From: "John Smith" on Fri 22 Jul 2005 21:08

Geesh...

You guys are for real huh?
You think code and a radio makes you special guys?

It does in their minds. They are the PCTA *Extras*!

Was the license really so difficult for you, you believe the rest of
us with much different opinions are stupid and find it that big a
challenge?

Yes they do. :-)

PCTA extras are the Gods of Radio! [amateur radio, that is]

I started building tesla coils at ~10, I got my novice ticket and
built my first single tube transmitter when I was 12, my first degree
was in electronic engineering in '72... I ate this chit up... I was
bored and didn't know what I wanted to be--until they invented the
computer... I returned to college in 1978 and got my BS in CS in 1981
along with a BA in journalism, I completed my MS in CS in '83...
since then I have always taught a night class at the local jr. college
and continue to take classes at the local university to stay current
and be with fresh young minds...

Careful, John, careful. Gonad the Librarian (K4YZ) will come
in here and totally denounce "night classes" as something for
immigrants or "stupids." :-)

Get real... lay down the opium pipe and step out of the gutter!

That be a bit strong, John. Tom/Garique is basically an OK
kind of guy. It's the OTHER PCTA extras in here who need
their hairy legs (covered by jackboots) shaved a bit (words
toned down considerably to be 'courteous' to the arrogant).

And, I just consider myself an average guy (you should see my sister,
she has all the brains in the family!)... of course, I do live in a
nice neighborhood and have nice neighbors...

Oh, no...another segue into Real Estate and Mortgages! :-)

That's even worse than "ham balloons reaching the threshold
of space!" [which others have already done but one in here
wants congratulatory messages praising him for announcing
he is "going to do it!"]

There can be NO controversial commentary on the code test
for radio amateurs in here. All MUST do it to show their
dedication and committment to the amateur community! It
has always been that way and it must always be! It is the
heart and soul of U.S. amateur radio! CW uber alles!!
Sieg heil!!!

Oops, got carried away with PCTA spirit words there... :-)

bit bit

Geesh...

You guys are for real huh?
You think code and a radio makes you special guys?

Ah com' on John ....did you ever hear me say anything about CW being special
...... in fact the older I get the less "specialness" means to be ..... as
if it really meant anything back then .....



Was the license really so difficult for you, you believe the rest of
us with much different opinions are stupid and find it that big a
challenge?


Never studpidity ....motivation .... well based on some of the arguments I
have seen here and in my ham d'jour life ....it just seems that if someone
really wanted HF privlidges then suck it up ...study a bit ...pass and have
the ritualistic back yard key burial .......then get on with life ..... but
that apparently will not be necessary now .....no carping ...just fact
.....and I will welcome anyone to the bands and if they are on CW without
being tested ...no big deal. I call that a win for band useage which we
need and for ham radio in general ....




I started building tesla coils at ~10, I got my novice ticket and
built my first single tube transmitter when I was 12, my first degree
was in electronic engineering in '72... I ate this chit up... I was
bored and didn't know what I wanted to be--until they invented the
computer... I returned to college in 1978 and got my BS in CS in 1981
along with a BA in journalism, I completed my MS in CS in '83...
since then I have always taught a night class at the local jr. college
and continue to take classes at the local university to stay current
and be with fresh young minds...


Gee John ...then why are your posts so bizzare ??? I really don't like to
prejudge anyone but your comments over the last several months really don't
reflect the above ...I am sorry if I say this but I am a bit surprized ....
I deal a lot with "old timers" in my profession .....and I find them
interesting and their journey through this life more so in a positive rather
then a negative ..... Also comments about people with problems, disabilities
and diseases don't fit.


Get real... lay down the opium pipe and step out of the gutter!


Huh .....???? oh well ...never tried the stuff thank God but I do like
a couple of beers now and then ....


And, I just consider myself an average guy (you should see my sister,
she has all the brains in the family!)... of course, I do live in a
nice neighborhood and have nice neighbors...

John


I'm glad you do ...as I have good ones also ....have to tell you one of
these days about my old ones ... .."adventures in paradise" ...... complete
with the pit bulls and multiple 20 second visits from strangers throughout
the day ....

Take care John ...73 Tom KI3R

Joe Guthart wrote
I am glad the FCC finally took charge of the situation and decided to drop the code requirements. Here's why ...


"I like Amateur Radio and want it to be a life-long hobby for me ...
however, I just plainly can't take time to effectively study the code
at this point in my life . . . I got my Technician license about two
and a half years ago . . because it was a neat little challenge for me
to combine radio communications with some of the newer digital modes .
.. . Basically, it was fun, not really technical challenging, but a nice
way to relax. I do enjoy making contacts on 6 meters. I would play
around with some different radio, antenna, and computer configurations
and started to develop a relationship with some fellow ham buddies."

- - - -

If you had the time to do all that you had the time to learn 5wpm.

- - - -

"Fellow hams need to sit back and take an objective look at this hobby
because it is dying a rapid death!"

- - - -

The hobby will have to "die" by about 80% before the number of hams
becomes the same as it was when I first got on the bands.
- - - -

"Take a look at the declining number of amateur radio manufacturers and
radios. How could any business justify spending a lot on research and
development in a market that is collapsing?"

- - - -

Within the past 2-3 years the ham equipment manufacturers have
introduced or are about to introduce at least new top-of-the-line HF
xcvrs, the least expensive $3,500, the most expensive, the Icom 7800
costs around $10.5k. Icom didn't thnk they'd sell more than 200 of them
in this country. They sold the whole batch in six weeks. This is a
"collapse"?! You've been listening to the wrong talking heads and
you're simply parroting them and/or rationales are where you find 'em
eh? .

- - - -

"This will not kill our hobby, but will inject more life into it."

- - - -

For maybe two years. Then what?

- - - -

73's to All,

Joe / KG4YJS

w3rv

Within the past 2-3 years the ham equipment manufacturers have
introduced or are about to introduce at least *three* new top-of-the-line HF
xcvrs . . .

kelly:

Yep, really dynamic chit goin' on here. Just a quick tune across
those old HF's and you are taken back with the overcrowding and
congestion, my gawd man--it is a damn nightmare!

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz....

Ohhhh, that was just a dream, huh? Darn, was just starting to get
interesting! (or, shortly will grin)

John

wrote in message
oups.com...

Joe Guthart wrote
I am glad the FCC finally took charge of the situation and decided
to drop the code requirements. Here's why ...


"I like Amateur Radio and want it to be a life-long hobby for me ...
however, I just plainly can't take time to effectively study the
code
at this point in my life . . . I got my Technician license about two
and a half years ago . . because it was a neat little challenge for
me
to combine radio communications with some of the newer digital modes
.
. . Basically, it was fun, not really technical challenging, but a
nice
way to relax. I do enjoy making contacts on 6 meters. I would play
around with some different radio, antenna, and computer
configurations
and started to develop a relationship with some fellow ham buddies."

- - - -

If you had the time to do all that you had the time to learn 5wpm.

- - - -

"Fellow hams need to sit back and take an objective look at this
hobby
because it is dying a rapid death!"

- - - -

The hobby will have to "die" by about 80% before the number of hams
becomes the same as it was when I first got on the bands.
- - - -

"Take a look at the declining number of amateur radio manufacturers
and
radios. How could any business justify spending a lot on research
and
development in a market that is collapsing?"

- - - -

Within the past 2-3 years the ham equipment manufacturers have
introduced or are about to introduce at least new top-of-the-line HF
xcvrs, the least expensive $3,500, the most expensive, the Icom 7800
costs around $10.5k. Icom didn't thnk they'd sell more than 200 of
them
in this country. They sold the whole batch in six weeks. This is a
"collapse"?! You've been listening to the wrong talking heads and
you're simply parroting them and/or rationales are where you find
'em
eh? .

- - - -

"This will not kill our hobby, but will inject more life into it."

- - - -

For maybe two years. Then what?

- - - -

73's to All,

Joe / KG4YJS

w3rv

Joe Guthart wrote:
I am glad the FCC finally took charge of the situation and
decided to drop the code requirements.

Well, it's what they're proposing to do, anyway.

Here's why ...

I like Amateur Radio and want it to be a life-long hobby
for me ... however, I just plainly can't take time
to effectively study the code at this point in my life.
I think my story is pretty common for most of the
new people entering Amateur Radio today. I am a
43 year old married father of three children. I
have a background in Aerospace Engineering and my
full time work is in the high technology sector
working with many well known computing infrastructure
companies. I got my Technician license about two and
a half years ago because it was a neat little challenge
for me to combine radio communications with some of
the newer digital modes. Basically, it was fun, not
really technical challenging, but a nice way to relax.
I do enjoy making contacts on 6 meters. I would
play around with some different radio, antenna, and
computer configurations and started to develop a relationship
with some fellow ham buddies. Soon I became limited
with the VHF/UHF band and wanted to hop onto HF. Of
course, by the current rules one would have to jump on
and take on learning Morse Code. I am absolutely sure
I could do this if I had enough time. Having an ongoing
career and being a family man, doesn't really leave
a whole lot of time to practice dits and dahs. I have
actually played around with the code several times, but
real life events and changing priorities always got in
the way; not en excuse just reality. I really do see
learning the code as similar to my older engineering
brethren making me learn how to use a slide rule; it's kind of neat, but not really effective for me, or most folks, given the advance of other computing methods and devices.

So what that boils down to is this, Joe: You don't want to
spend the time or effort needed to learn enough Morse Code
to pass the test.

What about the written tests for General and Extra? In order
to use digital modes on HF, you need at least a General
Class license.

Fellow hams need to sit back and take an objective look
at this hobby because it is dying a rapid death!

How do you figure?

When I became a ham in 1967, there were about 260,000 US hams.
Now there are over 650,000. The peak was about two years ago,
but there have been ups and downs before.

Amateur Radio needs me and people just like me to join in on
the HF bands and to use our real world high tech expertise to
help further Amateur Radio.

OK, fine, how *exactly* will that happen?

Will you design and build new high tech radios?
Develop new high-performance modes of communication?
Set up some sort of new radio network?
Get more people interested in amateur radio by
demos, articles, etc.?

Where will the time come from to do that stuff?

For that matter, where will the time come from for
you to set up an HF station and operate it?

Amateur Radio also needs my $$$$. Take a look at
the declining number of amateur radio manufacturers
and radios.

Did that in another part of this thread. The trend is
opposite to what you're saying.

How could any business justify spending a
lot on research and development in a market
that is collapsing?

Well, the manufacturers don't think it's collapsing!

Finally, I honor all those of you who are code proficient.

Thank you!

I too may one day still be code proficient even if there is no formal testing.

Why not now?

20-45 minutes a day for 4-6 weeks should get you to 5 wpm. There
are freeware Morse Code trainers that will run on most PCs. I
recommend the G4FON one.

However, I do think that the right decision has been made
by the FCC and will ultimately be finalized with little
changes.

I don't think it's the right thing, but I'm afraid FCC will
do it anyway.

This will not kill our hobby, but will inject more life into
it.

I hope you're right.

73 de Jim, N2EY

From: on Jul 24, 6:26 pm

Joe Guthart wrote:

I am glad the FCC finally took charge of the situation and
decided to drop the code requirements.

Well, it's what they're proposing to do, anyway.

You thought that out by yourself from Notice of PROPOSED
Rule Making (NPRM)? :-)

Here's why ...

I like Amateur Radio and want it to be a life-long hobby
for me ... however, I just plainly can't take time
to effectively study the code at this point in my life.
I think my story is pretty common for most of the
new people entering Amateur Radio today. I am a
43 year old married father of three children. I
have a background in Aerospace Engineering and my
full time work is in the high technology sector
working with many well known computing infrastructure
companies. I got my Technician license about two and
a half years ago because it was a neat little challenge
for me to combine radio communications with some of
the newer digital modes. Basically, it was fun, not
really technical challenging, but a nice way to relax.
I do enjoy making contacts on 6 meters. I would
play around with some different radio, antenna, and
computer configurations and started to develop a relationship
with some fellow ham buddies. Soon I became limited
with the VHF/UHF band and wanted to hop onto HF. Of
course, by the current rules one would have to jump on
and take on learning Morse Code. I am absolutely sure
I could do this if I had enough time. Having an ongoing
career and being a family man, doesn't really leave
a whole lot of time to practice dits and dahs. I have
actually played around with the code several times, but
real life events and changing priorities always got in
the way; not en excuse just reality. I really do see
learning the code as similar to my older engineering
brethren making me learn how to use a slide rule; it's kind of
neat, but not really effective for me, or most folks, given the
advance of other computing methods and devices.

So what that boils down to is this, Joe: You don't want to
spend the time or effort needed to learn enough Morse Code
to pass the test.

Amazing intellect you display, Jimmie!

However, before you slide into more snide remarks, try
to understand that NOT everybody lives a life of
radiotelegraphy. True!

What about the written tests for General and Extra? In order
to use digital modes on HF, you need at least a General
Class license.

Tsk, tsk. Misdirecting into the writtens again, are you?

Let's get back to the MORSE CODE TEST NPRM, WT Docket
05-235. NOTHING in that NPRM proposes to change
anydamnthing in the WRITTEN test elements.

Fellow hams need to sit back and take an objective look
at this hobby because it is dying a rapid death!

How do you figure?

Is morse code ANYTHING in radio in this new millennium
besides being a niche interest area for a bunch of
olde-tyme hammes stuck on telegraphy?

When I became a ham in 1967, there were about 260,000 US hams.
Now there are over 650,000. The peak was about two years ago,
but there have been ups and downs before.

Tsk. There has been a slow but STEADY decline in
licenses for two years.

Amateur Radio needs me and people just like me to join in on
the HF bands and to use our real world high tech expertise to
help further Amateur Radio.

OK, fine, how *exactly* will that happen?

Will you design and build new high tech radios?
Develop new high-performance modes of communication?
Set up some sort of new radio network?
Get more people interested in amateur radio by
demos, articles, etc.?

Let's put it this way: It AIN'T gonna be by "designing
and building state-of-the-art VACUUM TUBE transmitters
in the 1990s!" :-)

Where will the time come from to do that stuff?

What...are you now a time-study man for the "amateur
community" management?!?

For that matter, where will the time come from for
you to set up an HF station and operate it?

Isn't it about time YOU came up with some solid-state
designs yourself?!?

The solid-state era in all electronics happened 40
years ago.


Finally, I honor all those of you who are code proficient.

Thank you!

Jimmie, you are an absolute CREDIT to amateur radio...of
the 1940s.


I too may one day still be code proficient even if there is no
formal testing.

Why not now?

Why EVER?

20-45 minutes a day for 4-6 weeks should get you to 5 wpm. There
are freeware Morse Code trainers that will run on most PCs. I
recommend the G4FON one.

Gosh, Jimmie, a half hour to an hour a day studying solid-
state circuitry could get you into shape to "design and
build your very own TRUE state-of-the-art transmitter!"

Why, heck and darn, all your neighbors could come over and
admire it, go oooh and aaahh and you explain every solid-
state bit of it!

However, I do think that the right decision has been made
by the FCC and will ultimately be finalized with little
changes.

I don't think it's the right thing, but I'm afraid FCC will
do it anyway.

Have courage. Do not be afraid!

The sun will come up...tomorrow...down music

This will not kill our hobby, but will inject more life into
it.

I hope you're right.

He IS right, sweetums. All this radiotelegraphy was
beginning to stagnate in-place. Gangrene is sure to follow.

New, BETTER blood needed, stuff that doesn't want to revert
to 1940s and 1930s in standards and practices!

But...YOUR amateur radio world looks dark and dreary indeed.
No more will you be able to show off your "federally
authorized" morsemanship rank/title/privileges!

What will your neighbors say then?

dot dot

wrote:
From: on Jul 24, 6:26 pm


For that matter, where will the time come from for
you to set up an HF station and operate it?

Isn't it about time YOU came up with some solid-state
designs yourself?!?

The question was " . . . you to set up an HF station and operate it?"
When was the last time you set up your personally-owned station and
operatated it yourself solid state or otherwise Sweetums?

Thought so.

One more laughable pot calling the kettle black pile of bafflegab from
the bowels of L.A.

But...YOUR amateur radio world looks dark and dreary indeed.
No more will you be able to show off your "federally
authorized" morsemanship rank/title/privileges!

Nah, all we have to do is quietly show up at a Field Day getogether and
go brasspounding and watch the crowd of codeless wonders gather 'round
in amazement.

What will your neighbors say then?

dot dot


w3rv

wrote:
wrote:

From: on Jul 24, 6:26 pm


For that matter, where will the time come from for
you to set up an HF station and operate it?

Isn't it about time YOU came up with some solid-state
designs yourself?!?


The question was " . . . you to set up an HF station and operate it?"
When was the last time you set up your personally-owned station and
operatated it yourself solid state or otherwise Sweetums?

Thought so.

One more laughable pot calling the kettle black pile of bafflegab from
the bowels of L.A.


But...YOUR amateur radio world looks dark and dreary indeed.
No more will you be able to show off your "federally
authorized" morsemanship rank/title/privileges!


Nah, all we have to do is quietly show up at a Field Day getogether and
go brasspounding and watch the crowd of codeless wonders gather 'round
in amazement.

I'm sure that the world of amateur radio looks bleak indeed to a
sourball standing on the outside, looking in. Morse Code testing or no,
Mr. Anderson will still be on the outside looking in. There isn't a
snowball's chance in hell that Leonard will obtain his "Extra right out
of the box" before he completes his mission of taking up space and using
up oxygen.

Dave K8MN

Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
wrote:

From: on Jul 24, 6:26 pm


For that matter, where will the time come from for
you to set up an HF station and operate it?

Isn't it about time YOU came up with some solid-state
designs yourself?!?


The question was " . . . you to set up an HF station and operate it?"
When was the last time you set up your personally-owned station and
operatated it yourself solid state or otherwise Sweetums?

Thought so.

One more laughable pot calling the kettle black pile of bafflegab from
the bowels of L.A.


But...YOUR amateur radio world looks dark and dreary indeed.
No more will you be able to show off your "federally
authorized" morsemanship rank/title/privileges!


Nah, all we have to do is quietly show up at a Field Day getogether and
go brasspounding and watch the crowd of codeless wonders gather 'round
in amazement.

I'm sure that the world of amateur radio looks bleak indeed to a
sourball standing on the outside, looking in. Morse Code testing or no,
Mr. Anderson will still be on the outside looking in.

And he built that wall around himself himself. Unbelievable . . .

There isn't a
snowball's chance in hell that Leonard will obtain his "Extra right out
of the box" before he completes his mission of taking up space and using
up oxygen.

Yeah but yoicks would you really like to have him show up on the
bands?? Ye Gods . . ! Maybe we oughta just leave well enough alone
before he goes ape and climbs over his wall and does something we'll
regret.

Dave K8MN

w3rv