"N2EY" wrote in message
...
In article , "Kim W5TIT"

writes:

Weren't you folks having a place built, Kim? Or are we talking about
the
same thing?

No, no! We're not having a place built...we are ordering a manufactured
home (trailer, whatever-you-want-to-call-it). We are all set with land,
and
explored building. But, for some reason, neither of us is particularly
interested in dealing with having one built (there's not one good
experience
we've ever had relayed about dealing with builders...LOL).

I lump buying/setting up a new manufactured or modular home in with
building,
though obviously they're not exactly the same. Main thing is you're
talking
about the same project (getting a new place).

Know what? One
mortgage company so far has told us, "you have a lot of room to move,"
meaning that we can get into something much bigger and more expensive
than
we are looking for. They seem shocked that we aren't interested in
"maxxing" out our limit!!

Sure. I've encountered that, too, in all sorts of transactions, Their
focus is
very narrow. And their fees and commissions are based on the selling
price.

And note that reselling mortgages is pretty standard, so the people who
sold you the house and mortgage won't be holding the bag if you do
default.

Yep, we've already been told as soon as the "deal is done," the mortgage
will be sold.

I wonder how those folks make their money, with all the paperwork
involved, but
I suppose that if somebody handles ten million dollars in mortagages per
month
and gets 0.1% commission, it adds up...

And, you're right about bankruptcy, too. When I said to a lender that
we
weren't comfortable with the expense they were suggesting, they said
we
could afford it and didn't know what the problem was.

Of course not. It's not their money or their house!

Or the accomplishment of having excellent credit!

Right! You shoulda seen the looks on their faces when I started reciting
my
credit history.....

I told them I think
about things like potentially losing my job or my husband losing his.
The
come back was that we always have bankruptcy available!!!

Now *that's* a new one! ;-)

Point is that the lenders &tc won't protect us from ourselves. *We*
have
to do that.

Precisely what we're doing...

And a good thing too....

Here's another one for ya: I bet neither of us would have any problem
getting a
30 year mortgage, even though we'd be nearly 80 when said mortage was paid
off
(barring any advance payments). Huh?

73 de Jim, N2EY


snicker Well, believe it or not, that is what we're going for. We
thought about the 15-year but what we decided is we'd rather double/triple
payments at our own control...just for the very reason of potential job
loss.

I need to send you an email on another, personal note... I'll do it soon,
remind me if I don't!

Kim W5TIT

In article , "Kim W5TIT"
writes:

Here's another one for ya: I bet neither of us would have any problem
getting a
30 year mortgage, even though we'd be nearly 80 when said mortage was
paidoff (barring any advance payments). Huh?

73 de Jim, N2EY

snicker Well, believe it or not, that is what we're going for. We
thought about the 15-year but what we decided is we'd rather double/triple
payments at our own control...just for the very reason of potential job
loss.

Get yerself an amortization printout and notice how little you pay off the
principal each month on a 30 year. Which means if you can come up with just
that much extra each month, you can take a month off for each month - or more.
And as you say, if you run into trouble you just don't put in the extra for a
while.

There's also a completely opposite philosophy that some folks use. They figure
it's *better* to *not* pay off the mortgage any faster than you have to,
because the interest is deductible if you itemize, and the lowest rate the
average person can get is for a first mortgage of their primary residence.
Instead, they say, pay off all your other debt or don't get into it in the
first place.

I need to send you an email on another, personal note... I'll do it soon,
remind me if I don't!

Consider yourself reminded!

73 es GL in the new place de Jim, N2EY

If your interest rate is less than 5%, the best loan to get is a 30 year!
It's cheap money. Paying off a house quick is foolish. And the monthly
rate is usually a hell of alot less too. Spend the difference of that
paying off bills or invest it in a mutual fund or something.

Instead of paying off that low interest loan quickly, one is smarter paying
off the higher interest loans like automobiles, department and credit card
charges, and other loans/debts.



--
Ryan KC8PMX

"Why is it one careless match can start a forest fire, but
it takes a whole box to start a barbecue?"

snicker Well, believe it or not, that is what we're going for. We
thought about the 15-year but what we decided is we'd rather double/triple
payments at our own control...just for the very reason of potential job
loss.

I need to send you an email on another, personal note... I'll do it soon,
remind me if I don't!

Kim W5TIT

Ryan, KC8PMX wrote:
If your interest rate is less than 5%, the best loan to get is a 30 year!
It's cheap money. Paying off a house quick is foolish. And the monthly
rate is usually a hell of alot less too. Spend the difference of that
paying off bills or invest it in a mutual fund or something.



Ahh, a financial truism! This belongs with:

The stock market ALWAYS goes up!

(It soitanly do, but over long time periods that are not relevant to
most of us who don't live over 150 years. More importantly it is what
the market is doing around the time you take your money out.)

Move your money into high yield accounts shortly before you retire, that
way you'll have more money when you retire!

I've listened to investment consultants actually pull this one out of
their hats. I know some older folk who have done this and now have
almost no retirement funds.

I have to chuckle at your truism. first, because your friend the real
estate agent uses those sort of arguments to talk you into buying
several thousand or tens of thousands more dollars worht of house.
Second is that You are saying a person who gets out of debt is foolish.

Best way to not be a fool is to not go heavily into debt in the first
place. I have a 5 percent loan, but I'll pay it off quickly, I think.

Instead of paying off that low interest loan quickly, one is smarter paying
off the higher interest loans like automobiles, department and credit card
charges, and other loans/debts.

Again, it's better to not get into a situation where you would have to
choose which loan you're paying off early.

- Mike KB3EIA -

"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
...
Ryan, KC8PMX wrote:
If your interest rate is less than 5%, the best loan to get is a 30
year!
It's cheap money. Paying off a house quick is foolish. And the monthly
rate is usually a hell of alot less too. Spend the difference of that
paying off bills or invest it in a mutual fund or something.



Ahh, a financial truism! This belongs with:

The stock market ALWAYS goes up!

What goes up must come down as well too. But that is the beauty of the
stock market. It is a cyclical thing. Ideally it would be like a good
sinus rhythm. It is just merely the knowledge of where to jump in at.


(It soitanly do, but over long time periods that are not relevant to
most of us who don't live over 150 years. More importantly it is what
the market is doing around the time you take your money out.)

Move your money into high yield accounts shortly before you retire, that
way you'll have more money when you retire!


Only if you know what you are doing and have a really good grasp of the
market.



I've listened to investment consultants actually pull this one out of
their hats. I know some older folk who have done this and now have
almost no retirement funds.


Yep... not for the weak or feable to try on thier own if not knowledgeable.



I have to chuckle at your truism. first, because your friend the real
estate agent uses those sort of arguments to talk you into buying
several thousand or tens of thousands more dollars worht of house.
Second is that You are saying a person who gets out of debt is foolish.


Actually the person I got this truism from and believe in it is Bruce
Williams, the talkshow host. If you do the math, it is fairly true.



Best way to not be a fool is to not go heavily into debt in the first
place. I have a 5 percent loan, but I'll pay it off quickly, I think.

I wouldn't but thats me. What I would do is see if you can refinance at all
to a lower rate. I have actually seen a interest rate recently somewhere in
the 3 percent range!! Talk about a cheap loan, hell, I would
refinance/remortgage my neighbors house if I could legally get away with it!
LOL



Instead of paying off that low interest loan quickly, one is smarter
paying
off the higher interest loans like automobiles, department and credit
card
charges, and other loans/debts.

Again, it's better to not get into a situation where you would have to
choose which loan you're paying off early.

Well, its not paying the principle that kills ya, its the interest that does
over a long time. The lesser the interest rate, the less I am interested in
rushing to pay it off extra early. Either way, one needs to do the math or
find someone who does understand real estate finance and other financal
calculations to make sure in their own individual circumstances.



--
Ryan KC8PMX

"All of us could take a lesson from the weather. It pays no
attention to criticism."

In article , "Ryan, KC8PMX"
writes:

"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
...
Ryan, KC8PMX wrote:
If your interest rate is less than 5%, the best loan to get is a 30
year!
It's cheap money. Paying off a house quick is foolish. And the monthly
rate is usually a hell of alot less too. Spend the difference of that
paying off bills or invest it in a mutual fund or something.



Ahh, a financial truism! This belongs with:

The stock market ALWAYS goes up!

What goes up must come down as well too.

Not necessarily. Look at where the Dow was when Bill Clinton took office in
1992...

But that is the beauty of the
stock market. It is a cyclical thing. Ideally it would be like a good
sinus rhythm. It is just merely the knowledge of where to jump in at.

Just as important is knowing when to jump *out*.

(It soitanly do, but over long time periods that are not relevant to
most of us who don't live over 150 years. More importantly it is what
the market is doing around the time you take your money out.)

Move your money into high yield accounts shortly before you retire, that
way you'll have more money when you retire!

Buy high, sell low, go broke...

Only if you know what you are doing and have a really good grasp of the
market.

Which absolutely no one has.

I've listened to investment consultants actually pull this one out of
their hats. I know some older folk who have done this and now have
almost no retirement funds.

Yep... not for the weak or feable to try on thier own if not knowledgeable.

The term is "risk tolerance"- a fancy way of saying how ready you are to lose
money. And the rule is simple: the closer you are to actually needing the
money, the less your risk tolerance should be.

I have to chuckle at your truism. first, because your friend the real
estate agent uses those sort of arguments to talk you into buying
several thousand or tens of thousands more dollars worht of house.
Second is that You are saying a person who gets out of debt is foolish.

Actually the person I got this truism from and believe in it is Bruce
Williams, the talkshow host. If you do the math, it is fairly true.

I did the math and it's false enough to be a worthless truism.

Best way to not be a fool is to not go heavily into debt in the first
place. I have a 5 percent loan, but I'll pay it off quickly, I think.

I wouldn't but thats me. What I would do is see if you can refinance at all
to a lower rate. I have actually seen a interest rate recently somewhere in
the 3 percent range!! Talk about a cheap loan, hell, I would
refinance/remortgage my neighbors house if I could legally get away with it!
LOL

Sure - because a house is something you need anyway, it's insured and not
likely to wind up obsolete or useless in a few years. Most of all, almost no
one can afford to buy a house for cash.

Instead of paying off that low interest loan quickly, one is smarter
paying
off the higher interest loans like automobiles, department and credit
card
charges, and other loans/debts.

Again, it's better to not get into a situation where you would have to
choose which loan you're paying off early.

Well, its not paying the principle that kills ya, its the interest that does
over a long time. The lesser the interest rate, the less I am interested in
rushing to pay it off extra early. Either way, one needs to do the math or
find someone who does understand real estate finance and other financal
calculations to make sure in their own individual circumstances.

Exactly - it's all in the numbers for your particular situation.

The biggest financial boo-boos people make a

- confusing "wants" and "needs" (you may need a car, but you want a new SUV)
- not having a budget, or not having one based on real data
- looking at their income out-of-context and saying "I can afford X" without
doing the numbers.

73 de Jim, N2EY

N2EY wrote:

In article , "Ryan, KC8PMX"
writes:


"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
...

Ryan, KC8PMX wrote:

If your interest rate is less than 5%, the best loan to get is a 30

year!

It's cheap money. Paying off a house quick is foolish. And the monthly
rate is usually a hell of alot less too. Spend the difference of that
paying off bills or invest it in a mutual fund or something.



Ahh, a financial truism! This belongs with:

The stock market ALWAYS goes up!

What goes up must come down as well too.


Not necessarily. Look at where the Dow was when Bill Clinton took office in
1992...


But that is the beauty of the
stock market. It is a cyclical thing. Ideally it would be like a good
sinus rhythm. It is just merely the knowledge of where to jump in at.


Just as important is knowing when to jump *out*.

And there is the problem for those playing the market for their
retirements. They know about when they are going to jump out, but if the
market doesn't cooperate....oh oh!

(It soitanly do, but over long time periods that are not relevant to
most of us who don't live over 150 years. More importantly it is what
the market is doing around the time you take your money out.)

Move your money into high yield accounts shortly before you retire, that
way you'll have more money when you retire!

Buy high, sell low, go broke...

Only if you know what you are doing and have a really good grasp of the
market.


Which absolutely no one has.

I've listened to investment consultants actually pull this one out of
their hats. I know some older folk who have done this and now have
almost no retirement funds.

Yep... not for the weak or feable to try on thier own if not knowledgeable.


The term is "risk tolerance"- a fancy way of saying how ready you are to lose
money. And the rule is simple: the closer you are to actually needing the
money, the less your risk tolerance should be.

I have to chuckle at your truism. first, because your friend the real
estate agent uses those sort of arguments to talk you into buying
several thousand or tens of thousands more dollars worht of house.
Second is that You are saying a person who gets out of debt is foolish.

Actually the person I got this truism from and believe in it is Bruce
Williams, the talkshow host. If you do the math, it is fairly true.

I did the math and it's false enough to be a worthless truism.

If you look at the total dollars spent, you can still pay less money on
some of the higher interest lower cost loans than lower interest higher
priced loans. (although I'd never suggest doing that) It's just the
sheer amount of dollars. So the best bet is to pay all the loans off as
quickly as possible.


Best way to not be a fool is to not go heavily into debt in the first
place. I have a 5 percent loan, but I'll pay it off quickly, I think.

I wouldn't but thats me. What I would do is see if you can refinance at all
to a lower rate. I have actually seen a interest rate recently somewhere in
the 3 percent range!! Talk about a cheap loan, hell, I would
refinance/remortgage my neighbors house if I could legally get away with it!
LOL


Sure - because a house is something you need anyway, it's insured and not
likely to wind up obsolete or useless in a few years. Most of all, almost no
one can afford to buy a house for cash.


Instead of paying off that low interest loan quickly, one is smarter
paying
off the higher interest loans like automobiles, department and credit
card
charges, and other loans/debts.

Again, it's better to not get into a situation where you would have to
choose which loan you're paying off early.

Well, its not paying the principle that kills ya, its the interest that does
over a long time. The lesser the interest rate, the less I am interested in
rushing to pay it off extra early. Either way, one needs to do the math or
find someone who does understand real estate finance and other financal
calculations to make sure in their own individual circumstances.


Exactly - it's all in the numbers for your particular situation.

The biggest financial boo-boos people make a

- confusing "wants" and "needs" (you may need a car, but you want a new SUV)
- not having a budget, or not having one based on real data
- looking at their income out-of-context and saying "I can afford X" without
doing the numbers.

Don't forget succumbing to the credit card problem. It's soooo easy to
live life large when you have 10 credit cards with a 20 thousand liimit
on each card.

One of those nifty little life secrets I've found out is that if you
are willing to avoid spending credit money like a drunken sailor while
you are young, you will have much more money for your toys when you get
older.

- Mike KB3EIA -

"Mike Coslo" wrote

....avoid spending credit money like a drunken sailor....

And how does a drunken sailor spend differently from a drunken marine or a
drunken soldier or a drunken airman or a drunken draft-dodger? Or do you
just have a thing about sailors? Or do you even have a clue, Mike?

With kindest personal regards,

de Hans, K0HB

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:

N2EY wrote:

In article , "Ryan, KC8PMX"
writes:


"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
...

Ryan, KC8PMX wrote:

If your interest rate is less than 5%, the best loan to get is a 30

year!

It's cheap money. Paying off a house quick is foolish. And the monthly
rate is usually a hell of alot less too. Spend the difference of that
paying off bills or invest it in a mutual fund or something.



Ahh, a financial truism! This belongs with:

The stock market ALWAYS goes up!

What goes up must come down as well too.


Not necessarily. Look at where the Dow was when Bill Clinton took office in
1992...


But that is the beauty of the
stock market. It is a cyclical thing. Ideally it would be like a good
sinus rhythm. It is just merely the knowledge of where to jump in at.


Just as important is knowing when to jump *out*.

And there is the problem for those playing the market for their
retirements. They know about when they are going to jump out, but if the
market doesn't cooperate....oh oh!

(It soitanly do, but over long time periods that are not relevant to
most of us who don't live over 150 years. More importantly it is what
the market is doing around the time you take your money out.)

Move your money into high yield accounts shortly before you retire, that
way you'll have more money when you retire!

Buy high, sell low, go broke...

Only if you know what you are doing and have a really good grasp of the
market.


Which absolutely no one has.

I've listened to investment consultants actually pull this one out of
their hats. I know some older folk who have done this and now have
almost no retirement funds.

Yep... not for the weak or feable to try on thier own if not knowledgeable.


The term is "risk tolerance"- a fancy way of saying how ready you are to
lose
money. And the rule is simple: the closer you are to actually needing the
money, the less your risk tolerance should be.

I have to chuckle at your truism. first, because your friend the real
estate agent uses those sort of arguments to talk you into buying
several thousand or tens of thousands more dollars worht of house.
Second is that You are saying a person who gets out of debt is foolish.

Actually the person I got this truism from and believe in it is Bruce
Williams, the talkshow host. If you do the math, it is fairly true.

I did the math and it's false enough to be a worthless truism.

If you look at the total dollars spent, you can still pay less money on
some of the higher interest lower cost loans than lower interest higher
priced loans. (although I'd never suggest doing that) It's just the
sheer amount of dollars.

Yep. That's why you have to calculate the options.

So the best bet is to pay all the loans off as
quickly as possible.

Not always.

Suppose you're in a situation where money is tight but you can expect big
increases some time in the future. (example: kids are small and one parent is
home with them, but when the youngest reaches school age both parents will be
working full time). In a case like that, having a lower monthly payment may be
the best alternative even if it requires a longer loan term.

Best way to not be a fool is to not go heavily into debt in the first
place. I have a 5 percent loan, but I'll pay it off quickly, I think.

I wouldn't but thats me. What I would do is see if you can refinance at
all
to a lower rate. I have actually seen a interest rate recently somewhere
in
the 3 percent range!! Talk about a cheap loan, hell, I would
refinance/remortgage my neighbors house if I could legally get away with
it!
LOL


Sure - because a house is something you need anyway, it's insured and not
likely to wind up obsolete or useless in a few years. Most of all, almost
no
one can afford to buy a house for cash.


Instead of paying off that low interest loan quickly, one is smarter
paying
off the higher interest loans like automobiles, department and credit
card
charges, and other loans/debts.

Again, it's better to not get into a situation where you would have to
choose which loan you're paying off early.

Well, its not paying the principle that kills ya, its the interest that
does
over a long time. The lesser the interest rate, the less I am interested
in
rushing to pay it off extra early. Either way, one needs to do the math
or
find someone who does understand real estate finance and other financal
calculations to make sure in their own individual circumstances.


Exactly - it's all in the numbers for your particular situation.

The biggest financial boo-boos people make a

- confusing "wants" and "needs" (you may need a car, but you want a new
SUV)
- not having a budget, or not having one based on real data
- looking at their income out-of-context and saying "I can afford X"
without
doing the numbers.

Don't forget succumbing to the credit card problem. It's soooo easy to

live life large when you have 10 credit cards with a 20 thousand liimit
on each card.

That's simply another version of looking at their income out-of-context and
saying "I can afford X" without doing the numbers. If you can't afford to pay
off the credit cards at the end of the month, you really can't afford the
purchase made on them.

I consider credit cards as "payment cards", nothing more.

One of those nifty little life secrets I've found out is that if you
are willing to avoid spending credit money like a drunken sailor while
you are young, you will have much more money for your toys when you get
older.

New verse to an old song:

What shall we do with a drunken sailor
What shall we do with a drunken sailor
What shall we do with a drunken sailor
Ear-lie in the morning?

Put 'im in charge of an Exxon tanker
Put 'im in charge of an Exxon tanker
Put 'im in charge of an Exxon tanker
Ear-lie in the morning!

73 de Jim, N2EY

Don't forget succumbing to the credit card problem. It's soooo easy to
live life large when you have 10 credit cards with a 20 thousand liimit
on each card.

One card with a 500 dollar limit here.... used for emergencies and the
occaisional on-line purchase.


One of those nifty little life secrets I've found out is that if you
are willing to avoid spending credit money like a drunken sailor while
you are young, you will have much more money for your toys when you get
older.

Bingo.... keep money going into savings and then take the funds out when you
need to purchase, but that is an idealism that most cannot grasp.


--
Ryan KC8PMX

"Health is merely the slowest possible rate at which one can die."