Joe Collins wrote:
Now that Bruce Parens and NCI have won the CW wars, what will happen
to the exclusive CW allocations if a CW requirement is dropped?
Certainly there can be no argument for keeping the current band
structure in place, and phone operations probably ought to be spread
out into what was once exclusively reserved for CW operators. Not
only would this alleviate the congestion in the phone bands, but it
would finally and officially place CW into perspective: Just another
optional mode of operation without any exclusive rights to any
frequency.

This cannot be, for no one wants to take anything away from Morse code
users.

- Mike KB3EIA -

In article , Mike Coslo wrote:

This cannot be, for no one wants to take anything away from Morse code
users.

Why not, 8 years ago, the Arrl did a survey. They asked amateurs who had
passed a morse code exam if they EVER used morse code. Two out of three
responded "no". I.e. 2/3's of the hams surveyed NEVER used morse code.

Of course in those days they spun it as "1 out 3 sometimes uses morse code".

So if it came to a vote you'd have a hard time keeping things as they are.

Geoff.

--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson 972-54-608-069
Do sysadmins count networked sheep?

"Geoffrey S. Mendelson" wrote in message
...
In article , Mike Coslo wrote:

This cannot be, for no one wants to take anything away from Morse code
users.

Why not, 8 years ago, the Arrl did a survey. They asked amateurs who had
passed a morse code exam if they EVER used morse code. Two out of three
responded "no". I.e. 2/3's of the hams surveyed NEVER used morse code.

Of course in those days they spun it as "1 out 3 sometimes uses morse
code".

So if it came to a vote you'd have a hard time keeping things as they are.

Geoff.

The ARRL had a new survey in the last 6 months. Half of the respondants use
morse any where from occasionally to 100% of the time. Morse code usage
appears to be on the rise. In the past year, participation in the ARRL
Morse contests showed an increase of 20% over the previous year.
Participation in the voice contests was practically the same as last year
with virtually no growth.

So that 8 year old survey does not reflect today's situation.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

In article ,
(Geoffrey S. Mendelson) writes:

In article , Mike Coslo wrote:

This cannot be, for no one wants to take anything away from Morse code
users.

Why not, 8 years ago, the Arrl did a survey.

That's pretty close - 1996

They asked amateurs who had
passed a morse code exam if they EVER used morse code.

No, you are mistaken. On several counts.

They asked 1100 US hams, chosen at random. Of these, 100 were Novices and 200
each Techs, Tech Pluses, Generals, Advanceds and Extras. So they asked hams who
had not taken a code test as well as hams who had.

The question was "How much do you operate Morse code?" and there were only
three possible answers: "Regularly", "Rarely" and "Never". No definitions of
what those terms mean, no questions on other modes, etc. (After all, a ham who
is not on the air at all never uses Morse code on the air).

Two out of three
responded "no". I.e. 2/3's of the hams surveyed NEVER used morse code.

Wrong again!

35% answered "Never"
37% answered "Rarely"
27% answered "Regularly"
1% did not answer.

It is obvious that the question is so flawed as to be meaningless. For example,
how much Morse operation is "regular"?

Note that the question doesn't specify HF operation, or ask if the ham is
active at all, if he/she is equipped for HF operation, etc. etc.

Of course in those days they spun it as "1 out 3 sometimes uses morse code".

Wrong again!

64% (37+27) sometimes use Morse code, according to that survey. That's a fact,
not spin.

So if it came to a vote you'd have a hard time keeping things as they are.

Maybe.

Try this "survey": Actually listen to the CW/digital subbands and see how much
activity there really is. Try 40 meters below 7050 some evening.

73 de Jim, N2EY

"N2EY" wrote


35% answered "Never"
37% answered "Rarely"
27% answered "Regularly"
1% did not answer.



64% (37+27) sometimes use Morse code, according to that survey. That's a fact,
not spin.



Facts (and spin) are in the eye of the beholder, Jim. Your "64%
sometimes use Morse code" is trumped by the fellow who uses the same
numbers to factually state that "72% (35+37) of the hams surveyed rarely
or never use Morse code".

73, de Hans, K0HB

____________________________
/ \
| They called me mad, and I |
|\/\/\/| / called them mad, but damn \
| | | them, they outvoted me. |
| (o)(o) | |
c _) | |
| '___| \_ __________________________/
| / | /
/____\ _/
/ \


--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG

In article ilgate.org, "Hans
Kohb" writes:

"N2EY" wrote


35% answered "Never"
37% answered "Rarely"
27% answered "Regularly"
1% did not answer.



64% (37+27) sometimes use Morse code, according to that survey. That's a
fact,
not spin.



Facts (and spin) are in the eye of the beholder, Jim.

"Reality does not care what you believe"

Your "64%
sometimes use Morse code" is trumped by the fellow who uses the same
numbers to factually state that "72% (35+37) of the hams surveyed rarely
or never use Morse code".

How is it trumped?

Besides, the point of my post was that the original poster was way off on a
number of things.

73 de Jim, N2EY

"N2EY" wrote in message
...
In article ,
(Geoffrey S. Mendelson) writes:

In article , Mike Coslo wrote:

This cannot be, for no one wants to take anything away from Morse code
users.

Why not, 8 years ago, the Arrl did a survey.

That's pretty close - 1996

They asked amateurs who had
passed a morse code exam if they EVER used morse code.

No, you are mistaken. On several counts.

They asked 1100 US hams, chosen at random. Of these, 100 were Novices and
200
each Techs, Tech Pluses, Generals, Advanceds and Extras. So they asked
hams who
had not taken a code test as well as hams who had.

The question was "How much do you operate Morse code?" and there were only
three possible answers: "Regularly", "Rarely" and "Never". No definitions
of
what those terms mean, no questions on other modes, etc. (After all, a ham
who
is not on the air at all never uses Morse code on the air).

Two out of three
responded "no". I.e. 2/3's of the hams surveyed NEVER used morse code.

Wrong again!

35% answered "Never"
37% answered "Rarely"
27% answered "Regularly"
1% did not answer.

It is obvious that the question is so flawed as to be meaningless. For
example,
how much Morse operation is "regular"?

Note that the question doesn't specify HF operation, or ask if the ham is
active at all, if he/she is equipped for HF operation, etc. etc.

Of course in those days they spun it as "1 out 3 sometimes uses morse
code".

Wrong again!

64% (37+27) sometimes use Morse code, according to that survey. That's a
fact,
not spin.

So if it came to a vote you'd have a hard time keeping things as they
are.

Maybe.

Try this "survey": Actually listen to the CW/digital subbands and see how
much
activity there really is. Try 40 meters below 7050 some evening.

73 de Jim, N2EY

Yep for a 'so called dead mode' (cw) there sure seems to be a LOT of
activity in the real world.

Dan/W4NTI

"Dan/W4NTI" wrote in message
...

"N2EY" wrote in message
...
In article ,
(Geoffrey S. Mendelson) writes:

In article , Mike Coslo wrote:

This cannot be, for no one wants to take anything away from Morse
code
users.

Why not, 8 years ago, the Arrl did a survey.

That's pretty close - 1996

They asked amateurs who had
passed a morse code exam if they EVER used morse code.

No, you are mistaken. On several counts.

They asked 1100 US hams, chosen at random. Of these, 100 were Novices
and
200
each Techs, Tech Pluses, Generals, Advanceds and Extras. So they asked
hams who
had not taken a code test as well as hams who had.

The question was "How much do you operate Morse code?" and there were
only
three possible answers: "Regularly", "Rarely" and "Never". No
definitions
of
what those terms mean, no questions on other modes, etc. (After all, a
ham
who
is not on the air at all never uses Morse code on the air).

Two out of three
responded "no". I.e. 2/3's of the hams surveyed NEVER used morse code.

Wrong again!

35% answered "Never"
37% answered "Rarely"
27% answered "Regularly"
1% did not answer.

It is obvious that the question is so flawed as to be meaningless. For
example,
how much Morse operation is "regular"?

Note that the question doesn't specify HF operation, or ask if the ham
is
active at all, if he/she is equipped for HF operation, etc. etc.

Of course in those days they spun it as "1 out 3 sometimes uses morse
code".

Wrong again!

64% (37+27) sometimes use Morse code, according to that survey. That's a
fact,
not spin.

So if it came to a vote you'd have a hard time keeping things as they
are.

Maybe.

Try this "survey": Actually listen to the CW/digital subbands and see
how
much
activity there really is. Try 40 meters below 7050 some evening.

73 de Jim, N2EY

Yep for a 'so called dead mode' (cw) there sure seems to be a LOT of
activity in the real world.

Dan/W4NTI



What makes you think CW is a dead mode?

Kim W5TIT


---
Posted via news://freenews.netfront.net
Complaints to

On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 19:41:11 -0400, N2EY wrote:
In article ,
(Geoffrey S. Mendelson) writes:

In article , Mike Coslo wrote:

This cannot be, for no one wants to take anything away from Morse
code
users.

Why not, 8 years ago, the Arrl did a survey.

That's pretty close - 1996

They asked amateurs who had
passed a morse code exam if they EVER used morse code.

No, you are mistaken. On several counts.

They asked 1100 US hams, chosen at random. Of these, 100 were Novices
and 200 each Techs, Tech Pluses, Generals, Advanceds and Extras. So they
asked hams who had not taken a code test as well as hams who had.

The question was "How much do you operate Morse code?" and there were
only three possible answers: "Regularly", "Rarely" and "Never". No
definitions of what those terms mean, no questions on other modes, etc.
(After all, a ham who is not on the air at all never uses Morse code on
the air).

Two out of three
responded "no". I.e. 2/3's of the hams surveyed NEVER used morse code.

Wrong again!

35% answered "Never"
37% answered "Rarely"
27% answered "Regularly"
1% did not answer.

It is obvious that the question is so flawed as to be meaningless. For
example, how much Morse operation is "regular"?

It's only flawed for the purposes you're trying to put it to. Its original
purpose was to gauge the level of interest based on use of Morse. For that
purpose, it doesn't matter whether the respondent's use of Morse fits your
definition of "regularly" -- or mine -- it matters only whether it fits
the respondent's definition.

Most of the cavilling about survey questions comes from misunderstanding
the question's purpose and misuse of the results to try to "prove" things
that the survey wasn't addressing. If you want to sample opinion on a
topic, hire a reputable research firm to formulate and conduct a survey
that will elicit the facts you want. Trying to hammer an existing survey
into something that it wasn't designed to be is almost certain to lead to
skewed conclusions.

Note that the question doesn't specify HF operation, or ask if the ham
is active at all, if he/she is equipped for HF operation, etc. etc.

Of course in those days they spun it as "1 out 3 sometimes uses morse
code".

Wrong again!

64% (37+27) sometimes use Morse code, according to that survey. That's a
fact, not spin.

But as you point out, nobody really knows what "operate" means in this
case. For example, if a person's entire use of Morse code is to copy
repeater IDs, which they do by laboriously copying down the dots and
dashes and then looking up the letters in a table, is that "operation" of
Morse? The survey doesn't say.

So if it came to a vote you'd have a hard time keeping things as they
are.

Maybe.

Try this "survey": Actually listen to the CW/digital subbands and see
how much activity there really is. Try 40 meters below 7050 some
evening.

That's a much better way to get a feel for the true level of interest.
Signals on the air are a much better measure of what's popular in ham
radio than any survey results or any amount of Usenet bloviating.

Jon

Jon Bloom wrote in message g...

If you want to sample opinion on a
topic, hire a reputable research firm to formulate and conduct a survey
that will elicit the facts you want.

Thats what the ARRL should have done.