On Sat, 07 Jul 2007 08:10:05 -0700, Telstar Electronics
wrote:

On Jul 6, 9:59 pm, Vinnie S. wrote:
Anyway to make this easier to connect, such a in series with the mic so I do not
have to hack to cut traces? Like possibly putting in a box with and stantard 4
pin on the input and output? Also, what mic should you use with this?

An external device as you describe was considered during the design
phase... but we decided that an external box (although easier to hook
up initially) was unsightly with all the wires hanging all over, had
mounting issues, and therefore was much less reliable in the long run.
It also has problems accomodating different mic/radio plugs. The
VoiceMax requires the cutting of a single trace within the receiver
and works with any non-amplified dynamic mic. Since it's inside the
rig... you set it up once... and enjoy the benefit each & every
transmission without doing a thing. Hope that answers your comment/
question.
www.telstar-electronics.com


I don't think people want to screw with cutting or hacking their radio. I think
you would sell more as an external box. If amplifiers were this way, they would
never sell. That is why people buy them separately, granted, the size would have
some effect. But you can still get stinger boards.

Revisit the idea.

Vinnie S.

On Jul 8, 9:05 pm, Vinnie S. wrote:
I don't think people want to screw with cutting or hacking their radio. I think
you would sell more as an external box. If amplifiers were this way, they would
never sell. That is why people buy them separately, granted, the size would have
some effect. But you can still get stinger boards.
Revisit the idea.

There are certainly pros & cons with either approach. One big problem
in the external design is the need for a battery. Our feeling was that
things with batteries can be problematic... and require additional
monitoring to make sure the unit is functioning on a daily basis. This
increased "battery vigilance" was one of the main reasons the internal
design was chosen. Another issue is definately the radio's internal
limiter. On most radios... this is factory set at around 85% possible
modulation. If you want to take full advantage of the VoiceMax 100%
constant modulation capability... the radios limiter needs to be
adjusted/disabled. The VoiceMax has built in limiting... so a
redundant system is not needed. However, if the limiter in the set is
not adjusted/disabled... VoiceMax will still increase and maintain the
modulation to whatever the radio's internal limiter is set to...
usally aroud 85% as I said before. It sounds like you have no plans to
open your radio... so VoiceMax is not for you.
www.telstar-electronics.com

On Mon, 09 Jul 2007 04:49:11 -0700, Telstar Electronics
wrote:

On Jul 8, 9:05 pm, Vinnie S. wrote:
I don't think people want to screw with cutting or hacking their radio. I think
you would sell more as an external box. If amplifiers were this way, they would
never sell. That is why people buy them separately, granted, the size would have
some effect. But you can still get stinger boards.
Revisit the idea.

There are certainly pros & cons with either approach. One big problem
in the external design is the need for a battery. Our feeling was that
things with batteries can be problematic... and require additional
monitoring to make sure the unit is functioning on a daily basis. This
increased "battery vigilance" was one of the main reasons the internal
design was chosen. Another issue is definately the radio's internal
limiter. On most radios... this is factory set at around 85% possible
modulation. If you want to take full advantage of the VoiceMax 100%
constant modulation capability... the radios limiter needs to be
adjusted/disabled. The VoiceMax has built in limiting... so a
redundant system is not needed. However, if the limiter in the set is
not adjusted/disabled... VoiceMax will still increase and maintain the
modulation to whatever the radio's internal limiter is set to...
usally aroud 85% as I said before. It sounds like you have no plans to
open your radio... so VoiceMax is not for you.
www.telstar-electronics.com


It's not for me, but I am showing interest, and you're blowing me off. The funny
thing is, I don't have the theory expertise that you, James, or Frank have. But
I am one of the few people that uses CB, that can open the radio up and read
schemtics, and follow directions for mods. I would guess that 95% of the people
still in CB, cannot do this, and would have to take it to a CB shop and have it
installed for anywhere from $30-5-. Why would they do this? As far as the
battery problem, there are a couple options. One is to put 12VDC terminals on
it, or simply use a 12V battery. Hell, the 9V battery in my mike lasts for
years.

Second question is, before I hack into my radio, how much better is this than my
Turner +3B with Speech Compression?

Vinnie S.

On Jul 9, 8:09 am, Vinnie S. wrote:
It's not for me, but I am showing interest, and you're blowing me off. The funny
thing is, I don't have the theory expertise that you, James, or Frank have. But
I am one of the few people that uses CB, that can open the radio up and read
schemtics, and follow directions for mods. I would guess that 95% of the people
still in CB, cannot do this, and would have to take it to a CB shop and have it
installed for anywhere from $30-5-. Why would they do this? As far as the
battery problem, there are a couple options. One is to put 12VDC terminals on
it, or simply use a 12V battery. Hell, the 9V battery in my mike lasts for
years.
Second question is, before I hack into my radio, how much better is this than my
Turner +3B with Speech Compression?

I'm not trying to encourage or discourage you... just trying to give
you the facts. I agree that there are many people that don't have the
expertise to install such a device. These folks would have to seek the
help of a technically competent person... such as a CB shop as you
mention. I would suggest that you supply any potential installer with
the installation manual at http://www.telstar-electronics.com/VoiceMax%20B.pdf
.... to see if they feel they are capable of the job. As for your
question about the Turner... sorry... I have no knowledge regarding
this unit.

On Mon, 09 Jul 2007 06:54:48 -0700, Telstar Electronics
wrote:

+++On Jul 9, 8:09 am, Vinnie S. wrote:
+++ It's not for me, but I am showing interest, and you're blowing me off. The funny
+++ thing is, I don't have the theory expertise that you, James, or Frank have. But
+++ I am one of the few people that uses CB, that can open the radio up and read
+++ schemtics, and follow directions for mods. I would guess that 95% of the people
+++ still in CB, cannot do this, and would have to take it to a CB shop and have it
+++ installed for anywhere from $30-5-. Why would they do this? As far as the
+++ battery problem, there are a couple options. One is to put 12VDC terminals on
+++ it, or simply use a 12V battery. Hell, the 9V battery in my mike lasts for
+++ years.
+++ Second question is, before I hack into my radio, how much better is this than my
+++ Turner +3B with Speech Compression?
+++
+++I'm not trying to encourage or discourage you... just trying to give
+++you the facts. I agree that there are many people that don't have the
+++expertise to install such a device. These folks would have to seek the
+++help of a technically competent person... such as a CB shop as you
+++mention. I would suggest that you supply any potential installer with
+++the installation manual at http://www.telstar-electronics.com/VoiceMax%20B.pdf
+++... to see if they feel they are capable of the job. As for your
+++question about the Turner... sorry... I have no knowledge regarding
+++this unit.
**********

The only reason I see for doing a internal board and not an external
unit is that a board has to be bought for every radio a person owns if
they want to have the same capabilities on all their radios. Thus more
potential sales. The rest of your explanation is pure hogwash.

james

"Telstar Electronics" wrote...

I'm not trying to encourage or discourage you... just trying to
give you the facts.

But, by making it internal only, you ARE encouraging the hacking of
radios.
I don't know about America, but there are very few real radio techs in
this country willing to take on CB work. It simply doesn't pay what a
real tech is worth. If they try to charge what they are worth, the
CBer will simply find a cheap "rig doctor" who has no real training.
Alternatively, they will try to fit it themselves... they will ask in
some group, and most likely get help from one of those "rig doctors".

Either way, "rig doctor" or DIY, they are likely to end up with
a hatchet job. When the system sounds like crap, will they really
blame their work - or your product?

I agree that there are many people that don't have the
expertise to install such a device. These folks would have to seek the
help of a technically competent person... such as a CB shop as you
mention.

Some time back, a regular customer brought in their radio and a
speech processor, which they wanted fitting. The speech
processor was a well known type, and had been obtained from
a well known UK supplier.
I believe that that the shop purchased the processor in kit
form, putting it together, to allow for their profit margin... because
I simply refuse to believe that the manufacturer makes such a
hatchet job of their soldering and wiring.

Proving that, even if your product only goes to retailers or
is only fitted by retailers, it may still end up as a hatchet
job... and your product could get the blame.



As for your question about the Turner... sorry... I have no
knowledge regarding this unit.

You have no knowledge of the products you are competing with?
And no intention of providing what the customer desires?

I can understand you ignoring the rantings of a bitter, twisted
old man who may have a grudge... but someone interested in your
product?
This seems to suggest that YOU decided that YOU want to
make and sell a product based on YOUR desires... not on what
the consumer wants or needs.

It reminds me of a certain singer who said that he didn't care
that his latest stuff was not what the public wanted... he
liked it.
Last I heard, I believe he was cleaning streets somewhere in
America.


Regards,
Peter.
http://www.citizensband.radiouk.com/

"Vinnie S." wrote...

It's not for me, but I am showing interest, and you're blowing me off.

This group has shown much hostility towards Brian, and I was about to
Email one of the regulars to ask what the history is. Because, so far,
I had not seen the reason for it apart from the usual p1ss1ng
contests and opposing groups within rrcb.

However, Brian himself appears to have given what could be a real
good reason to avoid his products... his apparent disregard for
the customer's needs or desires.
That, for me, raises concerns about whether he would provide
good customer care or simply blow the customer off once he
has their money.

The funny thing is, I don't have the theory expertise that you,
James, or Frank have.

Most CBers do not have technical expertise, it is not a
requirement. In fact, CB is for those without such expertise.
That is why, as a consumer, you need to be aware. Many companies
have used this lack of knowledge against their customers, selling
them total crap.

But I am one of the few people that uses CB, that can open the
radio up and read schemtics, and follow directions for mods.

I don't know about "few". Over the years, I have seen a
large amount of fekked up equipment, due to people who are
willing to go inside their radio... and those willing to do
other people's radios the same way.
One person I knew would do this with every radio he had, he
was famous for it. Every time he got a radio, he would go
inside and feck it up. He would then sell it cheap t a tech,
and buy another.
The tech would put everything right and make a killing
on the sale.

As far as the battery problem, there are a couple options. One
is to put 12VDC terminals on it, or simply use a 12V battery.
Hell, the 9V battery in my mike lasts for years.

Over the years, I have seen many battery operated CB
accessories and many with wires for 12v supply.
Power microphones, base microphones, echo boxes, speech
processors, VOX, preamps, power amps, etc.

None of the manufacturers had a problem with external
units, or the selling of them.


Second question is, before I hack into my radio, how much better
is this than my Turner +3B with Speech Compression?

Do they still make this, to the same old specifications, or is
it an old one still in use?

This is from an old catalog, really old...
Model +3B
Frequency range: 300-3500Hz
Impedance: 1K Ohm
Output level: -42dB adjustable
Battery type: 7v Turner / Mallory.

That is all it gives, and it is not clear whether that
"-42dB" is dBm and whether that is maximum, minimum
or some middle figure.

There is another processor in this catalog, anyone remember
the MC902 processor? Remember the days of "Solid-State"
equipment?
Loads of switches, knobs, and even a meter on this one.

Does Brian give out full spec on his processor?


Regards,
Peter.
http://www.citizensband.radiouk.com/

On Mon, 09 Jul 2007 04:49:11 -0700, Telspam Electronics
wrote in
.com:

On Jul 8, 9:05 pm, Vinnie S. wrote:
I don't think people want to screw with cutting or hacking their radio. I think
you would sell more as an external box. If amplifiers were this way, they would
never sell. That is why people buy them separately, granted, the size would have
some effect. But you can still get stinger boards.
Revisit the idea.

There are certainly pros & cons with either approach. One big problem
in the external design is the need for a battery. Our


MPD.


feeling was that
things with batteries can be problematic... and require additional
monitoring to make sure the unit is functioning on a daily basis. This
increased "battery vigilance" was one of the main reasons the internal
design was chosen.


Power mics have batteries but people still buy them. Or why not tap 12
volts from the power leads to the radio? If the box is so great I'm
sure people would be willing to do -that- much.


Another issue is definately the radio's internal
limiter. On most radios... this is factory set at around 85% possible
modulation.


Wrong. They are set at the factory for 95 to 98% modulation, as per
just about every service manual I've ever seen. And that's a lot of
manuals. An additional 2 to 5% is, for all practical purposes,
insignificant, translating to a peak power increase of less than 1%.


If you want to take full advantage of the VoiceMax 100%
constant modulation capability... the radios limiter needs to be
adjusted/disabled. The VoiceMax has built in limiting... so a
redundant system is not needed.


Wrong. The limiter in the radio is set for the specific radio, and is
usually integrated into the audio AGC that's already built into the
radio (which makes your processor somewhat redundant except for the
noise gate). Disabling the internal limiter and using an external
limiter will almost certainly result in clipping, especially when the
person setting it has no calibration equipment.... that is, assuming
your processor's limiter can be adjusted. Can it?


However, if the limiter in the set is
not adjusted/disabled... VoiceMax will still increase and maintain the
modulation to whatever the radio's internal limiter is set to...
usally aroud 85% as I said before. It sounds like you have no plans to
open your radio... so VoiceMax is not for you.


It sounds like you have no plans to open and read a few service
manuals and find out how these radios already work.

On Mon, 09 Jul 2007 04:49:11 -0700, Telstar Electronics
wrote:

+++On Jul 8, 9:05 pm, Vinnie S. wrote:
+++ I don't think people want to screw with cutting or hacking their radio. I think
+++ you would sell more as an external box. If amplifiers were this way, they would
+++ never sell. That is why people buy them separately, granted, the size would have
+++ some effect. But you can still get stinger boards.
+++ Revisit the idea.
+++
+++There are certainly pros & cons with either approach. One big problem
+++in the external design is the need for a battery. Our feeling was that
+++things with batteries can be problematic... and require additional
+++monitoring to make sure the unit is functioning on a daily basis. This
+++increased "battery vigilance" was one of the main reasons the internal
+++design was chosen. Another issue is definately the radio's internal
+++limiter. On most radios... this is factory set at around 85% possible
+++modulation. If you want to take full advantage of the VoiceMax 100%
+++constant modulation capability... the radios limiter needs to be
+++adjusted/disabled. The VoiceMax has built in limiting... so a
+++redundant system is not needed. However, if the limiter in the set is
+++not adjusted/disabled... VoiceMax will still increase and maintain the
+++modulation to whatever the radio's internal limiter is set to...
+++usally aroud 85% as I said before. It sounds like you have no plans to
+++open your radio... so VoiceMax is not for you.
+++www.telstar-electronics.com
***************

Hogwash and plenty of it.

the SSM2166 draws about 10mA of current. Four NiMH AA batteries have
1800mAhr capabilities. At full charge that delivers 5.6VDC to the
chip. Well within the operating range. Should get about 150 hrs of
operation. Add a charging circuit and you have no more issues.

Yep the internal audio power amp has some form of limiting
(compression) that keeps the modulation percentage in the 85 to 100%
range. Often that feedback path is the first thing that most CBers cut
out when they buy their radios. So what is the need for another
internal compression unit when CBers don't want aduio compression?
Secondly why add another compressor when you already have sufficient
compression built into the radio? If I wanted more, I would increase
the negative feedback to the controlled gain stage of the audio
modualtor section. Often this is just a resistor value change.

Beisdes increasing modulation percentage from 85% to 100% gains little
in range or intelligability. Often not worth the effort. Adds about 7%
audio power into the each of the two sidebands. Even if the limiter
section of the modulator section is not disabled adding your
compressor is not going to increase the percentage of modulation. So
why waste the money to buy and install it unless you disable the
radio's internal limiter?

After doing all that to gain up to 15% increased modulation
percentage? Cheaper to clip and/or alter the feedback in the
modualtion stage.

james

On Jul 9, 12:03 pm, james wrote:
the SSM2166 draws about 10mA of current. Four NiMH AA batteries have
1800mAhr capabilities. At full charge that delivers 5.6VDC to the
chip. Well within the operating range. Should get about 150 hrs of
operation. Add a charging circuit and you have no more issues.

James, you are very similar to Frank... in that you have distinct
ideas. The problem you both have is one of conveyance. I have made
every effort to answer your questions in a civil manner... but you
continue to rant uncontrollably. I'm not sure by what authority you
speak... since you have no design of your own. Therefore, the
conversation with Frank and James is ended as far as I'm concerned. If
some others have questions, I'd be more than happy to attempt to
answer you. If you don't wish to use this forum... I fully understand.
Please email me anytime.
www.telstar-electronics.com