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Old March 23rd 07, 06:29 AM posted to rec.radio.amateur.moderated
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Default Being paid while you operate

On Tue, 20 Mar 2007 20:38:36 EDT, "who knows"
wrote:

Sounds like it would be a good idea to ask Riley Hollingsworth for
clarification?


Don't bother -- he clarified it many years ago, in public. This
question comes up every so often because folks don't remember the
answer.

This should be made clear in the first ten minutes of any ham radio
training course at any level.

No personal offenses intended....g
--

73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane
ARRL Volunteer Counsel

email: k2asp [at] arrl [dot] net


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Old March 23rd 07, 12:18 PM posted to rec.radio.amateur.moderated
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Default Being paid while you operate


"Phil Kane" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 20 Mar 2007 20:38:36 EDT, "who knows"
wrote:

Sounds like it would be a good idea to ask Riley Hollingsworth for
clarification?


Don't bother -- he clarified it many years ago, in public. This
question comes up every so often because folks don't remember the
answer.

This should be made clear in the first ten minutes of any ham radio
training course at any level.

No personal offenses intended....g
--

73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane
ARRL Volunteer Counsel

email: k2asp [at] arrl [dot] net

Since you have the knowledge, why not share it?


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Old March 23rd 07, 02:58 PM posted to rec.radio.amateur.moderated
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Default Being paid while you operate


"Phil Kane" wrote in message
news
On Tue, 20 Mar 2007 14:40:22 EDT, "Russ" wrote:

Being a engineer/conductor and talking to the automobile driving down the
highway about the train on 2 meter simplex: No problem.


YES problem. The FRA and most railroads' rule books prohibit train
operating crews from using any communication system not related to
train operation or safety (reporting incidents) while on duty.

Whether crewmenbers adhere to that or not is up to the individual, his
union representative, and the powers-that-be if caught.
--

It was an illustration---an analogy, not meant to be Gospel!
Not everything should be taken in a 100% wooden, literal sense!
Gee,
Russ
KW5KW

73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane


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Old March 23rd 07, 05:38 PM posted to rec.radio.amateur.moderated
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Default Being paid while you operate

On Fri, 23 Mar 2007 02:29:26 -0400, Phil Kane wrote:

I think that it's a very clear statement. "In most cases" means just
what it says. There are exceptions.


Like... just about all of them. I have a hard time coming up with many
instances where it's any of the FCC's business whether I talk on the radio
on company time, as long as I'm not being paid to talk on the radio. It's
between me and my employer, and the FCC rarely has any jurisdiction or
enforcement power over company rules and policies.

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Old March 25th 07, 05:01 AM posted to rec.radio.amateur.moderated
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On Fri, 23 Mar 2007 08:18:40 EDT, "Newby" wrote:

Don't bother -- he clarified it many years ago, in public. This
question comes up every so often because folks don't remember the
answer.

This should be made clear in the first ten minutes of any ham radio
training course at any level.

No personal offenses intended....g


Since you have the knowledge, why not share it?


"The knowledge" was posted by me and others yesterday.
--

73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane

From a Clearing in the Silicon Forest

Beaverton (Washington County) Oregon

e-mail: k2asp [at] arrl [dot] net



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Old March 25th 07, 05:02 AM posted to rec.radio.amateur.moderated
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On Fri, 23 Mar 2007 10:58:42 EDT, "who_me?" wrote:

It was an illustration---an analogy, not meant to be Gospel!
Not everything should be taken in a 100% wooden, literal sense!


It is well known that I am a communications attorney whose practice
involves dealing with the FCC and other regulatory agencies on
compliance matters. One takes things in a 100% wooden sense or one
does not succeed in that business.

And as I tell my clients - and a lot of them are hams - if you try to
get away with something and get caught, how will you explain it? The
:dude" defense - some other dude did it - doesn't go in regulatory
matters. I prefer to keep my clients from getting into trouble by
giving them the straight scoop, so to speak.

As far as railroading goes, it is well known that that's my avocation
and I know the operating rules almost as well as I know the FCC rules.
If you think that the FCC rules are complex, you ought to see the
Federal Railroad Administration rules!
--

73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane
ARRL Volunteer Counsel

email: k2asp [at] arrl [dot] net

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Old March 25th 07, 05:27 AM posted to rec.radio.amateur.moderated
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Default Being paid while you operate

On Fri, 23 Mar 2007 13:38:10 EDT, Rick wrote:

On Fri, 23 Mar 2007 02:29:26 -0400, Phil Kane wrote:

I think that it's a very clear statement. "In most cases" means just
what it says. There are exceptions.


Like... just about all of them. I have a hard time coming up with many
instances where it's any of the FCC's business whether I talk on the radio
on company time, as long as I'm not being paid to talk on the radio.


Because of international treaties upon which the US is a signatory,
the Amateur Radio Service has specific restrictions on what
communications are prohibited and which are allowed.

You, I, and the FCC all agree that it's not the FCC's business WHEN
you transmit, it's WHAT you are transmitting that counts. The
bottom line is you can't use amateur radio for the benefit of the
employer or if you are being paid to operate, with the exception under
which specific organizations (the ARRL is only one of them) can pay
operators for operating.

It's between me and my employer, and the FCC rarely has any jurisdiction or
enforcement power over company rules and policies.


In general you are right, as long as the company rules do not require
you to, or give you permission to, violate communication laws.
--

73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane
ARRL Volunteer Counsel

email: k2asp [at] arrl [dot] net

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Old March 27th 07, 08:59 AM posted to rec.radio.amateur.moderated
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"Phil Kane" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 23 Mar 2007 10:58:42 EDT, "who_me?" wrote:

It was an illustration---an analogy, not meant to be Gospel!
Not everything should be taken in a 100% wooden, literal sense!


It is well known that I am a communications attorney whose practice
involves dealing with the FCC and other regulatory agencies on
compliance matters. One takes things in a 100% wooden sense or one
does not succeed in that business.


I could discuss this for a while here and there, but a cement truck driver
could talk on 2m while driving his truck BUT said driver could not use his
radio to talk to the dispatcher about where to deliver his load.

Like I said it's an analogy--an illustration.

I'm glad you're on our side, can you help with self-defense if I accidently
print and loose my other license here in TX?

Russ - KW5KW


And as I tell my clients - and a lot of them are hams - if you try to
get away with something and get caught, how will you explain it? The
:dude" defense - some other dude did it - doesn't go in regulatory
matters. I prefer to keep my clients from getting into trouble by
giving them the straight scoop, so to speak.

As far as railroading goes, it is well known that that's my avocation
and I know the operating rules almost as well as I know the FCC rules.
If you think that the FCC rules are complex, you ought to see the
Federal Railroad Administration rules!
--

CHL laws are complex as well!
Russ

73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane
ARRL Volunteer Counsel

email: k2asp [at] arrl [dot] net


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Old March 28th 07, 01:46 AM posted to rec.radio.amateur.moderated
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Default Being paid while you operate

On Tue, 27 Mar 2007 03:59:04 EDT, "Russ" wrote:

I'm glad you're on our side, can you help with self-defense if I accidently
print and loose my other license here in TX?


Don't know what you mean by "print and loose my other license here in
TX". Does it relate to ham radio?
--

73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane

From a Clearing in the Silicon Forest

Beaverton (Washington County) Oregon

e-mail: k2asp [at] arrl [dot] net



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