From: on Thurs 17 Nov 2005 02:45

wrote:
From: on Nov 16, 2:20 am
Dave Heil wrote:


What Len fails to understand is that such carryings-on are simply
delaying The R&O.

Whoa! "Commissioner Miccolis" is WARNING everyone?

Nope - just stating some facts. Your wordy personal attacks in reply
comments to FCC just make you look worse than those you attack, Len.

Only to mighty motivated macho morsemen. :-)


But you hadn't taken even the first baby step to getting an amateur
radio license.

WHY was that required? You haven't explained the "necessity"
of gettng an amateur license FIRST.

Jimmie, you really DON'T understand the environment I was
working in/at. Go download:

http://sujan.hallikainen.org/Broadca...s/My3Years.pdf

...in order to see that environment. NONE of it required any
"baby steps" going FIRST through some hobby license.


But you still hadn't taken even the first baby step to getting an
amateur radio license.

WHY? You are starting to sound as irrational as Dudly...


Actually two errors. Got the date wrong and the sequence with cb.

With all those ERRORS you make, you are getting a reputation
for irrationality and unreliability...


And you *still* hadn't taken even the first baby step to getting an
amateur radio license.

Tsk, tsk, tsk, and Jimmie is still walking around in his
baby shoes, taking little baby steps.

Quick, somebody change his diaper...



What I think happened is this: Len discovered that unlike "book learning",
he didn't pick up on the Morse Code in a few quick lessons.

Looks like that part's true.

My, my, little baby step Jimmie IS starting to look as hateful
as Dudly, always seeking to impugn my "motivations" (that you
think up in your fantasy).


There was NO INTELLECTUAL REWARD "waiting," sweetums.

Sure there was - the amateur radio license and all that you could
do with it. Wasn't worth your time? Fine!

So...I already had plenty of REAL experience in PROFESSIONAL
HF radio communications, a First 'Phone (Commercial), and
those were "NOT intellectual?!?"

You ARE getting irrational.


There was NO
INTELLECTUAL reward in it.

Then what's your problem?

YOUR irrationality.


In other words, if it didn't make money for you, it wasn't going to
get your time and effort.

You really can't understand anyone who doesn't have YOUR
immaculate set of "standards" can you?



Do you always have to be on the cutting edge, Len? Do you have a
cutting-edge computer?

Close enough. If I want cutting-edge, I go to the inside
workshop or the kitchen. Lots of good cutting tools there.


In 1962 I was 8 years old

5 years later, in 1967, I was a licensed amateur radio operator at age
13. You were not.

At 13 you were still taking baby steps?


I got the Second Phone at age 18, in 1972. Didn't need a First Phone.

At 18 you still hadn't taken off the baby shoes?



You don't tell us why *you* are so interested in something you are
not a part of and most probably never will be.

Take off your baby shoes and quit bawling like an infant.

YOU, still in your baby shoes, aren't worthy of an answer
to your demands for "motivation." When given, you won't
accept any reasonable explanation.

I don't care to be a baby sitter for some puerile mewling
about "baby shoes."


Let's see...I am retired from a successful career (from regular
hours, I still do contract work IF I want to) in electronics
design engineering, have a fine house (all paid for), have a
wonderful wife (who was also my high school sweetheart), have
had enough TITLES and POSITIONS to satisfy me, half century,
a comfortable income to handle easy living now.

You've told us how great things are for you many, many times, Len.
As if all that somehow explains your obsession.

"Obsession?!?" :-)

Trying to change federal law is an "obsession?"

Yes, I can see where baby shoe wearers would get petulant and
whiny if their hobby radio toys and merit badges are
threatened...

But you still haven't taken even the first baby step to getting an
amateur radio license.

Again with "baby shoes." Irrational.


I do NOT NEED TO PROVE ANYTHING by getting more TITLES, more
certificates suitable for framing.

Not about that at all.

YES, it IS, Jimmie. You haven't graduated to ADULT shoes
yet and you are in middle age.


Then why are you so unfriendly here, Len?

PCTAs are NOT a friendly sort when their radio toys and merit
badges are threatened. Especially those who are still wearing
their baby shoes such as yourself.



But you mention them and your other accomplishments here, and in
comments to FCC, over and over again.

Yet you have no amateur radio license....

BWAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yup, Jimmie, with that "comparison/analogue" you have exhibited
great IRRATIONALITY.


We are secure
in ourselves. We've "done it" and DON'T need to brag, don't
need more pretty certificates suitable for framing.

Then why are you here?

It is part of a greater effort to eliminate morse code testing
from United States amateur radio regulations on license exams.

How many times must I repeat that before you understand?


It seems to me that what you most enjoy about amateur radio is insulting
and denigrating radio amateurs via the internet.

Sorry, Jimmie, I only "insult" those poor misguided souls
who think that morse code mode communications is still
"cutting-edge technology skill" in radio.

Jimmie, WHY do YOU continue to insult, demean, anatagonize all
who see to remove the code test?

Why are YOU so obsessed with retaining it?

Why are YOU so obsessed with regressing U.S. amateur radio?


Who is this "Jimmie" you speak of?

Yourself. Are you uncomfortable with affectionate, friendly
names?


Well, you can't be talking about me, because I'm none of those things.

You are without fault? You are the shining example of
comportment in the "amateur community?" :-)

Role models look very silly standing tall in baby shoes, Jimmie.



You are NOT custodian of archaic radio
arts. You've NEVER worked in 24/7 long-haul HF radio traffic
services. You've apparently NEVER done any radio activity
outside of HF.

Actually, I have.

PROVE it by third-party references...or be called Brother of
Dudly the Imposter.


Hell, you've never had PRIDE in
what you work at at work

Not me. I'm proud of what I do. I just don't repeat it over and over
and over in an amateur radio newsgroup.

Brother of Dudly, since you NEVER explained what you work at
or where you work, both lacking detail, you will NEVER be
accused of "repeating it over and over and over." :-)

and try to keep your employer a
big, dark secret...you never talk about it except in very
vague descriptions and implications.

Why should I mention it here, Len? Is there *any* employment that would
change the way you behave towards others who disagree with you?

Brother of Dudly, don't try misdirection again. Tiresome.

We readers will just put you down as either NOT WORKING or
at some place not associated with electronics at all.

You don't talk shop. You can't relate your work to electronics
or don't want to. You make some inferences and vague claims,
but NOTHING SPECIFIC. You accuse all those who disagree with
you of "bad behavior." Sure sounds like what Dudly the Imposter
has done continually in here for years.

Why are you so antagonistic to CHANGE, Jimie? Why must you
keep wearing your baby shoes?

Jimmie, are you a merry masochist or a chary control-freak,
insisting that it is "morally wrong" to go against morse
code testing?

Who is this "Jimmie", Len? The person you describe isn't like
me at all.

YES, it IS. Jimmie, you are constantly AGAINST the code test
elimination. You are antagonistic to all those who want to
get rid of it. Why is that, Jimmie?

Are your baby shoes so very, very important to you?



AMATEUR radio is a HOBBY, Jimmie.

And much more, Len. You think the amateurs who went to help
out after the recent hurricanes were only "hobbyists" doing it for
"FUN"?

Thousands and thousands of human being helped the victims
of hurricanes Katrina and Rita. NO amateur radio license
was "required" to HELP A FELLOW HUMAN BEING.

Cut out the sensationalist pandering to visceral emotion,
Jimmie. It's so phony.

AMATEUR RADIO IS BASICALLY A *HOBBY*. It was never anything
else.

You want a HERO MEDAL for being a ham? Go to a jewelry
maker and have them make it for you. I'm sure your "friends
and neighbors" will all gush over it and make you feel very
heroic and wonderful.

AMATEUR RADIO IS BASICALLY A *HOBBY*. It was never anything
more.


Say goodnight, Brother of Dudly. Put your baby shoes down
beside the crib and crawl in. Mommie and Daddie will be
along to tuck you in...

wrote:
From: on Thurs 17 Nov 2005 02:45

wrote:
From: on Nov 16, 2:20 am
Dave Heil wrote:

What Len fails to understand is that such carryings-on are simply
delaying The R&O.

But you hadn't taken even the first baby step to getting an amateur
radio license.

WHY was that required?

It's not required.

You haven't explained the "necessity"
of gettng an amateur license FIRST.

Because there is none, Len.

The point is that this newsgroup is about amateur radio. And
the NPRM is about amateur radio and the Morse Code test
to get an amateur radio license.

A license you've never been able to earn.

you really DON'T understand the environment I was
working in/at.

Actually, I do, Len. That environment wasn't amateur radio.
It was military radip, back when *one* new teleprinter cost more
than most amateur radio stations of the time.

Go download:

http://sujan.hallikainen.org/Broadca...s/My3Years.pdf

Seen it. What's your point? Amateur radio isn't the Army.

...in order to see that environment. NONE of it required any
"baby steps" going FIRST through some hobby license.

Nobody said it did, Len. You were trained at taxpayer expense,
and worked as part of a large supervised team that took care
of that facility.

Actually two errors. Got the date wrong and the sequence with cb.

With all those ERRORS you make, you are getting a reputation
for irrationality and unreliability...

Two errors, Len, and quickly corrected.

What I think happened is this: Len discovered that unlike "book learning",
he didn't pick up on the Morse Code in a few quick lessons.

Looks like that part's true.

starting to look as hateful
as Dudly, always seeking to impugn my "motivations" (that you
think up in your fantasy).

No fantasy involved, just a reading of what you wrote about it. You
simply "GAVE UP".

Heck, you wouldn't even spend the time or money to get/build a suitable
radio receiver and listen to real live Morse Code on the air back
then. Just some tapes copied from records...

There was NO INTELLECTUAL REWARD "waiting," sweetums.

Sure there was - the amateur radio license and all that you could
do with it. Wasn't worth your time? Fine!

So...I already had plenty of REAL experience in PROFESSIONAL
HF radio communications, a First 'Phone (Commercial), and
those were "NOT intellectual?!?"

Nobody said that.

Sounds like what you're saying is that you think your commercial
license
and experience as a military radio technician (not radio operator)
should
somehow give you a magic golden ticket to an amateur radio license. No
way the mighty Anderson should be required to actually *learn*
something
for an *amateur* license...right?

There was NO
INTELLECTUAL reward in it.

Then what's your problem?

YOUR irrationality.

Much ado about nothing, then.

In other words, if it didn't make money for you, it wasn't going to
get your time and effort.

You really can't understand anyone who doesn't have YOUR
immaculate set of "standards" can you?

I understand your "standards" very well, Len. To you, an amateur
radio license wasn't - and still isn't - worth the effort it would
take
for you to learn enough to pass the required tests. Right?

I have no problem with those "standards" at all.

Do you always have to be on the cutting edge, Len? Do you have a
cutting-edge computer?

Close enough.

In other words, no, you don't have a cutting-edge computer.

In 1962 I was 8 years old

5 years later, in 1967, I was a licensed amateur radio operator at age
13. You were not.

I got the Second Phone at age 18, in 1972. Didn't need a First Phone.

You don't tell us why *you* are so interested in something you are
not a part of and most probably never will be.

YOU, still in your baby shoes, aren't worthy of an answer
to your demands for "motivation."

Awwww..."not worthy"?

Are you ashamed of your motivations, Len? Or have I
already stated them, and you're angry that I understand
so much?

When given, you won't
accept any reasonable explanation.

Your explanations aren't complete.

Let's see...I am retired from a successful career (from regular
hours, I still do contract work IF I want to) in electronics
design engineering, have a fine house (all paid for), have a
wonderful wife (who was also my high school sweetheart), have
had enough TITLES and POSITIONS to satisfy me, half century,
a comfortable income to handle easy living now.

You've told us how great things are for you many, many times, Len.
As if all that somehow explains your obsession.

"Obsession?!?" :-)

Yes, Len. You're clearly obsessed with something that doesn't affect
you.

Trying to change federal law is an "obsession?"

Nope. The way you behave in doing so definitely is. Particularly since
the "law" does not really affect you.

It's as if someone from far away from Sun City tried for years to get
the zoning rules there changed, because they *might* want to build
a house there.

Yes, I can see where baby shoe wearers would get petulant and
whiny if their hobby radio toys and merit badges are
threatened...

I wear a size 12 in most shoes, Len. I prefer Saucony running shoes
most of the time. I ran 35 minutes before dawn today - kinda big steps
out there....

I do NOT NEED TO PROVE ANYTHING by getting more TITLES, more
certificates suitable for framing.

Not about that at all.

YES, it IS,

Nobody's asking you to prove anything, Len. It's just odd that you
are so interested in the rules of a radio service that you are so
completely uninvolved with.

But you mention them and your other accomplishments here, and in
comments to FCC, over and over again.

Yet you have no amateur radio license....

BWAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yup, Jimmie, with that "comparison/analogue" you have exhibited
great IRRATIONALITY.

How? Your accomplishments do not give you a golden ticket to an
amateur radio license.

One of the wonderful things about amateur radio is that all must meet
the same requirements for the license, regardless of other radio
experience, licenses, education, age, income, etc. Always been that
way. The grade schooler has to meet the same license requirement
as the graybeard Ph.D. in EE with multiple patents and other licenses.

That simple equality really seems to burn you.

We are secure
in ourselves. We've "done it" and DON'T need to brag, don't
need more pretty certificates suitable for framing.

Then why are you here?

It is part of a greater effort to eliminate morse code testing
from United States amateur radio regulations on license exams.

Has it made *any* difference? Do you really think your words have
convinced anyone?

And why does it matter to you anyway?

How many times must I repeat that before you understand?

It seems to me that what you most enjoy about amateur radio is insulting
and denigrating radio amateurs via the internet.

Sorry, Jimmie, I only "insult" those poor misguided souls
who think that morse code mode communications is still
"cutting-edge technology skill" in radio.

Incorrect. You insult and denigrate anyone who disagrees with you.

Jimmie, WHY do YOU continue to insult, demean, anatagonize all
who see to remove the code test?

Who is this "Jimmie" you keep referring to? Your imaginary friend?

Why are YOU so obsessed with retaining it?

I'm not. I simply think the Morse Code test does more good than harm.
I think it's a good idea, for reasons stated here and in my Comments
to FCC.

Why are YOU so obsessed with regressing U.S. amateur radio?

I'm not - I'm about progress and moving forward.

Who is this "Jimmie" you speak of?

Yourself. Are you uncomfortable with affectionate, friendly
names?

It's neither affectionate nor friendly.

You are NOT custodian of archaic radio
arts. You've NEVER worked in 24/7 long-haul HF radio traffic
services. You've apparently NEVER done any radio activity
outside of HF.

Actually, I have.

PROVE it by third-party references

I've worked W3RV, K3LT, and many others on VHF FM. Ask them.

Hell, you've never had PRIDE in
what you work at at work

Not me. I'm proud of what I do. I just don't repeat it over and over
and over in an amateur radio newsgroup.

Brother of Dudly, since you NEVER explained what you work at
or where you work, both lacking detail, you will NEVER be
accused of "repeating it over and over and over." :-)

You have done so, so you are guilty...

and try to keep your employer a
big, dark secret...you never talk about it except in very
vague descriptions and implications.

Why should I mention it here, Len? Is there *any* employment that would
change the way you behave towards others who disagree with you?

Brother of Dudly, don't try misdirection again. Tiresome.

Answer the question, Len.

We readers will just put you down as either NOT WORKING or
at some place not associated with electronics at all.

Readers know that you'd simply use my employment - whatever it is -
as another insult venue.

You don't talk shop.

Not here. Why should I?

Why are you so antagonistic to CHANGE,

I'm not. You are. As in "changes to real estate zoning"...

AMATEUR radio is a HOBBY, Jimmie.

And much more, Len. You think the amateurs who went to help
out after the recent hurricanes were only "hobbyists" doing it for
"FUN"?

Thousands and thousands of human being helped the victims
of hurricanes Katrina and Rita. NO amateur radio license
was "required" to HELP A FELLOW HUMAN BEING.

Not required, but very helpful.

Cut out the sensationalist pandering to visceral emotion,
Jimmie. It's so phony.

Tell it to the folks at Electronic Design magazine, Len - a
"PROFESSIONAL" publication:

http://www.elecdesign.com/Articles/A...164/11164.html

AMATEUR RADIO IS BASICALLY A *HOBBY*. It was never anything
else.

Not just a hobby, though. That seems to really bother you.

wrote:


WHY was that required? You haven't explained the "necessity"
of gettng an amateur license FIRST.

There is no 'necessity' of getting an amateur license, unless you want
to operate on the ham bands, just like there is no 'necessity' of
getting a driver's license unless you want to drive a car. All of your
bragging about your intellect and knowledge and experience you claim has
squat to do with ham radio. Thousands of people with no prior knowledge
or experience in radio communications, electronics, ect., have studied
and passed the test to obtain a ham license. Something that seems to
completely befuddle you. Yet here you go on and on about all your skills
and knowledge yet you can't seem to get a license, something that many
grade schoolers have achieved.


Jimmie, you really DON'T understand the environment I was
working in/at. Go download:

The environment you worked in has nothing to do with getting a ham license.

http://sujan.hallikainen.org/Broadca...s/My3Years.pdf

...in order to see that environment. NONE of it required any
"baby steps" going FIRST through some hobby license.

No 'baby steps'? I supposed you were born with all the knowledge and
skills you needed.

wrote:
From: on Thurs 17 Nov 2005 02:45

wrote:
From: on Nov 16, 2:20 am
Dave Heil wrote:

In other words, if it didn't make money for you, it wasn't going to
get your time and effort.

You really can't understand anyone who doesn't have YOUR
immaculate set of "standards" can you?

I've met people like you, Len. They're all about what positions they've
held, how much they made, the cost of their home(s), the brand and year
of the car they drive. They miss a lot of life. They never seem to do
anything for the love of it.

You don't tell us why *you* are so interested in something you are
not a part of and most probably never will be.

Take off your baby shoes and quit bawling like an infant.

YOU, still in your baby shoes, aren't worthy of an answer
to your demands for "motivation." When given, you won't
accept any reasonable explanation.

I don't care to be a baby sitter for some puerile mewling
about "baby shoes."

It isn't just about baby steps (not baby shoes), is it? You don't care
to join an activity where you'd still be considered a beginner, do you?
I mean, you haven't achieved the neophyte level in amateur radio.


Let's see...I am retired from a successful career (from regular
hours, I still do contract work IF I want to) in electronics
design engineering, have a fine house (all paid for), have a
wonderful wife (who was also my high school sweetheart), have
had enough TITLES and POSITIONS to satisfy me, half century,
a comfortable income to handle easy living now.

What do your former employment, income, home and marital status have to
do with your getting an amateur radio license, Len?

You've told us how great things are for you many, many times, Len.
As if all that somehow explains your obsession.

"Obsession?!?" :-)

Trying to change federal law is an "obsession?"

In your case, yes, it is. You are obsessed.

Yes, I can see where baby shoe wearers would get petulant and
whiny if their hobby radio toys and merit badges are
threatened...

But you still haven't taken even the first baby step to getting an
amateur radio license.

Again with "baby shoes." Irrational.


I do NOT NEED TO PROVE ANYTHING by getting more TITLES, more
certificates suitable for framing.

Not about that at all.

YES, it IS, Jimmie. You haven't graduated to ADULT shoes
yet and you are in middle age.

You can write "YES it IS" all you want. Obtaining an amateur radio
license isn't about those things.

Then why are you so unfriendly here, Len?

PCTAs are NOT a friendly sort when their radio toys and merit
badges are threatened.

How are you threatening anyone's radio equipment, Len? Tell us about
the merit badges. Back to the question: Why are you so unfriendly here?


Especially those who are still wearing
their baby shoes such as yourself.


We are secure
in ourselves. We've "done it" and DON'T need to brag, don't
need more pretty certificates suitable for framing.

Then why are you here?

It is part of a greater effort to eliminate morse code testing
from United States amateur radio regulations on license exams.

How many times must I repeat that before you understand?

It'll likely never be understood by folks, Len. After all, you aren't
remotely involved in amateur radio. It sounds as if you have an obsession.

It seems to me that what you most enjoy about amateur radio is insulting
and denigrating radio amateurs via the internet.

Sorry, Jimmie, I only "insult" those poor misguided souls
who think that morse code mode communications is still
"cutting-edge technology skill" in radio.

That's simply incorrect, Leonard. You insult anyone who favors
retention of morse testing in amateur radio. I don't recall a single
soul who claims that morse code represents cutting edge technology.

Jimmie, WHY do YOU continue to insult, demean, anatagonize all
who see to remove the code test?

"Jimmie", "Brother of Dudly", "Reverend Jimmie", "Nun of the Above". Do
any of those sound familiar to you? Would you prefer to see a more
complete list of your insulting, demeaning and antagonistic names for folks?

Why are YOU so obsessed with retaining it?

Why are YOU so obsessed with regressing U.S. amateur radio?

Please explain how retention of morse testing is regression in any form.
After all, morse code is used daily by thousands of radio amateurs.

Who is this "Jimmie" you speak of?

Yourself. Are you uncomfortable with affectionate, friendly
names?

Are you being affectionate, Len? You've come up with a number of
"affectionate names" for people who post here and who disagree with your
views, haven't you?

You are NOT custodian of archaic radio
arts. You've NEVER worked in 24/7 long-haul HF radio traffic
services. You've apparently NEVER done any radio activity
outside of HF.

Actually, I have.

PROVE it by third-party references...or be called Brother of
Dudly the Imposter.

Care to see your special profile, Leonard?

Hell, you've never had PRIDE in
what you work at at work

Not me. I'm proud of what I do. I just don't repeat it over and over
and over in an amateur radio newsgroup.

Brother of Dudly, since you NEVER explained what you work at
or where you work, both lacking detail, you will NEVER be
accused of "repeating it over and over and over." :-)

You continue to complain that others insult or denigrate you. You've
told Jim that he never had any "PRIDE" in his work. You go on to call
him "Brother of Dudly". Do you consider your behavior to be rude? Are
the smileys supposed to excuse your churlish manner? :-) :-)

and try to keep your employer a
big, dark secret...you never talk about it except in very
vague descriptions and implications.

Why should I mention it here, Len? Is there *any* employment that would
change the way you behave towards others who disagree with you?

Brother of Dudly, don't try misdirection again. Tiresome.

Talk about misdirection. You dodged the question, Leonard.


We readers will just put you down as either NOT WORKING or
at some place not associated with electronics at all.

We readers? You're now speaking for all other readers of this newsgroup?

You don't talk shop. You can't relate your work to electronics
or don't want to. You make some inferences and vague claims,
but NOTHING SPECIFIC. You accuse all those who disagree with
you of "bad behavior." Sure sounds like what Dudly the Imposter
has done continually in here for years.

You can't blame Jim for not wanting to talk shop with you. Look what
has happened to others who have revealed details of their work (and who
happen to favor retention of morse testing). You make up derogatory
names for those folks and you insult their jobs and military service.


Who is this "Jimmie", Len? The person you describe isn't like
me at all.

YES, it IS. Jimmie, you are constantly AGAINST the code test
elimination.

Gee, Lennie, you are constantly AGAINST the retention of morse code
testing in amateur radio. Imagine that.


You are antagonistic to all those who want to
get rid of it. Why is that, Jimmie?

If you want to see antagonistic, check out some of your r.r.a.p. output.

AMATEUR RADIO IS BASICALLY A *HOBBY*. It was never anything
more.

It was and is more. I'd have thought you'd have been notified.


Say goodnight, Brother of Dudly. Put your baby shoes down
beside the crib and crawl in. Mommie and Daddie will be
along to tuck you in...

....and, poor baby, you still wonder why you are insulted and denigrated?

Dave K8MN

Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
From: on Thurs 17 Nov 2005 02:45

wrote:
From: on Nov 16, 2:20 am
Dave Heil wrote:

In other words, if it didn't make money for you, it wasn't going to
get your time and effort.

You really can't understand anyone who doesn't have YOUR
immaculate set of "standards" can you?

I've met people like you, Len. They're all about what positions they've
held, how much they made, the cost of their home(s), the brand and year
of the car they drive. They miss a lot of life. They never seem to do
anything for the love of it.

sounds more like you and Stevie than Len

You don't tell us why *you* are so interested in something you are
not a part of and most probably never will be.

Take off your baby shoes and quit bawling like an infant.

YOU, still in your baby shoes, aren't worthy of an answer
to your demands for "motivation." When given, you won't
accept any reasonable explanation.

I don't care to be a baby sitter for some puerile mewling
about "baby shoes."

It isn't just about baby steps (not baby shoes), is it? You don't care
to join an activity where you'd still be considered a beginner, do you?
I mean, you haven't achieved the neophyte level in amateur radio.

more projecting and assuming agains Alas for Dave he does not seem to
know what ASSuming leads to


Let's see...I am retired from a successful career (from regular
hours, I still do contract work IF I want to) in electronics
design engineering, have a fine house (all paid for), have a
wonderful wife (who was also my high school sweetheart), have
had enough TITLES and POSITIONS to satisfy me, half century,
a comfortable income to handle easy living now.

What do your former employment, income, home and marital status have to
do with your getting an amateur radio license, Len?

what does the sexual habits of anyone have to do with it either?

doesn't stop you and Stevie from making an issue of them

You've told us how great things are for you many, many times, Len.
As if all that somehow explains your obsession.

"Obsession?!?" :-)

Trying to change federal law is an "obsession?"

In your case, yes, it is. You are obsessed.

so what then?

Yes, I can see where baby shoe wearers would get petulant and
whiny if their hobby radio toys and merit badges are
threatened...

But you still haven't taken even the first baby step to getting an
amateur radio license.

Again with "baby shoes." Irrational.


I do NOT NEED TO PROVE ANYTHING by getting more TITLES, more
certificates suitable for framing.

Not about that at all.

YES, it IS, Jimmie. You haven't graduated to ADULT shoes
yet and you are in middle age.

You can write "YES it IS" all you want. Obtaining an amateur radio
license isn't about those things.

it should not be but many Hamas don't seem to show they are not into
such such things

Then why are you so unfriendly here, Len?

PCTAs are NOT a friendly sort when their radio toys and merit
badges are threatened.

How are you threatening anyone's radio equipment, Len? Tell us about
the merit badges. Back to the question: Why are you so unfriendly here?

indeed I would like to know how Len posting is threatening to anyone
radio toys or license status

Len however is not truely able to explain that

perhaps if you or esp Stevie took a long hard look in the mirror you
might enlighten us


Especially those who are still wearing
their baby shoes such as yourself.


We are secure
in ourselves. We've "done it" and DON'T need to brag, don't
need more pretty certificates suitable for framing.

Then why are you here?

It is part of a greater effort to eliminate morse code testing
from United States amateur radio regulations on license exams.

How many times must I repeat that before you understand?

It'll likely never be understood by folks, Len. After all, you aren't
remotely involved in amateur radio. It sounds as if you have an obsession.

It seems to me that what you most enjoy about amateur radio is insulting
and denigrating radio amateurs via the internet.

Sorry, Jimmie, I only "insult" those poor misguided souls
who think that morse code mode communications is still
"cutting-edge technology skill" in radio.

That's simply incorrect, Leonard. You insult anyone who favors
retention of morse testing in amateur radio. I don't recall a single
soul who claims that morse code represents cutting edge technology.

Jimmie, WHY do YOU continue to insult, demean, anatagonize all
who see to remove the code test?

"Jimmie", "Brother of Dudly", "Reverend Jimmie", "Nun of the Above". Do
any of those sound familiar to you? Would you prefer to see a more
complete list of your insulting, demeaning and antagonistic names for folks?

Why are YOU so obsessed with retaining it?

Why are YOU so obsessed with regressing U.S. amateur radio?

Please explain how retention of morse testing is regression in any form.

by defeating the aims of the ARS haven't you been reading anything all
these years

After all, morse code is used daily by thousands of radio amateurs.
had enough of dave flushing the rest

nobodys old friend wrote:
Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
From: on Thurs 17 Nov 2005 02:45

wrote:
From: on Nov 16, 2:20 am
Dave Heil wrote:

In other words, if it didn't make money for you, it wasn't going to
get your time and effort.

You really can't understand anyone who doesn't have YOUR
immaculate set of "standards" can you?

I've met people like you, Len. They're all about what positions they've
held, how much they made, the cost of their home(s), the brand and year
of the car they drive. They miss a lot of life. They never seem to do
anything for the love of it.

sounds more like you and Stevie than Len

Then you've not been paying attention, Markie. (Like THAT'S
new......)

It isn't just about baby steps (not baby shoes), is it? You don't care
to join an activity where you'd still be considered a beginner, do you?
I mean, you haven't achieved the neophyte level in amateur radio.

more projecting and assuming agains Alas for Dave he does not seem to
know what ASSuming leads to

How do you see Dave as "projecting"...?!?!

Dave's name has appeared in EVERY Amateur Radio journal (save,
perhaps, for "Ham Radio" and "QEX") at one time or an other for the
last 10-15 years that I am aware of.

Lennie WILL be a "beginner" as it pertains to Amateur Radio. He
may know how the trons flow, but he can't seem to operate a station.

Let's see...I am retired from a successful career (from regular
hours, I still do contract work IF I want to) in electronics
design engineering, have a fine house (all paid for), have a
wonderful wife (who was also my high school sweetheart), have
had enough TITLES and POSITIONS to satisfy me, half century,
a comfortable income to handle easy living now.

What do your former employment, income, home and marital status have to
do with your getting an amateur radio license, Len?

what does the sexual habits of anyone have to do with it either?

Depends on if you try to do one or the otehr at the same time.

doesn't stop you and Stevie from making an issue of them

Just following the cue, Markie...Just following the cue....

You can write "YES it IS" all you want. Obtaining an amateur radio
license isn't about those things.

it should not be but many Hamas don't seem to show they are not into
such such things

Jesus Fa-reekin-Key-ryst!

Now the Hamas is using Amateur Radio...?!?!?!

Who next? al-Queda? The PFLP? Red Faction Group?

Then why are you so unfriendly here, Len?

PCTAs are NOT a friendly sort when their radio toys and merit
badges are threatened.

How are you threatening anyone's radio equipment, Len? Tell us about
the merit badges. Back to the question: Why are you so unfriendly here?

indeed I would like to know how Len posting is threatening to anyone
radio toys or license status

Lennie is a liar. A prolific one and an verbose one.
Unfortunately, many people only hear the loudest squeak, and if scum
like Lennie isn't kept in his place, he can get away with his mischief.

Len however is not truely able to explain that

Of course not. Lennie will reply with any one of several
pat-answers about his rights and his "true intent", then go right on
with his open warfare against Amateur Radio.

perhaps if you or esp Stevie took a long hard look in the mirror you
might enlighten us

The problem is not in mine or Dave's mirror...

Please explain how retention of morse testing is regression in any form.

by defeating the aims of the ARS haven't you been reading anything all
these years

This argument of "Amateur Radio can't progress while there is a
Morse test in place" is a BS argument, and has been for the 30 years
that I have been an Amateur.

Need proof?

Go find a copy of November QST, dated 1975, and then tell me
there's not been ANY "progress' since then, Markie.

And I can tell you what ELSE you can find in 1975...My name and
callsign.

Know what you WON'T find in a 1975 QST...?!?!?

Lennie's name and callsign.

After all, morse code is used daily by thousands of radio amateurs.

had enough of dave flushing the rest

What you MEAN is that you''re tired of trying to effectively dodge
the questions and answer them with some meaningful response.

Steve, K4YZ

From: Dave Heil on Nov 19, 6:34 pm

wrote:
From: on Thurs 17 Nov 2005 02:45
wrote:
From: on Nov 16, 2:20 am
Dave Heil wrote:

In other words, if it didn't make money for you, it wasn't going to
get your time and effort.

You really can't understand anyone who doesn't have YOUR
immaculate set of "standards" can you?

I've met people like you, Len.

No you haven't, Heil. People like me would AVOID your kind.
Such avoidance allows you to continue living. Be greatful
for that.

They're all about what positions they've
held, how much they made, the cost of their home(s), the brand and year
of the car they drive.

Such as those who were "in the foreign service" now
living in a large residence with many antennas? That fancy,
expensive Orion transceiver? :-)

They miss a lot of life.

They do? Ohm my. Do you define "life" as only enjoying what
YOU enjoy?

I don't think that's right. Everyone ought to do what THEY
like...at least in my mind. You seem to think that is wrong.

What am I "missing?" I have many activities, all of which
I have selected based on what I enjoy.

I enjoy some luxuries in life and the freedom of retirement.
I enjoy the relationship I have renewed with my wife (after
a long absence since our days together in high school). I
enjoy a new car which is not a luxury vehicle and replaces
a 1992 model. I enjoy a number of friends both here and
around the country, just recently having a reunion with
family friends in the midwest plus good companionship with
my wife's classmates at their 50th Graduation Reunion.

They never seem to do anything for the love of it.

No? :-)

Have you ever considered that what YOU observe in others
might be flawed?

Nah. You are without flaw...you are an Extra Morseman!


It isn't just about baby steps (not baby shoes), is it? You don't care
to join an activity where you'd still be considered a beginner, do you?
I mean, you haven't achieved the neophyte level in amateur radio.

Tsk, tsk, tsk...more arrogant superiority manifest there, Heil.

Amateur radio is basically a HOBBY. It isn't a craft, guild,
or union that demands some kind of "apprentice-journeyman-
master" hierarchial order...except in the minds of some olde
fahrts who love to talk down to "lesser folk" (the ones THEY
think are "lesser").

Am I some kind of "beginner" in radio after a half century
of experience in more parts of the EM spectrum than any
amateur is allowed? Am I some kind of "beginner" because I've
operated transmitters with far higher power outputs than
amateurs are allowed to have? Am I some kind of "beginner"
because long ago I learned how to design radio circuits from
a blank pad with pen on to the finished hardware and gotten
them to perform as originally specifed?

You seem to think so. What it really boils down to is
manual telegraphy.

I would be an absolute beginner at telegraphy, no dispute,
if I were to take that up again. All I know is the pattern
of dots and dashes and their corresponding English language
characters. That's suffed into a good memory with lots and
lots and lots of other data, some useful, some not.

But - and this is very important in the NPRM 05-143 decision -
the FCC has ALREADY made ALL ALLOCATED MODES OPTIONAL TO USE.
There just isn't ANY mandate to exclusively use radiotelegraphy
except on two small slivers of the lower end of 6m and 2m.
But, getting the amateur license to use ANY amateur band
below 30 MHz still requires passing a telegraphy test!

I'm seeking to eliminate that telegraphy test. There's no
point in having it except as a vestige of pride still felt
by those long-timers who once considered themselves as
'compagnons de telegraphe' because the human-made regulations
gave them status-rank-privileges BECAUSE of that telegraphy
test. I and thousands upon thousands of others have operated
radio transmitters legally and competently at frequencies
below 30 MHz without being required to know or use any radio-
telegraphy skills. That "plain, simple fact" shows the
hypocrisy of the PCTA in demanding the retention of the
telegraphy test. That test regulations does NOT serve the
public, only the few already-licensed in amateur radio who
consider, self-righteously superior through passing a
telegraphy test.

Now, if you wish to start some program to teach real
beginners in radio the skills of telegraphy, I am not
against that. Feel free to use what allocations you've
been granted. So far. Beep your little Orion to outer
space if you want.

Remember, what YOU consider to be "necessary" is NOT
shared by the public, is NOT a physical requirement to
operate any RF emitter below 30 MHz. It is just your
personal desire. You are not yet a god of anything,
are not divine. You are simply inflexible and self-
righteous, seeking to retain federally-mandated testing
in skills which you passed some time ago.


What do your former employment, income, home and marital status have to
do with your getting an amateur radio license, Len?

If you wish to make some kind of game out taking words
and sentences out of context, then I can beat your game
any time for amount that you can count. That's wasted
effort and impolite.


You've told us how great things are for you many, many times, Len.
As if all that somehow explains your obsession.

"Obsession?!?" :-)
Trying to change federal law is an "obsession?"

In your case, yes, it is. You are obsessed.

Incorrect. It is PERSISTENCE. It is IDEALISM, a quest to
make things better for others who share some of my interests.
It is many things but it is definitely not some deviant
obsession.

On the other hand, those who have met old test regulations
and insist and insist that those should be kept for the
future are suspect. Their self-righteousness is suspect.
Their failure to change with a changing reality is suspect.
Their obstinancy on keeping the old ways forever in this
new millennium are suspect. Their perceived self-worth
is threatened by feared loss of status and privilege,
perhaps even rank in the pecking order of the "amateur
community."

I've just rounded up the usual suspects and shown some light
on them. You complain of the glare in your eyes. Too bad,
that makes it hard for you to admire yourself in the mirror.
Apologies to you for that. I may have to change to a more
intense light source...


You can write "YES it IS" all you want. Obtaining an amateur radio
license isn't about those things.

True, the U.S. amateur radio test regulations have nothing
about baby shoes or taking little baby steps.

RIGHT NOW the U.S. amateur test regulations require a
telegraphy test for any class privileges below 30 MHz.
THAT is what many are trying to change.

NPRM 05-143 is about ELIMINATING that code test. Change
for the future, for the public...the public in the
Commission's language is ALL OF US, not just the personal
desires of the few who have met and passed telegraphy
tests.

Then why are you so unfriendly here, Len?

Because both Miccolis and Heil are decidedly unfriendly to
all who disagree with them. They will not bend from their
self-righteous opinions, offer no real concessions on the
code test, act arrogant and superior (Heil becomes abusive)
on the subject of radiotelegraphy. They increase all that
on replies having opposite opinions. They continue attempts
at "pushing buttons" of those opposed to them.

They have sown what they now reap in return.


That's simply incorrect, Leonard. You insult anyone who favors
retention of morse testing in amateur radio.

Miccolis and Heil both PERCEIVE insults where there is only
strong, sharp responses to their overbearing self-images.

This venue is a debate forum, not a gathering around the
bar at a local fraternal order. It does not have to be
"friendly" in the sense that all "must" think alike, have
the same opinions. If you wish "hail fellow well met"
gatherings, seek fellowship among your own kind. This
venue is open to ALL who are able to access it.


Please explain how retention of morse testing is regression in any form.
After all, morse code is used daily by thousands of radio amateurs.

Those radio amateurs - if operating legally - below 30 MHz
using radiotelegraphy have ALREADY passed a federal
telegraphy test. If they have already passed it, removal
of the code test regulation will not affect their operating
privileges.

However, the code test retention WILL affect all those
uncountable in the future who MAY want to get an amateur
radio license having below-30-MHz privileges. They are
not invisible, only uncountable because there is no
accurate way to get their numbers. At best, the Commission
gets only a general impression of their numbers in the
filings on Docket 05-235. So far, those numbers of the
public against code testing are about even with those
for its retention.

Care to see your special profile, Leonard?

A "profile" by whom? Someone who dislikes me intensely in
public? By someone who has no claimed training/schooling
in psychology? By someone who is a staunch, stubborn,
steadfast pro-code-test-advocate?

Feel free to post any "profile" you wish. I will repeat
it for the benefit of all those who might miss one...as I
have before. Feel free to make a Big Issue of it. All that
does is show what a self-righteous little spiteful
sociopath you are in here when your personal opinions are
countered.

You continue to complain that others insult or denigrate you. You've
told Jim that he never had any "PRIDE" in his work.

Yes, I should be taken to task on that, considering that
Miccolis has NEVER TOLD ANYONE HERE *EXACTLY* WHAT HE DOES
AT HIS *UNNAMED* EMPLOYMENT PLACE.

You go on to call him "Brother of Dudly".

In some ways Miccolis *IS* like Dudly the Imposter, yielding
only vague generalities of what he does/did without giving
more specific descriptions. You fit that description in some
posts...such as your "being in a country at war" implying that
you were somehow personally engaged in warfare...and that
later your only description of military experiences of any
specific nature involved operating some MARS radios in a
"behind the front lines" location. You've then made repeated
denigrating statements about my assignment at a "rear area,"
something that I had no choice but to accept at the time.

Do you consider your behavior to be rude?

No. It is strong and confrontational...which has been quite
normal in computer-modem networks since the original ARPANET
spread out into the world. These networks are not for the
faint of heart or the easily disturbed one-sided inflexible
ideological bigots who refuse to compromise.

NPRM 05-143 is a direct affront to the perception of some in
what constitutes "ham radio" or "amateur radio." Some insist
that radiotelegraphy is "the heart and soul of ham radio,"
therefore a test for that skill must "always" be in the
regulations. Those are repeated phrases (although not
necessarily verbatim) from many of the Comments found in
Docket 05-235 written by those in opposition to the NPRM.
That is the "world" to them and, should the telegraphy test
be eliminated, will result in the END of that "world" to
them. Naturally those people will be disturbed, distraught,
angry, or outraged at the very idea that their "world" is
"threatened." They become surly and resentful in their
anxiety and thus perceive that loss of a telegraphy test is
a "threat" to them. They also perceive that anyone who is
for the elimination of the telegraphy test is, in some way,
"unacceptible" to their "world." They can think of only
Their "world" and show no consideration of the rest of the
public. In their perceptions they have become selfish,
self-centered and lose their capability of accepting that
others of the public do not share their internal "world"
image. They get ANGRY at the public desiring change and
try to quash any thought of change. That ANGER manifests
itself in attempts to denigrate the person who challenges
them. Quite a common syndrome not confined to amateur
radio matters but to all human endeavor.

Are the smileys supposed to excuse your churlish manner?

"Smileys" are just emoticons that represent my mood after
having made some statement. In-person, there would be
much more in the way of expressed emotion, tone of voice,
"body language" and so forth to indicate my mood at any
particular time. Given the limitations of allowed
character limitations in this particular medium, emoticons
are a minimal extension of what would be readily apparent
during in-person encounters.

Your use of "churlish" is inappropriate and a bit insulting.
"Churl" is a rather old descriptor of "1. a peasant, 2.
a surly, ill-bred person; a boor." You wish to place
yourself "above" others, to be "their superior." [that is
readily apparent in your many previous postings in here]
Your general attitude seems to be nothing more than
bullying with strong overtones of bravado, a "don't mess
with ME" sort of thing. That reveals much to all other
readers.

If I use "smileys" [ :-) ] that only indicates I am
actually physically smiling on having written something.
I rarely use other emoticons, such as a mild frown
or disagreement [ :-( ] because I am more amused at
the general commentary in here than disapproving. :-)


Talk about misdirection. You dodged the question, Leonard.

Tsk, tsk. There is NO imperative or mandate that all
"must" answer someone's question. You presume too much
authority. An infinite amount of presumptions since you
are not the moderator in here.

We readers will just put you down as either NOT WORKING or
at some place not associated with electronics at all.

We readers? You're now speaking for all other readers of this newsgroup?

Not at all. I read ALL postings in this public venue,
therefore reiterating that I am one of those readers.

I speak only for myself. For whom do you speak as your
"authority?"


You can't blame Jim for not wanting to talk shop with you. Look what
has happened to others who have revealed details of their work (and who
happen to favor retention of morse testing).

Miccolis has not revealed any details of what he does for
a living...other than he is a "professional" and is "proud
of his work." Miccolis has expressed a number of varying
opinions of alleged knowledge, even expertise in areas
where he has not claimed any experience (aerospace,
specifically on spacecraft; non-amateur communications
where he refused to give anything specific on where or what),
yet has been highly confrontational, even antagonistic to
those who HAVE had experience. Miccolis has admitted that
he has NEVER served in any military postion, yet he chides
veterans who have served by claiming expertise in military
matters and military life.

Look at Steven James Robeson who has woven a veritable,
virtual straw skyscraper of claims in here. He is exposed
constantly on his outright fraudulent claims, yet he
persists. I have drawn a parallel to his actions in here
to the "Dudley" description found in Ernest K. Gann's
auotbiographical book "Fate Is The Hunter." That Dudley
was an outrageous fraud in commercial aviation and
eventually killed himself and his passengers in a crash
caused by his incompetence. The "Major Dud" label he got
(and deserved) is a play on words, a contraction of my
comparison to Gann's presented example with the name
contracted...Frank Gilliland applied the "major" both
from Robeson's claim of rank of major in the CAP and the
former half-hour TV sitcom "Major Dad" about an active-
duty USMC officer. Marine veterans, indeed most veterans
of any branch with a pride in their military service, are
justifiably insulted both personally and as a group at
ANY poseur, any fake "veteran" who makes claims of
machismo and/or heroism when they have NO PROOF of such
claims.

YOU have made numerous denigratory personal insults about
my "rear area service" in my military experience, a
voluntary enlistment in the Army, a branch that had
selective service draftees during a definite war period.
If you are a REAL military veteran, then you should know
that no one in the military, especially in the enlisted
ranks, has much choice of where they are assigned. I went
where I was told, did my duties, got promotions because I
did my duties competently. That my assignment involved
HF radio communications on a large scale was an eye-
opening revelation into the much larger world of radio.
It was "the luck of the draw" and it resulted in a major
life career change for me that I never regretted. That
you were resentful of that fortuitous circumstance is
not my problem. The ACAN-STARCOM-DCS worldwide net was
and remains far larger than any Department of State
communications network; the military nets did carry State
communications then and both share the DSN now.

Brian Kelly, formerly a regular in here, vacillated on
his postings, taking several "sides." While NEVER having
served, he boasted of "more important work" for the
military than I, negatively criticized what I did as both
a military and a civilian person, yet made a number of
embarassing faux pas on his knowledge of the military,
including the activities of the now-closed NADC in
Pennsylvania. He might have changed his mind on NPRM
05-143, maybe not. He has stopped posting in here.

Hans Brakob, a proud morseman and USN veteran, a Master
Chief Petty Officer, has gone on the record as favoring
the elimination of the U.S. amateur radio code test. I
respect his military service and I think he respects mine.
My only "disagreement" with Hans is his penchant for
posting/forwarding so many stories/tales on USN life,
some of them of quite an emotional nature. While the
USN and the entire maritime world enthusiastically
boosted the use of early radio a century ago, there is
a sense of overkill in boosting morsemanship from an
emotional, visceral level a century later...especially
given the enormous improvements in all radio techniques
and technologies during that century.

Brian Burke is a USAF veteran and I do not discredit his
service nor insult his active-duty assignments. Robeson
does that for no reason. Brian is a meteorologist, not
one directly involved in the worldwide USAF radio network,
but he is conversant and knowledgeable about military
radio procedures on land. Burke favors the elimination
of the U.S. amateur radio license exam code test and is
a code-tested radio amateur licensee.

Frank Gilliland is a USMC veteran and works IN radio,
does not have an amateur radio license yet takes the
side against the NPRM. That's fine with me. Frank
does not insult me yet we have had some mild disagreements
in here. Frank is frank and believable. His postings
have an air of honesty. Frank takes no guff from Dudly
and speaks up on Dudly's fakery, misuse of what is
known jargon in the Corps, and Dudly's general weird
attitude.

You make up derogatory
names for those folks and you insult their jobs and military service.

I WILL endeavor to insult, demean, and generally despise
ANY military veteran FAKE that exists or shows up. That
is a PROMISE.

I WILL endeavor to insult, demean, and generally despise
anyone who attempts the same sort of insults, denigrations,
and personal insults on ME. They get back what they hurl.

I have digitized records of proof of my military service,
my civilian jobs, personal references (both mentioned in
here in specifics plus those not yet mentioned), plus
some additional verification documents from government
agencies on my ordinary life. While not an exceptional
life, it exists, has existed, and was real. Anyone who
challenges that, in any way, shape, or form had damn
well be able to PROVE their charges beyond any doubt.
If they cannot prove what they charge, they will get
much worse than they try to give.

In my life experience I've encountered a number of
"churlish" bullies who've attempted many things against
me, including physical violence. I learned to stand up
to them, face them down, and, in a few cases, had to
physically defeat them when they were not able to control
themselves. I'm not looking for trouble but if trouble
finds me, then woe is that trouble; such will not find
an easy adversary.



Gee, Lennie, you are constantly AGAINST the retention of morse code
testing in amateur radio. Imagine that.

TS.


...and, poor baby, you still wonder why you are insulted and denigrated?

Up yours.

You can continue to maintain the code test on your purely
personal level of your targeted insults to me specifically.
You have received responses. You apparently don't like
being countered on the personal level. Your problem. If
I have the time you will get replies as I choose.

Since you started this thread with an overt personal insult
as the title, you are in no position to claim yourself
either "civil" in this war of words or as the "neutral
judge" of What Should Be. You are neither "neutral" nor
"judge."

Or, it could shift to the broader perspective of actually
talking regulation policy and arguing on that plane. If
you choose to resort to the personal level again, you are
the one to have failed in the shift. You get NO points
for already being IN amateur radio through licensing since
the code test regulations affect only those who are either
not in amateur radio or those inside who wish to "upgrade."
You are in neither category. You are not in the FCC nor
do you control any licensing regulations. You have no
qualifications that make you "superior" for arguing policy
on the public level, can only resort to puerile personal
insults. QED.

wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Nov 19, 6:34 pm
wrote:
From: on Thurs 17 Nov 2005 02:45
wrote:
From: on Nov 16, 2:20 am
Dave Heil wrote:

In other words, if it didn't make money for you, it wasn't going to
get your time and effort.

You really can't understand anyone who doesn't have YOUR
immaculate set of "standards" can you?

I've met people like you, Len.

No you haven't, Heil. People like me would AVOID your kind.

Then why do you not avoid his "kind" here, Len?

Such avoidance allows you to continue living.

How?

Is that a threat? You seem to be saying that Dave would be
in some sort of danger if he were to meet you.

What danger would that be, Len?

Be greatful for that.

I'm *grateful* I don't have neighbors like you, Len.

Am I some kind of "beginner" in radio after a half century
of experience in more parts of the EM spectrum than any
amateur is allowed?

In some kinds of radio, you are a beginner, Len.

Am I some kind of "beginner" because I've
operated transmitters with far higher power outputs than
amateurs are allowed to have?

Yes - because you didn't "operate" those transmitters in the legal
sense of the word.

Am I some kind of "beginner"
because long ago I learned how to design radio circuits from
a blank pad with pen on to the finished hardware and gotten
them to perform as originally specifed?

Yet when a simple design problem was posed to you here,
you could not solve it.

You seem to think so. What it really boils down to is
manual telegraphy.

That's one thing you're a beginner at, Len. There's lots more.

I would be an absolute beginner at telegraphy, no dispute,
if I were to take that up again. All I know is the pattern
of dots and dashes and their corresponding English language
characters. That's suffed into a good memory with lots and
lots and lots of other data, some useful, some not.

"suffed"?

Seems to me that beginner status is what really bothers you.

But - and this is very important in the NPRM 05-143 decision -
the FCC has ALREADY made ALL ALLOCATED MODES OPTIONAL TO USE.

Always been that way, Len.

In fact, an amateur license does not have to be used at all. In many
services, if a license is not used, it is revoked by FCC.

There just isn't ANY mandate to exclusively use radiotelegraphy
except on two small slivers of the lower end of 6m and 2m.

No amateur has to use those segments.

But, getting the amateur license to use ANY amateur band
below 30 MHz still requires passing a telegraphy test!

And that's a very good thing.

I'm seeking to eliminate that telegraphy test.

Why? It has no effect on you.

There's no
point in having it except as a vestige of pride still felt
by those long-timers who once considered themselves as
'compagnons de telegraphe' because the human-made regulations
gave them status-rank-privileges BECAUSE of that telegraphy
test.

That's a real load of bull, Len.

One point in having the test is that Morse Code is a big part of
today's amateur radio.

I and thousands upon thousands of others have operated
radio transmitters legally and competently at frequencies
below 30 MHz without being required to know or use any radio-
telegraphy skills.

But not as radio amateurs. You were a transmitter technician in the
Army and a cber. Sorry, that experience does not qualify you to
operate an amateur radio station. FCC agrees.

That "plain, simple fact" shows the
hypocrisy of the PCTA in demanding the retention of the
telegraphy test.

No hypocrisy. Just an opinion that disagrees with yours.

That test regulations does NOT serve the
public,

Yes, they do.

only the few already-licensed in amateur radio who
consider, self-righteously superior through passing a
telegraphy test.

Nope.

Now, if you wish to start some program to teach real
beginners in radio the skills of telegraphy, I am not
against that. Feel free to use what allocations you've
been granted. So far. Beep your little Orion to outer
space if you want.

Remember, what YOU consider to be "necessary" is NOT
shared by the public,

Says who?

"The public" was invited to comment on this very issue. And the
majority (55%) of those who bothered to comment say that
at least some Morse Code testing *is* necessary for an amateur
radio license of at least Extra class.

is NOT a physical requirement to
operate any RF emitter below 30 MHz.

Neither is a written test, Len. Millions of people have used HF
transmitters without passing *any* test, you know.

It is just your
personal desire.

Getting rid of the test is just *your* personal desire.

You are not yet a god of anything,
are not divine.

Neither are you, Len.

You are simply inflexible and self-
righteous, seeking to retain federally-mandated testing
in skills which you passed some time ago.

You've told us how great things are for you many, many times, Len.
As if all that somehow explains your obsession.

"Obsession?!?" :-)
Trying to change federal law is an "obsession?"

In your case, yes, it is. You are obsessed.

Incorrect. It is PERSISTENCE.

No, in your case it's an obsession.

It is IDEALISM, a quest to
make things better for others who share some of my interests.

And who would those "others" be?

It is many things but it is definitely not some deviant
obsession.

It's clearly an obsession for you.

On the other hand, those who have met old test regulations
and insist and insist that those should be kept for the
future are suspect.

Why? Because they're persistent and idealistic?

Their self-righteousness is suspect.
Their failure to change with a changing reality is suspect.
Their obstinancy on keeping the old ways forever in this
new millennium are suspect. Their perceived self-worth
is threatened by feared loss of status and privilege,
perhaps even rank in the pecking order of the "amateur
community."

Man, you really can pile up the bullstuff, Len.

You can write "YES it IS" all you want. Obtaining an amateur radio
license isn't about those things.

True, the U.S. amateur radio test regulations have nothing
about baby shoes or taking little baby steps.

RIGHT NOW the U.S. amateur test regulations require a
telegraphy test for any class privileges below 30 MHz.
THAT is what many are trying to change.

NPRM 05-143 is about ELIMINATING that code test. Change
for the future, for the public...the public in the
Commission's language is ALL OF US, not just the personal
desires of the few who have met and passed telegraphy
tests.

Most of the public who bothered to comment do not agree with complete
code test elimination, Len.

Then why are you so unfriendly here, Len?

Because both Miccolis and Heil are decidedly unfriendly to
all who disagree with them.

Well, that's not true of me, anyway.

K2UNK and I disagree mightily on many things, including the Morse Code
test. Yet we are friendly. Same is true of myself and K0HB. And many
others.

In fact, Len, it seems that *you* are the unfriendly one.

wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Nov 19, 6:34 pm
wrote:
From: on Thurs 17 Nov 2005 02:45
wrote:
From: on Nov 16, 2:20 am
Dave Heil wrote:

That's simply incorrect, Leonard. You insult anyone who favors
retention of morse testing in amateur radio.

Miccolis and Heil both PERCEIVE insults where there is only
strong, sharp responses to their overbearing self-images.

No, you write lots of insults, Len. Anybody who disagrees with
you here becomes the target of your personal attacks. In fact,
you're no longer satisfied with such insults on Usenet, and have
added ECFS as one of your venues.

This venue is a debate forum, not a gathering around the
bar at a local fraternal order.

Then go ahead and "debate", rather than calling names.

Please explain how retention of morse testing is regression in any form.
After all, morse code is used daily by thousands of radio amateurs.

Those radio amateurs - if operating legally - below 30 MHz
using radiotelegraphy have ALREADY passed a federal
telegraphy test. If they have already passed it, removal
of the code test regulation will not affect their operating
privileges.

However, the code test retention WILL affect all those
uncountable in the future who MAY want to get an amateur
radio license having below-30-MHz privileges.

Apply that logic to the written test, too.

They are
not invisible, only uncountable because there is no
accurate way to get their numbers.

So you have no idea how many there really are.

At best, the Commission
gets only a general impression of their numbers in the
filings on Docket 05-235. So far, those numbers of the
public against code testing are about even with those
for its retention.

55% for retention of some code testing, 45% for complete
removal - when you count those individuals who bothered
to file an opinion with FCC.

You continue to complain that others insult or denigrate you. You've
told Jim that he never had any "PRIDE" in his work.

Yes, I should be taken to task on that, considering that
Miccolis has NEVER TOLD ANYONE HERE *EXACTLY* WHAT HE DOES
AT HIS *UNNAMED* EMPLOYMENT PLACE.

Why does that matter, Len? What difference does my job make
to what you describe as "hobby radio"?

Your behavior here has demonstrated that it doesn't matter what
someone's job involves. If that person disagrees with you, their
employment is ridiculed and denigrated by you.

yielding
only vague generalities of what he does/did without giving
more specific descriptions.

See above. Only a fool would give you more information when
your previous behavior shows what you will do with that information.

Do you consider your behavior to be rude?

No.

Well, it is. Very rude.


It is strong and confrontational...which has been quite
normal in computer-modem networks since the original ARPANET
spread out into the world. These networks are not for the
faint of heart or the easily disturbed one-sided inflexible
ideological bigots who refuse to compromise.

That last phrase describes you pretty well, Len.

NPRM 05-143 is a direct affront to the perception of some in
what constitutes "ham radio" or "amateur radio."

Yeah, well, different strokes for different folks.

Some insist
that radiotelegraphy is "the heart and soul of ham radio,"
therefore a test for that skill must "always" be in the
regulations.

Opinions vary all over the place on that.

We readers will just put you down as either NOT WORKING or
at some place not associated with electronics at all.

We readers? You're now speaking for all other readers of this newsgroup?

Not at all. I read ALL postings in this public venue,
therefore reiterating that I am one of those readers.

Yet you use the plural.

You can't blame Jim for not wanting to talk shop with you. Look what
has happened to others who have revealed details of their work (and who
happen to favor retention of morse testing).

Miccolis has not revealed any details of what he does for
a living...other than he is a "professional" and is "proud
of his work."

Here we go again....

Miccolis has expressed a number of varying
opinions of alleged knowledge, even expertise in areas
where he has not claimed any experience (aerospace,
specifically on spacecraft; non-amateur communications
where he refused to give anything specific on where or what),
yet has been highly confrontational, even antagonistic to
those who HAVE had experience.

Well, Len, you've never been a radio amateur, and have no real
experience with radiotelegraphy, yet you are "highly confrontational,
even antagonistic to those who HAVE had experience."

More important, you find it necessary to attack me personally, rather
than deal with facts.

Miccolis has admitted that
he has NEVER served in any military postion, yet he chides
veterans who have served by claiming expertise in military
matters and military life.

Where have I claimed "expertise" in anything, Len? If you think
my postings are those of an expert, that's your opinion, not
anything I posted.

Hans Brakob, a proud morseman and USN veteran, a Master
Chief Petty Officer, has gone on the record as favoring
the elimination of the U.S. amateur radio code test. I
respect his military service and I think he respects mine.
My only "disagreement" with Hans is his penchant for
posting/forwarding so many stories/tales on USN life,
some of them of quite an emotional nature.

Why is that a problem for you? Is it becase Hans' stories,
and his storytelling, are better than yours?

While the
USN and the entire maritime world enthusiastically
boosted the use of early radio a century ago, there is
a sense of overkill in boosting morsemanship from an
emotional, visceral level a century later...especially
given the enormous improvements in all radio techniques
and technologies during that century.

Whoa! "there is a sense of overkill in boosting morsemanship
from an emotional, visceral level a century later."

What the heck is that supposed to mean - that Hans isn't even
supposed to like Morse Code?

Brian Burke is a USAF veteran and I do not discredit his
service nor insult his active-duty assignments.

Because he agrees with you.

You make up derogatory
names for those folks and you insult their jobs and military service.

I WILL endeavor to insult, demean, and generally despise
ANY military veteran FAKE that exists or shows up. That
is a PROMISE.

Also real ones who disagree with you. Like a USCG radio
operator whom you dissed in your classic "sphincters post".

I WILL endeavor to insult, demean, and generally despise
anyone who attempts the same sort of insults, denigrations,
and personal insults on ME. They get back what they hurl.

You'll also do the same to those who simply disagree with you,
or point out your mistakes. You consider disagreement with
your ideas or information to be a personal insult.