girls or cars or because they went off to college and
had no room for antennas and rigs or no time due to studying. Many of
them returned to amateur radio. Many got married and started families
and returned to ham radio. Most never left amateur radio but their
activity varied.

One big "hook", for me was that except for those few curmudgeons I was
not treated as an inferior - particularly on the air. A big part of
this was due to the mode I used - Morse Code. With Morse Code (and
text modes), no one knows your age or gender unless you tell them.
Operating skill, QSO content and signal quality established one's on-
air reputation, not how deep or gravelly your voice was.

This was a very important consideration for me, too. Even for the
operation that I did on phone, by and large people treated me as an
equal, and if I demonstrated skill they recognized that skill without
regard to my age. Even in traditional in-person interactions like club
meetings and Field Day operations, I was treated as an equal if I could
demonstrate that I deserved to be treated that way. Generally speaking
the local ham community was eager to reach out and teach me if it was
obvious that I needed teaching.

In my first few years there was no real ham community in my area. I
depended upon the support and largess of a number of individuals. A
move to Miami in 1966 exposed me to amateur radio clubs--some of them
quite large. I can't think of many areas where a young person can be
treated as an equal by a banker, an attorney, a doctor, the fellow who
runs the local water company or the man who operates his own gas station.

I can't think of another hobby where I could have gained access to such
a community of people who were often peers of my parents.

Exactly.

To speculate wildly, it might be that one cause for curmudgeon-ness is
the fear of what advancements/accomplishments the young folks might
actually make.

I think you give this segment of our hobby too much credit grin.

You never know when you might have a young Bill Gates visiting your
amateur radio club.

There are always going to be folks who simply have no social skills or
prefer not to deal with "kids". There will be people who enjoy building
or experimenting, but they have no desire to interact with other humans.
That's their prerogative.

Thankfully, most of them aren't hams. Ham radio is all about
interaction with other humans. I've met a few reclusive or squirrelly
or curmudgeonly radio amateurs over the years, but their number is small.

It's a shame when they make newcomers feel unwelcome, but it's going to
happen in any group. Other members in the group must compensate.

I think that in a club situation the other members see it happening and
do step in to balance things.

The core value of Amateur Radio is "radio for its own sake". Some
folks get that, most do not. The task is to spread that word to all,
publicize the wide variety of things hams do, welcome those who are
interested, and help them with what *they* find interesting.

Spreading the word is more important these days than ever before. We
can't expect people to become interested in something that they don't
know exists.

That's what I liked about the Jay Leno texting versus Morse piece of a
couple of years back. It gave exposure to amateur radio in a fun way.

Oddly enough, a lot of the young hams I have met are fascinated by
Morse Code, simply because it is unique and outside their experience.
That doesn't mean it's the only thing to show them, or that all new
hams must start out one and only one way. But it does mean we cannot
assume young hams are only interested in "new" things.

But CW is new to them. It's different. Unique.

You've got a point.

Ham radio is never going to appeal to everyone. Never has; never will.
The majority of people, young and old, tend to go with what has the
interest of the mainstream. Hams have always been somewhat "different",
and the hobby has always appealed to a segment of the population that
wasn't interested in doing whatever the fashionable thing might be at
the moment.

When I was licensed, I was living in a remote West Virginia mountain
town. Long distance telephone calls were expensive. We received three
TV stations only via cable. Listening to Bruce Bradley on WABC or Dick
Biondi on WLS meant contact with the rest of the world. Books brought
the world to my door and amateur radio meant that I could use a rather
primitive radio station in my bedroom to contact another fellow
operating from his basement in France, an outbuilding in Russia or a
from a stucco house in Chile.

Some ideas:

1) Presentations at the middle-school and even elementary-school level
- including the parents.

Getting the teachers involved would be ideal. Teachers are an
incredibly important influence on their students.

Think back: Some kids do everything the teacher tells them. Some kids
do everything except what the teacher tells them. I've had very good
teachers and I've had dreadful teachers.

2) Identify local hams who are available to be Elmers. (I suspect that
some of the curmudgeon-ness is due to the fear of being expected to be
an Elmer).

This is indeed key. It's what made the hobby so important for me as a
younger ham.

I'll assist any young person who wants to become a ham--as long as they
don't call me an "Elmer".

3) Subtle helps to prospective young hams, such as a ride to a club
meeting, Field Day or hamfest, the loan of a rig, the gift of a box of
"old wire" that happens to contain all the parts needed to build an
antenna, etc.

And the help to actually put it together.

....and the patience to demonstrate proper operation.

4) Inclusion and acceptance. This means being considered an equal, or
at least a potential equal. For example, put new hams or prospective
hams to work with FD setup, logging, etc. (That means knowing how to
do things the right way, though!)

I do think this is the most important aspect. I'm not suggesting that
we coddle people simply because they are young, or fawn over them. But
we should give them the opportunity to contribute as equals, with
appropriate encouragement and assistance. Breaking into the "old boys'
network" can be impossible if the old boys don't make an effort to be
inclusive.

I think that most do make an effort to be inclusive and to show a
newcomer the ropes. Some of it has to do with the old boys. Much has
to do with the attitude of the newcomer.

Dave K8MN

Dave Heil wrote:
Steve Bonine wrote:
wrote:

I became a ham at age 13, mostly through what I learned from ARRL
books. The big attraction was that Radio in general and Amateur Radio
in particular looked like a lot of fun to me. And for more than 40
years, it has been.

Me too. But I do think that we have increased competition these days
from other outlets for prospective hams, and other things that "look
like a lot of fun". Computers and such gadgets are a part of daily
life for young folks these days; it's only natural that they gravitate
in that direction. I suspect that the vast majority of them have not
been exposed to ham radio at all.

You have to admit that there were always things which looked like a lot
of fun. In our day it was guitars, skateboards, stereo equipment,
photography, sports and GIRLS. Not many of us were exposed to amateur
radio in terms of percentages of young people.

The difference is the level of exposure as a user. Today, every young
person is exposed to personal computers as a user, in the same way that
they are exposed to cars as a user. Most of them won't go past the
level of a user, but a few will turn into gearheads or into computer geeks.

I had an old Zenith tabletop radio with shortwave which covered 5.5 to
18 MHz. I used it initially to listen to broadcast radio. Then I
discovered the shortwave broadcasters and finally the 40 and 20m hams
using AM. Luckily for me, I heard a ham who was in our town and he lit
the fire for me.

That's my point. I, too, had access to a shortwave receiver and
followed much the same path that you did. That's much less likely to
happen today. Back then, people were exposed to radio as users. Today,
they're exposed to it via cell phones but they don't perceive it as
radio. Entering ham radio via the SWL route is very rare these days.

There were lots of young hams and young SWLs who were interested in
becoming hams. They read Pop'tronics and EI. Most of the Novices I
worked were in my age group.

Now that you mention it, I do remember working a lot of novices who were
in my age group. There weren't that many local hams who were as young
as me, but there were a lot on the air.

K8CFT administered Novice exams to a
number of junior high and high school aged boys. At one time, the
little town of Oak Hill, West Virginia (population 7,000) boasted seven
young Novices along with six or seven higher class radio amateurs. Of
those seven hams, five are still licensed and active. One dropped out
of amateur radio and one (who was active) died last year. The key was
that *we were interested*. No one can make someone spend his leisure
hours doing something in which he has no interest.

Yes, but you can only be interested in something if you know it exists.
If the option of finding out about ham radio via the SWL route has
disappeared, how do young people find out that they have the option of
spending leisure hours in ham radio?

I think that the best option to attract young folks into the hobby is to
expose them at school. Doing that requires teachers who are at least
amenable to the idea. I suppose that getting publicity into the
channels that they use could work, but I'm not sure how to do that. I'm
not even sure what channels to shoot for.

Another option is to attract older recruits. This has its own set of
issues since someone who is busy raising a family and building a career
may not have vast amounts of spare time to spend in a hobby.

But for me the bottom line is that it's important to attract people into
the hobby to replace the folks who are leaving. As the ham population
ages and declines, it becomes more and more difficult to find a critical
mass of local hams to support things like the local club, FD operations,
Skywarn, and anything that's not done on the air. This problem is
especially evident in rural areas that don't have a large population to
draw from.

73, Steve KB9X

On May 25, 5:01�pm, Steve Bonine wrote:
wrote:
I became a ham at age 13, mostly through what I learned from ARRL
books. The big attraction was that Radio in general and Amateur Radio
in particular looked like a lot of fun to me. And for more than 40
years, it has been.

..I do think that we have increased competition these days
from other outlets for prospective hams, and other things that "look
like a lot of fun". �Computers and such gadgets are a part of
daily life
for young folks these days; it's only natural that they gravitate in
that direction.

Those things are part of daily life for almost everyone (in developed
countries) today.

But amateur radio has had that sort of competition for many decades -
it's nothing new.

�I suspect that the vast majority of them have not been
exposed to ham radio at all.

IMHO, *that* is the Big Problem.

I think there is a sense that, back in the Old Days,
there were young
hams (high school and younger) all over the place.
In my experience as
a young ham (1960s-70s), however, that was
not the case at all. Ham
radio was a niche thing back then, same as now, even without
computers, cell phones, etc.

Yes, I agree. �I do remember more young hams back then,
though. �It was
mostly a hobby for older people, but I do think there were more
young hams then.

Here's one data point for you:

I graduated from high school in 1972. Middle class suburb of
Philadelphia, emphasis was on math and science. Out of about 5000
students (boys and girls in two side-by-side schools), there were
never more than a handful of hams. Less than a dozen in the four years
I was there (which covers 7 graduating classes. At any one time there
were no more than six hams in both schools.

Operating skill, QSO content and signal quality
established one's on-
air reputation, not how deep or gravelly your voice was.

This was a very important consideration for me, too. �Even for the

operation that I did on phone, by and large people treated me as an
equal, and if I demonstrated skill they recognized that skill without
regard to my age. �Even in traditional in-person interactions like

club
meetings and Field Day operations, I was treated as an equal if I could
demonstrate that I deserved to be treated that way. �Generally
speaking
the local ham community was eager to reach out and teach me if it was ob
vious that I needed teaching.

Yep. But at the same time, there had to be a willingness to learn.

I can't think of another hobby where I could have gained
access to such
a community of people who were often peers of my parents.

And on a first-name basis, too. A bank president was "Joe", a
respected MD was "Bill", a highly skilled professional radio operator
was "Lou".

To speculate wildly, it might be that one
cause for curmudgeon-ness is
the fear of what advancements/accomplishments
the young folks might
actually make.

I think you give this segment of our hobby too much credit grin.

There are always going to be folks who simply have no social
skills or prefer not to deal with "kids".

That's true, but it's not what I was getting at.

What I have seen happen more than a few times is the case of a young
amateur rising through the ranks very quickly, passing older and more-
experienced amateurs on the way. Not just in license class (although
the "incentive licensing" changes helped that) but in things like DXCC
countries, code speed, contest scores, operating skills, new
technology in use, etc.

While most hams are glad to see such things, I suspect that there were
at least a few who did not like being bested at *anything* by
young(er) folks. Particularly when it's in the area of skills.

The core value of Amateur Radio is "radio for its
own sake". Some
folks get that, most do not. The task is to spread that word to all,
publicize the wide variety of things hams do, welcome
those who are
interested, and help them with what *they* find interesting.

Spreading the word is more important these days than ever
before. �We
can't expect people to become interested in something that they
don't know exists.

Again, that's the Big Problem.

Oddly enough, a lot of the young hams
I have met are fascinated by
Morse Code, simply because it is unique and
outside their experience.
That doesn't mean it's the only thing to show them, or that all new
hams must start out one and only one way. But it does
mean we cannot
assume young hams are only interested in "new" things.

But CW is new to them. �It's different. �Unique.

Yes. it's new to them. But they rapidly recognize that it's not a new
technology at all. Doesn't matter; it's the uniqueness that makes it
interesting.

Uniqueness is a big deal to the young people I know. I clearly recall
seeing the first Harry Potter book appear - and seeing it being read,
in hardcover, by local kids as young as 2nd and 3rd grade.
"Conventional wisdom" says that "kids today" would not read books, let
alone buy them (or pester their parents to buy them), yet here they
were doing just that. Because the stories are unique.

Ham radio is never going to appeal to everyone. �
Never has; never will.

Of course.

The majority of people, young and old, tend to go with
what has the interest of the mainstream. �Hams have
always been somewhat "different",
and the hobby has always appealed to a segment
of the population that
wasn't interested in doing whatever the fashionable
thing might be at the moment.

I think it's much simpler than that. Some people like the idea of
"radio for its own sake", others can't see the point.

That applies to almost any voluntary activity. For example, most
golfers will never play at anything like a professional level. The
game takes a considerable amount of time and expense, is dependent on
season and weather, and even when you play really well only a few will
ever know.

Yet lots of folks play, because it's not only fun but a challenge.

Same for sport fishing, target shooting, running marathons, and a
variety of arts and crafts done for pleasure. In all cases the journey
is as important (if not more important) than the destination.

1) Presentations at the middle-school and even elementary-
school level - including the parents.

Getting the teachers involved would be ideal. �Teachers are an
incredibly important influence on their students.

Agreed! But that requires a teacher who is a ham.

Scouting is perhaps the #1 source of new young hams
today, btw. Particularly boys. Scouting groups are
always looking for responsible adult leaders.

2) Identify local hams who are available to be Elmers. (I
suspect that
some of the curmudgeon-ness is due to the fear of being
expected to be an Elmer).

This is indeed key. �It's what made the hobby so important for me
as a younger ham.

3) Subtle helps to prospective young hams, such as a ride to a club
meeting, Field Day or hamfest, the loan of a rig, the gift of a
box of
"old wire" that happens to contain all the parts needed to build
an antenna, etc.

And the help to actually put it together.

Sort of. A key factor is knowing just how little help to give.

4) Inclusion and acceptance. This means being
considered an equal, or
at least a potential equal. For example, put new hams
or prospective
hams to work with FD setup, logging, etc. (That means
knowing how to
do things the right way, though!)

I do think this is the most important aspect. �I'm not suggesting
that
we coddle people simply because they are young, or fawn over
them. �But
we should give them the opportunity to contribute as equals, with
appropriate encouragement and assistance. �Breaking into
the "old boys'
network" can be impossible if the old boys don't make an effort to be in
clusive.

Agreed - and that includes being willing to delegate authority.

I will never forget being allowed to run the 40 meter CW setup
overnight on Field Day back in 1970. I was 16, a ham for three years,
and there I was with a Drake 4-line and good antenna on a hot contest
band. You can bet I learned a lot that night!

73 de Jim, N2EY

wrote:

1) Presentations at the middle-school and even elementary-
school level - including the parents.
Getting the teachers involved would be ideal. Teachers are an
incredibly important influence on their students.

Agreed! But that requires a teacher who is a ham.

No, it doesn't. It only requires a teacher who is open to allowing
someone to help him/her, and a person willing to help.

73, Steve KB9X

On May 26, 9:11�pm, Steve Bonine wrote:
wrote:
1) Presentations at the middle-school and even elementary-
school level - including the parents.
Getting the teachers involved would be ideal. Teachers are an
incredibly important influence on their students.

Agreed! But that requires a teacher who is a ham.

No, it doesn't. �It only requires a teacher who is open to allowin
g
someone to help him/her, and a person willing to help.

In theory, yes, the teacher doesn't have to be a ham.

But in practice, I think a teacher who was that interested in having
ham radio in the school would *be* a ham, if for no other reason than
it makes the whole thing easier.

--

A lot depends, too, on what level of involvement ham radio is to be in
the school. For example, in increasing order of involvement:

1) Books, magazines and other info on ham radio could be provided to
the school libraries.

2) Local amateurs could give a presentation/demonstration at an
assembly, student activity day, etc. This would simply say "Here's
what ham radio is, what hams do, what it takes to become one.." etc.

3) Ham radio could be introduced as an extra-curricular activity, same
as computer clubs, robotics clubs, etc. (The local high school has a
computer club that focuses on rehabbing older computers for use by
students who can't afford their own, and a robotics club that designs
and builds machines for competition).

4) Ham radio could be part of the curriculum, integrated into the
math, technology, communications and geography parts.

IMHO the bell-the-cat question at all levels is: Who's going to do the
work, and pay the costs?

73 de Jim, N2EY