"JR" wrote:

Would a vertical antenna such as the Hustler 6BTV operate (Transmit and
Recieve) well on a ground mount in the middle of a concrete parking lot if
the concrete contained a lot of the concrete reinforcing wire? The parking
lot is next to a large lake as well and the ground stays pretty wet most of
the time.


JR


A concrete pad is very close to being an excellent ground system. If
it has all the rebar welded together and a strap brought up for you to
connect to, it IS an excellent ground system, called a Ufer ground.

Concrete is a poor conductor, but there are a lot of paths for that
poor conductor to reach surrounding soil, which may even be a poorer
conductor. A Ufer ground takes advantage of that. IIRC, it was
invented in WWII for keeping quonset huts filled with ammo from
blowing up from static discharge. Turns out it makes a good RF and a
good lightning system ground.

If I ever have a house built, I'll make sure it has a Ufer ground, so
I don't have to deal with ground rods and radials.


--
Eric F. Richards

"Nature abhors a vacuum tube." -- Myron Glass,
often attributed to J. R. Pierce, Bell Labs, c. 1940

Just build a backyard patio out of concrete with lots of wire in the mix
and you are all set.
cuhulin

Cuhulin,

Actually an In-the-Ground Swimming Pool with a Full Circle
Copper Ground Cable about 2 to 3 Feet down in the ground and
completely encircling the Pool; that is also Bonded to the
House's AC Electrical System Ground - Is a Real Ground Sink )

iane ~ RHF

EFR,
Thank You for sharing the information and point me in the direction of
the
Ufer Ground including Concrete-Encased Electrodes and the Grounding
Electrode Systems

ABOUT - The Ufer Ground
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortw...a/message/7208

The "Ufer" Ground
http://www.psihq.com/iread/ufergrnd.htm
http://www.scott-inc.com/img/ufer.gif

Technical Note - A New Look at the Ufer Ground System
- by Chris Scott - Radio World 1989
http://www.scott-inc.com/html/ufer.htm

Ufer and Tower Grounding - Lightning Protection Information
http://www.comm-omni.com/polyweb/ufertower.htm

Concrete-Encased Electrodes and the Grounding Electrode System
- by Michael J. Johnston

Ufer Ground - Technical Bulletin :
http://www.sonoma-county.org/prmd/do...in/ufergnd.htm
Technical Details :
When available the building reinforcing steel (rebar)
is the preferred method for providing an electrode.
Concrete Encased Electrodes (UFER) can consist of
either a minimum of 20' of No. 4 copper wire or two or
more No. 4 or larger rebar installed in the foundation
with a minimum of 2" of concrete cover. When using rebar,
it must be spliced a minimum of 40 bar diameters,
ex. 40bd x 1/2"=20" min splice length.
http://www.sonoma-county.org/prmd/do...Electrodes.gif

Diagram of Ufer Metods and Driven Ground Rod Electrodes

The Best Way to Install Ground Rods ?
- by Gary Coffman [KE4ZV]
http://www.pupman.com/listarchives/1.../msg00016.html

Assembling your Antenna System
Part III - Constructing of the Tower Base
http://www.astrosurf.org/lombry/qsl-tower-assembly3.htm
Note - A Word of Caution about the Ufer Ground

Typical Residential Electrical Service Grounding Diagram
Service Entrance Grounding and Bonding Diagrams
http://www.ci.lompoc.ca.us/departmen...douts/elec.pdf
http://www.ventura.org/vcrma/build_s...s_info/e-8.pdf

All About Lightning Protection
http://www.hamradio-badarc.co.uk/project/earthproj1.htm
Part IV - The External Grounding System
http://www.astrosurf.com/lombry/Radi...unding-dwg.gif
Single Point Ground Panel (SPGP)

Grounding verses Bonding Part 6
- by Mike Holt
http://www.ecmweb.com/mag/electric_g..._vs_bonding_6/

Tips for Grounding an Antenna in Thin Soils
http://www.eng-tips.com/viewthread.c...=134129&page=1

eHAM - One of the Most Common Questions in the
Elmers Section is about Grounds and Grounding.
http://www.eham.net/articles/12459

QUESTION - What Does UFER stand for ?
{ Herbert G. Ufer the man's last name }


that's ufer, Ufer. UFER ! for me now - iane ~ RHF