K=D8HB wrote:
"Michael Coslo" wrote

How we gonna connect the nation at 700 MHz?

Hi Mike,

The article had nothing to do with "connecting the nation". It has to do=
with
regional interoperability, the very thing that Katrina aftermath found la=
rgely
inadequate.

73, de Hans, K0HB

Hans, as a retired CPO, you know as well as anybody else that
interoperability of any service is a problem. Recall Grenada where a
grunt used his Sprint calling card on a commercial line to call the
Pentagon and request an Air Force air-strike on a target.

Good grief! It's not just about grunts dying anymore.

You'd think after 09/11/2001 we'd have fast-tracked this stuff!

wrote:

KØHB wrote:

"Michael Coslo" wrote


How we gonna connect the nation at 700 MHz?

Hi Mike,

The article had nothing to do with "connecting the nation". It has to do with
regional interoperability, the very thing that Katrina aftermath found largely
inadequate.

73, de Hans, K0HB


Hans, as a retired CPO, you know as well as anybody else that
interoperability of any service is a problem. Recall Grenada where a
grunt used his Sprint calling card on a commercial line to call the
Pentagon and request an Air Force air-strike on a target.

Good grief! It's not just about grunts dying anymore.

You'd think after 09/11/2001 we'd have fast-tracked this stuff!


This is what has me worried. If a new Whiz-bang system is going to
work, it has to connect the whole nation. When New Orleans is under
water, they don't just need to talk to the locals, they need to get word
out to the whole country - or at least the parts that can send help.

And since we don't know where the next disaster will strike, that means
the whole country needs to be in the picture.

No big picture thinkers need apply?

- Mike KB3EIA -

"Michael Coslo" wrote


This is what has me worried. If a new Whiz-bang system is going to work, it
has to connect the whole nation.

Mike,

Come back to the discussion when you understand the term "regional
interoperability".

DOS Hint: It has absolutely nothing to do with "connect the whole nation".

73, de Hans, K0HB

KØHB wrote:
"Michael Coslo" wrote


This is what has me worried. If a new Whiz-bang system is going to work, it
has to connect the whole nation.


Mike,

Come back to the discussion when you understand the term "regional
interoperability".

DOS Hint: It has absolutely nothing to do with "connect the whole nation".

Hans,

As the Czar of this discussion, how about TELLING us exactly what
Obrien's regional interopability plan is? ;^) Even a little clue might
help the dillatentes like me.

And I'm telling you that IMO any system that doesn't connect areas
larger than "regional" is not going to work under many circumstances.

Of course I could be wrong.

- Mike KB3EIA -

"Mike Coslo" wrote


As the Czar of this discussion, how about TELLING us exactly what Obrien's
regional interopability plan is? ;^) Even a little clue might help the
dillatentes like me.


Actually (if you read his piece) OBrien doesn't profess to have a plan, but
rather suggests that Katrina and the impending availability of 700MHz, may be
the catalyst that causes (like a good kick in the ass) serious non-lip-service
attention at the metropolitan and regional levels to survivable incident-wide
first-responder communications systems.

And I'm telling you that IMO any system that doesn't connect areas larger than
"regional" is not going to work under many circumstances.

That's a separate and distinctly different kettle of fish.

Think of intra-incident (first responders, search and rescue) as tactical
communications, and extra-incident (recovery, supply/logistics) as strategic
communications. You need both, but they are completely different animals and
treating them similarly inevitably means that you won't get either one right.

73, de Hans, K0HB

K=D8HB wrote:
"Mike Coslo" wrote

As the Czar of this discussion, how about TELLING us exactly what Obrie=
n's
regional interopability plan is? ;^) Even a little clue might help the
dillatentes like me.

Actually (if you read his piece) OBrien doesn't profess to have a plan, b=
ut
rather suggests that Katrina and the impending availability of 700MHz, ma=
y be
the catalyst that causes (like a good kick in the ass) serious non-lip-se=
rvice
attention at the metropolitan and regional levels to survivable incident-=
wide
first-responder communications systems.

If 9-11 couldn't accomplish that kick, Katrina sure can't. All the
while the SECDEF and the JCS strive to make the military lighter and
faster, the Senate makes our government more sluggish and stupid. If
only Katrina had been the leader of a Christian Cult.

And I'm telling you that IMO any system that doesn't connect areas larg=
er than
"regional" is not going to work under many circumstances.

That's a separate and distinctly different kettle of fish.

Think of intra-incident (first responders, search and rescue) as tactical
communications, and extra-incident (recovery, supply/logistics) as strate=
gic
communications. You need both, but they are completely different animals=
and
treating them similarly inevitably means that you won't get either one ri=
ght.

73, de Hans, K0HB

Hans, you missed your calling in life. You shudda been a communicator.

KØHB wrote:
"Michael Coslo" wrote


This is what has me worried. If a new Whiz-bang system is going to work, it
has to connect the whole nation.


Mike,

Come back to the discussion when you understand the term "regional
interoperability".

DOS Hint: It has absolutely nothing to do with "connect the whole nation".

Hans, I done some reading!

From what I can see the spectrum is presumed worth a lot of money.


I read about Texas' interoperability plan. They are doing 8 channels in
the 2 meter neighborhood, and also have a 700 MHz plan

http://www.dfwinfo.com/hs/radio/PDF/region40_web.pdf

for the 700 MHz plan. It has a little info, but is heavy on extraneous
stuff.

Looks like we've settled on a 6.25 KHz voice path. That's good!

My opinion is that "regional" don't cut it. It will probably work well
until the big one hits.

- Mike KB3EIA -

"Mike Coslo" wrote


My opinion is that "regional" don't cut it.

Cuts it just fine when you're talking about regional interoperabilty plans.
These plans concern themselves with intra-regional (not extra-regional)
interoperabilty.

A cop or fireman on the streets of Dallas has no need for communications with a
cop or fireman in Seattle, thus the interop plan doesn't address this
non-existant "need".

But since disasters don't confine themselves to political boundaries, most good
plans do include provisions for communications with immediately adjacent
regions.

73, de Hans, K0HB

On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 08:36:31 -0400, Michael Coslo wrote:

This is what has me worried. If a new Whiz-bang system is going to
work, it has to connect the whole nation. When New Orleans is under
water, they don't just need to talk to the locals, they need to get word
out to the whole country - or at least the parts that can send help.

That 'sposed to be the county and state Emergency Services and
National Guard's task with their obscenely expensive Rockwell-Collins
ALE HF radios that are 'sposed to be able to load up on a doorknob
and have all sorts of DoD/FEMA channels to play on.

We here in the back woods of Oregon have those in our county and
state EOCs and we also have a gaggle of MARS folks who have
those capabilities.

Notice all the 'sposed in the above. Is it or is it not a people
problem?

--
73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane

Phil Kane wrote:
On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 08:36:31 -0400, Michael Coslo wrote:


This is what has me worried. If a new Whiz-bang system is going to
work, it has to connect the whole nation. When New Orleans is under
water, they don't just need to talk to the locals, they need to get word
out to the whole country - or at least the parts that can send help.


That 'sposed to be the county and state Emergency Services and
National Guard's task with their obscenely expensive Rockwell-Collins
ALE HF radios that are 'sposed to be able to load up on a doorknob
and have all sorts of DoD/FEMA channels to play on.

We here in the back woods of Oregon have those in our county and
state EOCs and we also have a gaggle of MARS folks who have
those capabilities.

Notice all the 'sposed in the above. Is it or is it not a people
problem?

Yes, it is a people problem. Is that wonderful radio going to be at the
other end when it is needed? Just having one on one end of the emergency
isn't too helpful.

Emergencies tend to be random, and tend to wipe out a lot of important
things when they do happen. Maybe if we can make all of our disasters
happen in predetermined places?

- Mike KB3EIA -