"Alun" wrote

You can do whatever you like, but it is precisely _because_ you and
others
use 'Japan' as a phonetic that I have problems with people who think
that
was what I said when I correctly pronounce the correct phonetic for
the
letter P. This sucks!

Suck it may, but "Papa" and "Japan" do not sound alike to me. If you
say "Papa", I'll never type "J" into my log.

"Bravo" and "Papa" are much more often confused in my experience, and
both of them are on the "approved" phonetic set. "Oscar" and "Bravo"
are similarly often copied one for the other.

I've never known anyone to confuse "Portugal" for "Japan", "Brazil" for
"Portugal", or "Ontario" for "Brazil". Perhaps that's why this set is
so widely preferred over the ICAO set.

73, de Hans, K0HB

In article ,
(Len Over 21) writes:

After you've lived and experienced a few eras in anything, you'll
find lots and lots of "experts" in that anything, who either "know
all about (from reading a book or seeing a movie)" or are some-
how so gifted in their relative youth that they are divine
messengers sent to enlighten all the hoi polloi and the koi.
:-)

Gee, Len, that's interesting....

You mean like someone who's never held any class of amateur license, nor been
involved in radio regulation in any way, yet loudly and repeatedly proclaims
what changes should be made to the amateur radio regulations?

Or someone who has never been directly invoved in the raising of children, yet
proclaims what they can and cannot do at various ages - even to the point of
not allowing them to be amateur radio operators before a certain age?

Or someone who has never really learned or used Morse Code, yet loudly and
repeatedly denies its usefulness - even to the point of denying its historical
importance?

Or someone who claims a desire for "civil discussion", yet will not carry on a
civil discussion with someone of differing opinions, and instead refers to the
other parties by ad-hominem insults to their age, work, gender, license class,
education, name, ethnicity, and military service?

Subject: Able Baker Charlie
From: PAMNO (N2EY)
Date: 6/13/2004 8:07 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

In article ,
(Len Over 21) writes:

After you've lived and experienced a few eras in anything, you'll
find lots and lots of "experts" in that anything, who either "know
all about (from reading a book or seeing a movie)" or are some-
how so gifted in their relative youth that they are divine
messengers sent to enlighten all the hoi polloi and the koi.
:-)

Gee, Len, that's interesting....

You mean like someone who's never held any class of amateur license, nor been
involved in radio regulation in any way, yet loudly and repeatedly proclaims
what changes should be made to the amateur radio regulations?

Or someone who has never been directly invoved in the raising of children,
yet
proclaims what they can and cannot do at various ages - even to the point of
not allowing them to be amateur radio operators before a certain age?

Or someone who has never really learned or used Morse Code, yet loudly and
repeatedly denies its usefulness - even to the point of denying its
historical
importance?

Or someone who claims a desire for "civil discussion", yet will not carry on
a
civil discussion with someone of differing opinions, and instead refers to
the
other parties by ad-hominem insults to their age, work, gender, license
class,
education, name, ethnicity, and military service?

You forgot a few, Jim:

Like someone who has never been a licensed aviator who tries to advise
current aviators on navigation aid functions and techniques.

Like somone who has no training, certification or licensure in ANY
healthcare profession trying to one-upmanship those who are.

Let us not forget those who have attempted to embellish thier military
service record with the sacrifices of Soldiers who were KIA three years before
the commenter was ever IN the military.

And there are those who make scathing comments on the nature and character
of various volunteer organizations although they themselves have never been in
any of these organizations, and in one case where they hadn't even reached
puberty when they made thier "observations" on those organizations.

The list goes on.

73

Steve, K4YZ

Subject: Temper Fry, Was Able Baker Charlie
From: (William)
Date: 6/12/2004 5:34 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

(Steve Robeson K4CAP) wrote in message
...
Subject: Able Baker Charlie
From: (William)
Date: 6/11/2004 11:50 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

I'm going to start a new fenetic alfabet:

ahoy
boy...(SNIP)

Ebonics goes Caucasian. Why am I not surprised Son Of Lennie came up
with
it?

Steve, K4YZ

Steve, no thanks for the private email, even though I've asked you
repeatedly not to communicate with me privately. I really do prefer
to keep all comms with you strictly public. You broke the rules, but
certainly in keeping with your mode of operation.

No problem, Brain.

YOU made promises about certain "private" e mails before that you overtly
broke...

Just like your mentor...

So how is it that you can call people liars all day long, give people
a deadline to produce some google search, hound and hound those who
disagree with you, and in general be the sweetheart pariah of the
PCTA?

But when someone else calls you a liar, when you have lied, you
threaten a summons. Are you nuts? No. Don't answer that question.
I don't want any more lies out of you.

I've not uttered any lies here, Brain.

You've made THAT accusation before and never substantiated it. Just like
you've never justified ANY of the claims YOU'VE made.

You make accusations and claims you don't justify then cry "foul!" when
you get spoon fed your own silliness.

Sucks to be you, Brain. Seems it's a well worn path, though.

So congratulations on earning persona non grata. You've truly worked
hard at ii. Earned, Never Given.

According to YOU...?!?!

HAH!

And FWIW, the fenetic alfabet was a joke, but leave it to the mentally
impaired to think is was a serious effort.

I KNOW it was a joke. I have yet to see a whole lot come out of you that
I could take seriously. How could I?

Sayonara and have a great life.

As long as I have folks like you and Lennie against which I can benchmark
what is bad as compared to what is good, it IS a great life.

You REALLY don't get it, do you?

Steve, K4YZ

N2EY wrote:
In article ,
(Len Over 21) writes:


After you've lived and experienced a few eras in anything, you'll
find lots and lots of "experts" in that anything, who either "know
all about (from reading a book or seeing a movie)" or are some-
how so gifted in their relative youth that they are divine
messengers sent to enlighten all the hoi polloi and the koi.
:-)


Gee, Len, that's interesting....

You mean like someone who's never held any class of amateur license, nor been
involved in radio regulation in any way, yet loudly and repeatedly proclaims
what changes should be made to the amateur radio regulations?

Or someone who has never been directly invoved in the raising of children, yet
proclaims what they can and cannot do at various ages - even to the point of
not allowing them to be amateur radio operators before a certain age?

Or someone who has never really learned or used Morse Code, yet loudly and
repeatedly denies its usefulness - even to the point of denying its historical
importance?

Or someone who claims a desire for "civil discussion", yet will not carry on a
civil discussion with someone of differing opinions, and instead refers to the
other parties by ad-hominem insults to their age, work, gender, license class,
education, name, ethnicity, and military service?

You forgot to add:

"Someone that has a main purpose here of antagonizing people into
e-battles as a master troll." And in this case, his lack of experience
in certain areas only serves as more bait.

I for one, am impressed by just how GOOD Mr. Anderson is at this! You
(or anyone here) know what will happen when you rise to the bait, you
know pretty much what the resulting exchange will be, and yet it is
irresistable.

Whereas most antagonists eventually find no one to write to in a news
group, Len has managed to generate enough interest to make himself and
those who would spar with him into some of the leading posters.

This is no small accomplishment. I for one have to respect that.

- Mike KB3EIA -

Yep, the still do, or at least something extremely close to it.....

Ryan
KC8PMX


"Dee D. Flint" wrote in message
...
Don't the police and other services use the APCO phonetics?

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE


"Dan/W4NTI" w4nti@get rid of this mindspring.com wrote in message
nk.net...
Wasn't aware they were still being used.

Go for it.

Dan/W4NTI

"Ryan, KC8PMX" wrote in message
...
Just for kicks and giggles..... what about those who in their line of
work
are required to know APCO phonetics?? (Adam, Boy, Charlie/Charles
etc.)

Ryan KC8PMX


Yeah.....something like that belongs in a beginners columb like
'Your
Novice
Accent' .. Oh excuse me. They cancelled that one years ago. I
guess
that
means most of the readers of QST are novice equivilants ?
Hmmmmmmmm

Make your own conclusions there.

Dan/W4NTI

If not required by laws or rules, then it is required out of some level of
operational courtesy though.

Ryan
KC8PMX


"KØHB" wrote in message
k.net...

"Ryan, KC8PMX" wrote

As a ham I am required to use the ITU phonetics.......

No you're not.

Regardless of the article in QST, there is no requirement for hams to
use the ICAO phonetics. You are free to use whatever phonetics you
wish, or none at all if that strikes your fancy.

73, de Hans, K0HB
--
SOC #291 http://www.qsl.net/soc

Ryan, KC8PMX wrote:


As a
ham I am required to use the ITU phonetics.......

There is no rule that a ham must use a certain set if phonetics.

In article , (Steve
Robeson K4CAP) writes:

Subject: Temper Fry, Was Able Baker Charlie
From: (William)
Date: 6/12/2004 5:34 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

(Steve Robeson K4CAP) wrote in message
...
Subject: Able Baker Charlie
From: (William)
Date: 6/11/2004 11:50 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

I'm going to start a new fenetic alfabet:

ahoy
boy...(SNIP)

Ebonics goes Caucasian. Why am I not surprised Son Of Lennie came up
with it?

Steve, K4YZ

Steve, no thanks for the private email, even though I've asked you
repeatedly not to communicate with me privately. I really do prefer
to keep all comms with you strictly public. You broke the rules, but
certainly in keeping with your mode of operation.

No problem, Brain.

YOU made promises about certain "private" e mails before that you
overtly broke...

Just like your mentor...

Poor baby. Still fretting over AOL tossing off your private home page
that was totally libelous? :-)

And all because of a simple mistake in private e-mails which nursie
complained long and loudly about in public in here? :-)

PCTA Exta double standard at work. QED.

So how is it that you can call people liars all day long, give people
a deadline to produce some google search, hound and hound those who
disagree with you, and in general be the sweetheart pariah of the
PCTA?

But when someone else calls you a liar, when you have lied, you
threaten a summons. Are you nuts? No. Don't answer that question.
I don't want any more lies out of you.

I've not uttered any lies here, Brain.

"Sorry Hans, MARS IS amateur radio!" :-)

You've made THAT accusation before and never substantiated it. Just
like you've never justified ANY of the claims YOU'VE made.

Nursie never ever do anything wrong. Everyone else do wrong! :-)

You make accusations and claims you don't justify then cry "foul!" when
you get spoon fed your own silliness.

Sucks to be you, Brain. Seems it's a well worn path, though.

More "meaningful discourse." :-)

So congratulations on earning persona non grata. You've truly worked
hard at ii. Earned, Never Given.

According to YOU...?!?!

HAH!

And FWIW, the fenetic alfabet was a joke, but leave it to the mentally
impaired to think is was a serious effort.

I KNOW it was a joke. I have yet to see a whole lot come out of you
that I could take seriously. How could I?

Sayonara and have a great life.

As long as I have folks like you and Lennie against which I can benchmark
what is bad as compared to what is good, it IS a great life.

You REALLY don't get it, do you?

Nobody does. Nursie's personal reality is there and this is
it for him.

Meanwhile, DoD Directive 4650.2, AR 25-4, NTP 8(C) are still
there, defining and regulating MARS for the Military.

NATO did adopt its phonetic alphabet in 1955...the next to the
last year I was on active duty in the U.S. Army.

None of that happened according to nursie. All of us "Lie."
The real truth is in his imagination. Tsk, tsk.

Temper fry...

LHA / WMD

In article , Mike Coslo
(jumping in on the Sermon On The Antenna
Mount trolling) writes:

N2EY wrote:
In article ,

(Len Over 21) writes:

snip of today's hellfire sermon...

You forgot to add:

"Someone that has a main purpose here of antagonizing people into
e-battles as a master troll." And in this case, his lack of experience
in certain areas only serves as more bait.

Awww...poor Mike got his ego perceived as stepped on?

Mike, I've been involved with radio communications since the beginning
of that in early 1953. That's 51 years.

The subject thread is supposed to be on phonetic alphabets. No
problem, I've used those since 1953 and the NATO phonetic
alphabet since 1955 (49 years for that). Is that "lack of experience?"
:-)

I for one, am impressed by just how GOOD Mr. Anderson is at this! You
(or anyone here) know what will happen when you rise to the bait, you
know pretty much what the resulting exchange will be, and yet it is
irresistable.

In other words, you DEMAND that ALL like, honor, love, and cherish
your own preferences and cannot stomach an opposite viewpoint?
:-)

Whhhooooo...you guys are in the WRONG venue to have such an
attitude on the Internet!!! :-)

Whereas most antagonists eventually find no one to write to in a news
group, Len has managed to generate enough interest to make himself and
those who would spar with him into some of the leading posters.

"Leading posters?" :-)

You mean all those wonderful folks who yell "PUTZ" and "Son of
Lennie" and "Sucks to be you" or the snarly types tawkin tuff and
trying to stuff opposite opinions into the ground?

Yup. "Leading posters." Like the ads for some up-coming horror
fantasy movie showing blood, agony, and gore all over the wall. :-)

This is no small accomplishment. I for one have to respect that.

The only ones asking for "respect" are the telegraphy gods of hum
radio, demanding all love, honor, and cherish their "superior" mode
of modes, and thus Rule over all "inferior" beings. :-)

But, the subject title was "phonetic alphabets," wasn't it?

Got a tad off the subject into Personal Hatred, dintcha? :-)

"These things just seem to write themselves" - another hum god

LHA / WMD

In article ,
(Steaming Steve der STASI Unteroffizier who has to ride the coattails of those
specifically attacking personalities) scribbles:

Subject: Able Baker Charlie
From: PAMNO (N2EY)
Date: 6/13/2004 8:07 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

In article ,
(Len Over 21) writes:

After you've lived and experienced a few eras in anything, you'll
find lots and lots of "experts" in that anything, who either "know
all about (from reading a book or seeing a movie)" or are some-
how so gifted in their relative youth that they are divine
messengers sent to enlighten all the hoi polloi and the koi.
:-)

Gee, Len, that's interesting....

You mean like someone who's never held any class of amateur license, nor been
involved in radio regulation in any way, yet loudly and repeatedly proclaims
what changes should be made to the amateur radio regulations?

Or someone who has never been directly invoved in the raising of children,
yet
proclaims what they can and cannot do at various ages - even to the point of
not allowing them to be amateur radio operators before a certain age?

Or someone who has never really learned or used Morse Code, yet loudly and
repeatedly denies its usefulness - even to the point of denying its
historical importance?

Or someone who claims a desire for "civil discussion", yet will not carry on
a
civil discussion with someone of differing opinions, and instead refers to
the
other parties by ad-hominem insults to their age, work, gender, license
class,
education, name, ethnicity, and military service?

You forgot a few, Jim:

Like someone who has never been a licensed aviator who tries to advise
current aviators on navigation aid functions and techniques.

Oooooo...der CAP Ace SPEAKS! :-)

[single-engine rated private pilot tries to sound like multi-engine air
transport rated commercial captain or some figher jock...]

Tsk, tsk, tsk. Poor nursie, the wonderham doesn't understand that
air navigation, radio navigation aids, and techniques are NOT a part
of the NATO phonetic alphabet use. :-)

No problem. I know how TACAN, VOR, Localizer, Glideslope,
Marker Beacons, ATCRBS Transponders, Airborne radars all work
because I've been intimately involved with such hardware in design
engineering...in the labs as well as the fixed bases (airports to
civilians). Nursie doesn't know ARINC from an earache, has never
met Bill Cairns of ARINC, doesn't know what an "ATR box" is but
probably (after years of military study) got to know what a "station"
on an aircraft is...:-)

None of that really involves the NATO phonetic alphabet because
nursie is too deep in his hatred of individual personalities to be able
to distinguish right from wrong.

ICAO did adopt the NATO phonetic alphabet and made it a part of
the Air Traffic Control language...which was adopted as English
internationally back in the mid-1950s. I've used that on civil aviation
radio in voice communications about 1960 for the first time. No
biggie, but nursie can't let his hatred die and must tell a bunch of
LIES about my past experience. :-)

Like somone who has no training, certification or licensure in ANY
healthcare profession trying to one-upmanship those who are.

Nursie, trying to masquerade as Dr. Killgore, Knows All, thinks he
wrote "Gray's Anatomy" or the "Physicians' Desk Companion." :-)

Nursie can't stand being "one-upped" on ANYTHING. :-)

Let us not forget those who have attempted to embellish thier military
service record with the sacrifices of Soldiers who were KIA three years before
the commenter was ever IN the military.

Two years. My assignment was to the 71st Signal Service Battalion,
8235th Army Unit. The "71st" lost 20 members on 1 Jul 50 in an air
crash in Korea, en route to bolster U.S. Army communications there.
I honor their memory and of that military unit. Hardy Barracks, the
last surviving U.S. military location in Tokyo, was named for one of
those 20, Corporal Elmer Hardy. I was billeted at Hardy Barracks.
The new transmitter site at Kashiwa was, in 1956, renamed Camp
Tomlinson in honor of one of the "71st" officers on that fatal crash.
I was in the first of C Company to move into the Kashiwa site and
help enabling the start of HF radio operations for station ADA.

I don't "embellish" anything. I was there, as assigned, did my work,
and honored those who went before. I would dishonor the names of
all 23 of my unit if I did not mention them or keep them in my heart.

And there are those who make scathing comments on the nature and
character
of various volunteer organizations although they themselves have never been in
any of these organizations, and in one case where they hadn't even reached
puberty when they made thier "observations" on those organizations.

Poor baby. Still in need of mental counsel. His obsessional hatred
abounds. "Meaningful discussion" isn't possible.

LHA

In article , PAMNO
(Rev. Jim puts on his Evangelistic robes for
a hellfire-and-brimstone Sermon On The Antenna Mount which is
really a nasty old Troll for his series of shouting and hollering in the
disguise of a "polite" reply) writes:

In article ,
(Len Over 21) writes:

After you've lived and experienced a few eras in anything, you'll
find lots and lots of "experts" in that anything, who either "know
all about (from reading a book or seeing a movie)" or are some-
how so gifted in their relative youth that they are divine
messengers sent to enlighten all the hoi polloi and the koi.
:-)

Gee, Len, that's interesting....

You mean like someone who's never held any class of amateur license, nor been
involved in radio regulation in any way, yet loudly and repeatedly proclaims
what changes should be made to the amateur radio regulations?

Poor baby. Got your ego all in a dither because you aren't the
"renowned historian" and truthsayer in all things amateur?

Well, heck yes and gosh darn, Rev. Jim are all upset again.

This could be the start of REAL truthtelling in reply which would last
(probably) months and result in long, long, "refutations" that Rev. Jim
never ever tells any untruth and speaks with the voice of the gods.

Or someone who has never been directly invoved in the raising of children, yet
proclaims what they can and cannot do at various ages - even to the point of
not allowing them to be amateur radio operators before a certain age?

Yup, Rev. Jim, the "renowned pediatrician" has to voice an old, bitter
"cause" of his left over from 6 years ago. :-)

[see last item in my Comments on docket 98-143...which the teen
avenger was Hot and Heavy in denunciation of...(still in the ECFS
under 13 Jan 99 filing date)]

Or someone who has never really learned or used Morse Code, yet loudly and
repeatedly denies its usefulness - even to the point of denying its
historical importance?

Rev. Jim got his BP up over 200/100 again on manual telegraphy.

Tsk, tsk, tsk...then manufactures a falsehood that I "denied its
historical importance." In any other venue that would be a LIE. :-)

In the first days of ALL radio, the ONLY way to use it for any sort
of communication was by on-off keying telegraphy. That first demo
of radio was in 1896, in Italy and in Russia. The telegraphy codes
used were the "morse code" (presumably with some local country
variants for some characters, unknown to exact details). The first
Morse-Vail Telegraph (commercial) service was in 1844 or 52 years
before the first radio-as-communications medium demonstration.

There's no question that "morse code" has historical significance.
It does. But, the first radio demo was 108 years ago...roughly five
generations in the past. Today, the only real use of manual
telegraphy codes is in amateur radio where its advocates go on
angry benders of denunciation of anyone who even frowns on its
"usefulness." All the other radio services just dropped "morse" as
being too slow, too error-prone, and requiring comm specialists
at each end that weren't useful anymore.

Or someone who claims a desire for "civil discussion", yet will not carry on a
civil discussion with someone of differing opinions, and instead refers to the
other parties by ad-hominem insults to their age, work, gender, license class,
education, name, ethnicity, and military service?

I should "show respect" for those self-empowered paragons of pride
who insist (to the point of angry jumping up and down) that all must
respect those olde-tyme manual radio telegraphers? Because
telegraphy is Their Favorite and all should honor Their favorite?

Wow, ol' Rev. Jim really got cooking on his Hellfire-And-Brimstone
denunciation of all who don't Believe in the True God of Radio, Morse!

Tsk, tsk, tsk. Hell Hath No Fury Like A Telegrapher Scorned! :-)

Uh, Rev. Jim, send me your TS Card. I'll punch it. Save everyone
all the time and trouble of reading your raving of madness.

You DO know what a "TS Card" is, don't you? No? Tsk, tsk, an
old military service term-phrase. You weren't IN the military, were
you? Tsk, tsk. You did NOT work any military comms or even any
civilian comms, did you? No? Tsk, tsk.

Gosh, golly, and heckanddarn, all this fuss and Fury over some
NATO phonetic alphabet that went in force in the NATO militaries
of 1955 and was the forerunner of such adoption worldwide. Even
in the ICAO...whose working air carriers were, in the majority, in
NATO-member countries back in the mid-1950s. :-)

Beep, beep

LHA / WMD

In article ,
(Kellie after his divine words got tromped on) writes:

(Len Over 21) wrote in message
...
In article ,

(Brian Kelly) writes:

Kellie should note that the U.S. MILITARY adopted the NATO
phonetic alphabet in 1955, not 1956.

The ICAO and the ITU globally and the FAA, ANSI and the ARRL inside
the U.S. all agreed upon the same phonetic alphabet and it lives on
today. That's a documented 100% correct statement. What's your point
Putz?

Not quite the "100%" you state, but you will cuss and swear and
act real tuff about it. As you did here. :-)

NATO started it in 1955.

I was a member of the U.S. Army when NATO started it and the
U.S. military made the directives that had the military change over
and use it. Kellie wasn't. Kellie was never a part of the United
States military.

Answer: "I'm just the local neighborhood putz, I don't have a point, I
never did and I never will".

Tsk, tsk, tsk. Following your "NCOIC" in "meaningful discussions,"
are you? :-)

[as one who was IN the
U.S. Army at the time, and in radio communications work, I am
quite familiar with that adoption, about as first-hand as one can
get (without shooting off his catapult)]

Golly dayum and holy cow, I wish I was there when you used them there
NATO phonetics on the Army RTTY repeaters you babysat. NATO-issued
RTTY microphones?

Tsk, tsk, tsk...the troll tries insult mode again when he MIGHT (in the
best of all possible worlds) have had "meaningful discussions." :-)

"Army RTTY repeaters?" You call a 10 KW water-cooled HF
transmitter a "repeater?" :-) [BC-310 driven by a BC-339]

The U.S. military never had "NATO-issued RTTY microphones."
Still don't.

Kellie all "knowledgeable" about an AN/FRC-22 40 KW SSB
transmitter? He ever tune one up? He ever keep it going 24/7?

1955 was 49 years ago.
Is Kellie POSITIVE the ARRL adopted the NATO phonetic
alphabet 49 years ago? Or even 48 years ago?

Kellie in Nap Mode, can't be bothered to check it out... :-)

The ICAO (International Civil Aviation Organization) may also
have selected the NATO phonetic alphabet in 1955, rather than
1956, but I expect a lot of outraged protests on that... :-)

Kellie still in Nap Mode (old folks seem to do a lot of that).

But, Kellie can't tell the difference between a challenging statement
or a question through his tri-focals, so I let that pass. :-)

I do know it is NOT the "ICAO phonetic alphabet"

except for a
bunch of anti-military peacenik hardliners will never admit to the
existance of NATO, therefore they want to rename it for "ICAO."

SNORES

Poor baby. All tuckered out from all that reading of someone you
perceive walked all over your words? Tsk, tsk, tsk. :-)

Kellie will now start mumbling "putz" and other Yiddish
endearments... :-)

Can't even start to be bothered, "The Putz" obviously works just fine
for everybody around here.

Kellie woke up to stumble his way around a trolling reply. :-)

SK dit dit.

You passed on? How sad. Or did you just pass CW gas?

Temper fry...

LHA / WMD

In article , (Steve
Robeson K4CAP) writes:

Subject: Able Baker Charlie
From: (Len Over 21)
Date: 6/11/2004 3:27 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

I do know it is NOT the "ICAO phonetic alphabet" except for a
bunch of anti-military peacenik hardliners will never admit to the
existance of NATO, therefore they want to rename it for "ICAO."

Hmmmmmm.....

That's funny...

APCO calls it the ICAO phonetic alphabet.

APCO isn't a military organization.

Police agencies had the "10 codes" before CBers did. :-)

The FAA calls it the ICAO phonetic alphabet.

FAA is (through the USA) part of the ICAO. :-)

Where did the ICAO get their phonetic alphabet? :-)

NATO had it first in 1955. Tsk, tsk, tsk.

It's refered to as the ICAO phonetic alphabet in about a dozen different
military aeronatutical publications that I recall including the FLIP charts.

You've "FLIPed" out, nursie.

Ain't no "aeronatutical publications." Lots of aeronautical ones... :-)

I've seen it refered to as the ICAO phonetic is several European radio
hobby magazines.

You've also said "MARS is amateur radio" despite DoD Directive
4650.2 (effective 21 Nov 03). :-)

You NOW refer to amateur radio as a "hobby?" Tsk, tsk, tsk.

Where is that enormous pride and esprit de corps in that very
special "service" you honor by keeping it like a quasi-paramilitary
something or other?

Remember, "ham radio" doesn't work like all other radios. It is
very different in your reality, extra special and never, never, ever
"just a hobby" in that fantasyland.

Ya figger all them folks know something YOU don't, Lennie...?!?!

NATO knows. The made the NATO phonetic alphabet a reality
in 1955. Hasn't changed any since that year.

Kellie will now start mumbling "putz" and other Yiddish
endearments... :-)

If it fits, Lennie...

Ya PUTZ!

Tsk, tsk, tsk. More of that "meaningful discussion?" :-)

LHA / WMD

But there are strong recommendations from the various Amateur Radio Socities
that you do.

And I have heard many times in pile-ups --- ITU Phonetics only and some DX
operators won't answer you with any other phonetics.

--
Lamont Cranston

The Shadow Knows
----------------------------
"JJ" wrote in message
...
Ryan, KC8PMX wrote:


As a
ham I am required to use the ITU phonetics.......

There is no rule that a ham must use a certain set if phonetics.

Len Over 21 wrote:
In article , Mike Coslo
(jumping in on the Sermon On The Antenna
Mount trolling) writes:

Awww...poor Mike got his ego perceived as stepped on?

Absolutely not! I was complementing you on something. You are pretty
good at this.


Got a tad off the subject into Personal Hatred, dintcha? :-)

I hate almost no one. Whether you like it or not, I like you.

- Mike KB3EIA -

Ryan, KC8PMX wrote:

If not required by laws or rules, then it is required out of some level of
operational courtesy though.

Ryan
KC8PMX

I prefer that people simply say their callsign to me. Phonetics annoy
me mostly. When they use their phonetics, are they practicing courtesy
to me?

- Mike KB3EIA -


"KØHB" wrote in message
k.net...

"Ryan, KC8PMX" wrote


As a ham I am required to use the ITU phonetics.......

No you're not.

Regardless of the article in QST, there is no requirement for hams to
use the ICAO phonetics. You are free to use whatever phonetics you
wish, or none at all if that strikes your fancy.

73, de Hans, K0HB
--
SOC #291 http://www.qsl.net/soc

Da Shadow wrote:

But there are strong recommendations from the various Amateur Radio Socities
that you do.

And I have heard many times in pile-ups --- ITU Phonetics only and some DX
operators won't answer you with any other phonetics.

--
Lamont Cranston


Wow, it must be something for these "operators" to be so anal! If a
person only answers me because I speak a certain way, then I'll forgo
their blessed contact.

- Mike KB3EIA -

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:

N2EY wrote:
In article ,

(Len Over 21) writes:


After you've lived and experienced a few eras in anything, you'll
find lots and lots of "experts" in that anything, who either "know
all about (from reading a book or seeing a movie)" or are some-
how so gifted in their relative youth that they are divine
messengers sent to enlighten all the hoi polloi and the koi.
:-)


Gee, Len, that's interesting....

You mean like someone who's never held any class of amateur license, nor
been
involved in radio regulation in any way, yet loudly and repeatedly
proclaims
what changes should be made to the amateur radio regulations?

Or someone who has never been directly invoved in the raising of children,
yet
proclaims what they can and cannot do at various ages - even to the point
of
not allowing them to be amateur radio operators before a certain age?

Or someone who has never really learned or used Morse Code, yet loudly and
repeatedly denies its usefulness - even to the point of denying its
historical
importance?

Or someone who claims a desire for "civil discussion", yet will not carry
on a
civil discussion with someone of differing opinions, and instead refers to
the
other parties by ad-hominem insults to their age, work, gender, license
class,
education, name, ethnicity, and military service?

You forgot to add:

"Someone that has a main purpose here of antagonizing people into
e-battles as a master troll." And in this case, his lack of experience
in certain areas only serves as more bait.

Well, if the shoe fits...

I for one, am impressed by just how GOOD Mr. Anderson is at this!

I'm not.

You
(or anyone here) know what will happen when you rise to the bait, you
know pretty much what the resulting exchange will be, and yet it is
irresistable.

Naw, it's totally resistible. And predictable.

Whereas most antagonists eventually find no one to write to in a news
group, Len has managed to generate enough interest to make himself and
those who would spar with him into some of the leading posters.

Nothing new there, Mike.

This is no small accomplishment. I for one have to respect that.

I don't.

There's nothing to respect or admire able about being able to tear down,
insult, and destroy - or attempt to.

Here's a classic for ya - I call it "the sphincter post":

http://groups.google.com/groups?selm...001001%40nso-f
p.aol.com&output=gplain

73 de Jim, N2EY

Perhaps Mike -- But they sometimes are the only game in town

--
Lamont Cranston

The Shadow Knows
"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
...
Da Shadow wrote:

But there are strong recommendations from the various Amateur Radio
Socities
that you do.

And I have heard many times in pile-ups --- ITU Phonetics only and some
DX
operators won't answer you with any other phonetics.

--
Lamont Cranston


Wow, it must be something for these "operators" to be so anal! If a
person only answers me because I speak a certain way, then I'll forgo
their blessed contact.

- Mike KB3EIA -

"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
...


Ryan, KC8PMX wrote:

If not required by laws or rules, then it is required out of some level
of
operational courtesy though.

Ryan
KC8PMX

I prefer that people simply say their callsign to me. Phonetics annoy
me mostly. When they use their phonetics, are they practicing courtesy
to me?

- Mike KB3EIA -


I find that people have a high error percentage in getting my call correct
even with a clear, strong FM signal unless I give it at least once
phonetically. While my call is N8UZE, the Z is frequently repeated back to
me as B, C, D, G, P, T, or V. The only people who don't make that mistake
are those who have known me for a while and are familiar with my call.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
...
Da Shadow wrote:

But there are strong recommendations from the various Amateur Radio
Socities
that you do.

And I have heard many times in pile-ups --- ITU Phonetics only and some
DX
operators won't answer you with any other phonetics.

--
Lamont Cranston


Wow, it must be something for these "operators" to be so anal! If a
person only answers me because I speak a certain way, then I'll forgo
their blessed contact.

- Mike KB3EIA -


There's often quite a good reason for it. Many DX stations only have a
minimal grasp of English and departing from the ICAO phonetics can cause
them real problems in getting the call sign correct.

In addition, if everyone is using the same phonetics, the brain becomes
trained to them and can pick it out even if mispronounced, heavily accented,
or incompletely heard due to noise or interference.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

Dee D. Flint wrote:
"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
...

Da Shadow wrote:


But there are strong recommendations from the various Amateur Radio

Socities

that you do.

And I have heard many times in pile-ups --- ITU Phonetics only and some

DX

operators won't answer you with any other phonetics.

--
Lamont Cranston


Wow, it must be something for these "operators" to be so anal! If a
person only answers me because I speak a certain way, then I'll forgo
their blessed contact.

- Mike KB3EIA -



There's often quite a good reason for it. Many DX stations only have a
minimal grasp of English and departing from the ICAO phonetics can cause
them real problems in getting the call sign correct.

Do they really have that bad a grasp, I wonder? Language barrier would
argue in favor of the "country" type phonetics instead of the ICAU
versions. In the short time I have been a ham, I have made use of the
languages I have learned in the past, and worked at picking up others. I
sure as anything would work hard at picking up English if I was planning
on working DX.

p.s. no Anglo-centrism here - I would pick up Swahili if need be.


In addition, if everyone is using the same phonetics, the brain becomes
trained to them and can pick it out even if mispronounced, heavily accented,
or incompletely heard due to noise or interference.

- Mike KB3EIA -

On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 17:52:22 -0400, Mike Coslo wrote:

I prefer that people simply say their callsign to me. Phonetics annoy
me mostly. When they use their phonetics, are they practicing courtesy
to me?

We have an individual (respected old-timer at that) who, when he
takes his turn-in-the-barrel as net control of our daily ARES/RACES
check-in, gets confused over people's call signs regardless of
whether phonetics are used or not, and even if one identifies with
phonetics, he will acknowledge with some ad-hoc inconsistent mixture
of ITU, old military, and old telco (cities) phonetics.

For one, it drives me nuts even though he's a nice guy.

And on another score, the last letter in my call is "P", and how can
"pa-PA" - or even the popular pronunciation "poppuh" be confused with
"Japan" ??

--
73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane

From a Clearing in the Silicon Forest
Beaverton (Washington County) Oregon

"Dee D. Flint" wrote in
:


"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
...


Ryan, KC8PMX wrote:

If not required by laws or rules, then it is required out of some
level of operational courtesy though.

Ryan
KC8PMX

I prefer that people simply say their callsign to me. Phonetics annoy
me mostly. When they use their phonetics, are they practicing courtesy
to me?

- Mike KB3EIA -


I find that people have a high error percentage in getting my call
correct even with a clear, strong FM signal unless I give it at least
once phonetically. While my call is N8UZE, the Z is frequently
repeated back to me as B, C, D, G, P, T, or V. The only people who
don't make that mistake are those who have known me for a while and are
familiar with my call.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE


Likewise, without phonetics my call is often copied as N3KRP or N3KAP
instead of N3KIP. Unfortunately, using international phonetics my November
3 Kilo India Papa is often copied as November 3 Kilo India Japan (see the
argument above with Hans who favours the alternate set that uses Japan
instead of Juliet).

JJ wrote in news:pa2dnWsHvLe-JVHdRVn-
:

Ryan, KC8PMX wrote:


As a
ham I am required to use the ITU phonetics.......

There is no rule that a ham must use a certain set if phonetics.



No indeed, but I wish there was.

"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
...
Dee D. Flint wrote:
"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
...

Da Shadow wrote:


But there are strong recommendations from the various Amateur Radio

Socities

that you do.

And I have heard many times in pile-ups --- ITU Phonetics only and
some

DX

operators won't answer you with any other phonetics.

--
Lamont Cranston


Wow, it must be something for these "operators" to be so anal! If a
person only answers me because I speak a certain way, then I'll forgo
their blessed contact.

- Mike KB3EIA -



There's often quite a good reason for it. Many DX stations only have a
minimal grasp of English and departing from the ICAO phonetics can cause
them real problems in getting the call sign correct.

Do they really have that bad a grasp, I wonder? Language barrier would
argue in favor of the "country" type phonetics instead of the ICAU
versions. In the short time I have been a ham, I have made use of the
languages I have learned in the past, and worked at picking up others. I
sure as anything would work hard at picking up English if I was planning
on working DX.


It actually is not rare for a DX station to know practically no English at
all (it is even more true in a contest that includes DX). Some are simply
interested in running contacts. All they can handle is a signal report and
call sign. So using the phonetics THEY want or are accustomed to is the
polite thing to do.

Keep in mind that the ICAO phonetics were developed with certain criteria in
mind. One of these is that they be relatively easy to pronounce even if the
person doesn't otherwise speak English. Another criterion was that even if
mispronounced, listeners could still ascertain what letter was intended.
For example, the French may actually pronounce "Charlie" as "Sharlie" but
the listener is still able to get the right letter. Germans may pronounce
"Whiskey" as "Viskey" but we still get the letter correct. Americans will
mispronounce "Quebec" and "Papa" but again the other station has a very good
chance of getting it correct. Another criterion was that the words be of
reasonable length, neither excessively short or excessively long. Although
the ICAO phonetics sometimes are poor in meeting all the criteria, the
country name approach is often poorer in this regard (e.g. Zanzibar is just
way too long).

Now I have used phonetics other than the ICAO upon occasion. However I
always start with the ICAO and switch only if they can't seem to understand,
which happens on shortwave with the noise and interference. Fortunately
that is rare for me. My call seems to work quite well with the ICAO
phonetics. On the other hand, my OM sometimes finds it necessary to use
"Sugar" instead of "Sierra" and "Germany" instead of "Golf". The soft,
sibilant sound of "Sierra" often gets lost in the hiss of noise and the
throaty "Golf" seems almost to get "swallowed" when spoken and sometimes
doesn't come through well. Still this does not mean one should disregard
the ICAO set.

The objective is always clarity of communication. Standardization of
approach generally helps this. That is why the ICAO developed its phonetics
and why amateur organizations encourage the use of this set.

Again it goes back to what the brain has been trained to do. To someone who
is accustomed to using "Zulu", the phonetic "Zanzibar" can cause the brain
to momentarily stumble in getting the letter. Then a repeat is required.
Would you rather repeat the phonetic several times or use one that the
station is accustomed to so they can get it on the first try?

In looking at your call, you are fortunate (just as I am) to have one
composed of letters that comes across easily using the ICAO phonetics.
There should be no need to use any other set with a call such as yours and
other phonetics could actually be confusing.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

Mike Coslo wrote in
:

Da Shadow wrote:

But there are strong recommendations from the various Amateur Radio
Socities that you do.

And I have heard many times in pile-ups --- ITU Phonetics only and
some DX operators won't answer you with any other phonetics.

--
Lamont Cranston


Wow, it must be something for these "operators" to be so anal! If
a
person only answers me because I speak a certain way, then I'll forgo
their blessed contact.

- Mike KB3EIA -



If they don't know much English, it's a bit rough on them to use non-
standard words, and even if they do, it increases the chance of a busted
call in the log.

N2EY wrote:

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:

N2EY wrote:
In article ,

(Len Over 21) writes:


After you've lived and experienced a few eras in anything, you'll
find lots and lots of "experts" in that anything, who either "know
all about (from reading a book or seeing a movie)" or are some-
how so gifted in their relative youth that they are divine
messengers sent to enlighten all the hoi polloi and the koi.
:-)


Gee, Len, that's interesting....

You mean like someone who's never held any class of amateur license, nor
been
involved in radio regulation in any way, yet loudly and repeatedly
proclaims
what changes should be made to the amateur radio regulations?

Or someone who has never been directly invoved in the raising of children,
yet
proclaims what they can and cannot do at various ages - even to the point
of
not allowing them to be amateur radio operators before a certain age?

Or someone who has never really learned or used Morse Code, yet loudly and
repeatedly denies its usefulness - even to the point of denying its
historical
importance?

Or someone who claims a desire for "civil discussion", yet will not carry
on a
civil discussion with someone of differing opinions, and instead refers to
the
other parties by ad-hominem insults to their age, work, gender, license
class,
education, name, ethnicity, and military service?

You forgot to add:

"Someone that has a main purpose here of antagonizing people into
e-battles as a master troll." And in this case, his lack of experience
in certain areas only serves as more bait.

Well, if the shoe fits...

I for one, am impressed by just how GOOD Mr. Anderson is at this!

I'm not.

You
(or anyone here) know what will happen when you rise to the bait, you
know pretty much what the resulting exchange will be, and yet it is
irresistable.

Naw, it's totally resistible. And predictable.

Whereas most antagonists eventually find no one to write to in a news
group, Len has managed to generate enough interest to make himself and
those who would spar with him into some of the leading posters.

Nothing new there, Mike.

This is no small accomplishment. I for one have to respect that.

I don't.

There's nothing to respect or admire able about being able to tear down,
insult, and destroy - or attempt to.

Here's a classic for ya - I call it "the sphincter post":

http://groups.google.com/groups?selm...001001%40nso-f
p.aol.com&output=gplain

I hear tell that those air raids on Tokyo in the fifties were exercises
in sheer terror. I have to admit to being a little puzzled by what
appears to be a reference to the writer's multiple sphincters (in the
next to last paragraph).

Dave K8MN

Alun wrote:

JJ wrote in news:pa2dnWsHvLe-JVHdRVn-
:


Ryan, KC8PMX wrote:



As a
ham I am required to use the ITU phonetics.......

There is no rule that a ham must use a certain set if phonetics.




No indeed, but I wish there was.

It would be even better if we had rules that say exactly what we can say
during the contact. 8^) Yer getting a tad rigid here, Alun.

73's!! - Mike KB3EIA -

Alun wrote:

Mike Coslo wrote in
:


Da Shadow wrote:


But there are strong recommendations from the various Amateur Radio
Socities that you do.

And I have heard many times in pile-ups --- ITU Phonetics only and
some DX operators won't answer you with any other phonetics.

--
Lamont Cranston


Wow, it must be something for these "operators" to be so anal! If
a
person only answers me because I speak a certain way, then I'll forgo
their blessed contact.

- Mike KB3EIA -




If they don't know much English, it's a bit rough on them to use non-
standard words, and even if they do, it increases the chance of a busted
call in the log.

Quite possibly. I use the so called "proper" phonetics myself (though
prefering plain callsigns).

I'm just not terribly into telling people what they can or can't say on
the air as long as it is decent language.

- Mike KB3EIA -

In article , PAMNO
(N2EY) writes:

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:

N2EY wrote:
In article ,

(Len Over 21) writes:

After you've lived and experienced a few eras in anything, you'll
find lots and lots of "experts" in that anything, who either "know
all about (from reading a book or seeing a movie)" or are some-
how so gifted in their relative youth that they are divine
messengers sent to enlighten all the hoi polloi and the koi.
:-)


You forgot to add:

"Someone that has a main purpose here of antagonizing people into
e-battles as a master troll." And in this case, his lack of experience
in certain areas only serves as more bait.

Well, if the shoe fits...

I for one, am impressed by just how GOOD Mr. Anderson is at this!

I'm not.

Awwwww... :-)

You
(or anyone here) know what will happen when you rise to the bait, you
know pretty much what the resulting exchange will be, and yet it is
irresistable.

Naw, it's totally resistible. And predictable.

Rev. Jim just CAN'T resist, can he? :-)

Whereas most antagonists eventually find no one to write to in a news
group, Len has managed to generate enough interest to make himself and
those who would spar with him into some of the leading posters.

Nothing new there, Mike.

This is no small accomplishment. I for one have to respect that.

I don't.

Awwwww... :-)


There's nothing to respect or admire able about being able to tear down,
insult, and destroy - or attempt to.

Yup, yup, the "good old days" of classic amateur CW" are going
down the tubes and the righteous Rev. Jim is invoking the wrath
of the ham gods against those anti-CW heretic unbelievers!

Tsk, tsk, tsk.

Here's a classic for ya - I call it "the sphincter post":

Rev. Jim has lots of "sphincter" problems, do he? :-)

Hoo, hoo...the Extra Double Standard is in full swing again!


Now the SUBJECT thread here is about phonetic alphabets but
Rev. Jim is way into the hellfire and damnation of the unbelievers
wishing to smite all heretics anywhichway he can. Subject, no,
attacking personalities, yes. :-)

He is on a roll and keeps forgetting he slips on the butter. :-)

LHA / WMD

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:

Len Over 21 wrote:
In article , Mike Coslo
(jumping in on the Sermon On The Antenna
Mount trolling) writes:

Awww...poor Mike got his ego perceived as stepped on?

Absolutely not! I was complementing you on something. You are pretty
good at this.

Those replies "just seem to write themselves..." :-)

About two decades ago I started computer-modem communications.
I've seen and met lots of discussors and just dis-cussers in person
via the BBS gatherings. How folks write here is indicative of how
they really feel, up close and personal. :-)


Got a tad off the subject into Personal Hatred, dintcha? :-)

I hate almost no one. Whether you like it or not, I like you.

Tsk, tsk, tsk, Mike. Your words in other messages betray you...

It is totally irrelevant whether anyone is "liked" or not. This is
computer-modem comms and the in-person social rules don't
apply here. The SUBJECT is the thing, but so few beginners
can't grasp that. [so few have been in real debate so they are
inexperienced]

The SUBJECT title is about phonetic alphabets. It isn't about
"being liked" or "being disliked." On the phonetics, some folks
don't like phonetic alphabets, others think they belong...a sort of
quasi-jargon to hang with all the others. Me, I got them way,
way back as part of the military procedures, used them, and
the NATO set has become standard for me and I think nothing
more about it.

Perhaps one exception: "One-three-whiskey at the brewery"
has two sets of meanings to anyone on normal downwind leg
at VNY. [Anheiser-Busch brewery is just across the runways
from the VNY tower...controllers know it, so do all the local
pilots...:-) ]

LHA / WMD

In article ,
(William) writes:

(Len Over 21) wrote in message
...
In article ,
(Steve
Robeson K4CAP) writes:

Subject: Temper Fry, Was Able Baker Charlie
From: (William)
Date: 6/12/2004 5:34 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

(Steve Robeson K4CAP) wrote in message
...
Subject: Able Baker Charlie
From: (William)
Date: 6/11/2004 11:50 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

I'm going to start a new fenetic alfabet:

ahoy
boy...(SNIP)

Ebonics goes Caucasian. Why am I not surprised Son Of Lennie came
up
with it?

Steve, K4YZ

Steve, no thanks for the private email, even though I've asked you
repeatedly not to communicate with me privately. I really do prefer
to keep all comms with you strictly public. You broke the rules, but
certainly in keeping with your mode of operation.

No problem, Brain.

YOU made promises about certain "private" e mails before that you
overtly broke...

Just like your mentor...

Poor baby. Still fretting over AOL tossing off your private home page
that was totally libelous? :-)

And all because of a simple mistake in private e-mails which nursie
complained long and loudly about in public in here? :-)

PCTA Exta double standard at work. QED.

Len, I don't see Steve's post in Google. Is he using the "no
archive?"

Dunno...haven't been in Google for months and months. No reason
to go there for this newsgroup. :-)

Can't blame him what with such a litiguous society.

I doubt he understands that he could be sued. In his reality, he
is absolutely and totally "correct" and any opposition is terribly
"wrong." Ergo, he is not ever going to be sued by anyone.

AOL knows that. :-) They took down his libelous Home Page
as soon as I made them aware of it... :-)

So how is it that you can call people liars all day long, give people
a deadline to produce some google search, hound and hound those who
disagree with you, and in general be the sweetheart pariah of the
PCTA?

But when someone else calls you a liar, when you have lied, you
threaten a summons. Are you nuts? No. Don't answer that question.
I don't want any more lies out of you.

I've not uttered any lies here, Brain.

"Sorry Hans, MARS IS amateur radio!" :-)

You've made THAT accusation before and never substantiated it. Just
like you've never justified ANY of the claims YOU'VE made.

Nursie never ever do anything wrong. Everyone else do wrong! :-)

He's an idiot.

I'll be kinder. He is stuck in that alternate reality where he is always
right and never has to answer to anyone else. He hasn't understood
that everyone else lives in the real reality. :-)

You make accusations and claims you don't justify then cry "foul!"
when
you get spoon fed your own silliness.

Sucks to be you, Brain. Seems it's a well worn path, though.

More "meaningful discourse." :-)

Len, I've always said that my /T5 logs are in storage. A simple 5
minute google search could have borne that out. But Steve had to make
up stories. Untrue stories. They're not lost, never have been. And
I know that Steve and Kelly aren't in them because I didn't work any
USA stations.

Half of the Gang of Four still want your head on a platter for even
being IN that country and because you talked back to them. Those
PCTAs can say and do anything they want but NOBODY can talk
back to them without incurring their divine wrath. shrug

So congratulations on earning persona non grata. You've truly worked
hard at ii. Earned, Never Given.

According to YOU...?!?!

HAH!

And FWIW, the fenetic alfabet was a joke, but leave it to the mentally
impaired to think is was a serious effort.

I KNOW it was a joke. I have yet to see a whole lot come out of you
that I could take seriously. How could I?

Sayonara and have a great life.

As long as I have folks like you and Lennie against which I can
benchmark
what is bad as compared to what is good, it IS a great life.

You REALLY don't get it, do you?

Nobody does. Nursie's personal reality is there and this is
it for him.

Nobody does. Nobody "gets it." Hannibal Lector might get it, but I
don't.

Maybe nursie grows his own cilantro. "Tastes slurp good with a
little cilantro..."

Meanwhile, DoD Directive 4650.2, AR 25-4, NTP 8(C) are still
there, defining and regulating MARS for the Military.

Sad that Steve can't read, can't google. It would save him a lot of
grief. He can only make untrue accusations about sexual orientation
and preferences for minors.

Anyone who doesn't think and do exactly as him is "perverse."

NATO did adopt its phonetic alphabet in 1955...the next to the
last year I was on active duty in the U.S. Army.

Why didn't they just wait for IGY?

NATO, not NASA. Remember what happened to the all-USA-made
Viking Rocket? That was NASA's and Martin's... :-)

None of that happened according to nursie. All of us "Lie."
The real truth is in his imagination. Tsk, tsk.

He has demons inside.

Maybe he uses a mouth wash and gargoyles after that?

:-)

Or, post-traumatic stress disorder after all those "hostile actions?"

LHA / WMD

Len Over 21 wrote:

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:


Len Over 21 wrote:

In article , Mike Coslo
(jumping in on the Sermon On The Antenna
Mount trolling) writes:

Awww...poor Mike got his ego perceived as stepped on?

Absolutely not! I was complementing you on something. You are pretty
good at this.


Those replies "just seem to write themselves..." :-)

About two decades ago I started computer-modem communications.

Those days were something by comparison. Phone cradle modems and slow
as molasses. Can't say as I'm all that sorry they are gone.

I've seen and met lots of discussors and just dis-cussers in person
via the BBS gatherings.

Yeah, me too.

How folks write here is indicative of how
they really feel, up close and personal. :-)

You are 100 percent correct.


Got a tad off the subject into Personal Hatred, dintcha? :-)

I hate almost no one. Whether you like it or not, I like you.


Tsk, tsk, tsk, Mike. Your words in other messages betray you...

I'm sorry you feel that way.

It is totally irrelevant whether anyone is "liked" or not.

100 percent correct. That doesn't change the fact that I do like you.

This is
computer-modem comms and the in-person social rules don't
apply here.

If you do not wish them to apply to you, they don't have to. You are
the master of what you say and do in person or in a newsgroup.

- Mike KB3EIA -

Kiki-Bueno-3-Encarta-Insipid-Autogyro

hmmm, that's beginning to sound like some of the spam I've been getting
lately! 8^)

Phil Kane wrote:

On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 17:52:22 -0400, Mike Coslo wrote:


I prefer that people simply say their callsign to me. Phonetics annoy
me mostly. When they use their phonetics, are they practicing courtesy
to me?


We have an individual (respected old-timer at that) who, when he
takes his turn-in-the-barrel as net control of our daily ARES/RACES
check-in, gets confused over people's call signs regardless of
whether phonetics are used or not, and even if one identifies with
phonetics, he will acknowledge with some ad-hoc inconsistent mixture
of ITU, old military, and old telco (cities) phonetics.

For one, it drives me nuts even though he's a nice guy.

And on another score, the last letter in my call is "P", and how can
"pa-PA" - or even the popular pronunciation "poppuh" be confused with
"Japan" ??


pa-PA could under some circumstances sound a teeny bit like Japan if
some one pronounced it Jaw-pawn. Who would do that, I'm not sure.

- Mike KB3EIA -

Y'know, with all this discussion about different phonetic alphabets, people
confusing "Papa" with "Japan" and DX/contest folks using a completely different
set and being cornfuzed by anything else, it makes me wonder.

Doesn't all this add up to 'phone modes being "slow", "limited" and
"error-prone"?

73 de Jim, N2EY