|
Alun wrote:
"Dee D. Flint" wrote in igy.com: "Alun" wrote in message . .. I see no benefit in giving over 7125-7150 to phone. 7075-7100, for example, would be the same size and in a more useful place. Moreover, it would harmonise Region 2 US hams with US hams outside R2. This will crowd the CW/digital/data modes too much since there are so many US hams. It would be better to wait for the other treaty changes from the conference to take affect and synchronize Regions 1 and 3 with Region 2. You do know of course that the treaty now requires broadcasters to move out of 7.1 to 7.2 and that this will become an exclusive amateur allocation. Of course I do, but do you think they will really move? Some may, but I think some of them never will. Maybe we all should move voice to the bottom of 40m, and create a new subband for modes that create bad QRM to the broadcasters who don't vacate? :-) |
Larry Roll K3LT wrote:
I don't see why the Extra-class code test requirement needs to be set at the current 5 WPM level. A 12-wpm code test would be a better idea, and anyone interested enough in achieving Extra could go from nothing to that level in a matter of weeks. However, since Extra is already dumbed-down to 5 WPM, I guess there's no putting the toothpaste back in the tube. The medical wavier issue would pop up again. And the FCC doesn't want to deal with that. As I (mis)undestand it, all you had to do to get a wavier was to tell your family doctor you had this problem with the code, and all he had to do was sign off on it. Most doctors probably didn't understand the issue beyond that there was no safety issue involved ("What, you can't learn how to drive a bus, well, here's a wavier to take to the DMV to get a commercial driver's license") and it was unlikely that anyone would question the doctor about it. So it was easily abused, and the FCC doesn't want to deal with it. And the FCC doesn't gain anything out of requiring higher speed code (it's not a lid filter, as witness 14.313 before restructuring). |
Zonedout wrote:
N2EY wrote: 3 classes of license: Novice, General, Extra The ARRL & FCC should just stop screwing around, forget hams' need to have their ego stroked with the license class of "Advanced" or "Extra" printed on their ticket, and just rename the classes Class A, B, & C. Everyone gets a new "name" for their license class and all the whiners that "Advanced" sounds more advanced than "Extra", etc., are just cut off at the knees. Change the names to "top banana", "2nd banana", and "beginner" ;-) |
Steve Robeson, K4CAP wrote:
"Tom Winston" wrote in message ... On 19 Jan 2004 10:08:20 -0800, N2EY wrote: Existing Advanceds get free upgrade to Extra, ... That's not an upgrade; that's a downgrade. Advanced class licensees passed the Extra class written exam, and passed a 13 wpm code test. Furthermore, most Advanced class licensees took the older Extra exam -- an exam that's a lot tougher than the current Extra exam. Uhhhh...in what universe? The only "Advanced" class licensees that I know of that took an Extra written test but didn't upgrade were one's who failed the 20WPM. There was that window of time from Jan 2000 to April 14, 2000 where one could take the extra written, pass it, get the CSCE, and cash it in on April 15, 2000. And then have your extra. And not fail the 20wpm test because he didn't take it. I did this and also took the advanced written (was an old tech plus), and cashed in the CSCEs April 15th. And I'd like to know how getting more operating privileges is a "downgrade"...?!?! Would you take an airline ticket "upgrade" by moving FROM First Class to Coach? Uh uh...It's the other way around. Same here. Possession of the Advanced class license proves that the holder met higher standards than the current crop of Extras. But those advanceds didn't do the extra writtens (4B). So, if the extra written is "worth" more than 13wpm, then todays' extras have higher standards than the advanceds'. Depends on how you call it, if element 4B 13wpm or not. Perhaps. Certainly the Advanced Class folks passed a more stringent code test. My Advanced written was hard, but so was the Extra. I am proud of both. It's a good thing to have, but it's not at the top of my resume. My 13 patents and BSEE are above it. Now that we're in bragging mode.... :-) |
In article , Robert Casey wrote:
Change the names to "top banana", "2nd banana", and "beginner" Then I get to change my Phonetics to "Another Banana 2 Render Code" Alex / AB2RC |
"KØHB" wrote in news:JYnPb.21394$zj7.4912
@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net: "Alun" wrote That's not what I read. As far as I know it is in a law that was sponsored by the late Senator Barry Goldwater, K7UGA. I'm certain you're mistaken. 73, de Hans, K0HB It might be more productive if someone could produce some evidence one way or the other! |
Robert Casey wrote in
: Alan wrote: (N2EY) wrote in : In article , Alun writes: (N2EY) wrote in news:c2356669.0401191008.a3c8376 : http://www.arrl.org/news/stories/2004/01/19/1/?nc=1 Summary: 3 classes of license: Novice, General, Extra The _only_ merit to that is that testing was free for Novices, so it would reintroduce a free licence class. Not part of the proposal as I read it. As I understand it, the law providing free testing for Novices remains on the books. Hence, it really does matter what the entry level licence is called. If it is re-named 'Novice', then the test is free. No, it's not part of the proposal, and having since read the whole thing on the ARRL web site, it appears that the league haven't thought about this particular wrinkle, as they say that the name is still open and it could be called something else. The new Novice would replace the existing Technician class as the entry level exam. It would have less power and fewer VHF/UHF privileges, but more HF privileges. Provided the new class that happened to be called Novice had Tech Plus privileges and they had to pass the current Element 2 I would have no trouble with that Why? I thought the old Novice was too easy Current Element 2 is very VHF/UHF centric, and so are current Tech Plus privs. The goal seems to be to strike more of a balance between above and below 30 MHz privileges. So change the question pool, but don't dumb it down 5 wpm code test retained for Extra only Predictably, I do have a problem with that. Me too. Should be at least 13 and preferably 20 wpm. Sending and receiving. Won't happen Exactly. Nobody else uses code anymore. And what does the FCC get out of it? And the medical wavier issues come back.... They ain't gonna do anything to have THAT come up again! Morse skill testing for voice privileges is illogical and should be dumped. It's no more illogical than testing theory in order to be allowed to use manufactured equipment. Not in my opinion Moreover, it can be now, since it has not been required by the ITU for the last six months. FCC will most probably just drop it completely. I think they will too Again, nobody else uses code anymore. Code made good sense back 50 years ago during the vacuum tube radio era. Simple equipment was all that was needed and given the reliability of vacuum tube stuff voice could likely fail when needed. But today's equipment is all made with chips and quite reliable. And digital modes like packet can handle automatically health and welfare traffic code used to do, with less operators needed. Existing Advanceds get free upgrade to Extra, OK Why OK? Why not simply carry the Advanceds as a separate class, as has been done for the past 3 years and 9 months? Can't stand loose ends Let's say that 4 years experience as an advanced is equal to element 4B (the old extra written an advanced used to be able to take to get his extra). So make the advanced turn into an extra next April. Techs and Tech Pluses get free upgrade to General Not OK in this scenario, given my comments above Agreed - but why is it OK for Advanceds to get a free upgrade to Extra, but not OK for Techs and Tech Pluses to get free upgrade to General? What is the fundamental difference that makes one freebie OK but not the other? As I see it, the new Novice would be a replacement for the Tech, which is already pretty easy 'Phone image subbands for 80/40/15 widened slightly Good. Bad. Some phone below 7100? No? Why not? That space is needed for CW and digital modes. Better to keep those on the Novice freqs and refarm more useful spectrum to phone Are the digital modes more tolerant of SW broadcaster QRM than SSB? If so, move the digital modes to 7150-7300 and voice 7000-7150. If nothing else, it would help chase the SW broadcasters away... Brilliant idea! Now that's what I call lateral thinking. It'll never happen though. I suggest:- 7000-7045 CW/Digital 7045-7100 Phone 7100-7150 CW/Digital 7150-7245 Phone 7245-7300 CW/Digital Nothing atall wrong with that, in fact it would be a major improvement. It'll get me flamed, though! 73 de Alun, N3KIP |
Robert Casey wrote in news:400ECC4F.9040505
@ix.netcom.com: Alun wrote: "Dee D. Flint" wrote in digy.com: "Alun" wrote in message ... I see no benefit in giving over 7125-7150 to phone. 7075-7100, for example, would be the same size and in a more useful place. Moreover, it would harmonise Region 2 US hams with US hams outside R2. This will crowd the CW/digital/data modes too much since there are so many US hams. It would be better to wait for the other treaty changes from the conference to take affect and synchronize Regions 1 and 3 with Region 2. You do know of course that the treaty now requires broadcasters to move out of 7.1 to 7.2 and that this will become an exclusive amateur allocation. Of course I do, but do you think they will really move? Some may, but I think some of them never will. Maybe we all should move voice to the bottom of 40m, and create a new subband for modes that create bad QRM to the broadcasters who don't vacate? :-) With a power limit of 50kW to make sure, ROTFL! |
"google blogger" wrote in message roups.com... Looks like the Ivy League also has **finally** realized that the Incentive License disaster of the 1960's pretty much trashed ham radio. Learn your history. ARRL fought that proposal. That was solely the idea of the FCC. Dee D. Flint, N8UZE |
"google blogger" wrote in
roups.com: "Winston" wrote in message ... I was an Advanced in 1963. I guess, by proxy, I will be able to say I was an Extra for 40 years. I became an Extra in 1979. What will I become now. Think of it as having walked in a very large circle for the past 40 Years. : ) : ) : ) Do you think that if everyone would just buy five copies of QST every month the League would give up attempting to license every deadbeat dad and upgrading every licensee that can recite QST? Win/W0LZ Probably an accurate observation Win. All that the ARRL has ever been interested in for the past 40+ years is more subscriptions to their ad filled fishwrap. No suprise really as the ARRL's 501-C3 Charter lists them as a non-profit "scientific" publishing company. Looks like the Ivy League also has **finally** realized that the Incentive License disaster of the 1960's pretty much trashed ham radio. Now their franticly trying to back-peddle the boat before it finally goes over Niagra Falls. Not much you can do, seeing that 99.5% of young persons are more interested in Ipod, Blogging, Chatrooms and other Net related projects instead of this old antiquated hobby of their granddaddy called "ham radio". (It used to be that ham radio was unique in that it was the only alternative to making a long distance telephone call to speak with someone far away. Today anyone can do the same with a $10-per-month ISP and a PC. The NOVELTY of long distance communications for the common person has worn off - this is the root-cause of the issue - ham radio is become obsolete. ) I didn't realise that people wrapped fish in publications over here. Fish wrapped in newspaper used to be really common back home in G land, and I dare say you might still find it if you looked hard enough. 73 de Alun, N3KIP (Ex-G8VUK) |
"Alun" wrote in message ... (N2EY) wrote in om: I did. As they get 7100-7200, any reason to have 'phone below 7100 goes away completely. Only when:- 1 - all the broadcasters have moved, probably circa the year 2100; and 2 - all the countries have 7100-7200, which might almost take as long As I recall, the treaty language from the past summer requires the broadcasters to move out. It's not a recommendation and it's not optional. I think the year is either 2007 or 2009 (I forget and don't want to take the time to go look it up). Since the equipment is already available, I would expect the various countries to move rather quickly on adding the allocation. Dee D. Flint, N8UZE |
"JJ" wrote in message ... Bert Craig wrote: Existing Advanceds get free upgrade to Extra Oh great, I get to be an Extra by default. I had rather keep my Advanced, advanced even sounds more advanced than Extra does. To the average lay person, I bet they'd agree that of the five license classes, they think Advanced would likly be the highest. I've never thought the EXTRA name conveyed the true sense of the license being the highest overall. YMMV Cheers, Bill K2UNK |
"Alun" wrote It might be more productive if someone could produce some evidence one way or the other! I can do better than evidence, I can provide proof.... The governing regulation is §97.527 which allows, but does NOT require, VEC's to collect reimbursement for examinations. (In other words, there is no requirement that VEC's collect money for ANY examination.) Collection of reimbursement is AUTHORIZED but it is not MANDATORY. Back in the early-mid 90's the ARRL VEC decided not to collect fees for Novice examinations. This ****ed off the W5YI VEC who actually petitioned the FCC to REQUIRE the collection of fees. FCC declined to grant his petition. 73, de Hans, K0HB |
In article om, "Dee D.
Flint" writes: Actually I wonder if the ARRL petition isn't a crafty ruse. It will look good to people who want what it proposes but has high odds of being rejected by the FCC since the FCC has a long history of shooting down automatic upgrades. They get the "attaboy" for "trying" and can then lay it at the FCC's door when it fails even though they may want it to fail. SHAME! Thinking improper and vulgar thoughts about the ARRL! Say 100 Hail Hirams as penance and sin no more. LHA / WMD |
In article ,
(N2EY) writes: Alun wrote in message . .. (N2EY) wrote in om: Alun wrote in message . .. (N2EY) wrote in : In article , Alun writes: (N2EY) wrote in news:c2356669.0401191008.a3c8376 : http://www.arrl.org/news/stories/2004/01/19/1/?nc=1 Summary: 3 classes of license: Novice, General, Extra The _only_ merit to that is that testing was free for Novices, so it would reintroduce a free licence class. Not part of the proposal as I read it. As I understand it, the law providing free testing for Novices remains on the books. Hence, it really does matter what the entry level licence is called. If it is re-named 'Novice', then the test is free. No, it's not part of the proposal, and having since read the whole thing on the ARRL web site, it appears that the league haven't thought about this particular wrinkle, as they say that the name is still open and it could be called something else. Unless K0HB is mistaken, no such rule exists in Part 97. And since no new Novices have been issued in almost 4 years, it's a bit of a moot point. But it might be a nice thing for VECs to do... The new Novice would replace the existing Technician class as the entry level exam. It would have less power and fewer VHF/UHF privileges, but more HF privileges. Provided the new class that happened to be called Novice had Tech Plus privileges and they had to pass the current Element 2 I would have no trouble with that Why? I thought the old Novice was too easy Why? The old 20-25 question Novice I took in 1967 at the age of 13 was adequate to keep me out of trouble, even though my first station was homebrewed from junk parts. And that Novice license started me on the path to Advanced in about a year, Extra in about 3 years and BSEE in a little over 8 years.... And there were many many Novices like me. If an entry level license keeps the newbies out of trouble and inspires them to learn and do more, isn't that just about perfect? Well? Think about it - what exactly *should* an entry-level license do? Here's a few suggestions on what they "should" do - 1. When meeting an Extra in person, always salute and show respect at all times as required by the Geneva Convention. 2. Always call Extras "sir" or "madam" as the case may be, always using military courtesy. After all, amateur radio IS a service.. 3. If an Extra wants to use the frequency you are operating on, apologize and immediately QSY to another frequency. The bands really belong to him. 4. Allot 10 percent of one's income to the League. This is the the tithe that binds better than duct tape. 5. Always defer to the Extra's desires. If they like a particular boatanchor, profess to show an interest in the clunker and praise them for their choice. If they can afford a top-of-the- line expensive transceiver, express deep envy for same and congratulate them on being able to go into hock to get it. 6. Above all, profess a deep and sincere love for morse code, the most elegant and sophisticated means of communications used by amateurs today. Always say you are working hard on code to demonstrate your committment to the ideals of the amateur community. 7. Remember that the Extra is Always Right in technical matters and never ever contradict him/her even if they make a moronic mistake about any radio theory or amateur regulations. Their rank/status/privilege plus that important certificate (suitable for framing) from the federal government shows that They Are Right. 8. In the Amateur Service try to remember General Order #1 - You will walk the bands in a military manner being always on the alert for "the rare one" and always deferring to an Extra's need to play on your frequency whenever they wish. 9. Never ever use any jargon or phrases that were not used in amateur radio prior to 1940. Use morse mode abbreviations wherever possible in written communications...to show a dedication and committment to the amateur way and that you belong with them, heart and soul. Even thinking of using 10 codes will get you excommunicated without forgiveness. 10. Always treat CB users as river bottom scum and call them all bad names and do not permit them to drink from the same water fountains as you do. They deserve to ride in the back of the EM bus...as they have for 46 years. LHA / WMD |
In article om, "Dee D.
Flint" writes: Why single out the ARRL? Almost every organization and our national political scene is the same way. A few active people get out and vote. A few active people get out and do the work. These are the people who always have and always will shape policy. Yet those who are unwilling to vote or do the work continually whine about how they are not represented. It is the same thing throughout our society. The ARRL is not unique. Gasp! You mean that the ARRL does NOT represent amateur radio in the USA? How can that be? Doesn't everyone write their Director/Section Manager who will faithfully and honestly bring their views to the Big Board? Strange. LESS than a quarter of all licensed U.S. radio amateurs belone to the League. You mean that ARRL represents those three-fourths who aren't members?!? Does the ARRL represent any of those interested in becoming a radio amteur? LHA / WMD |
"KØHB" wrote in news:mGDPb.22507$zj7.7765
@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net: "Alun" wrote It might be more productive if someone could produce some evidence one way or the other! I can do better than evidence, I can provide proof.... The governing regulation is §97.527 which allows, but does NOT require, VEC's to collect reimbursement for examinations. (In other words, there is no requirement that VEC's collect money for ANY examination.) Collection of reimbursement is AUTHORIZED but it is not MANDATORY. Back in the early-mid 90's the ARRL VEC decided not to collect fees for Novice examinations. This ****ed off the W5YI VEC who actually petitioned the FCC to REQUIRE the collection of fees. FCC declined to grant his petition. 73, de Hans, K0HB I don't think that qualifies as proof. Oh well, never mind. |
"Dee D. Flint" wrote in
gy.com: "Alun" wrote in message ... (N2EY) wrote in om: I did. As they get 7100-7200, any reason to have 'phone below 7100 goes away completely. Only when:- 1 - all the broadcasters have moved, probably circa the year 2100; and 2 - all the countries have 7100-7200, which might almost take as long As I recall, the treaty language from the past summer requires the broadcasters to move out. It's not a recommendation and it's not optional. I think the year is either 2007 or 2009 (I forget and don't want to take the time to go look it up). Since the equipment is already available, I would expect the various countries to move rather quickly on adding the allocation. Dee D. Flint, N8UZE A triumph of optimism over reality |
(Len Over 21) wrote in
: In article , (N2EY) writes: Alun wrote in message ... (N2EY) wrote in om: Alun wrote in message . .. (N2EY) wrote in : In article , Alun writes: (N2EY) wrote in news:c2356669.0401191008.a3c8376 : http://www.arrl.org/news/stories/2004/01/19/1/?nc=1 Summary: 3 classes of license: Novice, General, Extra The _only_ merit to that is that testing was free for Novices, so it would reintroduce a free licence class. Not part of the proposal as I read it. As I understand it, the law providing free testing for Novices remains on the books. Hence, it really does matter what the entry level licence is called. If it is re-named 'Novice', then the test is free. No, it's not part of the proposal, and having since read the whole thing on the ARRL web site, it appears that the league haven't thought about this particular wrinkle, as they say that the name is still open and it could be called something else. Unless K0HB is mistaken, no such rule exists in Part 97. And since no new Novices have been issued in almost 4 years, it's a bit of a moot point. But it might be a nice thing for VECs to do... The new Novice would replace the existing Technician class as the entry level exam. It would have less power and fewer VHF/UHF privileges, but more HF privileges. Provided the new class that happened to be called Novice had Tech Plus privileges and they had to pass the current Element 2 I would have no trouble with that Why? I thought the old Novice was too easy Why? The old 20-25 question Novice I took in 1967 at the age of 13 was adequate to keep me out of trouble, even though my first station was homebrewed from junk parts. And that Novice license started me on the path to Advanced in about a year, Extra in about 3 years and BSEE in a little over 8 years.... And there were many many Novices like me. If an entry level license keeps the newbies out of trouble and inspires them to learn and do more, isn't that just about perfect? Well? Think about it - what exactly *should* an entry-level license do? Here's a few suggestions on what they "should" do - 1. When meeting an Extra in person, always salute and show respect at all times as required by the Geneva Convention. 2. Always call Extras "sir" or "madam" as the case may be, always using military courtesy. After all, amateur radio IS a service.. 3. If an Extra wants to use the frequency you are operating on, apologize and immediately QSY to another frequency. The bands really belong to him. 4. Allot 10 percent of one's income to the League. This is the the tithe that binds better than duct tape. 5. Always defer to the Extra's desires. If they like a particular boatanchor, profess to show an interest in the clunker and praise them for their choice. If they can afford a top-of-the- line expensive transceiver, express deep envy for same and congratulate them on being able to go into hock to get it. 6. Above all, profess a deep and sincere love for morse code, the most elegant and sophisticated means of communications used by amateurs today. Always say you are working hard on code to demonstrate your committment to the ideals of the amateur community. 7. Remember that the Extra is Always Right in technical matters and never ever contradict him/her even if they make a moronic mistake about any radio theory or amateur regulations. Their rank/status/privilege plus that important certificate (suitable for framing) from the federal government shows that They Are Right. 8. In the Amateur Service try to remember General Order #1 - You will walk the bands in a military manner being always on the alert for "the rare one" and always deferring to an Extra's need to play on your frequency whenever they wish. 9. Never ever use any jargon or phrases that were not used in amateur radio prior to 1940. Use morse mode abbreviations wherever possible in written communications...to show a dedication and committment to the amateur way and that you belong with them, heart and soul. Even thinking of using 10 codes will get you excommunicated without forgiveness. 10. Always treat CB users as river bottom scum and call them all bad names and do not permit them to drink from the same water fountains as you do. They deserve to ride in the back of the EM bus...as they have for 46 years. LHA / WMD Hilarious! I have actually encountered someone who actually thought he must be right and spoke down to me on the air because he had a 2x1 call and I was a mere 1x3. Never mind that I am an Extra (not to mention a BSEE) but just kept my no-code call. This must come under 7. Not as common as you might think, this one. I have met many people who actually abide by number 6, i.e. they pretend to like the code, but they make only one CW QSO every 2-3 years. Usually, they are pro the CW test too. They never use it, but think the tradition is important. I am not talking about anyone here, AFAIK, but they are out there. Numbers 1-3 sound fair to me, though, ROTFL! |
On 22 Jan 2004 00:02:34 GMT, Alun wrote:
"Dee D. Flint" wrote in igy.com: "Alun" wrote in message ... (N2EY) wrote in om: I did. As they get 7100-7200, any reason to have 'phone below 7100 goes away completely. Except for us up North, perhaps - we have 7.050 to 7.100 allocated as SSB on our 40M band plan. There are a few Canadian nets that operate there regularily, as well as quite a bit of foreign DX. Fortunately, our band plans are guidelines prepared by Radio Amateurs of Canada - not federally mandated. 73, Leo Only when:- 1 - all the broadcasters have moved, probably circa the year 2100; and 2 - all the countries have 7100-7200, which might almost take as long As I recall, the treaty language from the past summer requires the broadcasters to move out. It's not a recommendation and it's not optional. I think the year is either 2007 or 2009 (I forget and don't want to take the time to go look it up). Since the equipment is already available, I would expect the various countries to move rather quickly on adding the allocation. Dee D. Flint, N8UZE A triumph of optimism over reality |
"N2EY" wrote in message m... http://www.arrl.org/news/stories/2004/01/19/1/?nc=1 Summary: 3 classes of license: Novice, General, Extra 5 wpm code test retained for Extra only [ STUFF DELETED ] 73 de Jim, N2EY Even though I support the removal of the CW requirement for any license, I find this to be an acceptable compromise. The reduction to three license classes has already happened, although the Novice license as proposed is actually a new license. Perhaps a different name could be found for it to reduce confusion with the current Novice license. Dave, K3WQ |
|
"Alun" wrote From K0HB: The governing regulation is §97.527 which allows, but does NOT require, VEC's to collect reimbursement for examinations. (In other words, there is no requirement that VEC's collect money for ANY examination.) Collection of reimbursement is AUTHORIZED but it is not MANDATORY. I don't think that qualifies as proof. Since it is a citation of the actual federal rules, it is certainly more convincing than your tenuous assertion that you "read somewhere"..... 73, de Hans, K0HB |
"Leo" wrote in message ... On 22 Jan 2004 00:02:34 GMT, Alun wrote: "Dee D. Flint" wrote in igy.com: "Alun" wrote in message ... (N2EY) wrote in om: I did. As they get 7100-7200, any reason to have 'phone below 7100 goes away completely. Except for us up North, perhaps - we have 7.050 to 7.100 allocated as SSB on our 40M band plan. There are a few Canadian nets that operate there regularily, as well as quite a bit of foreign DX. Fortunately, our band plans are guidelines prepared by Radio Amateurs of Canada - not federally mandated. 73, Leo Do you really think you would like all the US amateurs jumping in down there?? Remember the population difference. We have a tremendous amount of activity on 40m voice on 7.150 to 7.300 until the broadcasts drive us off. If we had SSB access to that 7.050 to 7.100 used by other countries, it would be packed solid and nobody else could get in. Do you want that? Far better to continue the battle to get the allocation extended to 7.300 for all amateurs around the world. Dee D. Flint, N8UZE |
Maybe we all should move voice to the bottom of 40m, and create a new subband for modes that create bad QRM to the broadcasters who don't vacate? :-) With a power limit of 50kW to make sure, ROTFL! Unfortunatley quite true, unless their intended audience lives in your town. Maybe we should still put our digital modes there, as CW and such I think may not be bothered much by broadcaster QRM. CW as it's narrowband and one could use a frequency a couple KHz's away from the broadcast carriers, and other digital modes I think may not be bothered by the QRM much. |
In article om, "Dee D.
Flint" writes: Learn your history. ARRL fought that proposal. That was solely the idea of the FCC. The ARRL can do NO wrong, of course. Evil is the FCC...of course. FCC has been around since 1934...almost 70 years. ARRL doesn't grant amateur licenses although they think they "control" it. FCC grants amateur licenses and is THE authority on U.S. civil radio regulation. Vote early and often... LHA / WMD |
In article om, "Dee D.
Flint" writes: Do you really think you would like all the US amateurs jumping in down there?? Remember the population difference. We have a tremendous amount of activity on 40m voice on 7.150 to 7.300 until the broadcasts drive us off. If we had SSB access to that 7.050 to 7.100 used by other countries, it would be packed solid and nobody else could get in. Do you want that? Far better to continue the battle to get the allocation extended to 7.300 for all amateurs around the world. Ahem...the "40m 'battle'" has been going on since WARC-79. That's a mere 24 1/2 years. :-) Tsk, tsk, tsk...sounds like somebody hasn't been through Basic Training and learning how to "battle" effectively. LHA / WMD |
In article , Leo
writes: On 21 Jan 2004 23:14:48 GMT, (Len Over 21) wrote: ROTFL etc.... again! Not sure where moralizing, assessing levels of taste and inappropriateness, and passing vengeful judgement on fellow hams fits in, though. - 9 kinda fits, with its 1940s flavour. It could also be combined with 10, but that would annoy the CBers and other scum as it is at least a layer of decency down from that. Do we perhaps need to consider an Item 11? Hmmmm..... A musician might get creative and write something for a SANCTIMONIUM. That's the horn they like to blow, part of the Big Brass section of their community orchestra of amateur blowhards. [ Toot, toot! They are on a Tootsie Roll! ] I didn't include the all-important Self-Righteousness aspect of the sanctimonius sect of status quoists. My omission. Good point to bring it up! This could turn into a "Never Ending Story!" :-) LHA / WMD |
In article , Alun
writes: I have actually encountered someone who actually thought he must be right and spoke down to me on the air because he had a 2x1 call and I was a mere 1x3. Never mind that I am an Extra (not to mention a BSEE) but just kept my no-code call. This must come under 7. Not as common as you might think, this one. I have met many people who actually abide by number 6, i.e. they pretend to like the code, but they make only one CW QSO every 2-3 years. Usually, they are pro the CW test too. They never use it, but think the tradition is important. I am not talking about anyone here, AFAIK, but they are out there. Ohhh...SOME in here might come under at least 2 items...:-) LHA / WMD |
Len Over 21 wrote:
In article om, "Dee D. Flint" writes: Learn your history. ARRL fought that proposal. That was solely the idea of the FCC. The ARRL can do NO wrong, of course. Evil is the FCC...of course. Months from now, you'll state with much confidence that someone here said such things. You will of course be correct. The someone was you. FCC has been around since 1934...almost 70 years. ....not nearly as old as the League, is it? ARRL doesn't grant amateur licenses although they think they "control" it. Who, beside you, believes such a statement? FCC grants amateur licenses and is THE authority on U.S. civil radio regulation. Vote early and often... Vote Leonard Kusinich! Dave K8MN |
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On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 00:54:28 GMT, "Dee D. Flint"
wrote: "Leo" wrote in message .. . On 22 Jan 2004 00:02:34 GMT, Alun wrote: "Dee D. Flint" wrote in igy.com: "Alun" wrote in message ... (N2EY) wrote in om: I did. As they get 7100-7200, any reason to have 'phone below 7100 goes away completely. Except for us up North, perhaps - we have 7.050 to 7.100 allocated as SSB on our 40M band plan. There are a few Canadian nets that operate there regularily, as well as quite a bit of foreign DX. Fortunately, our band plans are guidelines prepared by Radio Amateurs of Canada - not federally mandated. 73, Leo Do you really think you would like all the US amateurs jumping in down there?? Remember the population difference. We have a tremendous amount of activity on 40m voice on 7.150 to 7.300 until the broadcasts drive us off. If we had SSB access to that 7.050 to 7.100 used by other countries, it would be packed solid and nobody else could get in. Do you want that? Far better to continue the battle to get the allocation extended to 7.300 for all amateurs around the world. Dee D. Flint, N8UZE Agree that the exclusivity of the 40M band should be extended to 7.300 - but that is likely quite a few years away. It will be a few more years before the 7.100 to 7.200 segment is cleared of broadcast stations. And, the bandwidth from 7.050 to 7.100 (at least from my QTH) is relatively underutilized - not a great deal of CW or digital traffic going on there. Just thinking that it might provide some clear space for you to operate if it was opened to phone in the US. Personally, I don't mind having it as clear as it is right now at all! There are, as I stated, some excellent DX opportunities there... 73, Leo |
"KØHB" wrote in news:fZEPb.22599$zj7.10801
@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net: "Alun" wrote From K0HB: The governing regulation is §97.527 which allows, but does NOT require, VEC's to collect reimbursement for examinations. (In other words, there is no requirement that VEC's collect money for ANY examination.) Collection of reimbursement is AUTHORIZED but it is not MANDATORY. I don't think that qualifies as proof. Since it is a citation of the actual federal rules, it is certainly more convincing than your tenuous assertion that you "read somewhere"..... 73, de Hans, K0HB That's the problem though, isn't it? What we need is the statute, not the rules, which prove nothing in the absence of Novice testing. |
Alun wrote:
"KØHB" wrote in news:fZEPb.22599$zj7.10801 @newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net: "Alun" wrote From K0HB: The governing regulation is §97.527 which allows, but does NOT require, VEC's to collect reimbursement for examinations. (In other words, there is no requirement that VEC's collect money for ANY examination.) Collection of reimbursement is AUTHORIZED but it is not MANDATORY. I don't think that qualifies as proof. Since it is a citation of the actual federal rules, it is certainly more convincing than your tenuous assertion that you "read somewhere"..... That's the problem though, isn't it? What we need is the statute, not the rules, which prove nothing in the absence of Novice testing. So if I understand your view, you'd like to see a statute as proof that the statute does not exist. Does that sum it up? Dave K8MN |
The ARRL's stand was now clear. Exclusive frequencies must be restored
to the Advanced and Extra class amateurs in order to give the Generals an "incentive" to upgrade. Of course, what was left unsaid was that in order to do so, frequencies would have to be taken away from the General class hams." All this so the top HAMs have something to gloat about. |
All this so the top HAMs have something to gloat about.
Heres what so Stupid, there is nothing to prevent you from being a "TOP HAM" |
In (Len Over 21) writes:
In article om, "Dee D. Flint" writes: Actually I wonder if the ARRL petition isn't a crafty ruse. It will look good to people who want what it proposes but has high odds of being rejected by the FCC since the FCC has a long history of shooting down automatic upgrades. They get the "attaboy" for "trying" and can then lay it at the FCC's door when it fails even though they may want it to fail. SHAME! Thinking improper and vulgar thoughts about the ARRL! Say 100 Hail Hirams as penance and sin no more. LHA / WMD You probably realized that Dee D. may be assuming the role of "devil's advocate" here (by overplaying an idea to generate further discussion). In other words, we might not want to take her words at face value until she clarifies what she really means. So, Dee D., what did you really mean to say above? -- 73, Paul W. Schleck, K3FU http://www.novia.net/~pschleck/ Finger for PGP Public Key |
Alun wrote
That's the problem though, isn't it? It's not a problem for me. What we need is the statute, not the rules, which prove nothing in the absence of Novice testing. The rule cited shows that there is not a requirement to charge a fee for any license examination of any class. If you think otherwise, then I guess the burden of proof lies with you, not with me. I've made my case by citing the governing regulation. Good luck on this one now! 73, de Hans, K0HB |
"Alun" wrote I don't think that qualifies as proof. Here is a direct quote from the "Amateur Radio Newsline" broadcast of Sept 12th, 1993, where the hissy-fit of W5YI is described. Since K7UGA left the Senate in 1986, long before this incident, it's unlikely that he responded with legislation which required free Novice exams. Sunuvagun! de Hans, K0HB " VEC UPSET ABOUT FREE NOVICE TESTS The ARRL says that it will not charge applicants for Novice tests. This even though the W5YI VEC has filed a complaint with the FCC alleging that the League's VEC operation is in violation of the rules because it refuses to charge applicants for these tests. But Fred Maia W5YI who operates the VEC bearing his callsign claims that its a matter of uniformity. That all VEC's who use what is called the annual method of figuring reimbursement are required to charge an examination fee for every test it gives, including Novice exams. The ARRL says that it plans to continue its policy of administering Novice tests free of charge because it believes that this policy is consistent with an FCC tradition established back in the 1950's. This, as a way of making it easy for youngsters to get entry level licenses. The League's President, George Wilson, W4OYI says that the whole thing is nothing more than one of the ironies that keeps ham radio politics interesting. Wilson notes that VEC's have always had the latitude to set their own fees. He adds -- and we quote -- "Frankly, we see no compelling Federal interest in whether or not a class of nine year olds ought to be charged for taking an entry level ham radio exam." But Maia and his W5YI VEC operation see it very differently. In his September 1st issue of his W5YI Report newsletter Maia says that the potential financial benefit to the League resulting from its policy is to serious to be ignored. He says that free examinations when all other VEC's charge, attract applicants who are the potential purchasers of examination preparation materials. Maia believes that the purchasing decisions of these people may be unduly influenced by their choice of VEC's. |
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