After reading http://www.cebik.com/fdim/fdim8.html and coming to the
conclusion I may never get my random wire up high enough for any real
DX, I am looking to sloper and TTFD. I can install either of these
facing eastward toward Europe quite easily with a top height of 30
feet or better.

I can barely get my random wire 3 feet off the ground. Unless I run it
off the roof like a sloper.

Noise reduction is right up there with signal strength on my priority
list. My house has a metal roof I am thinking anything up above them
might help sheild the antennas from household noise.

Any thoughts about one antenna over the other?

mike

On Sat, 27 Sep 2003 00:28:36 GMT, mike wrote:

After reading http://www.cebik.com/fdim/fdim8.html and coming to the
conclusion I may never get my random wire up high enough for any real
DX, I am looking to sloper and TTFD. I can install either of these
facing eastward toward Europe quite easily with a top height of 30
feet or better.

I can barely get my random wire 3 feet off the ground. Unless I run it
off the roof like a sloper.

When it comes to wire antennas the sloper works pretty well.
I've run a pair of half wave, center fed slopers on 75 (W2AU balun).
They are identical antennas so naturally they tune differently....
(Surrounding objects) The upper ends are close to 90 feet and the
angles are close to 45 degrees. A half sloper would take ... about
half the space, or about 45 feet and it sounds as if that is within
your requirements.

I have one To the NE for Europe and one to the SW, although the one to
the SW is coming down. BTW, into Europe I usually show about 2
S-units difference between the two antennas. It does vary, but the
least I've seen has been one S-unit.

4 nights ago I worked EA3JE in Barcelona (after the sun was up
there...bout 0600Z) on 3.791 with 5/8 reports in both directions.
A half hour earlier he was something like 20 over 9.

Noise reduction is right up there with signal strength on my priority
list. My house has a metal roof I am thinking anything up above them
might help sheild the antennas from household noise.

Metal roofs may not be the best unless the sheets are bonded and
grounded...then again like any noise generator; they may not bother at
all. I have very little problem with noise except for an electric
fence about a 1/4 mile to the SW and another about a half mile to the
East. Most of the time, at least on the lower frequencies
atmospherics (QRN) is far stronger than most anything else.

Now I'm working to either put up a couple of half slopers on 160, a
fan dipole, and inverted L or shunt feed the tower


Any thoughts about one antenna over the other?

You really need to give a bit more information, but for me, I prefer
the sloper, or half sloper...IF you have the room and the height...A
lot depends on which band(s). Done right the tower can act as a
reflector for a "little" bit of gain.

Roger Halstead (K8RI EN73 & ARRL Life Member)
www.rogerhalstead.com
N833R World's oldest Debonair? (S# CD-2)


mike

On Sat, 27 Sep 2003 00:28:36 GMT, mike wrote:

I can barely get my random wire 3 feet off the ground. Unless I run it
off the roof like a sloper.

Noise reduction is right up there with signal strength on my priority
list. My house has a metal roof I am thinking anything up above them
might help sheild the antennas from household noise.

Any thoughts about one antenna over the other?

mike

Hi Mike,

A metal roof? Make it one half of the antenna, the other half driving
straight for ground.

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

On Sat, 27 Sep 2003 20:41:45 GMT, Richard Clark
wrote:


Hi Mike,

A metal roof? Make it one half of the antenna, the other half driving
straight for ground.

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC


Thats a thought. But Wouldnt it be really noisy?
I also have a really big CB antenna up top too.
Hasnt been used in 15 years and would need to rewire it as the
hardline is tatered.

mike

On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 00:23:32 GMT, mike wrote:

On Sat, 27 Sep 2003 20:41:45 GMT, Richard Clark
wrote:


Hi Mike,

A metal roof? Make it one half of the antenna, the other half driving
straight for ground.

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC


Thats a thought. But Wouldnt it be really noisy?
I also have a really big CB antenna up top too.
Hasnt been used in 15 years and would need to rewire it as the
hardline is tatered.

mike

Hi Mike,

Noisy? Only listening can tell. There is nothing terribly important
about antennas except they be as high as possible and long in
proportion to the longest wavelength (tenth wavelength would be
bordering on pretty small, one wavelength bordering on getting large -
notice there's a lot of latitude between). If you notice the presence
or absence of the CB antenna, I would suspect you must have a mighty
small roof.

No one ever stops at one design. You are the first example of that
with your comment about two. No one stops at two either. If they
did, they sure don't post here (and you, again, provide yet another
example of that verity). The reason being is that you can't tell what
you've done unless you can compare it (and it hardly pays to take
someone else's word without testing ;-)

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 00:33:47 GMT, Richard Clark
wrote:


Hi Mike,

Noisy? Only listening can tell. There is nothing terribly important
about antennas except they be as high as possible and long in
proportion to the longest wavelength (tenth wavelength would be
bordering on pretty small, one wavelength bordering on getting large -
notice there's a lot of latitude between). If you notice the presence
or absence of the CB antenna, I would suspect you must have a mighty
small roof.

No one ever stops at one design. You are the first example of that
with your comment about two. No one stops at two either. If they
did, they sure don't post here (and you, again, provide yet another
example of that verity). The reason being is that you can't tell what
you've done unless you can compare it (and it hardly pays to take
someone else's word without testing ;-)

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC
Hey Richard,

Well the random wire has been a huge improvement over the indoor coax
loops (Got 3 of those BTW) both in terms of signals and noise
reduction. Course with that metal roof, I am sure you can understand
why.

Last evening while trying to hastily install a length of wire as a
psuedo sloper (for comparison purposes), I Lost a coax connector on
the random wire where it enters the second floor window. That was it
for the random wire as the coax went sailing off the porch and out
onto the lawn, he,he.

Anyway, I found a north pointing length of wire sloping off the house
is totaly useless here in New England. But we are taking about 1/3
less wire at a random length. (with an antenna tuner)

Needless to say the radom wire outperformed the sloper except for RCI
which was unusually clear last night. So, I kept the psuedo sloper up
and just connected the end of it to the random wire as it ended where
the random began. Total length is now 30 meters or so. grin

I probably should be reasonably happy with what I have going as it
really is quiet and pulls in quite a few stations. I even managed to
get the average height up a tad more.

However, like most SWL's, I feel compelled to install something that
pulls in even more.

Enter Alpha Delta

mike

On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 02:58:56 GMT, mike wrote:


However, like most SWL's, I feel compelled to install something that
pulls in even more.

Enter Alpha Delta

mike

Hi Mike,

If one antenna were perfect, we would all have that one (and I am sure
no two users would duplicate the other's choice).

I have several (goes without saying I suppose) that easily overlap in
the HF region and none duplicate the performance of the other. ALSO
no single one is always better than the other (choose any pair or
combination to compare).

Signals do not always arrive at the same strike angle to earth and
given the variety of antennas, I find one is more suitable to that
angle than another. Sometimes the choice is like a dead resistor
where the other shines, and then an hour later their roles reverse.
Propagation does not always conform to our design choice that is
optimized for what the signal is not.

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC