RadioBanter - You'll probably never have to use CW to save a life.

wrote:
wrote:
From: on Mon, Sep 4 2006 5:30 pm
Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
wrote:
From: an old friend on Sun, Sep 3 2006 10:09 am

Actually there's a bit more to it than that.

If you recall, Len once set out to get an amateur license, and
reportedly got up to 7 or 8 wpm before he gave up on learning Morse
Code.

You see, learning Morse Code was "hard work" for Len back then.

Tsk. M. Superior is in her innuendo habit...

I explained that but you can't use my explanation and
have to manufacture a NON-reason of your own.

You gave up, Len. You said yourself that it was hard work, didn't you?

Yep.

Archived.

Bad luck for him WE never forgot it, eh?

In the early 1960s I did make an attempt to get my
morse cognition skill up to 13 WPM, using mainly code
tapes (magneitc).

I'm not sure of the reason I had
then, probably some pressure from co-workers who were
into SSB voice; my lab boss at Ramo-Wooldridge was Ed
Dodds, W6ERU, had a nice Collins setup in Woodland
Hills, beam antenna, regular skeds with a friend in
New Zealand.

The point was that you tried and then gave up.

Even more interesting was the "pressure" he got from his "SSB
voice" buddies.

Guess they weren't THAT good of buddies...Lennie didn't thinkl
them worthy enough of joining them on the air.

While CB (on 27 MHz) had been authorized
in 1958, it had only spread so far in 1962 since the
off-shore electronics industry hadn't yet begun to
invade the market.

Didn't US manufacturers make cb sets?

Sonar, E F Johnson, Allied, LaFayette...You mean those...?!?!

My E.F. Johnson Viking Messenger
had been removed from my 1953 Austin-Healey (an
excellent ground plane with all-aluminum body) since
my first wife coerced me into getting Detroit Iron.
Apartment dwelling was not good for CB then, nor for
amateur radio. We went house-hunting.

Gosh that's lot of detail to tell a simple story.

Just more braggadoccio...An opportunity to tell us about his (never
existed) Austin-Healy.

He's apparently one of those folks who does "book learnin'" rather
easily - let him read something and he'll lecture you on it endlessly.
Some of what he says will actually be right, too.

No, Jimmy, that's YOUR ploy in here.

Len, we all know that you talk only about yourself here...

Reminds me of "Good Will Hunting"...

Couldn't tell Robin Williams what the Sistine Chapel was like...

But learning Morse Code to the 13 wpm level needed for a General
license turned out to be not so easy for Len, so he has held a grudge
about it for decades.

No "grudge" for any amateur wanting to USE it.

Your behavior here says otherwise, Len.

In spades.

A view
only against the alleged "necessity" to demonstrate
morsemanship just to GET a license.

Even though you don't seem to want such a license.

Especially since he hasn't needed it for 15 years now.

You've manufactured a "moral defect" which didn't exist.

Who said it was a moral defect, Len?

You simply gave up.

Even before it was PC to do so.

You've conveniently OMITTED the fact that eleven years
before then I began working Big Time HF radio comms where
there was NO manual morse code used nor required.

That doesn't change the fact that you gave up trying to learn Morse
Code because it was too much work for you.

Lennie's NEVER been into the "Big Time HF radio comms" as an
OPERATOR (except for CB and the occassional jaunt on a friend's yacht)
! He was, at best, a radio mechanic.

CB
had already been authorized on HF five years before and
required NO test whatsoever, certainly NOT morse code.

Is that how you think amateur radio should be? A few channels in one
part of the spectrum, very low power, one or two modes, and only
approved manufactured equipment?

Of COURSE that's what he wants...

Then he can "Shack and Awe" the unwashed minions with his expertise
and knowledge in PROFESSIONAL electronics...

And no...I didn't mispell that...Lennie would drag folks into his
"shack" and try to "awe" them with his Japanese SWL receiver.

In any event, it doesn't change the fact that you gave up trying to
learn Morse Code because it was too much work for you.

Seven years before that I'd been granted a First 'Phone
commercial license, again not requiring any manual morse
code demonstration yet I could (commercially) operate on
HF using that.

But not on the amateur bands. And not using your own station unless you
got a station license for it.

But Lennie got to push a button that made a robot on the moon
hiccup.

The fact is that legally operating an amateur radio station (except in
a life-and-death emergency) on the amateur bands requires a valid
amateur radio license. No other form of license or experience is
acceptable to FCC.

You've also left out the fact of how much Morse Code is actually used
on the HF amateur bands - then and now.

Let's not confuse Lennie with facts.

There arose what Cecil Moore would later
term "return on investment" given the readily-observable
CHANGE in communications already taking place in the
late 1950s.

How much of HF amateur radio operation used Morse Code in the late
1950s, Len? How much of HF amateur radio operation uses Morse Code
today, Len?

How many HF priviledges did Lennie have in the 1950's? How many
does he have now...?!?!

In using code tapes there was no "difficulty" in learning
the tone patterns, only the TIME needed to get them down
well enough. TIME is not an unlimited quantity and a LOT
of things needed my time in my twenties.

In other words, it was hard work because it took *you* a lot of time to
learn it.

Whelllp....Did take him 14 years to get that Associate's
degree....

If I had to
choose between a girlfriend (and later wife) and "morse
code practice," those code tapes would be kicked to the
gutter.

Who said you had to choose? Couldn't there be time for both?

(GRIN ! ! )

I always did!

I was multitasking before multitasking was cool!

If you think opposite, just shove a J-38 up yer
bum and have an orgasm, morse style.

I thought you didn't have any grudge against someone using Morse Code,
Len.

There you go thinking again, Jim.

None of that changes the fact that you gave up trying to learn Morse
Code because it was too much work for you.

Now you may wonder why, if Len could do 7 or 8 wpm at one point, he
didn't just get a Novice license, and improve his Morse Code skills by
operating, as most of us did.

I bought a house in 1963. Shortly thereafter my (then)
wife was diagnosed with cancer. She died in 1964. I
was then 31 and stuck with a bunch of bills that
required a second job to break even. Night college
classes had to be postponed for an indefinite period.
I kept the house.

I'm sorry for your loss, Len. It's clear some things were delayed.

Yep. Sorry.

Makes me feel bad about the $250K in debt my daughter's bills
left...but I got paid off anyway...

With all that, you indefatiguable little character assassin,
you thought it was NECESSARY TO STUDY MORSE CODE?!?!?

Nobody said it was necessary, Len. Read what was written, for a change.

The fact is that you gave up because it was too much work for you. If
it were easy for you to learn, you would have learned it quickly and
passed the 13 wpm test long before 1963.

1964 was 42 years ago, Len. From your accounts of your personal
history, you never again tried to learn Morse Code, nor to get any
class of amateur license. But you've had plenty of time to argue about
it, and make fun of others who have done what you have not.

Reminds me of the arguments I ahve with the teen daughter...I
constantly have to point out to her that her chores could be done in
less time than she argues about them.

If you really thought that, you have all the emotional
sensitivity of a lump of wet clay...or an aberrant
outlook that isn't in Psych 101 or 102 textbooks. Too
twisted for my undergrad knowledge of psychology.

It's not about me, Len.

YOUR "undergrad knowledge of psychology"...?!?!?

Don't you mean your wife's correspondence school reference
texts...?!?!

The answer should be obvious: No way would Len allow himself to be
classified as a "Novice". That license did not carry the appropriate
title or status for him.

I'm not a "novice" in radio, Jimmy.

That's right, Len.

In amateur radio, you're not even a Novice yet.

Neither do I have
any emotional need for Rank, Status, Title in a HOBBY
activity.

Sure you do, Len. That's part of why you behave the way you do here.

The "RANK" of "professional"

The "TITLE" of "engineer"

The "STATUS" of unlicensed.

Since remodeling one unused bedroom into an
office, I haven't even mounted the RCA "first-patent"
plaque given to me by Chief Engineer Ray Aires nor the
picture of me getting it with Jim Hall, KD6JG, my
immediate manager at the time looking on.

See? There you go!

yadayadayada

My wife is
the same way (I do the bragging about her) and her
'sheepskins' (3) are in storage up north.

I guess if you pay good money for a correspondence course, the
"sheepskin" is the least you could expect.

All of my
First 'Phone and GROL certificates and single college
certificate are in the big safety deposit box down
here; don't need them. I am secure in myself and what
I can do.

And you tell us all about at every opportunity.

In any event, it doesn't change the fact that you gave up trying to
learn Morse Code because it was too much work for you.

And let's not forget, Jim...Lennie told us his GROL expired back in
October of 2000.

Outside of the amateur radio pecking order, WHAT GOOD IS
MORSEMANSHIP TODAY?

What do you mean by "amateur radio pecking order"? And "morsemanship"?

The plain and simple fact is that Morse Code skill is needed to pass
one of the license tests for an Amateur Radio license with HF/MF
privileges in the USA.

Morse Code skills are very useful in operating an Amateur Radio
station. Besides the fact that it is enjoyable once the skills are
developed, it permits the use of a wide variety of equipment, gets the
most results from limited resources, and is a different form of
communication than or text modes.

It isn't used for regular comms by
any other radio service. There isn't one single Public
Safety radio service that uses manual morse code.

So what?

Double ditto "so what"...

The IS an AMATEUR RADIO forum...right...?!?!

The fact is that lots of Amateur Radio operators *do* use Morse Code.
Amateur Radio is not part of those other radio services - it's a
separate and distinct radio service. Only a person with a valid Amateur
Radio license can legally operate an Amateur Radio station (except in a
life-and-death emergency).

Why should the requirements for an Amateur Radio license be determined
by what *other* radio services do, rather than by what Amateur Radio
operators do?

Don't try to bluff Lennie with facts and logic, Jim...The local ER
will be scooping his brains off the floor for a week.

There
isn't even one surviving landline morse code telegraph
circuit now.

Are you *sure*?

OF COURSE!

E V E R Y O N E consults with lennie before they erect or remove
ANY communications links!

I've communicated by radio from land, from
a cockpit (at the controls) in the air, from the sea
(Ventura Harbor area), from a moving vehicle, from a
stationary vehicle, while on march in the Army with a
PRC-8 on my back. All during the last half century.
No "TITLES" necessary to do any of that or to do it well.

None of those were Amateur Radio, however. And in this age of cell
phones, most people with one have probably "communicated by radio" from
the sea, a moving vehicle, a stationary vehicle, while walking, etc.

Radio sets like those used in aircraft and the PRC-8 are designed to be
used by people with minimal radio skills. They're a means to an end,
not the end itself.

Precisely. They'll also have much more experience in amateur radio than
Leonard H. Anderson. Those who are proficient in the use of Morse, will
always be a leg up on Leonard.

Riiiight, world's greates DXer, amateur radio is SOOOO much
more advanced than every other radio. [barf, har har]

The fact of the matter, Len, is that even with all your claimed
experience, you could not communicate by radio with my Amateur Radio
station. Nor with many other Amateur Radio stations. Besides the legal
issues of a license, you just don't have the skills.

I think that's what really bugs you in all this.

What torque's Lennie's bolts is that there are 10 year old girls
with more HF operating experience than he: (ie: W6EMB)

So what? People have all kinds of skills, experience, etc. I'm sure
there are things where Len has more experience/knowledge/skill than I,

IMPOSSIBLE in Jimmyworld. :-) [he will almost say that
outright]

How is it impossible?

Where's Jimmyworld?

Is that near Epcot center?

and things where I have more experience/knowledge/skill than he.

Morsemanship, obviously. Something in great demand these
days of the 1930s. Morse champions are to be rewarded with
titles of nobility. Long live the morsemen. Huzzah.

There are many things I can do better than you, Len. Morse Code is only
one of them.

On anything else, Jimmy hasn't made himself known. Such as
what he does for a living (if a life of morsemanship is
called living). Does Jimmy have a girlfriend? Boyfriend?
Any social life not requiring an antenna? Do we care?
[in general, no]

Then why do you keep trying to find out?

He's hoping there's more options out there than N9OGL and KB9RQZ.

Exactly. Amateur radio is "radio for its own sake".

Then why all the titles, rank, status, privilege, bandplans
and attendant class distinction?

Because they're all good things, Len.

I think you would like it if Amateur Radio became just like cb,

In case you've forgotten, Len did some writing for the now-defunct
amateur radio magazine "ham radio". He got paid for those articles, of
course. None of his articles were actual projects, though.

That is a moral deficit? :-)

Who said that?

You are IN ERROR, Jimmy. Look up the one on using an HP-25
calculator to convert Noise Bridge readings. That was
developed to aid some local friends on antenna measurements.

That's not a project, Len.

Look at the footnotes on that article and some of the
examples. The whole "Digital Techniques" series was based
on personal descriptions to others (some of which were
amateurs)...the last one on a Phase-Frequency Detector was
based on the prototyping I did, partly on an old Apple ][,
for an optical interferometer.

None of them was a "how to build it" article, though.

Not one article in "Ham Radio" allegedly authored by Leonard H
Anderson was ever subsequently footnoted in any other professional or
amateur project or article...Other than his own.

And the whole "Digital Techniques" stuff was in QST more than 5 years
earlier.

Guess that's why Lennie's stuff looked so familiar.

You conveniently forget the two-plus years I spent with
Ham Radio magazine as an Associate Editor.

Right - looking over *other people's* work.

Like I've said all along.

Look on the
mastheads for proof of that. Did that under Alf Wilson
(W6NIF, took over after Jim Fisk suddenly died) and
Rich Rosen (K1RR?). I opted out from HR from time
pressure of self-employment...and learning that publisher
Skip Tenney was going to sell HR to CQ.

And yet in all of that, learning Morse Code was too much work for you.

Oh Heaven forbid that Skip might have actually required Lennie to
"do his own work."

...and learning morse would apparently be "work" for Leonard.

"hard work", actually. That's why he gave up on it.

No, DUMB work. Waste of my time.

You just proved my point, Len. If it were easy for you, you'd have
learned it quickly and moved on.

None of the really "easy" things in MY life were the more
satisfying ones....(except for this one redhead in Laguna Beach...but
she's another thread!)

It was the one's where, at the end of the day, I knew I ahd put
something into and subsequently got something in return that I knew I
had accomplished something.

I guess this is why Lennie and Morkie "meld"...they are mutually
intolerant of effort to get what they want.

Why do I need morse?
Why does anyone need morsemanship? To keep the USA
safe from terrorists? BWAAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It's still a license requirement, and it's a useful skill in Amateur
Radio.

But that's obvious.

At least he has dropped the claim that HE worked 24/7.

I was on-call 24/7 with the scheduling times. NCOs got
stuck with that. Longest I worked was 34 hours, one time.

A lot of people are on call 24/7 in their jobs, Len. Many do not have
all the personnel you had at ADA, either.

I've worked longer than 34 hours at a stretch more than a few times,
too. I don't recommend it, but it can be done.

I've spent many-a-WEEK living in the HANGAR at MCAS Futenma and
Cubi Point.

Jimmy Noserve not know stuff like dat. He never be in
military serving his country. Jimmy "serve country in
different ways," the 'different' very, very undefined.

It doesn't matter what someone else has done, Len - if they disagree
with you, it's guaranteed you'll make fun of them and their
accomplishments. So why should anyone tell you what they've done?

Lennie spent a "career" in a back water radio station, crawling
through benjo ditches. Then 50 years later he made up a whole passle
of tales about Bear Bombers and "Incoming Artillery". he topped it off
with stories of what a great soldier he'd been since he served in a
unit that had KIA's THREE YEARS before he was even inducted. Lennie
never even pulled ADY to the country where the KIA's occured.

You surely remember what he has said about CHILDREN in the past.

Oh yes - something about his difficulty including them in what he sees
as an adult activity. Also, he proposed a minimum age requirement for
an amateur license even though he had absolutely no evidence of
problems caused by the licensing of young people. Then there's his
accusating the ARRL and some VEs of "fraud" in licensing some young
children.

"Accusating?" :-)

Yep.

I was not "accusating" the ARRL. I said their actions
were "grandfatherly" to a pair of cute six-year-olds. I
gave NO outright accusation if that's what your raging
character assassination words tried to say. :-)

You accused them of fraud, Len.

Outright accusations.

And despite dogged hounding to pony-up on his evidence of such
fraud, he never did.

FCC amateur radio regulations are written such that ANY
licensee, regardless of age, can operate (within bounds
of their license class) at any time. Says NOTHING about
"parental supervision" of six-year-olds or even nine-
year-old Extras.

Is that a problem?

There's no "parental permission" line on the current applications
(never has been), and by all readings of the law, the unlicensed parent
cannot supervise the child IRT Amateur Radio regulations!

How many radio amateurs are enforcement problems because of their
youth?

Correct, legal operation of radios requires MATURITY of
RESPONSIBILITY.

??

"MATURITY of RESPONSIBILITY"?

Did you mean "maturity and responsibility"?

If so, I agree!

Again...where's the proliferation of NAL's against "underage"
operators that substantiate Lennie's rant...?!?!

Anyone?

If you still think that 6 year olds and
9 year olds are MATURE, your head isn't on straight.

Can you name even *one* case where the "maturity" of a young radio
amateur was an issue in an FCC enforcement action?

Licensed Amateur Radio has existed in the USA since 1912. That's 96
years, and in all that time the FCC and its regulatory predecessors
have *never* seen fit to have any kind of age or "maturity"
requirement. Yet you, Leonard H. Anderson, somehow know better than the
FCC on the issue - even though you haven't presented even one example
of a problem caused by the lack of an age requirement.

And your proposed age requirement would have been 14 years - based on
nothing!

From the enforcement letters I've seen, the worst offenders in the
Amateur Radio service are much closer to *your* age, Len.

BBBWWWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If nine-year-olds can become Extras, then what does that
say about the MATURITY level of other Extras?

In as much as none of the current NAL's pending against Amateurs
are for persons under 40, I'd say pretty danged good!

It says the FCC is satisfied that they can be mature enough to operate
an Amateur Radio station, Len.

OTOH, your behavior here indicates that you, Len, are nowhere near
mature enough to operate an Amateur Radio station. It's a good thing
you're on Usenet and not the Amateur Radio bands.

Add Lennie to Morkie's "kook on parade" list.

Tsk, tsk, still bitching about a Comment I made to the
FCC in January 1999? Seven years ago and you still
can't let go of it? Not a good mental picture of you,
Jimmy.

It's not my problem, Len. You're the one who 'has trouble integrating
children into an adult activity'....

Morkie and Toiddie don't have any problem trying to integrate
children into an "adult activity"...Now if they'd just limit that to
AMATEUR RADIO.....

Didn't you know, Jim? Len's made himself an ADVOCATE for
something-or-other.

Keeping real estate zoning regulations as they were 40+ years ago?

What has THAT manufactured dispute of yours to do with
ANY radio?!?

It's not a manufactured dispute, Len. You brought it up, now you don't
want to hear about it.

Let's review that one:

You and some of your neighbors tried to keep the zoning ordinances in
your neighborhood stuck in the past. Despite all the changes that have
occured since the early 1960s, you did not want the zoning changed. You
wanted a piece of undeveloped land near your house developed only in
ways you approved of. Anyone who wanted to live or build in your
neighborhood should have to do it the way you did it, and no other way.
People trying to Get Into Sun City had to pass muster - go through a
hazing ritual - in the way *you* determined, even though so much has
changed since the early 1960s.

Except the zoning commission disagreed.

Whew...

Where have we heard THOSE rants before, Jim...?!?!

Oh, you are homeless? (in Radnor, PA?)

Jimmy got no sense of LIVING on his own PROPERTY?

Jimmy and Davie only care about amateur morse code, ham
radio, and growing antennas...

His life is otherwise empty, depsite the comfortable income, two
mortgage-free homes and the like. Maybe Len can take a part-time job as
bag boy at Ralph's.

Maybe Davie can go stick a plastic shopping bag on his head?

Breathe deep with it on, Davie. Use your hands to
tap out morse code if you get in trouble. :-)

No, Ralph's requires that everything be Pretty Good. Including the
ketchup.

Ralphs, Vons, Albertsons chains all sell food made by
professional food growers and producers.

Not Ralphs. Ralph's.

Albertson's, too, Jim!

AMATEURS
aren't wanted as growers/producers. Maybe at Tressieras
or Food4Less, but we don't go there.

In the case of food, professional doesn't always mean better. In fact,
it rarely does.

Len often acts ugly. I prefer not to think of him as naked.

Please don't go there...

You have a repugnance to seeing naked human beings, Jimmy?

Oh, yes, you are unmarried, right?

Uh oh...Seems Lennie's been sharing too much time at Morkie's
house!

Whether Len is ever a radio amateur or not, I'm not going to lose any
sleep over it.

Nor I. Besides, it's just not going to happen.

The code test issue was never about me or "whether or not
I get a license."

Then why are you so obsessed with it, Len?

Because Lennie's a "PROFEESIONAL"...All professionals MUST have
dominion over all things not receiveing funding.

That is in your weird, manufacture-the-
worst-personal-assassination scenarios, Jimmy and Davie.

Long ago and several times since then I've said that my
actions are for ending the US manual morse code test for
an amateur radio license.

But you don't say why you are so obsessed with it.

I still say that he was "insulted" by Amateurs at some point and
has since been on a vendetta to harass Amateurs wherever/however he
can.

It's pure meaness, in other words.

I bet that "ham" best man of his took liberties with Mrs Lennie II.

There is NO "personal" motive
in that...you are confusing PERSISTENCE with 'personal.'

Nope - it's quite clear how personal it is to you. You make personal
attacks on those who disagree with you, simply because they disagree.

Yep.

I was "Gunny" and "Steve" in private e mail until I told him that I
appreciated his point of view but didn't agree with it.

Then the "nazi" stuff followed.

You two need to take a look at what YOUR personal motives
are in taking it so hard about those of us who seek
removal of the code test.

Why?

You're the one who is obsessed, Len.

Uhhhhhyup.

Several possibilities exist the

1. Either of you (or both) are just Code Bigots,
bigots always approving of actions of similar
bigotry in others.

You mean like people who cannot tolerate dissenting opinions without
calling others names, making fun of their work, religion, gender,
ethnicity, education, government/military service, etc.?

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm...Who might THAT be...?!?!

2. Either of you (or both) are control freaks determined
to make all obey YOUR commands.

You mean like people who want to control the requirements for a license
they do not want, for a radio service in which they have no
participation?

You mean like people who want to control what their neighbors do with
their own property, and want the law to remain unchanged from the
1960s?

3. Neither of you, despite claims otherwise, understand
that manual morse code is a dead or dying mode in
ALL radio services; there is NO need to keep the
manual morse test to provide a "pool" of trained
morsemen for the national interest.

Morse Code is neither dead nor dying in Amateur Radio, though.

4. Either of you (or both) are scared that removal of
the code test will end your bragging rights, of
self-defined "importance" of rank-title-status-
privilege based largely on morsemanship.

Actually, the opposite is true.

Back when only a few hams had Extras, that license was seen as a major
accomplishment. When I got my Extra way back in 1970, less than 3% of
US hams had that license. Many hams thought 20 wpm was amazingly fast
Morse Code, particularly when copied with pencil and paper. There was
similar awe surrounding the written exams.

But over time, more and more hams got Extras.

Thanks to Bash...and now thanks to Bash those written tests are
useless for elective credits at ANY college any more.

Tens of thousands of
hams, young and old, from all walks of life, found that with a bit of
practice and study they could pass 20 wpm code and all the theory
tests. They found it wasn't nearly as hard as they had once thought.

Lower the requirements and the reverse will happen.

5. Either of you (or both) are elitist snobs who have
the "deep insecurity" of NEEDING rank-status-title
to make you appear "better" than others.

Well, Len, you've really described yourself in all of that. You tell
us, over and over, about *your* rank-status-title stuff.

Either of you (or both) fit one of those 5 things above,
possibly several of them.

Nope.

The correct answer is:

6. Both of us think that since Morse Code is widely used in
Amateur Radio, and has brings many advantages and benefits
to the Amateur Radio service, a basic test of Morse Code
skill
should be required for an Amateur Radio license.

That's the plain and simple fact of it. Nothing more.

But themn both of you (as do I) have practical experience from
which to amke an INFORMED opinion.

Lennie's still got his puppy nose smushed up against the window
looking in...

btw, in my comments to FCC on the recent NPRM, I suggested that the
Canadian solution be applied. All that would be required to change is
that if someone passed the General written with a score of 85% or
higher, they would get credit for Element 1 as well as Element 3.
Getting an Extra would require having a General and passing Element 4.

The result would be that a person could get a General or Extra the same
way as today (with code test) or, by doing a bit better on the General
written, they could get a General or Extra without the code test.

Rules changes would be minimal. Nobody would have to take a Morse Code
test, yet no one could say that standards were reduced.

Why couldn't the USA adopt the solution that's working in Canada?

I'd argue against that one, Jim...for the same reason their
healthcare system is in a shambles...And getting worse.
=
Irrelevant and a detail as to
which but your actions DO show fitting at least one of
them.

Nope.

OTOH, your actions fit all of them! All that has to be done is to
replace the word "code" with "anticode" and the five items you
described are all about you, Len.

But we knew that...

Both of you have to understand that there are a
great number of other citizens who also wish the code
test removal.

Where are they? They were outnumbered in comments to FCC. The majority
of those commenting wanted at least some code testing to remain -
remember, Len?

Lennie...Mork...Frankie...

Both of you have to understand that such
a position is NOT some idiotic moral imperfection but
rather a reasonable opinion based on the advancement of
technology of all radio by this first decade of the new
millennium.

Ah, the old presuming-your-conclusion...

Try to keep up. Unless it is too hard for
you...

You need to work on your Morse Code skills, Len - and your people
skills....

Lennie doesn't HAVE any "people skills" to work on.

Maybe for Christmas?

Steve, K4YZ