N2EY wrote:
Mike Coslo wrote in message ...

Da Shadow wrote:


400 GOTA QSOs seems a bit high considering we will try and teach newbies how
to operate. I think it is more important to tutor folks on HF and the
digital modes than to run the 400 QSOs. Perhaps we can do both.

It is high. The nice thing about the GOTA is that newbies and the
inexperienced can hone their skills without affecting the more seasoned
operators. My first field day was before the days of GOTA, and I knew
very well that I was holding the score down a bit with my slowness. GOTA
removes that. It's a great way to get started or get back in action.


I agree 100% on the purpose of GOTA but I think you guys both
misunderstand this rule:

"4.1.1.5. A maximum of 400 QSOs made by this station may be claimed
for
credit by its primary Field Day operation. A 100-point bonus may be
claimed
by the primary Field Day operation if the GOTA station reaches the 100
QSO
level."

Nope, no misunderstanding. I just mean that 400 QSO's is a very high
number to pick up on the GOTA station. I doubt many clubs get there.


The GOTA station is limited to a *maximum* of 400 QSOs. You cannot
count GOTA QSOs for credit beyond 400.

I think the reason for this rule, and the very loose definition of who
can run the GOTA station, is to keep the GOTA stations busy yet
focused on the truly inexperienced.

If you work *at least* 100 GOTA QSOs, you get 100 additional points
beyond the QSO points themselves.

Kerect!

So the strategy is to work exactly 400 GOTA QSOs. That's less than 17
per hour if you go straight through. 17 per hour is more than 3
minutes per QSO.

True, but I'd expect no GOTA stations will be in solid use. I've been
supervising our club GOTA station since the concept started, and at
least our typical day goes similar to a few people here, and a few
there. I think only one person at our station ever went beyond 25 QSO's.
And those QSO's aren't super quick. In addition, there is often an
instructional period, where they learn about the exchange, and pertinent
operating technique, that sort of stuff.


The big problem with the GOTA station in a 5F group is interference.
It's bad enough when two stations of different modes try to use the
same band at the same time, but when the GOTA folks show up on the
same band....

Yup. I would highly suggest a 5F group try to put up a Beverage antenna
as their common receive antenna, and get it as far away as the FD rules
allow 1000 foot circle that all the equipment has to be in. Don't know
if that EOC center will accommodate that or not.


- Mike KB3EIA -

In article , Mike Coslo writes:

N2EY wrote:
Mike Coslo wrote in message ...

Da Shadow wrote:


400 GOTA QSOs seems a bit high considering we will try and teach newbies
how
to operate. I think it is more important to tutor folks on HF and the
digital modes than to run the 400 QSOs. Perhaps we can do both.

It is high. The nice thing about the GOTA is that newbies and the
inexperienced can hone their skills without affecting the more seasoned
operators. My first field day was before the days of GOTA, and I knew
very well that I was holding the score down a bit with my slowness. GOTA
removes that. It's a great way to get started or get back in action.


I agree 100% on the purpose of GOTA but I think you guys both
misunderstand this rule:

"4.1.1.5. A maximum of 400 QSOs made by this station may be claimed
for
credit by its primary Field Day operation. A 100-point bonus may be
claimed
by the primary Field Day operation if the GOTA station reaches the 100
QSO
level."

Nope, no misunderstanding. I just mean that 400 QSO's is a very high
number to pick up on the GOTA station. I doubt many clubs get there.

OK!

The GOTA station is limited to a *maximum* of 400 QSOs. You cannot
count GOTA QSOs for credit beyond 400.

I think the reason for this rule, and the very loose definition of who
can run the GOTA station, is to keep the GOTA stations busy yet
focused on the truly inexperienced.

If you work *at least* 100 GOTA QSOs, you get 100 additional points
beyond the QSO points themselves.

Kerect!

So the strategy is to work exactly 400 GOTA QSOs. That's less than 17
per hour if you go straight through. 17 per hour is more than 3
minutes per QSO.

True, but I'd expect no GOTA stations will be in solid use. I've been
supervising our club GOTA station since the concept started, and at
least our typical day goes similar to a few people here, and a few
there. I think only one person at our station ever went beyond 25 QSO's.
And those QSO's aren't super quick. In addition, there is often an
instructional period, where they learn about the exchange, and pertinent
operating technique, that sort of stuff.

Sure. Point is, though, that by setting the number at 400, we don't have the
problem of having to shut the GOTA station down because the quota has been
reached.

The big problem with the GOTA station in a 5F group is interference.
It's bad enough when two stations of different modes try to use the
same band at the same time, but when the GOTA folks show up on the
same band....

Yup. I would highly suggest a 5F group try to put up a Beverage antenna

as their common receive antenna, and get it as far away as the FD rules
allow 1000 foot circle that all the equipment has to be in. Don't know
if that EOC center will accommodate that or not.

Why a Beverage? It receives well in one direction only, but in most of the USA
you need more than one direction.

73 de Jim, N2EY

N2EY wrote:

In article , Mike Coslo writes:


N2EY wrote:

Mike Coslo wrote in message ...


Da Shadow wrote:



400 GOTA QSOs seems a bit high considering we will try and teach newbies

how

to operate. I think it is more important to tutor folks on HF and the
digital modes than to run the 400 QSOs. Perhaps we can do both.

It is high. The nice thing about the GOTA is that newbies and the
inexperienced can hone their skills without affecting the more seasoned
operators. My first field day was before the days of GOTA, and I knew
very well that I was holding the score down a bit with my slowness. GOTA
removes that. It's a great way to get started or get back in action.


I agree 100% on the purpose of GOTA but I think you guys both
misunderstand this rule:

"4.1.1.5. A maximum of 400 QSOs made by this station may be claimed
for
credit by its primary Field Day operation. A 100-point bonus may be
claimed
by the primary Field Day operation if the GOTA station reaches the 100
QSO
level."

Nope, no misunderstanding. I just mean that 400 QSO's is a very high
number to pick up on the GOTA station. I doubt many clubs get there.


OK!


The GOTA station is limited to a *maximum* of 400 QSOs. You cannot
count GOTA QSOs for credit beyond 400.

I think the reason for this rule, and the very loose definition of who
can run the GOTA station, is to keep the GOTA stations busy yet
focused on the truly inexperienced.

If you work *at least* 100 GOTA QSOs, you get 100 additional points
beyond the QSO points themselves.

Kerect!


So the strategy is to work exactly 400 GOTA QSOs. That's less than 17
per hour if you go straight through. 17 per hour is more than 3
minutes per QSO.

True, but I'd expect no GOTA stations will be in solid use. I've been
supervising our club GOTA station since the concept started, and at
least our typical day goes similar to a few people here, and a few
there. I think only one person at our station ever went beyond 25 QSO's.
And those QSO's aren't super quick. In addition, there is often an
instructional period, where they learn about the exchange, and pertinent
operating technique, that sort of stuff.


Sure. Point is, though, that by setting the number at 400, we don't have the
problem of having to shut the GOTA station down because the quota has been
reached.

Well true, but in that vein of thought, we might as well not have a
limit at all.

FWIW, I don't mind limits on the GOTA station, mainly because I'm the
control op for our club. I sit with the newbies and hams getting back
into the fold all day, and then after the station closes down, I can
kick in the afterburners on the night shift. I've made good friends
working the overnight. (yeah, us crazies gotta stick together!)


The big problem with the GOTA station in a 5F group is interference.
It's bad enough when two stations of different modes try to use the
same band at the same time, but when the GOTA folks show up on the
same band....

Yup. I would highly suggest a 5F group try to put up a Beverage antenna
as their common receive antenna, and get it as far away as the FD rules
allow 1000 foot circle that all the equipment has to be in. Don't know
if that EOC center will accommodate that or not.


Why a Beverage? It receives well in one direction only, but in most of the USA
you need more than one direction.

When you use a multiple wavelength Beverage the directivity isn't quite
as bad. (or good - depending on what you are trying to achieve) I don't
recall the length of ours, but it was at least 2 wavelengths on 80 meters.

In any event, it quieted the interference between the rigs, and I don't
recall any significant losses to the east of us, since we still heard
the stations in that direction.

- Mike KB3EIA -

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:

Sure. Point is, though, that by setting the number at 400, we don't have
the
problem of having to shut the GOTA station down because the quota has been
reached.

Well true, but in that vein of thought, we might as well not have a
limit at all.

If we didn't, it becomes like another station only without being put in the
totals.

FWIW, I don't mind limits on the GOTA station, mainly because I'm the
control op for our club. I sit with the newbies and hams getting back
into the fold all day, and then after the station closes down, I can
kick in the afterburners on the night shift. I've made good friends
working the overnight. (yeah, us crazies gotta stick together!)

Oyez!First time I did that was...1968?

The big problem with the GOTA station in a 5F group is interference.
It's bad enough when two stations of different modes try to use the
same band at the same time, but when the GOTA folks show up on the
same band....

Yup. I would highly suggest a 5F group try to put up a Beverage antenna

as their common receive antenna, and get it as far away as the FD rules
allow 1000 foot circle that all the equipment has to be in. Don't know
if that EOC center will accommodate that or not.


Why a Beverage? It receives well in one direction only, but in most of the
USA you need more than one direction.

When you use a multiple wavelength Beverage the directivity isn't quite

as bad. (or good - depending on what you are trying to achieve) I don't
recall the length of ours, but it was at least 2 wavelengths on 80 meters.

2 wavelenghts on 80 is over 500 feet...

In any event, it quieted the interference between the rigs, and I don't

recall any significant losses to the east of us, since we still heard
the stations in that direction.

Thye physical separation alone may have been the trick.

Seems to me the optimum setup for a multi is to put the stations on the rim of
a circle and the generator in the center. Adjacent stations are on widely
different bands and modes. Antennas are just inside the 1000 foot line.

73 de Jim, N2EY

PAMNO (N2EY) wrote in message ...
In article , Mike Coslo writes:

N2EY wrote:
Mike Coslo wrote in message ...

Da Shadow wrote:


400 GOTA QSOs seems a bit high considering we will try and teach newbies
how
to operate. I think it is more important to tutor folks on HF and the
digital modes than to run the 400 QSOs. Perhaps we can do both.

It is high. The nice thing about the GOTA is that newbies and the
inexperienced can hone their skills without affecting the more seasoned
operators. My first field day was before the days of GOTA, and I knew
very well that I was holding the score down a bit with my slowness. GOTA
removes that. It's a great way to get started or get back in action.


I agree 100% on the purpose of GOTA but I think you guys both
misunderstand this rule:

"4.1.1.5. A maximum of 400 QSOs made by this station may be claimed
for
credit by its primary Field Day operation. A 100-point bonus may be
claimed
by the primary Field Day operation if the GOTA station reaches the 100
QSO
level."

Nope, no misunderstanding. I just mean that 400 QSO's is a very high
number to pick up on the GOTA station. I doubt many clubs get there.

OK!

The GOTA station is limited to a *maximum* of 400 QSOs. You cannot
count GOTA QSOs for credit beyond 400.

I think the reason for this rule, and the very loose definition of who
can run the GOTA station, is to keep the GOTA stations busy yet
focused on the truly inexperienced.

If you work *at least* 100 GOTA QSOs, you get 100 additional points
beyond the QSO points themselves.

Kerect!

So the strategy is to work exactly 400 GOTA QSOs. That's less than 17
per hour if you go straight through. 17 per hour is more than 3
minutes per QSO.

True, but I'd expect no GOTA stations will be in solid use. I've been
supervising our club GOTA station since the concept started, and at
least our typical day goes similar to a few people here, and a few
there. I think only one person at our station ever went beyond 25 QSO's.
And those QSO's aren't super quick. In addition, there is often an
instructional period, where they learn about the exchange, and pertinent
operating technique, that sort of stuff.

Sure. Point is, though, that by setting the number at 400, we don't have the
problem of having to shut the GOTA station down because the quota has been
reached.

The big problem with the GOTA station in a 5F group is interference.
It's bad enough when two stations of different modes try to use the
same band at the same time, but when the GOTA folks show up on the
same band....

Yup. I would highly suggest a 5F group try to put up a Beverage antenna

as their common receive antenna, and get it as far away as the FD rules
allow 1000 foot circle that all the equipment has to be in. Don't know
if that EOC center will accommodate that or not.

Why a Beverage? It receives well in one direction only,

Which is his whole point.

but in most of the USA
you need more than one direction.

A FD listening Beverage is basically a very good idea. Yes, they're
directional but from here on the east coast where Mike is located
beverage patterns can cover most of the country if they're done right.
The big advantage Beverages bring to the game is very high
front-to-back ratios. I suspect that what he's talking about here is
stringing a Beverage generally west of the transmiting antennas thus
reducing the levels of the recieved energies of the harmonics (and
other assorted crud) from the other FD stations operating on the lower
bands. IF the near end of the Beverage is some significant distance
from the transmitting antennas in terms of wavelength.

The problem I see with Mike's plan is that a one thousand foot
Beverage on, say 15M, is gonna have a pattern like a pencil and would
be basically useless because of it's very narrow beamwidth. A more
better idea might be optimized Beverages per band, compromise designs
between beamwith and length.

In the end isn't it a bit late in the game for this discussion . . ?

73 de Jim, N2EY