Noise level between two ant types
 

just a note, "charged particle" normally refers to a fermion like an
electron or proton. "charged dust particle" might be a better term.

Gravity

Noise level between two ant types
 

"Yuri Blanarovich" wrote in message
...

The point is, that if Cecil has seen sparks coming from his coax under
clear
AZ skies, or I have seen that small loop antenna shield DOES suppress
local
interference - measured, seen, experienced - than arguing by scientwists
is
just foolish, if not pathetic.

it's not dust particles, it's probably WIMPs or neutrinos. or an
evaporating graviton passing from another universe into ours.

Gravity

Noise level between two ant types
 

Jim Kelley wrote:



Tom Donaly wrote:


Where's the experimental evidence, Cecil?


Ever heard of Ben Franklin? :-)

73, ac6xg


Yes, and I've heard of Thales of Miletus, too, and both of
those gentlemen would have agreed with Tom Rauch because both
knew the value of experimentation and experience.
73,
Tom Donaly, KA6RUH

Noise level between two ant types
 

Jim Kelley wrote:



Tom Donaly wrote:


Where's the experimental evidence, Cecil?


Ever heard of Ben Franklin? :-)

73, ac6xg


Every winter here in New England we run numerous experiments, every time I walk
across the living room and touch a metal door knob.

The US military has an ESD specification of 25 KV @ 5 KOhms from a healthy
capacitor as a simulator.

Electro static discharge on antennas has been around for years. It is real!

Dry Climate and Wind are all that's needed. Now, is the Physics at the air
molecule level [Oxygen, Nitrogen, etc.], ionized Oxygen or Nitrogen atoms,
charged dust particle level [that just begs the issue ... how did the dust get
charged?], Van De Graff level, etc.? Who knows?

But, the antenna ESD is a very REAL effect. You can hypothesize the cause all
day. To solve the problem at the system level, I added an ESD bleed into my
antenna switches.

I'm going to filter this thread to the circular file.

Noise level between two ant types
 

Tom Donaly wrote:
Yes, and I've heard of Thales of Miletus, too, and both of
those gentlemen would have agreed with Tom Rauch because both
knew the value of experimentation and experience.

Virtually everything about clear-sky charged-particle
static is already known. It's just that some people
choose to ignore the laws of physics and remain ignorant
which is their right.
--
73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp

Noise level between two ant types
 

Dave wrote:
Jim Kelley wrote:



Tom Donaly wrote:


Where's the experimental evidence, Cecil?



Ever heard of Ben Franklin? :-)

73, ac6xg


Every winter here in New England we run numerous experiments, every time
I walk across the living room and touch a metal door knob.

The US military has an ESD specification of 25 KV @ 5 KOhms from a
healthy capacitor as a simulator.

Electro static discharge on antennas has been around for years. It is real!

Dry Climate and Wind are all that's needed. Now, is the Physics at the
air molecule level [Oxygen, Nitrogen, etc.], ionized Oxygen or Nitrogen
atoms, charged dust particle level [that just begs the issue ... how did
the dust get charged?], Van De Graff level, etc.? Who knows?

But, the antenna ESD is a very REAL effect. You can hypothesize the
cause all day. To solve the problem at the system level, I added an ESD
bleed into my antenna switches.

I'm going to filter this thread to the circular file.


No one said ESD didn't exist. But you hit the nail on the head so far
as wind caused ESD, "Who knows?" I don't, and neither does Cecil,
although he thinks he does.
73,
Tom Donaly, KA6RUH

Noise level between two ant types
 

Dave wrote:
Electro static discharge on antennas has been around for years. It is real!

Here's some interesting quotes from:

http://www.esda.org/basics/part1.cfm

"Virtually all materials, including water and dirt particles in the air,
can be triboelectrically charged."

"When a conductive material becomes charged, the charge (i.e., the
deficiency or excess of electrons) will be uniformly distributed across
the surface of the material. If the charged conductive material makes
contact with another conductive material, the electrons will transfer
between the materials quite easily. If the second conductor is attached
to an earth grounding point, the electrons will flow to ground and the
excess charge on the conductor will be "neutralized."

"Electrostatic charge can be created triboelectrically on conductors the
same way it is created on insulators. As long as the conductor is
isolated from other conductors or ground, the static charge will remain
on the conductor. If the conductor is grounded the charge will easily go
to ground. Or, if the charged conductor contacts or nears another
conductor, the charge will flow between the two conductors."
--
73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp

Noise level between two ant types
 

Tom Donaly wrote:
No one said ESD didn't exist. But you hit the nail on the head so far
as wind caused ESD, "Who knows?" I don't, and neither does Cecil,
although he thinks he does.

You are free to alleviate your ignorance by reading the same
technical material that I have read or continue your present
path and choose to remain ignorant.

For instance, seems to me the Electrostatic Discharge Association
knows something about charged particles that you don't know.

http://www.esda.org/basics/part1.cfm

"Creating electrostatic charge by contact and separation of
materials is known as "triboelectric charging."

"Virtually all materials, *including water and dirt particles
in the air*, can be triboelectrically charged."

Seems the Electrostatic Discharge Association is in complete
agreement with the 2000 ARRL Handbook:

"Precipitation static is an almost continuous hash-type noise
that often accompanies various kinds of precipitation, including
snowfall. Precipitation static is caused by rain drops, snowflakes
or even *wind-blown dust*, transferring a small electrical charge
on contact with an antenna."
--
73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp

Noise level between two ant types
 

In article ,
Cecil Moore wrote:

Dave wrote:
Electro static discharge on antennas has been around for years. It is real!

Here's some interesting quotes from:

http://www.esda.org/basics/part1.cfm

"Virtually all materials, including water and dirt particles in the air,
can be triboelectrically charged."

"When a conductive material becomes charged, the charge (i.e., the
deficiency or excess of electrons) will be uniformly distributed across
the surface of the material. If the charged conductive material makes
contact with another conductive material, the electrons will transfer
between the materials quite easily. If the second conductor is attached
to an earth grounding point, the electrons will flow to ground and the
excess charge on the conductor will be "neutralized."

"Electrostatic charge can be created triboelectrically on conductors the
same way it is created on insulators. As long as the conductor is
isolated from other conductors or ground, the static charge will remain
on the conductor. If the conductor is grounded the charge will easily go
to ground. Or, if the charged conductor contacts or nears another
conductor, the charge will flow between the two conductors."

some old grain elevators have blown up because of static charge.

Grain has power and is electric, at times.

Moral: Eat more grain.

Noise level between two ant types
 

"Tom Donaly" wrote

Where's the experimental evidence, Cecil? You and Yuri don't have
any because you're too afraid to get your hands dirty. Insulting
Tom isn't going to help any, either, nor is intellectual
weaseling and selective quotations from dubious sources.
73,
Tom Donaly, KA6RUH

You got it slightly wrong.
We mostly relate cases based on our experiments, which are repeatable and
unbelievers could easily duplicate them and see with their own
eyes/ears/whatever instead of "theorizing" here why "it can't be".
On insulting Tom, why don't you look up the threads and see who is insulting
first, pontificating and parading his "theories" on the web pages and if
questioned or debunked, takes of after wives, brings Dr. Phil, etc..
Interesting that bunch of baloney on his web site gets pass and is
proclaimed as gospel by his worshippers, while debunking gets attacked and
smacked with personal comments about .... Are you drinking the same Koolaid?
Shield is the antenna, riiiiight! Current along the loading coil is always
the same, riiiight!

73 Yuri da BUm