"Dwight Stewart" wrote:

I understand Kim's point. Lets try
it from this perspective. If you're one
of the millions of immigrants entering
this country, the speech we use on
the radio, and on the radio tests, in
this country is not already in the
"toolbox." And Spanish certainly isn't
in the "toolbox" of many other Hams
in this country. So, even if you ignore
any skills needed for the voice modes
(however minor), there is still some
validity in Kim's argument. Spanish is
use more often the CW in this (snip)


Wow! See what happens when you edit a sentence without checking it
afterwards. That last sentence should read "Spanish is used" and "more often
than CW."


Dwight Stewart (W5NET)

http://www.qsl.net/w5net/

SNIP___SNIP


Those should be drummed out of the corps, banished to the nether
world of VHF and higher. All must show commitment and dedication
to the amateur community by maintaining a pool of trained morsemen
ready and waiting to save the world from alien invasion.

Everything good in US amateur radio is about morse code skill.

Self-discipline, dedication, committing to the olde-tyme hamme
traditions. Showing all one's hard work and efforts.

Words to live by in the amateur lifestyle, the belief system that is
the bastion of amateurism. Amen.

LHA

Very true. You have hit the nail on the head this time. Everything
that was good about amateur radio was morse code and the trained pool
of not only morsemen as you like to put it but also technically
trained people too. Amateur Radio as a service is gone. It is only
self serving now. Not a service but a high priced hobby. After all, it
is called the Amateur Radio Service. We do not have a right to our
allocated frequencies. We only use them by the grace of the FCC. So
LHA, your tounge in cheek comments ring very true indeed.
JEP

"Dwight Stewart" wrote in message
hlink.net...
"N2EY" wrote:
"Dwight Stewart" writes:
The FCC doesn't have a mandate
to test discipline.

Yes, they do. That's what the "character"
stuff in the rules is about.

I've read the rules many times, but must have missed the part or parts
about character testing.

There's a local ham around here who
has generated so much trouble on
various repeaters and earned himself
so many warning letters that FCC is
considering not renewing his license
for "character" reasons. IOW he
simply doesn't have the necessary
self-discipline to be a ham.

First, what does that have to do with testing? Second, there is nothing
in
the rules about refusing a renewal based on character, so I seriously
doubt
that would be the FCC's explination for any action like this (a pattern of
rule violations, yes).

Agreed. But those things do constitute
"discipline".

Only if you stretch the word to mean something beyond common usage.

Dwight Stewart (W5NET)

http://www.qsl.net/w5net/


Unfortunately, I believe I have heard the story of which Jim speaks...or at
least one exactly like it. In fact, it seems to me that it was related to
the renewal of....hmmm, was it that Herb Schoen...something-or-other down in
the Carribean somewhere? Whatever license renewal denial it was, it was due
to character and that was the words of the FCC.

I think that's most unfortunate and don't agree with the practice at all.
Bust someone for R&R, etc., but the FCC--nor anyone and certainly not a
government--should be able to deny something because of "character."

Kim W5TIT

"JEP" wrote:

(snip) Amateur Radio as a service is
gone. It is only self serving now. Not
a service but a high priced hobby.
After all, it is called the Amateur
Radio Service.


First, you're obviously confused about the word "service." In FCC
terminology, "service" refers to a group of frequencies meant to serve a
particular purpose for the users of those frequencies, not anything done by
the users of those frequencies. As a result, we have the Amateur Radio
Service, Radio Broadcast Services, Cable TV Relay Service, Maritime Service,
Personal Radio Services, Citizens Band Radio Service, Fixed Microwave
Services, and so on through a long list of other radio services. In other
words, the word "service" in Amateur Radio Service does not refer to any
"service" we might provide to others.

Second, you're completely wrong about "service" being gone within the
Amateur Radio community. Based on what I've seen, I'd estimate as much as
75% of the current operators are involved in some form of public service
related activity in any given year. Of course, the need for our help is
high, meaning even more should become involved, but that hardly suggests the
idea of service is gone today.

The newsgroups "rec.radio.shortwave" and "rec.radio.cb" were deleted from
this reply (off-topic in those newsgroups).


Dwight Stewart (W5NET)

http://www.qsl.net/w5net/

That deemphasis has already occurred. The no-code tech was instituted in
the late 1980s and the code for the higher classes was dropped to only
5wpm
in 2000. There is no need for further deemphasis. Particularly when the
stated reason was attract technically inclined people. That hasn't
happened
so the reason for deemphasis has been proven to be invalid.


Get the foul mouthed red necked yahoos off of HF and I'll consider wasting
my time to learn CW to meet and exceed your criteria.

At 5-wpm, it's more a demonstration of discipline than proficiency. That
is
where the true crux lies.


A better demonstration of discipline would be if CW trained amateurs would
stop using HF like it was 11 meters.