Phil Kane wrote:
On 15 Jun 2005 17:01:18 -0700, wrote:


In all my 43 years in engineering I've met a grand total of four woman
engineers, two MEs, one EE and a Chem E.


In my 50 years in engineering I've =dated= more women engineers than
you seem to have met, was engaged to one (nuclear engineer) and
married another (EE). In my wife's office alone there are more than
4 =PEs= on her floor, including the chief of the structural engineering
section (imagine that, a lady tower engineer). Had my wife gone
through the paperwork as she talked about twenty years ago she, too,
would have been a PE.


Our contesting club alone has
three female members, an old girlfriend is a ham and I met W3CUL. Out
of Lord only knows how many engineers and hams I've met over the years.


In our club, the largest radio club in the state if not in the
Pacific Northwest, about 1/3 of the hams are women, and of them,
about half are active on the air in some fashion or other.

That IS a significant number, Phil.

- Mike KB3EIA -

Dee:

You miss a very important reality.

If the youngsters are not introduced to amateur radio--then most of
those interested in RF uses will go the Ghz freqs of lans/wans and setup
various neighborhood or city/town/county computer communication
networks, and when they look back at amateur radio and the code
requirement--they will laugh and become freebanders!!!

Much better to get 'em started right up front--although the oldsters
here act like radio is a big thing, the kids don't think so--they have
been chatting the world for a big percentage of their lifetimes on the
internet... they don't have to wait for conditions to improve, they
don't have to buy expensive equipment or set up large antennas or run
linears--they chat 24/7 with total and complete reliability...

they don't have to find someone with a license to chat with, anyone able
to obtain a computer they can and do chat with... there are NO
BARRIERS, compare that to amateur radio...

.... then there is the data throughput capabilities of the net which the
narrow rf spectrum amateur radio provides will never allow for...

The lack of them here proves there is some REAL problem, and that is
what I have been saying--AMATEUR RADIO WILL HAVE TO CHANGE AND COME OUT
OF THE PAST AND JOIN THE NEW TECHNOLOGIES WITH DYNAMIC MINDS TO MEET
THESE CHALLENGES OR DIE...

.... one or the other is inevitable, surely a blind person can see
that... I would think you might be free of the DINOSAUR SIZED EGOS of
the males here and able to grasp this immediately...

John

"Dee Flint" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
oups.com...

[snip]

Im convinced that events in the future will prove us right. Today we
have a "bloat the numbers at any cost" game which is doomed to
backfire
eventually. The big question is how badly it will backfire and how
much
damage will have been be done before it happens. The history of this
country over last couple decades is chock full of eamples of backing
away from failed giveaways. It's only a matter of time until ham
radio
gets it's turn.


The "bloat the numbers at any cost" will backfire for the simple
reason that too many with no real interest will get in and then drop
out. Then we will see once again a decline in numbers that will panic
people just as the relatively small drop off from the peak is panicing
people now.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

Dee Flint wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...

John Smith wrote:

Dee:



[snip]


"Dee Flint" wrote in message
...

"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
...



[snip]


So what you really needed was exposure - publicity - examples - demos.

Were you attracted to amateur radio because it was like the internet,
or because it was something very different?


Yes I needed to know what it was all about before developing an interest in
radio for it's own sake. The Novice/Tech class I took along with my husband
at the time filled that role.

I have to note that in an earlier post where you disagreed with me
about a person "knowing" they wanted to be a ham, after reading this, I
have to agree that the things that I most enjoy now are nothing like
what I thought I wanted to do when first becoming a ham.

Which of course is a powerful argument for keeping the Morse code test.

Once I had some basic knowledge about ham radio, I was attracted by the fact
that it was NOT like the internet. What attracted me was that I could talk
around the world with NO INFRASTRUCTURE. That communications was totally
dependent on me and my skills and my knowledge of propagation once I had the
basic radio and antenna. Here I, just an average citizen, could put a radio
signal around the world and even beyond if I wanted to pursue it.

If it had been like the internet, I'd probably have lost interest.

Although I use the Internet a lot (probably waay too much) I love Ham
radio precisely because it ISN'T the Internet.

- Mike KB3EIA -

John Smith wrote:
Dee:

Down load Mirc (it is free) if you have a windows machine (if apple
there are other programs)and learn to IRC... you will find you have been
missing a lot..

DIfferent strokes for different folks, John. Internet Relay Chat is for
some of us just about the *least* interesting facet of the Internet.

- Mike KB3EIA -

Dee Flint wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...

[snip]

Im convinced that events in the future will prove us right. Today we
have a "bloat the numbers at any cost" game which is doomed to backfire
eventually. The big question is how badly it will backfire and how much
damage will have been be done before it happens. The history of this
country over last couple decades is chock full of eamples of backing
away from failed giveaways. It's only a matter of time until ham radio
gets it's turn.



The "bloat the numbers at any cost" will backfire for the simple reason that
too many with no real interest will get in and then drop out.

Easy one Dee, cuz I think that is just what happened recently!


Then we will
see once again a decline in numbers that will panic people just as the
relatively small drop off from the peak is panicing people now.

The ability of middle aged and older men to become incredibly agitated
and angry about trivial things.

- Mike KB3EIA -

Dee:

If you download mirc, study it and how to use it, hook to the dalnet
server and pick a room like #australia - #40+friends #30-60friends -
#California - #Sweden - etc - etc -etc...

.... you will get lost for hours chatting, you can instantly send and
receive pictures and documents with other room members, the chat happens
in real time--you can go voice-to-net with another free application and
chat to the other countries for free in speech... after you have seen
and experienced all this--tell me amateur radio doesn't have to "GET
REAL!" I doubt if these old buggers here could even get Mirc installed
on their machines, learn to use it and find out what they are
missing--these old boy are just too plum SLOW!!!
grin

download mirc for free here == http://www.mirc.com

Warmest regards,
John

"John Smith" wrote in message
...
Dee:

You miss a very important reality.

If the youngsters are not introduced to amateur radio--then most of
those interested in RF uses will go the Ghz freqs of lans/wans and
setup various neighborhood or city/town/county computer communication
networks, and when they look back at amateur radio and the code
requirement--they will laugh and become freebanders!!!

Much better to get 'em started right up front--although the oldsters
here act like radio is a big thing, the kids don't think so--they have
been chatting the world for a big percentage of their lifetimes on the
internet... they don't have to wait for conditions to improve, they
don't have to buy expensive equipment or set up large antennas or run
linears--they chat 24/7 with total and complete reliability...

they don't have to find someone with a license to chat with, anyone
able to obtain a computer they can and do chat with... there are NO
BARRIERS, compare that to amateur radio...

... then there is the data throughput capabilities of the net which
the narrow rf spectrum amateur radio provides will never allow for...

The lack of them here proves there is some REAL problem, and that is
what I have been saying--AMATEUR RADIO WILL HAVE TO CHANGE AND COME
OUT OF THE PAST AND JOIN THE NEW TECHNOLOGIES WITH DYNAMIC MINDS TO
MEET THESE CHALLENGES OR DIE...

... one or the other is inevitable, surely a blind person can see
that... I would think you might be free of the DINOSAUR SIZED EGOS of
the males here and able to grasp this immediately...

John

"Dee Flint" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
oups.com...

[snip]

Im convinced that events in the future will prove us right. Today we
have a "bloat the numbers at any cost" game which is doomed to
backfire
eventually. The big question is how badly it will backfire and how
much
damage will have been be done before it happens. The history of this
country over last couple decades is chock full of eamples of backing
away from failed giveaways. It's only a matter of time until ham
radio
gets it's turn.


The "bloat the numbers at any cost" will backfire for the simple
reason that too many with no real interest will get in and then drop
out. Then we will see once again a decline in numbers that will
panic people just as the relatively small drop off from the peak is
panicing people now.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

"John Smith" wrote in message
...
Dee:

Down load Mirc (it is free) if you have a windows machine (if apple there
are other programs)and learn to IRC... you will find you have been missing
a lot..

John


Tried it and didn't like it. The magic of ham radio is that you don't need
an infrastructure such as the internet.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

"John Smith" wrote in message
...
Dee:

If you download mirc, study it and how to use it, hook to the dalnet
server and pick a room like #australia - #40+friends #30-60friends -
#California - #Sweden - etc - etc -etc...

... you will get lost for hours chatting, you can instantly send and
receive pictures and documents with other room members, the chat happens
in real time--you can go voice-to-net with another free application and
chat to the other countries for free in speech... after you have seen and
experienced all this--tell me amateur radio doesn't have to "GET REAL!" I
doubt if these old buggers here could even get Mirc installed on their
machines, learn to use it and find out what they are missing--these old
boy are just too plum SLOW!!!
grin

download mirc for free here == http://www.mirc.com

Warmest regards,
John

Not interested in internet chat. Tried it and it's dull. Too much
infrastructure and not enough independence to make it a fun hobby.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

Dee:

Well, at least you prove my point, the world moves on--some stay... but
as it has always been-it will wait for no man or woman... new mindsets
will now have to move us up-to-date, which has been my argument all
along... it will be a pleasure to see this happen in my lifetime...

John

"Dee Flint" wrote in message
...

"John Smith" wrote in message
...
Dee:

If you download mirc, study it and how to use it, hook to the dalnet
server and pick a room like #australia - #40+friends #30-60friends -
#California - #Sweden - etc - etc -etc...

... you will get lost for hours chatting, you can instantly send and
receive pictures and documents with other room members, the chat
happens in real time--you can go voice-to-net with another free
application and chat to the other countries for free in speech...
after you have seen and experienced all this--tell me amateur radio
doesn't have to "GET REAL!" I doubt if these old buggers here could
even get Mirc installed on their machines, learn to use it and find
out what they are missing--these old boy are just too plum SLOW!!!
grin

download mirc for free here == http://www.mirc.com

Warmest regards,
John

Not interested in internet chat. Tried it and it's dull. Too much
infrastructure and not enough independence to make it a fun hobby.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

Mike:

Yanno, back in the horse and buggy days--when the horse was king--same
thing--some waited with their horses for other to come to their senses
and get rid of their autos... it never happened...

I think this is very much the same where those so religiously and
historically tied to the past and what has always been will remain blind
to the fact that change is inevitable...

I know the question is not "if it will happen?" but rather, "how long is
this going to take?"

I feel like I am back at Kitty Hawk saying, "Now it is only a matter of
time, men WILL FLY THE EARTH AS EAGLES!" grin

"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
...
Dee Flint wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...

[snip]

Im convinced that events in the future will prove us right. Today we
have a "bloat the numbers at any cost" game which is doomed to
backfire
eventually. The big question is how badly it will backfire and how
much
damage will have been be done before it happens. The history of this
country over last couple decades is chock full of eamples of backing
away from failed giveaways. It's only a matter of time until ham
radio
gets it's turn.



The "bloat the numbers at any cost" will backfire for the simple
reason that too many with no real interest will get in and then drop
out.

Easy one Dee, cuz I think that is just what happened recently!


Then we will see once again a decline in numbers that will panic
people just as the relatively small drop off from the peak is
panicing people now.

The ability of middle aged and older men to become incredibly agitated
and angry about trivial things.

- Mike KB3EIA -