Open Letter to WK3C,

What a story. At a time when I've buried all my hard feelings as to
news according to ARRL, which has been public relations over the years,
your story emerges. It reinforces my opinion all along that the League
is in it for itself, not for ham radio. My plan to join has now been
scrapped.

Based on your writing, you shine with integrity. Any organization
should feel honored to put you on the ballot. I am truly sorry you've
run into what essentially is an utter lack of due process.

One remedial outlet you might survey is administrative. Is there any
argument that brings ARRL under the scrutiny of an administrative body
like the FCC is subjected to? Maybe you could argue -- admittedly a
big stretch -- that because they're the dominant ham radio group by
far, they occupy a monopolistic position, giving the federal
Administrative Procedure Act jurisdiction.

Now, that procedure you can handle yourself. Even if you don't
succeed, you might be able to get to the discovery stage, which would
be remedial. Not a licensed attorney, I offer my free help with this
procedure that I know so well. Oh yes, along with this offer, I must
add: "Contact a member of your jurisdiction's Bar."

Bob Sherin, W4ASX

wrote:
Rick wrote:

My League Director told me in public that only 4 Directors
voted to review the Executive Committee's ruling. He said
he told them that there was no "upside" to keeping Carl off
the ballot, and that as just one director, there was no
damage he could do anyway, even if he was as dangerous as
they thought.


I agree!

But, seems to me the Board is hellbent on paybacks for
Carl's work with NCI. After all, he and the rest of the NCI
Board have beaten them at every turn on the code issue.


No, they haven't.

It's clear that FCC was pushing for reductions in Morse Code testing
long before NCI existed. And there are strong no-code-test directors on
the ARRL BoD.


If
it's not paybacks time, then the Board is scared to death of
what Carl might do to try to reform the organization. It's
one or the other.


No, it isn't. There are other possibilities.

One is that Carl's manner *in the past* may have upset some people. Or
his *past* comments about ARRL and many aspects of ham radio.

There's also his leapfrogging over the field organization and going
straight for Director.

Personally I don't see any conflict between his present employment and
being an ARRL director. The commitees and Board see different.

Either way, this will stiffle future candidates who might
otherwise consider running for an ARRL office, but don't
want the public humiliation of being disqualified by the
Elections Committee if they don't like the way you part your
hair.


It might stifle some. But the alleged "humiliation" can be avoided by
not going public until the Board accepts your candidacy.


And, of course if doesn't do much for League
recruiting, particularly of younger hams who tend to rebel
against such shenanigans when they see them in adults. I
agree that there is no upside to keeping him off the ballot,
but apparently, the Board would rather bring the house down
on their heads than have to deal with an outsider who
doesn't care much for the way the exclusive good ol' boys
club has been doing things.


Seems that way. OTOH, there could be other factors.


Spread the word to your clubs around the country, and let's
let the Directors hear of our disgust over this blatant
abuse of power.


Can I be an NCI Board Member?

73 de Jim, N2EY


Have you been an NCI member for a year? If so, yes, you can
run, if you agree to the principles of the organization as
espoused on the web page.
Rick T.

CCW N4AOX wrote:
I'm usually one who waits to "hear the other side of the story", but this
incident astounds me. For the first time since I became interested in
amateur radio, it's not clear to me why I should continue my ARRL
membership.

73, de Hans, K0HB


Hans,

I am somewhat surprised at your naivete. The power and authority
for the "executive committee" to screen and block any candidate "for the
good of the service" was vested in a few individuals in the ARRL a few years
back. Read the BOD minutes and the by-laws. This applies all the way
down to the SM, SCM, EC level. That was about the time that the BOD minutes
was removed from the QST mag. reason: to save on printing costs. I
specifically protested through channels and on this forum at the time that
there was no peer review, no appeals process, no redress, no system of
checks and balances to prevent a runaway "star chamber". When an
organization reaches this level of tyranny under the guise of legitimacy, no
reform is possible.

WODR, folks, this is just how things work from top to bottom.

Deal with it.

- Mike KN3EIA -

"Michael Coslo" wrote


WODR, folks


WTF is "WODR", other than an FM station used to be down in SC playing funky shag
music?

an_old_friend wrote:
Dave Heil wrote:

an_old_friend wrote:

Dave Heil wrote:


wrote:


From: on Sep 14, 4:08 am

cut



Find me some articles of "great interest in millimeter bands"
allocated to amateur radio by the FCC. Who in here has EVER
worked up in the millimeter bands?

I have, on numerous occasions from WA8ONQ.



Who in here has EVER worked
any ham bands above 70 cm? [besides using a 1 GHz cell phone
or 2.4 GHz cordless telephone?]

I have, on numerous occasions.


as Have I

Tell Len. I didn't ask you.


get it throughyour thick head I can coment on ANY post I like and any
comments. If you can't handle that then shove off

Oh? You're in the business of telling others to leave the newsgroup,
Colonel?

That piece of
information is necessary to get an insight into the problem. I didn't find
it on the web site. Of course I don't have a lot of time this morning.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE


I found it extremely EASY to obtain all the details on Carl's
website. Just a couple of mouse clicks while reading this in
Google. The same with checking out the League's web site to see
the "announcement" of the candidates for Division. At NIGHT,
when I first saw Carl's message on Google.

Well, let's get a membership drive going, right? "Join and
CHANGE THE LEAGUE FROM 'WITHIN'!" Free, open, democratic
principle stuff. Uh huh. :-)

cuting Daves gartuous insults

Off the top of my head, those who post here who cannot run for ARRL
Director:

1. Those with a potential conflict of interest.

2. Non-radio amateurs.

3. Non-ARRL members.

One of those snags your "old_friend" and two of them fit Leonard H.
Anderson.



I see that you continue to "cute" things. Perhaps you think that is
somehow making my words go away. I've never made a "gartuous" insult in
my life.


more heil lies

Let's see. Where could the lie be? There is no word "gartuous" so I
could never had made such an insult. So, that coulnd't have been the
lie. Was it a lie that Leonard H. Anderson can't run for ARRL Director?
No, that couldn't have been the lie. Was it a lie that *you* can't
run for ARRL Director? No, that couldn't have been the lie. Maybe you
can't point it out instead of just writing "lies" at every opportunity.

You have nothing to say so you slash out at any targets in
neighboorhood, never mind the Subject you don't need no stinking
subjects

I had something to convey and I did so. That you didn't care for it
doesn't matter a whit.

Dave K8MN

KØHB wrote:

"Michael Coslo" wrote


WODR, folks



WTF is "WODR", other than an FM station used to be down in SC playing funky shag
music?


Sorry Hans, it was a typo. Should have bee WADR - "With All Due Respect".

- Mike KB3EIA -

wrote:
KØHB wrote:

"Dave Heil" wrote


It might be informative, if only to demonstrate that none were
in jobs which presented a conflict of interests.


I was a successful candidate (twice) for Vice Director, both times while
employed in the same industry segment as Carl.


You're one of the primary examples Carl has cited in his complaints.

I asked Hans if his work could have conceivably put him in a position to
influence items before the ITU. Maybe I missed it, but I haven't seen a
response to that yet.

What is particularly interesting (to me) is that the Executive Committee did not
reject Carl's candidacy because he HAS a conflict of interest, but because he
COULD (in the future) HAVE such a conflict. This, in spite of his sworn written
promise not to accept any client which might lead to a possible conflict.

As is well known around these parts, Carl and I have not always seen eye-to-eye
on every subject, but I have never doubted he was a person of integrity and a
true-to-his-word kind of guy. That the Executive Committee discounts that
solemn promise is very telling, and that the full BoD distanced themselves from
the issue by letting it be decided in committee diminishes their honor in my
eyes.

When I questioned my Director on the matter by email he declined to answer me
and passed the buck down to the Secretary, who blew me off with a scholarly
explanation/recital of Article 11 of the Articles of Association.


The whole deal was cooked from top to bottom. Our outgoing Director
Bernie Fuller N3EFN is backing our Vice Director Bill Edgar N3LLR for
the job. Then Carl popped up out of nowhere so "the boys" circled their
wagons and found a way to quash Carl's candidacy before it even got off
the ground.

Are you speculating, Brian or do you have some facts that are not common
knowledge?

Even the average banana republic military junta has more finesse than
this bunch.

I'm waiting to see how HQ responds publically to this nonsense. Or if
they stonewall it and hope it goes away.

I'd like to know all the facts before I start blasting away at the League.

Dave K8MN

"Dave Heil" wrote


I asked Hans if his work could have conceivably put him in a position to
influence items before the ITU. Maybe I missed it, but I haven't seen a
response to that yet.


Not directly, although during that period two of my employees sat on the T1E1
committee and did influence CCITT/ITU standards.

Further, Article 11 is not all about the ITU. (See below.) It is ambiguously
crafted and can be easily "lawyered" into excluding almost anyone whose paycheck
is remotely linked to RF spectrum matters, power lines (BPL?), publishing,
emergency communications, transmitter/receiver design/manufacturing, or any
other of the myriad things which the BoD might decide to be "affairs of the
League".

"No person shall be eligible for, or hold, the office of Director, Vice
Director, President or Vice President whose business connections are of
such nature that he could gain financially through the shaping of the
affairs of the League by the Board, or by the improper exploitation of
his office for the furtherance of his own aims or those of his employer.
The primary test of eligibility under this Article shall be the freedom
from commercial or governmental connections of such nature that his
influence in the affairs of the League could be used for his private benefit."


I'd like to know all the facts before I start blasting away at the League.


Me too. Unfortunately facts are not very forthcoming.

And I think it was Dr. Who who remarked "The very powerful and the very stupid
have one thing in common. Instead of altering their views to fit the facts, they
alter the facts to fit their views... which can be very uncomfortable if you
happen to be one of the facts that needs altering."

73, de Hans, K0HB
--
Homepage:
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~k0hb
Member:
ARRL http://www.arrl.org
SOC http://www.qsl.net/soc
VWOA http://www.vwoa.org
A-1 Operator Club http://www.arrl.org/awards/a1-op/
TCDXA http://www.tcdxa.org
MWA http://www.w0aa.org
TCFMC http://www.tcfmc.org
FISTS http://www.fists.org
LVDXA http://www.upstel.net/borken/lvdxa.htm
NCI http://www.nocode.org

wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Sep 14, 8:44 pm



wrote:

From: Dave Heil snarling on Sep 14, 1:17 pm

wrote:

From: on Sep 14, 4:08 am

Dee Flint wrote:

"K?B" wrote in message

wrote



http://home.ptd.net/~wk3c/



. . . unbelievable . . !!

I'm usually one who waits to "hear the other side of the story", but this
incident astounds me. For the first time since I became interested in
amateur radio, it's not clear to me why I should continue my ARRL
membership.

But what is the existing or potential conflict of interest?

Carl works as a consulting engineer for commercial firms which have
interests in the millimeter end of the spectrum which could be in
conflict with our interests in the ham bands which are also in that
part of the spectrum.

What you mean "millimeter end of the spectrum which could be in
'conflict with our interests' in the ham bands"?

Since WHEN has there been any "great interest" in the World
Above 30 MHz to the League? The core membership of the League
is interested only in "working DX on HF with CW." :-)

Plenty of League members operate the bands above 30 MHz.

Quantify "PLENTY," snarly Heil. Give us some NUMBERS.

"Snarly"=anyone who disagrees with Leonard H. Anderson.
I've worked hundreds of them over the past four years via SSB/CW/FM on
the VHF/UHF bands.


Tsk. Still VAGUE. "Hundreds" isn't quantified sufficiently well.

Yet you've surmised that ARRL members aren't interested. You have no
facts, no figures, just a hunch.

Also, the "millimeter" bands are not the centimeter bands such as
70 cm.

There's one your familiar restatements of the obvious. I'll add my
thanks for all of those who weren't aware.


Perhaps you've heard of the monthly QST VHF/UHF column. It has been
around for decades. I have decades worth of QST Magazine and ARRL
Handbooks featuring construction articles on VHF/UHF antennas,
amplifiers and the like.


Goodie, you can be an "elmer" and teach all those newcomers
ALL ABOUT the MILLIMETER BANDS!! :-)


Do you know that I haven't?

You have a virtual library all about MILLIMETER BANDS!

I have a very real library of all things radio.



You're out of touch, old timer. :-) :-)

Har. Har. Har.

It isn't really funny. You don't have much of an idea what is going on
in the VHF/UHF ham bands, do you?


Anyone on the WEST coast would NOT know what is going on
on the east coast. MILLIMETER BANDS are rather line-of-sight.

Anyone on the West Coast who is not a radio amateur would likely not
know much about what hams were doing at any given time on the millimeter
bands.


I was operating and maintaining multi-channel 1.8 GHz microwave
radio relay equipment in the fall of 1954. Where were you?

Me? I was in kindergarten, prepping myself to take over from geezers
who'd be out of steam at some point.


Tsk, you've been out of steam for years. :-)

All things are relative, Leonard. I have about fifteen years more steam
left than you.

Did you have a pressing need for steam? Get a steam iron and
go to it on the ironing board...

I'll take the sauna. You may opt for the steam iron if that's what
you've got.

I was testing X-Band (8 to 12 GHz) airborne radar at Hughes
in 1957. Where were you?

Second grade, Highlands Elementary School, Lake Worth, Florida, prepping
myself to take over from geezers who'd eventually run out of steam.


Ah, but you KNEW ALL ABOUT those MILLIMETER BANDS then, dincha?

Why, no, I didn't know a thing about them back then. Statistically,
I'll be learning more about them after your departure.


I was doing lab tests on 4mm waveguide components in 1960 at the
STL research lab. Where were you?

I'd just finished the fifth grade or was starting the sixth at Harrison
School, Lexington, Kentucky and was still prepping from geezers like
you--guys who'd eventually run out of steam.


Oh, my, you sure MOVED around a lot? On the run? Someone
after you?

Writing a book? Leave this chapter out and make it a mystery.


My late friend Lawrence
Evans W8CAL was on the ham bands from Moundsville begininng in 1931.


Tsk. All your friends are "late?" Too bad.

Most of my friends who were around before you were are now dead. That's
the way of life. Your "where were you" game plays right into it.

I was testing microwave components and systems, including
designing part of an active air-coupled test set on Ku-Band
(18 to 24 GHz) for the A-6 Intruder at Micro-Radionics in the
early 1960s. Where were you?

How early? In 1963 I was fourteen and was already a ham. We already
know what you weren't doing. You weren't a radio amateur.


I was a RADIO PROFESSIONAL. Had been one for 11 years by
1963. Got my First Phone in 1956.

Bully for you. Had this been a PROFESSIONAL radio newsgroup, someone
may have been impressed. You've been on the planet for over seven
decades. You still don't hold an amateur ticket.



I did the entirety of design of an L-band (1 to 2 GHz) Mode 4
capable transponder test set RF section at Teledyne
Electronics in '78. Where were you?

I was already a seasoned DXer at age 29.


Wowwwwwww. (big Ben Stein "wow")

Are you wanting some kind of medal? Certificate (suitable for
framing)?

I don't know of any medals available to DXers, Len. I have the
certificates, thanks.

How about your Life Story made into a motion picture? I know
a few over at the Writer-Producer's Guild in Burbank...should I
drop them a "treatment" or precis of your story?

No thanks. If I need help, I'll avail myself of my sis's connections.

I owned a home in Cincinnati, Ohio.


And that has WHAT to do with amateur radio, "seasoned old DXer?"

Oh, about as much as your PROFESSIONAL doings on the millimeter bands,
Len. You started off with a premise about radio amateurs and the
millimeter bands and, as usual, turned it into a treatise on what you
were doing decades back.

Well, in 1972 I was still in the Air Force.


Tsk. In 'Nam "in-country" working MARS radios? :-)

Why, I certainly did that from time-to-time in my off-duty hours. How
kind of you to remember, sort of.


Snarly? I've not yet begun to be snarly, wizened one.


Tsk. You've been snarly since your fabulous "synchronizing
RTTYs with morse" from the wilds of Africa... :-)

....then again you'd have no way to know that. :-) :-)

I've left plenty
out too, so if you're ever in the mood to play another game of "mine's
bigger than yours", I'll happily oblige.


No doubt "yours" is "bigger." No doubt it can throw a lot
farther. :-)

Throw it? What a peculiar thing to write.

It's probably been "in" more things than
mine, too! :-)

Are you guessing again?

You should use the royal "we" more. That way you can wave
your "we-we" at everyone to "prove your point."

Use it if you like, Len. I didn't do so.


I operated plenty of satellite gear, from large fixed installations to
suitcase TACSAT equipment.


Woweee...regular James Bomb sorta stuff, ey?

Was it?

I'll ask to see
if Steven Segal is available to play you in your Life Story
motion picture. Might take a while, though, agents wanna
have "lunch" and all that.

Do so if you like. Then a whole new group of folks can think you're a
crackpot.



Please present any evidence that you've uncovered which outlines what
ARRL members think about the frequencies above 30 MHz. Any at all will do.

How about over 2000 Comments on WT Docket 05-235?

How about over 2000 Comments on WT Docket 98-143?

Please, break them down for us by ARRL member and non-ARRL member.


Larry Klose already did much of that on Docket 98-143.

Wow! They were broken down by ARRL member and non-ARRL member? Amazing!

I'm still doing that on Docket 05-235 (which won't close until
end of October and 14th November).

....and THOSE are broken down by League member and non-League member?
Wowsers!

So far YOUR numerics are vague to "hundreds" but NOW you want
ME to be terribly, terribly specific as to membership? :-)

Weren't you the guy who asked for specific numbers from me?

Thank you for your efforts in justifying your previously unqualified and
unquantified statement.


My my you really ARE ****ed off, aincha, snarly Dave? Tsk, tsk.

Not at all, Leonard. I accorded you much more civil treatment than I
received from you.

My bad...said unkind things about Big Brother in Newington. :-)

That wasn't your error, Len. What you did was state unsubstantiated
things about League members.

Snarly Dave, go to the grill and fork yourself. You're done. :-)

There's a very well known profile which fits your behavior. Would you
like to see it?

Dave K8MN

Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Sep 14, 8:44 pm



wrote:

From: Dave Heil snarling on Sep 14, 1:17 pm

wrote:

From: on Sep 14, 4:08 am

Dee Flint wrote:

"K?B" wrote in message

wrote



http://home.ptd.net/~wk3c/



. . . unbelievable . . !!

I'm usually one who waits to "hear the other side of the story", but this
incident astounds me. For the first time since I became interested in
amateur radio, it's not clear to me why I should continue my ARRL
membership.

But what is the existing or potential conflict of interest?

Carl works as a consulting engineer for commercial firms which have
interests in the millimeter end of the spectrum which could be in
conflict with our interests in the ham bands which are also in that
part of the spectrum.

What you mean "millimeter end of the spectrum which could be in
'conflict with our interests' in the ham bands"?

Since WHEN has there been any "great interest" in the World
Above 30 MHz to the League? The core membership of the League
is interested only in "working DX on HF with CW." :-)

Plenty of League members operate the bands above 30 MHz.

Quantify "PLENTY," snarly Heil. Give us some NUMBERS.

"Snarly"=anyone who disagrees with Leonard H. Anderson.
I've worked hundreds of them over the past four years via SSB/CW/FM on
the VHF/UHF bands.


Tsk. Still VAGUE. "Hundreds" isn't quantified sufficiently well.

Yet you've surmised that ARRL members aren't interested. You have no
facts, no figures, just a hunch.

No in truth I believe his point is the ARRL Ledaership isn't interested

Also, the "millimeter" bands are not the centimeter bands such as
70 cm.

There's one your familiar restatements of the obvious. I'll add my
thanks for all of those who weren't aware.

well you were going on and on about 70cm and down so...


Perhaps you've heard of the monthly QST VHF/UHF column. It has been
around for decades. I have decades worth of QST Magazine and ARRL
Handbooks featuring construction articles on VHF/UHF antennas,
amplifiers and the like.


Goodie, you can be an "elmer" and teach all those newcomers
ALL ABOUT the MILLIMETER BANDS!! :-)


Do you know that I haven't?

I know you can't. You lack the temperment to mentor almost anybody
therefore of course you can't realy elemer any one on the MM bands
cut
Anyone on the WEST coast would NOT know what is going on
on the east coast. MILLIMETER BANDS are rather line-of-sight.

Anyone on the West Coast who is not a radio amateur would likely not
know much about what hams were doing at any given time on the millimeter
bands.

again why must you waste BW reminding everyone that Len ins't a ham

cut
My my you really ARE ****ed off, aincha, snarly Dave? Tsk, tsk.

Not at all, Leonard. I accorded you much more civil treatment than I
received from you.

Bigg whooper you aren't civil to anyone that disagrees with you

My bad...said unkind things about Big Brother in Newington. :-)

That wasn't your error, Len. What you did was state unsubstantiated
things about League members.

Snarly Dave, go to the grill and fork yourself. You're done. :-)

There's a very well known profile which fits your behavior. Would you
like to see it?

see you grill yourself? Hmm might be accepatabl;e esp if you realy went
and did it, but personaly Id prefer you flambayed

Dave K8MN