"Johnny Borborigmi" wrote in message
news:200601231914518930%growl@tummycom...
On 2006-01-23 16:08:16 -0500, dxAce said:
Yep, the folks who cannot or will not take the time to learn the code
come up with
excuses just like the one you presented all the time.

Thanks for sharing!

dxAce
Michigan
USA


I've been a ham for over 10 years and have never had to resort to using
code.

It's fun but not needed in todays world. I'd rather new hams be a lot more
technically oriented.


But they're not. They're appliance operators. And the electronics industry
has not helped, either.

Raiding the refrigerator is the same thing as operating an appliance.
cuhulin

Brenda Ann wrote:

"Johnny Borborigmi" wrote in message
news:200601231914518930%growl@tummycom...
On 2006-01-23 16:08:16 -0500, dxAce said:
Yep, the folks who cannot or will not take the time to learn the code
come up with
excuses just like the one you presented all the time.

Thanks for sharing!

dxAce
Michigan
USA


I've been a ham for over 10 years and have never had to resort to using
code.

It's fun but not needed in todays world. I'd rather new hams be a lot more
technically oriented.


But they're not. They're appliance operators. And the electronics industry
has not helped, either.

The electronics industry has been the driving force behind the dumbing down of
the testing criteria for years. More people = more equipment sales.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

"Brenda Ann" wrote in message
...

But they're not. They're appliance operators. And the electronics
industry
has not helped, either.

Whose fault is this? And more importantly, how it is best remedied?

Jackie

"Buzzygirl" wrote in message
...

"Brenda Ann" wrote in message
...

But they're not. They're appliance operators. And the electronics
industry
has not helped, either.

Whose fault is this? And more importantly, how it is best remedied?

Jackie

It would be best remedied by removing all pre-built ham gear from the market
and making it a requirement for hams to build all their own gear (as it was
in the beginning).

Of course, this isn't about to happen, too many of us like all the bells and
whistles on our fancy store-bought rigs (though I could still build my own
AM/FM/CW/SSB rigs (not necessarily all in the same rig), I couldn't build
something with all the memories, PLL style VFO, etc..)

Buzzygirl wrote:

Whose fault is this? And more importantly, how it is best remedied?

I'm not sure it's as necessary as people think. The whole purpose of
the "Amateur Radio Serivce" in the U.S. was to provide a pool of already
trained, ready to use radio operators in a war or emergency.

Events of the last few years have shown that inside a disaster area or
war zone, a radio operator needs to now how to use short range VHF
equipment, and communicate well in a panic situation by voice.

Outside of a disaster area, the internet has become the method of choice
for health and welfare traffic. Obviously, people who can man the
communitcations centers who are both computer and radio savvy are needed
there.

CW operation has no place in either. Convincing the heads of FEMA, the
Salvation Army, the Red Cross, or the local police or national guard
that it is necessary simply won't happen.

My generation was the crossover. In the mid '60s, children were exposed
to computer programing and started to move away from ham radio. There
was a short "burp" in the '70s when people still built their own
computers, but by 1980 it was gone and forgotten.

Ham radio was difficult to get into, morse code is difficult to learn and
for many of the people who are the computer geniuses of today, impossible
by traditional methods. Computers are welcoming. They are a lot cheaper
than radios, no morse code, no technical exam, just buy one at x-Mart,
and you're on.

This has caused many problems because people just don't build anything
anymore. It is almost impossible to find an engineer who is familure
with a soldering iron. Try to make a prototype device without a lot of
funding and you will understand what I mean.

Ham radio, IMHO, in order to survive needs to be a more hands on, people
oriented hobby. Elmering and outreach are the way to continue it.

Forcing people to learn morse code is not going to get more or better hams.
Education and experience is.

If you want to have people learn morse code offer to teach it. If you
want to get people to build things teach them. If you want people
who passed the test copying 5wpm and don't even own a key, help
them get one and build a cpo.

If you want people who are just on hf to stay with cw, go down to
the low speed (novice bands) area of the HF band and work them.
Be kind and patient. Help them to enjoy the hobby.

73,

Geoff.

--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel N3OWJ/4X1GM
IL Voice: (07)-7424-1667 IL Fax: 972-2-648-1443 U.S. Voice: 1-215-821-1838
The trouble with being a futurist is that when people get around to believing
you, it's too late. We lost. Google 2,000,000:Hams 0.

Geoffrey S. Mendelson wrote:
Buzzygirl wrote:

Whose fault is this? And more importantly, how it is best remedied?

I'm not sure it's as necessary as people think. The whole purpose of
the "Amateur Radio Serivce" in the U.S. was to provide a pool of already
trained, ready to use radio operators in a war or emergency.

That is a bygone era, and I'm not sure that hams really ever provided a
significant contribution to emergency communications.


Events of the last few years have shown that inside a disaster area or
war zone, a radio operator needs to now how to use short range VHF
equipment, and communicate well in a panic situation by voice.

Actually hams need to be recognized as being able to make a significant
contribution to emergency communications by the professional emergency
responders. My sense is that they are pretty much an afterthought.
Additionally hams need to have the equipment to communicate whth the
professionals.



Outside of a disaster area, the internet has become the method of choice
for health and welfare traffic. Obviously, people who can man the
communitcations centers who are both computer and radio savvy are needed
there.

CW operation has no place in either. Convincing the heads of FEMA, the
Salvation Army, the Red Cross, or the local police or national guard
that it is necessary simply won't happen.

My generation was the crossover. In the mid '60s, children were exposed
to computer programing and started to move away from ham radio. There
was a short "burp" in the '70s when people still built their own
computers, but by 1980 it was gone and forgotten.

Ham radio was difficult to get into, morse code is difficult to learn and
for many of the people who are the computer geniuses of today, impossible
by traditional methods. Computers are welcoming. They are a lot cheaper
than radios, no morse code, no technical exam, just buy one at x-Mart,
and you're on.

This has caused many problems because people just don't build anything
anymore. It is almost impossible to find an engineer who is familure
with a soldering iron. Try to make a prototype device without a lot of
funding and you will understand what I mean.

Ham radio, IMHO, in order to survive needs to be a more hands on, people
oriented hobby. Elmering and outreach are the way to continue it.

Forcing people to learn morse code is not going to get more or better hams.
Education and experience is.

If you want to have people learn morse code offer to teach it. If you
want to get people to build things teach them. If you want people
who passed the test copying 5wpm and don't even own a key, help
them get one and build a cpo.

If you want people who are just on hf to stay with cw, go down to
the low speed (novice bands) area of the HF band and work them.
Be kind and patient. Help them to enjoy the hobby.

73,

Geoff.

--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel N3OWJ/4X1GM
IL Voice: (07)-7424-1667 IL Fax: 972-2-648-1443 U.S. Voice: 1-215-821-1838
The trouble with being a futurist is that when people get around to believing
you, it's too late. We lost. Google 2,000,000:Hams 0.

On Tue, 24 Jan 2006 13:51:04 +0000 (UTC), (Geoffrey
S. Mendelson) wrote:

Buzzygirl wrote:

Whose fault is this? And more importantly, how it is best remedied?

I'm not sure it's as necessary as people think. The whole purpose of
the "Amateur Radio Serivce" in the U.S. was to provide a pool of already
trained, ready to use radio operators in a war or emergency.

That's what hams did in NO when ALL other types of communication
failed.

Events of the last few years have shown that inside a disaster area or
war zone, a radio operator needs to now how to use short range VHF
equipment, and communicate well in a panic situation by voice.

Outside of a disaster area, the internet has become the method of choice
for health and welfare traffic. Obviously, people who can man the
communitcations centers who are both computer and radio savvy are needed
there.

CW operation has no place in either.
What about when ther is NO power! Low powered CW rigs get through
when everything else fails. It has been demonstrated time and again.
They can use battery or solar power better than voice rigs because of
their low power draw.

Convincing the heads of FEMA, the
Salvation Army, the Red Cross, or the local police or national guard
that it is necessary simply won't happen.

My generation was the crossover. In the mid '60s, children were exposed
to computer programing and started to move away from ham radio. There
was a short "burp" in the '70s when people still built their own
computers, but by 1980 it was gone and forgotten.

Ham radio was difficult to get into, morse code is difficult to learn and
for many of the people who are the computer geniuses of today, impossible
by traditional methods.
These are called challenges!

Computers are welcoming. They are a lot cheaper
than radios, no morse code, no technical exam, just buy one at x-Mart,
and you're on.

This has caused many problems because people just don't build anything
anymore. It is almost impossible to find an engineer who is familure
with a soldering iron. Try to make a prototype device without a lot of
funding and you will understand what I mean.

Ham radio, IMHO, in order to survive needs to be a more hands on, people
oriented hobby. Elmering and outreach are the way to continue it.

Partly true but ther is still a need for CW as in my example cited
above!

Forcing people to learn morse code is not going to get more or better hams.
Education and experience is.
Learning Morse Code (CW) IS education!

If you want to have people learn morse code offer to teach it.
I learned CW at age 21 from some 13 year old explorer scouts who could
use CW at 35 WPM or higher. They viewed it as a challenge and were
willing to pass on their knowledge to others.

If you
want to get people to build things teach them. If you want people
who passed the test copying 5wpm and don't even own a key, help
them get one and build a cpo.

If you want people who are just on hf to stay with cw, go down to
the low speed (novice bands) area of the HF band and work them.
Be kind and patient. Help them to enjoy the hobby.

I partly agree however there are QRP (low power) enthusiasts who use
CW much of the time and enjoy it very much. They hold seminars near
Baltimore every year and are enjoying a rise in interest among fellow
and prospective hams.

73,

Geoff.
73 de WA3FWD
Warren

QRP kits - from easy to difficult - are available from companies on
the internet. Do a Google of "QRP" and take your pick.

an_old_friend wrote:
Warren wrote:
On Tue, 24 Jan 2006 13:51:04 +0000 (UTC), (Geoffrey
S. Mendelson) wrote:

Buzzygirl wrote:

Whose fault is this? And more importantly, how it is best remedied?

I'm not sure it's as necessary as people think. The whole purpose of
the "Amateur Radio Serivce" in the U.S. was to provide a pool of already
trained, ready to use radio operators in a war or emergency.

That's what hams did in NO when ALL other types of communication
failed.

when was that? I watched a lot of katrina coverage never was their a
time Foxnews had any trouble transmitting into or out of NO

CW operation has no place in either.
What about when ther is NO power!
no uqual s no radio
Low powered CW rigs get through
when everything else fails. It has been demonstrated time and again.

when was the last nothing but CW got trough? certainly not in this
century
They can use battery or solar power better than voice rigs because of
their low power draw.
so

The comm guys involved in emergency response don't really have a use
for ham-based communications. Getting the people who can really
provide some assistance to victims of a disaster to communicate with
one another is difficult enough. Tying in hams would only bring chaos
to an already hectic situation.

In several hurricanes I've monitored the hams did little more than set
up the usual nets, read NOAA weather reports and check in with one
another. No emergency comms were made. In one memorable hurricane in
the late 1980's the 14275 net was able to make contact with one ham on
the impacted carribean island. It was chaos as guys tried to talk over
one another in voice and cw all at one time with that poor guy.

Warren wrote:
What about when ther is NO power! Low powered CW rigs get through
when everything else fails. It has been demonstrated time and again.
They can use battery or solar power better than voice rigs because of
their low power draw.

I can't really agree with that having worked Italy on 20m using 1w SSB
on 20m. The rig was a Ten-Tec Argonaut 509. The biggest problem I had
was I forgot to say "over" after answering his CQ and he thought he missed
the last letter of my call.

Geoff.
--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel N3OWJ/4X1GM
IL Voice: (07)-7424-1667 IL Fax: 972-2-648-1443 U.S. Voice: 1-215-821-1838
The trouble with being a futurist is that when people get around to believing
you, it's too late. We lost. Google 2,000,000:Hams 0.