(Steve Robeson K4YZ) wrote:

Submit a mailing address chage to the FAA with just a post office box or
"Rural Route" number and see what happens, and they require it for the same
reasosn..."enforcement issues"

Why would the FAA require a street address when the FCC doesn't? Very
few pilots fly to their homes (though there's a suburb of Sacramento
when many houses have a hangar next to a runway), but many hams operate
from home.



==
Jack Hamilton


==
In the end, more than they wanted freedom, they wanted comfort and security.
And in the end, they lost it all - freedom, comfort and security.
Edward Gibbon

In article , "KØHB"
writes:

In fact, used to be that you needed to NOTIFY the FCC if you were going
to operate away from your assigned station location, and periodically
renew that notification.

I remember that the rule was that if you were going to operate away from home
for more than 48 hours, you had to send notification to the FCC district
offices where you'd be. So a ham on a long car vacation would send a series of
cards for each move after the initial 48 hours. Even a long weekend at the
shore or mountains required notification.

Some of just got an additional station
callsign if we were going to spend time at another location.

Some hams collected a string of them, for just that reason. PArticularly across
district lines.

73 de Jim, N2EY

Subject: Who Can Have A US License? Sequential Calls?
From: Jack Hamilton
Date: 11/25/2004 12:08 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

(Steve Robeson K4YZ) wrote:

Submit a mailing address chage to the FAA with just a post office box
or
"Rural Route" number and see what happens, and they require it for the same
reasosn..."enforcement issues"

Why would the FAA require a street address when the FCC doesn't? Very
few pilots fly to their homes (though there's a suburb of Sacramento
when many houses have a hangar next to a runway), but many hams operate
from home

In know, but they do. In 96 I submitted a change-of-address that included
my PO box and RR...I got an UGLY letter that stated I was required to provide
SPECIFIC directions to my residence from recognizable landmarks, or my
certificate was "subject to suspension pending provision of said information".

73

Steve, K4YZ

In article , (Steve
Robeson K4YZ) writes:

KH2D, who has *been there* says differently. See his posts on the subject.

I read it.

He refered to "CBers" with Amateur licenses. He did not specify that
ther
were licenses obtained from VE exams held at foreign hamfests. Sounded to me
like "locals"...

Unless I'm mistaken, only an Extra can be a VE that gives Extra exams. So you
have a chicken-and-egg scenario about how such a setup could get started.

And I said that if he didn't get the desired results, he should push
it with DoJ.

And they would do what? It's an offense committed outside US territory and US
jurisdiction, unless it's at an embassy or similar place.

Yet we HAVE had more than a small number of VE test session right here
in
the US that WERE just that (license for sale). I am sure there have been
cases
of fines, but in most cases, revocation of of licensure for both "licensee"
and
"examiner" was the only penalty enforced.

And a US citizen cannot use a foreign amateur license in the USA. So the
penalty is much tougher on them.

That's not the point.

Sure it is.

You brought up how to enforce regulations on foreign Amateurs who may
allow some misconduct in the performance of a VE session.

And the answer is...

No where did I say ANYthing about using a foreign license in the United
States.

What I DID say was that in VE session right here at home, conducted
by
Americans, the "most" penalties usually enforced are license revocation of
both
the licensee and the "examiner".

Are you suggesting any GREATER penalty on a foreigner who commits the
same
crime?

Do you dispute this fact?

Cool down and think about the main point:

Besides the fact that it's just plain wrong, hams who live in US territory have
two reasons not to cheat as VEs:

1) If they're caught, they could face fines and even jail time

2) If they're caught, they could lose their FCC licenses, which means no ham
radio on US territory, and maybe none at all. Ever.

A nonresident alien with both a foreeign and US license doesn't face the same
possible consequences.

OK...then send a copy of the document to me and I'd be glad to sign on
as
a
co-sponsor. But right now there's not much to argue with since what's
going
on
appears to be legal and there's no other legal precedent for the FCC to say
"No, We won't accept license applications from non-resident foreign
nationals".

Don't need a precedent.

Sure you do.

Why would the government revoke ANY privilege unless there was some
misconduct or abuse of that privilege?

Because they think it's not a good thing for the ARS, or for radio in general.
Look at the multiple choice code tests - they were eliminated as part of the
2000 restructuring after many years of use - because hams complained that they
weren't doing the job.

If you force THAT issue, then "they" can adequately argue that there are
even far greater abuses right here at home and the whole program goes out the
window!

So?

Ya *really* wanna stir things up?

Imagine if FCC came up with a new callsign system, like this:

1) No more vanity calls
2) All CONUS callsigns begin with W
3) All non-CONUS callsigns begin with K
4) All nonresident callsigns begin with N
5) All special event callsigns begin with A
6) All callsigns indicate the geographic location of the licensee's
address.
If
you move across a call district boundary, you get a new callsign,
sequentially
issued, no choice.
7) Everybody gets a 2x3 call except Extras, who get the shorter calls,
sequentially issued, until they're used up.
8) If your present call matches the new system, you can keep it. Otherwise
you
get a sequentially issued new call on the next renewal. No choice of the
new
call.

Can you imagine the uproar?

Since when has creating an up-roar been un-American...?!?!

Actually, Here's MY idea.

All new callsigns are assigned a 2x3 callsign, regardless of class,
period. All existing calls stay the same unless the licensee requests a
change
which they pay for.

Right away I can hear the yelling.

Why? If it's someone "new", they will have never known any other
way...and
I specifically stated that all those already licensed would not be forced to
make any changes.

Because the new folks would be subject to conditions that the existing hams
didn't face.

The FCC continues to offer the different "Group" callsigns, but if the
licensee wants a call other than what was issued, they pony up the
change...No
more "sequential" calls other than the 2x3 they were issued.

hooboy

Why? Do you walk up to Burger King and just take the food?

Fee-for-service is the way of the future if we continue to enact tax
cuts.

How much service is required to issue a sequential callsign?

If you move across a call district line, you either apply for a call
in
that district, or you are obligated to sign "portable", "stroke", "mobile",
etc
that call district. There are both enforcement and "good operating
practice"
issues therein.

So I'd have to start signing "N2EY/3" after more than 20 years of not having
to
do so from here? That's effectively lengthening the call to a 2x3

And no one looking for a 2-land call would wind up working someone in
PA!

Is that *really* such a problem? Many of the rarest states are in call
districts that contain a lot of states, so even if that rule were reenacted the
hunt is only slightly reduced.

How about we make it even easier: Carve up the callsign blocks into
state-specific ones so you could tell which exact state someone was in just
from the call. For example, in the 3rd call district, all calls with an M, R or
Y in the suffix could be restricted to Maryland only, all calls with D, E or L
could be restricted to Delaware, and all the rest would go to PA. (Adjust as
needed for population variation) So you could just look at a callsign and know
which state the ham was in.

"dadididadit didididadah" takes about 1 second extra at 20WPM. Big
deal.

It is when you do it a couple thousand times in a weekend.

Would I have to pay the fee to get a 3 land call?

What did I say?

What if all the 3-land 1x2s are gone?

Ominus Feces Occurum. There'd be 3-laders living in FL and other places
force to give up their "out-of-dictrict" calls too.

Right. Somebody who's been a ham for 60+ years and held the same call, then
moved to SFL 15 years ago would have to give it up or sign portable. Thanks a
lot.

The actual cost of the licensing program would go down since the FCC
would
no longer be issuing tons of "sequential" callsigns gratis, and fees
collected
would go up since you couldn't get any other format of call without ponying
up
the change to do so.

Issuing sequentials costs almost nothing because the computer simply spits
them
out automatically.

Still costs time to attend the computer, input the data, and pay for the
actual forms and postage.

No more time than the basic modification.Which are free anyway.

Of course it'll never happen, because the admin paperwork alone would be a
nightmare. Plus the vanity revenue would go away.

The paperwork would go down since they'd no longer be getting 605's at
every change of class of license or address change

whoa!

5 years ago I moved from 19082 to 19087. Still EPA, no callsign change would
have been required under any rules. Yet I had to send in a 605.

You're the one talking about changes to the rules.

How's this for example: "Where a change of address is requested and no
other change of callsign would be required due to location within the same
call
district, attaching a copy of the letter of notification sent to the
Commission
to the original station records shall be considered adequate. A change of
address on the original license document will be reflected upon the next
routine renewal or paid license transaction."

No good. FCC is supposed to know how to contact licensees. That's why they need
some sort of current address.

They can find your transmitter by DF ing, but to send you a letter they need an
address. Or at least a PO box.

and the fees would go up
since they were no longer issuing (save for the initial call) gratis
licenses.
And the FCC would be getting paid to process what extra paperwork they DID
receive.

But do vanity fees go to FCC or to the general fund?

Againn, Jim, you're the one suggesting changes...

I'm pointing out that your proposed changes would increase admin work that
serves "no regulatory purpose". Making my search for WAS easier isn't FCC's
job.

73 de Jim, N2EY

"Steve Robeson K4YZ" wrote


In the FCC's opinion it is not a regulatory necessity, thus they don't
require it.

It's not about regulatory. It's about enforcement.


In the FCC's opinion it is not an enforcement issue, thus they don't
require it.


There's are numerous letters in QST over the past few years
(and I must assume even more who haven't written) lamenting
the same thing.


The FCC sees no regulatory reason (nor enforcement reason, nor "good
operating practice" reason) to change your callsign when you move from
one district to another, nor are they required to consult "numerous
letters in QST" to determine what is "good operating practice"..

They do, however, often take into account the wishes of the citizens who
petition them for rule changes. One of those petitions asked that they
allow amateurs to retain their calls when moving because many hams had
become 'connected' to their call signs, almost as a 'name', and did not
wish to surrender the call when moving. Finding no regulatory,
enforcement, nor "good operating practice" reason that a ham shouldn't
keep their callsign, they ruled in favor of the petitioner.


I guess it's no problem when you are running a full gallon and
have the Internet right there at the operating position, Hans.

Whether I'm running a "full gallon" or 100mW (which is closer to what I
normally run) doesn't make it any easier to devine the source of a CQ.
And what does the internet have to do with it?

73, de Hans, K0HB/4ID

"Steve Robeson K4YZ" wrote

Subject: Who Can Have A US License? Sequential Calls?
From: "KØHB"
Date: 11/25/2004 11:43 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

"Steve Robeson K4YZ" wrote

And a primary station location should be required on the
license.

That's your opinion.

And my opinion is worth any less than yours...how...????


Did I say it was worth less? No, of course I didn't say it, and of
course you knew I didn't say it, but nice try at misdirection anyhow.

What I did say was "In the FCC's opinion......".

73, de Hans, K0HB/4ID

"Steve Robeson K4YZ" wrote



Submit a mailing address chage to the FAA with just a post
office box or "Rural Route" number and see what happens,
and they require it for the same reasosn..."enforcement issues"


FAA is not concerned with my amateur station location unless I move
close to an airport and build a tower, so I have no occasion to submit a
mailing address change to them.

I'll keep it in mind, however, if I move and my location/tower height
require permits from them. Until then, I really couldn't care less
about what FAA requires, since they lack jurisdiction in amateur radio
location matters.

73, de Hans, K0HB/4ID

"N2EY" wrote


How about we make it even easier: Carve up the callsign blocks into
state-specific ones so you could tell which exact state someone was in
just
from the call. For example, in the 3rd call district, all calls with
an M, R or
Y in the suffix could be restricted to Maryland only, all calls with
D, E or L
could be restricted to Delaware, and all the rest would go to PA.
(Adjust as
needed for population variation) So you could just look at a callsign
and know
which state the ham was in.


Aw, gee, Jim, that isn't nearly complicated enough. You gotta get it
down to the country level at least, preferably the city or township
level. The control freaks would like something like the old convoluted
USSR system. If you knew a guys call sign, the system was almost
detailed enough to use for targeting ICBMs. See below. Riley
Hollingsworth could just dial in your call sign, and a boomer sub off
the coast of New Jersey would target a tomahawk with the violation
notice attached to the nosecone. I can just see it now ---- "Hey,
K4CAP, your stations RF Exposure Evaluation appears to need updating.
Please report when you have completed the required survey."

73, de Hans, K0HB/4ID

TERRITORIES, PREFIXES AND SUFFIXES OF THE FORMER USSR.


(Updated list of prefixes and suffixes of former USSR radio
amateur stations).

Compiled by Oleg Chernozyomov, UA4CIF, 31 March, 1995
Text corrections and additional information by RW3AH, Dec. 24th 1995.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Source: Literature - "Amateur Stations of the former Soviet
Commonwealth"
by RA6YR, 1995.

Two-letter combinations after oblasts names in Russia and Ukraine are
adopted for ham tests and other purposes.

Russia R, RA, RK, RN, RU, RV, RW, RX, RZ, UA; 1-4, 6, 8-0;
Armenia EK UG)
Moldavia ER (ex-UO)
Byelorussia EU-EW; EV5 (ex-UC)
Kirghizia EX (ex-UM)
Tadjikistan EY (ex-UJ)
Turkmenia EZ (ex-UH)
Uzbekistan UK (ex-UI)
Kazakhstan UN; UP (ex-UL)
Ukraine UR-UY; EM-EO; UV, UW, UZ, U5 (ex-UB)
Azerbaijan 4J, 4K (ex-UD)
Georgia 4L (ex-UF)



Russia R, RA, RK, RN, RU, RV, RW, RX, RZ, UA; 1-4, 6, 8-0;
================================================== ==========

* The second letter in a suffix: W, X, Y, Z - Club stations
* U1-4, 6, 9-0 World War II veterans
* U1MIR - U9MIR cosmonauts
* R1ANA - R1ANZ Antarctica
* R1FJA - R1FJZ Franz Josef Land (Arctic)
* R1MVA - R1MVZ Maly Visotski Island (ex-4J1.)
* R3ARES - Russian amateur radio emergency service H.Q (RARES), Moscow.
* RE0RAS - RARES, Regional service. Central Siberia, Krasnoyarsk.
* R3ARC - H.Q. Rescue service of Russian Red Cross. Moscow.
* R3RRC - "Russian Robinson Club" H.Q. Lipetsk city (R3G area).
* R3SRR - Russian Amateur Radio Union H.Q. Moscow.
* R3VHF - VHF Committee of Russian Amateur Radio Union.

Oblast Identification by Combination of a Figure and 1st letter in a
suffix.
__________________________________________________ ________________________*** Russia, Region 1 *** Central cityNorth-West Russia of a territoryA, B, D, F, G, H, I, J, L, M - St.Petersburg (SP)C Leningradskaya oblast (LO) St.PetersburgN Republicarelia (KL) (Prefix RN1) PetrozavodskO Arkhangelskaya oblast ArchangelskP Nenetsky Autonomous Okrug (NO) Nar'yan-MarQ, R, S Vologodskaya oblast (VO) VologdaT, U Novgorodskaya oblast (NV) NovgorodW, X Pskovskaya oblast (PS) PskovY, Z Murmanskaya oblast (MU) Murmansk*** Russia, Region 2 ***BalticsF Kaliningradskaya oblast (KA) Kaliningrad*** Russia, Region 3 ***Central RussiaA, B, C, F, H Moscow ciA)D Moskovskaya oblast (MO) Moscow area(Pushkino)E Orlovskaya oblast (OR) OryolG Lipetskaya oblast (LP) LipetskI, J Tverskaya oblast (TV) Tver'L Smolenskaya oblast (SM) SmolenskM Yaroslavskaya oblast (JA) YaroslavlN, O Kostromskaya oblast (KS) KostromaP Tul'skaya oblast (TL) TulaQ Voronezhskaya oblast (VH) VoronezhR Tambovskaya oblast (TB) TambovS Ryazanskaya oblast (RA) Ryazan'T Nizhegorodskaya oblast (NN) Nizhny NovgorodU Ivanovskaya oblast (IV) IvanovoV Vladimirskaya oblast (VL) VladimirW Kurskaya oblast (KU) KurskX Kaluzhskaya oblast (KG) KalugaY Bryanskaya oblast (BR) BryanskZ Belgorodskaya oblast (BO) Belgorod*** Russia, Region 4 ***Volga river area.A, B Volgogradskaya oblast (VG) VolgogradC, D Saratovskaya oblast (SA) SaratovF Penzenskaya oblast (PE) PenzaH, I Samarskaya oblast (SR) SamaraL, M Ul'anovskaya oblast (UL) Ul'anovskN, O Kirovskaya oblast (KI) Kirov (Vyatka)P, Q, R Republic of Ta (Tatarstan) (TA) Kazan'S, T Republic of Mari (Mari-El) (MR) Joshkar-OlaU Republic of Mordovia (MD) SaranskW Republic of Udmurtia (UD) IzhevskY, Z Republic of Chuvashia (CU) Cheboksary*** Russia, Region 6 ***Northern CaucususA, B, C, D Krasnodarsky Kray (KR) KrasnodarE Republic of Karachaevo-Cherkessia (KC) CherkesskF, G, H Stavropolsky Kray (ST) StavropolI Republic of Kalmykia (KM) ElistaJ Republic of Northern Ossetia (SO) VladikavkazL, M, N, O Rostovskaya oblast (RO) Rostov-on-DonP, Q, R Republics of Ingushetia and Chechnya (CN) Grozny,Nazran'U, V Astrakhanskaya oblast (AO) Astrakhan'W Republic of Daghestan (DA) MakhachkalaX Republuc of Kabardino-Balkaria (KB) Nal'chikY Republic of Adygeya (AD) Maykop*** Russia, Region 8 ***Far East (Buryatia)T Ust' Ordynsky Buryatsky Autonomous Okrug (UO) Ust' OrdynskyV Aginsky Buryatsky Autonomous Okrug (AB) Aginskoe*** Russia, Region 9 ***Ural mounts. area and Central, Western Siberia.A, B Chelyabinskaya oblast (CB) ChelyabinskC, D, E Sverdlovskaya oblast (SV) YekaterinburgF Permskaya oblast (PM) Perm'G Komi-Permyatsky Autonomous Okrug (KP) KudymkarH, I Tomskaya oblast (TO) TomskJ Khanty-Mansyisky Autonomous Okrug (HM) Khanty-MansyiskK Yamalo-Nenetsky Autonomous Okrug (JN) SalekhardL Tyumenskaya oblast (TN) Tyumen'M, N Omskaya oblast (OM) OmskO, P Novosibirskaya oblast (NS) NovosibirskQ, R Kurganskaya oblast (KN) KurganS, T Orenburgskaya oblast (OB) OrenburgU, V Kemerovskaya oblast (KE) KemerovoW Republic of Bashkiria (Bashkortostan)(BA) UfaX Republic of Komi (KO) SyktyvkarY Altaysky Kray - (AL) BarnaulZ Republic of Altay (GA) Gorno-Altaysk*** Russia, Region 0 ***Eastern Siberia and Far East.A Krasnoyarsky Kray (KK) KrasnoyarskB Taymyrsky Autonomous Okrug (TM) DudinkaC Khabarovsky Kray (HK) KhabarovskD Yevreyskaya (Jewish) Autonomous Oblast (EA) BirobidzhanE, F, G Sakhalinskaya Oblast (SL)Yuzhno-SakhalinskH Evenkiysky Autonomous Okrug (EW) TuraI Magadanskaya oblast (MG) MagadanJ Amurskaya oblast (AM) BlagoveshenskK Chukotsky Autonomous Okrug (CK) Anadyr'L, M, N Primorsky Kray (PK) VladivostokO, P Republic of Buryatia (BU) Ulan-UdeQ, R Republic of Yakutia (Saha) (YA) YakutskS, T Irkutskaya oblast (IR) IrkutskU, V Chitinskaya oblast (CT) ChitaW Republic of Khakassia (HA) AbakanX Koryaksky Autonomous Okrug (KJ) PalanaY Republic of Tuva (TU) KyzylZ Kamchatskaya oblast (KT)Petropavlovsk-Kamchatsky __________________________________________________ ________________________ Armenia EK Yerevan city. ======= -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Moldavia (Moldova) ER ======================6, 7, 8, 9 - In reserve, special event licenses.0 - For foreign amateurs.Suffixes: KAA - KZZ - Club station AAA - ZZZ - 4 - Category AA - ZZ - 1, 2, 3 - CategoryER1 Kishinev, Dubossary, Orgeev, KhyncheshtyER2 Tiraspol, Bendery, KaushanyER3 Beltsy, Rybnitsa, FloreshtyER4 Yedintsy, Drokia, SorokiER5 Kagul, Komrat, Leovo, Chadyr-Lunga __________________________________________________ ________________________ Byelorussia EU. EW. EV. ========================EU - EW1 MinskEU - EW2 Minskaya oblast Minsk (Borisov)EU - EW3 Brestskaya oblast BrestEU - EW4 Grodnenskaya oblast GrodnoEU - EW6 Vitebskaya oblast VitebskEU - EW7 Mogilyovskaya oblast MogilyovEU - EW8 Gomel'skaya oblast GomelEU, EW9 In reserveEU, EW0 For foreign amateursEV5 For special event licensesSuffixes YAA - YZZ female operatorSuffixes, beginning with W, X, Z Club stationEV1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 7, 8, Suffixes A - Z World War II veterans, special memorial event stations. __________________________________________________ ________________________ Kirghizia EX. ==============EX2, 8, 0 one-letter suffixes Extra licenseEX6, 7, 8 two-letter suffixes I CategoryEX8, three-letter suffixes - 2, 3 CategoryEX9, second letter in a suffix - W, X, Y, Z - Club stationOblast identification by the 1st letter in a suffix (excluding Extrastations)M Chuyskaya oblast, Bishkek BishkekN Oshskaya oblast OshP Narynskaya oblast NarynQ Issyk-kul'skaya oblast PrzhevalskT Talasskaya oblast TalasV Dzhalal-Abadskaya oblast Dzhalal-Abad __________________________________________________ ________________________ Tadjikistan EY. =================EY1, 2, 3, 0 - In reserveSuffixes ZA - ZZ, ZAA - ZZZ - Club stationEY4 Gorno-Badakhshanskaya Autonomous Oblast KhorogEY5 Khatlonskaya oblast (region of Kulyab)EY6 Khatlonskaya oblast (region of Kurgan-Tyube)EY7 Leninabadskaya oblast KhodzhentEY8 DushanbeEY9 Nurek and Republican subordinate regions __________________________________________________ ________________________ Turkmenia EZ. =============EZ3 Akhalsky veloyatEZ4 Balkansky veloyatEZ5 Maryisky veloyatEZ6 Dashkhovuzsky veloyatEZ7 Lebapsky veloyatEZ8 AshgabadOne-letter suffixes Club stationOne-letter suffixes W,X,X,Z For special event licenses __________________________________________________ ________________________Uzbekistan UK================UK7, 8, 9UJ, UL, UM - In reserveSuffixes WA - ZZ Club stationU8 World War II veteransOblast identification by the 1st letter of a suffix:A TashkentB Tashkentskaya oblast TashkentC Kashkardar'inskaya oblast KarshiD Syrdar'inskaya oblast GulistanF Andizhanskaya oblast AndizhanG Ferganskaya oblast FerganaI Samarkandskaya oblast SamarkandL Bukharskaya oblast BukharaO Namanganskaya oblast NamanganQ Navoiyskaya oblast NavoiT Surkhandar'inskaya oblast TermezU Khorezmskaya oblast UrgenchV Dzhizakskaya oblast DzhizakZ Karakalpakia Nukus __________________________________________________ ________________________ Kazakhstan UN =============UN ordinary licensesUP For special event licensesSuffixes XA - XZ Emergency servicesUN1, UO, UQ In reserveOne-letter suffixes: Extra licenseTwo-letter suffixes: I CategoryThree-letter suffixes: 2, 3, 4 categoryOblast identification by the 1st letter of a suffix:A Mangistauskaya oblast MangistauB Akmolinskaya oblast AkmolinskC Severo-Kazakhstanskaya oblast PetropavlovskD Semipalatinskaya oblast SemipalatinskE Kokchetavskaya (Kokshetau) oblast KokchetavF Pavlodarskaya oblast PavlodarG Alma-Ata (Almaty)I Aktyubinskaya oblast AktyubinskJ Vostochno-Kazakhstanskaya oblast Ust' KamenogorskK Kzyl-Ordinskaya oblast Kzyl OrdaL Kustanayskaya oblast KustanayM Ural'skaya oblast UralskN Chimkentskaya oblast Chimkent(Shymkent)O Atyrauskaya oblast AtyrauP Karagandinskaya oblast KaragandaQ Alma-Atinskaya oblast Alma-Ata(Alamaty)R Dzhezkazganskaya oblast Dzhezkazgan (Zhezkazgan)S Leninsk (Baikonur)T Dzhambulskaya oblast Dzhambul(Zhambyl)V Taldy-Kurganskaya oblast Taldy-Kurgan (Taldykorgan)Y rgayskaya oblast Arkalyk __________________________________________________ ________________________ Ukraine UR-UY. ===============UR - UY ordinary licensesEM - EO For special event licensesUV, UW, UZ In reserveU5 World War II veteransTwo-letter suffixes: I CategoryThree-letter suffixes: 2, 3, 4 CategiriesSecond letter of a suffix: W, X, Y, Z - Club stationsUU1-8J, UU0J Crimea (KR) SimferopolUU9J Sevastopol (SL)Oblast identification by the 1st letter of a suffix:A Sumskaya oblast (SU) SumyB Ternopolskaya oblast (TE) TernopolC Cherkasskaya oblast (CH) CherkassyD Zakarpatskaya oblast (ZA) UzhgorodE Dnepropetrovskaya oblast (DN) DnepropetrovskF Odesskaya oblast (OD) OdessaG Khersonskaya oblast (HE) KhersonH Poltavskaya oblast (PO) PoltavaI Donetskaya oblast (DO) DonetskK Rovenskaya oblast (RI) Rovno (Rivno)L Kharkovskaya oblast (HA) KharkovM Luganskaya oblast (LU) LuganskN Vinnitskaya oblast (VI) VinnitsaP Volynskaya oblast (VO) LutskQ Zaporozhskaya oblast (ZP) ZaporozhieR Chernigovskaya oblast (CR) ChernigovS Ivano-Frankovskaya oblast (IF) Ivano-Frankovsk (Ivano-Frankivsk)T Khmelnitskaya oblast (HM) KhmelnitskyU Kievskaya oblast (KO) KievU Kiev (KV)V Kirovogradskaya oblast (KI) KirovogradW Lvovskaya oblast (LV) Lvov (Lviv)X Zhitomirskaya oblast (ZH) ZhitomirY Chernovitskaya oblast (CN) ChernovtsyZ Nikolaevskaya oblast (NI) Nikolaev __________________________________________________ ________________________ Azerbaijan 4J. 4K. ====================4J, 4K1, 0 For special event licenses and foreign amateurs.Suffixes AWA - ZZZ Club station AAA - ZVZ 2, 3 Category AA - ZZ 1 Category A - Z Extra licenses4J2, 4K2 Nakhichevan'4J4-9, 4K4-9 Baku city4J3, 4K3 Azerbaijan territories excluding Baku and Nakhichevan' __________________________________________________ ________________________ Georgia 4L. ==============4L1, 4L4, 4L6, 4L7, 4L0 ordinary licenses2, 3, 5, 8, 9 In reserveOne-letter suffiz Extra licensesTerritory Msg #36 From: RW3AH Date: 27-Dec 0752Z Subj: Ex-USSRCALLSIGN SYSTEM TERRITORIES, PREFIXES AND SUFFIXES OF THE FORMER USSR. ================================================== ====(Updated list of prefixes and suffixes of former USSR radioamateur stations). Compiled by Oleg Chernozyomov, UA4CIF, 31 March, 1995 Text corrections and additional information by RW3AH, Dec. 24th 1995. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Source: Literature - "Amateur Stations of the former SovietCommonwealth" by RA6YR, 1995. Two-letter combinations after oblasts names in Russia and Ukraine are adopted for ham tests and other purposes. Russia R, RA, RK, RN, RU, RV, RW, RX, RZ, UA; 1-4, 6, 8-0; Armenia EK UG) Moldavia ER (ex-UO) Byelorussia EU-EW; EV5 (ex-UC) Kirghizia EX (ex-UM) Tadjikistan EY (ex-UJ) Turkmenia EZ (ex-UH) Uzbekistan UK (ex-UI) Kazakhstan UN; UP (ex-UL) Ukraine UR-UY; EM-EO; UV, UW, UZ, U5 (ex-UB) Azerbaijan 4J, 4K (ex-UD) Georgia 4L (ex-UF) Russia R, RA, RK, RN, RU, RV, RW, RX, RZ, UA; 1-4, 6, 8-0; ================================================== ========== * The second letter in a suffix: W, X, Y, Z - Club stations * U1-4, 6, 9-0 World War II veterans * U1MIR - U9MIR cosmonauts * R1ANA - R1ANZ Antarctica * R1FJA - R1FJZ Franz Josef Land (Arctic) * R1MVA - R1MVZ Maly Visotski Island (ex-4J1.) * R3ARES - Russian amateur radio emergency service H.Q (RARES), Moscow. * RE0RAS - RARES, Regional service. Central Siberia, Krasnoyarsk. * R3ARC - H.Q. Rescue service of Russian Red Cross. Moscow. * R3RRC - "Russian Robinson Club" H.Q. Lipetsk city (R3G area). * R3SRR - Russian Amateur Radio Union H.Q. Moscow. * R3VHF - VHF Committee of Russian Amateur Radio Union. Oblast Identification by Combination of a Figure and 1st letter in a suffix. __________________________________________________ ________________________*** Russia, Region 1 *** Central cityNorth-West Russia of a territoryA, B, D, F, G, H, I, J, L, M - St.Petersburg (SP)C Leningradskaya oblast (LO) St.PetersburgN Republicarelia (KL) (Prefix RN1) PetrozavodskO Arkhangelskaya oblast ArchangelskP Nenetsky Autonomous Okrug (NO) Nar'yan-MarQ, R, S Vologodskaya oblast (VO) VologdaT, U Novgorodskaya oblast (NV) NovgorodW, X Pskovskaya oblast (PS) PskovY, Z Murmanskaya oblast (MU) Murmansk*** Russia, Region 2 ***BalticsF Kaliningradskaya oblast (KA) Kaliningrad*** Russia, Region 3 ***Central RussiaA, B, C, F, H Moscow ciA)D Moskovskaya oblast (MO) Moscow area(Pushkino)E Orlovskaya oblast (OR) OryolG Lipetskaya oblast (LP) LipetskI, J Tverskaya oblast (TV) Tver'L Smolenskaya oblast (SM) SmolenskM Yaroslavskaya oblast (JA) YaroslavlN, O Kostromskaya oblast (KS) KostromaP Tul'skaya oblast (TL) TulaQ Voronezhskaya oblast (VH) VoronezhR Tambovskaya oblast (TB) TambovS Ryazanskaya oblast (RA) Ryazan'T Nizhegorodskaya oblast (NN) Nizhny NovgorodU Ivanovskaya oblast (IV) IvanovoV Vladimirskaya oblast (VL) VladimirW Kurskaya oblast (KU) KurskX Kaluzhskaya oblast (KG) KalugaY Bryanskaya oblast (BR) BryanskZ Belgorodskaya oblast (BO) Belgorod*** Russia, Region 4 ***Volga river area.A, B Volgogradskaya oblast (VG) VolgogradC, D Saratovskaya oblast (SA) SaratovF Penzenskaya oblast (PE) PenzaH, I Samarskaya oblast (SR) SamaraL, M Ul'anovskaya oblast (UL) Ul'anovskN, O Kirovskaya oblast (KI) Kirov (Vyatka)P, Q, R Republic of Ta (Tatarstan) (TA) Kazan'S, T Republic of Mari (Mari-El) (MR) Joshkar-OlaU Republic of Mordovia (MD) SaranskW Republic of Udmurtia (UD) IzhevskY, Z Republic of Chuvashia (CU) Cheboksary*** Russia, Region 6 ***Northern CaucususA, B, C, D Krasnodarsky Kray (KR) KrasnodarE Republic of Karachaevo-Cherkessia (KC) CherkesskF, G, H Stavropolsky Kray (ST) StavropolI Republic of Kalmykia (KM) ElistaJ Republic of Northern Ossetia (SO) VladikavkazL, M, N, O Rostovskaya oblast (RO) Rostov-on-DonP, Q, R Republics of Ingushetia and Chechnya (CN) Grozny,Nazran'U, V Astrakhanskaya oblast (AO) Astrakhan'W Republic of Daghestan (DA) MakhachkalaX Republuc of Kabardino-Balkaria (KB) Nal'chikY Republic of Adygeya (AD) Maykop*** Russia, Region 8 ***Far East (Buryatia)T Ust' Ordynsky Buryatsky Autonomous Okrug (UO) Ust' OrdynskyV Aginsky Buryatsky Autonomous Okrug (AB) Aginskoe*** Russia, Region 9 ***Ural mounts. area and Central, Western Siberia.A, B Chelyabinskaya oblast (CB) ChelyabinskC, D, E Sverdlovskaya oblast (SV) YekaterinburgF Permskaya oblast (PM) Perm'G Komi-Permyatsky Autonomous Okrug (KP) KudymkarH, I Tomskaya oblast (TO) TomskJ Khanty-Mansyisky Autonomous Okrug (HM) Khanty-MansyiskK Yamalo-Nenetsky Autonomous Okrug (JN) SalekhardL Tyumenskaya oblast (TN) Tyumen'M, N Omskaya oblast (OM) OmskO, P Novosibirskaya oblast (NS) NovosibirskQ, R Kurganskaya oblast (KN) KurganS, T Orenburgskaya oblast (OB) OrenburgU, V Kemerovskaya oblast (KE) KemerovoW Republic of Bashkiria (Bashkortostan)(BA) UfaX Republic of Komi (KO) SyktyvkarY Altaysky Kray - (AL) BarnaulZ Republic of Altay (GA) Gorno-Altaysk*** Russia, Region 0 ***Eastern Siberia and Far East.A Krasnoyarsky Kray (KK) KrasnoyarskB Taymyrsky Autonomous Okrug (TM) DudinkaC Khabarovsky Kray (HK) KhabarovskD Yevreyskaya (Jewish) Autonomous Oblast (EA) BirobidzhanE, F, G Sakhalinskaya Oblast (SL)Yuzhno-SakhalinskH Evenkiysky Autonomous Okrug (EW) TuraI Magadanskaya oblast (MG) MagadanJ Amurskaya oblast (AM) BlagoveshenskK Chukotsky Autonomous Okrug (CK) Anadyr'L, M, N Primorsky Kray (PK) VladivostokO, P Republic of Buryatia (BU) Ulan-UdeQ, R Republic of Yakutia (Saha) (YA) YakutskS, T Irkutskaya oblast (IR) IrkutskU, V Chitinskaya oblast (CT) ChitaW Republic of Khakassia (HA) AbakanX Koryaksky Autonomous Okrug (KJ) PalanaY Republic of Tuva (TU) KyzylZ Kamchatskaya oblast (KT)Petropavlovsk-Kamchatsky __________________________________________________ ________________________ Armenia EK Yerevan city. ======= -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Moldavia (Moldova) ER ======================6, 7, 8, 9 - In reserve, special event licenses.0 - For foreign amateurs.Suffixes: KAA - KZZ - Club station AAA - ZZZ - 4 - Category AA - ZZ - 1, 2, 3 - CategoryER1 Kishinev, Dubossary, Orgeev, KhyncheshtyER2 Tiraspol, Bendery, KaushanyER3 Beltsy, Rybnitsa, FloreshtyER4 Yedintsy, Drokia, SorokiER5 Kagul, Komrat, Leovo, Chadyr-Lunga __________________________________________________ ________________________ Byelorussia EU. EW. EV. ========================EU - EW1 MinskEU - EW2 Minskaya oblast Minsk (Borisov)EU - EW3 Brestskaya oblast BrestEU - EW4 Grodnenskaya oblast GrodnoEU - EW6 Vitebskaya oblast VitebskEU - EW7 Mogilyovskaya oblast MogilyovEU - EW8 Gomel'skaya oblast GomelEU, EW9 In reserveEU, EW0 For foreign amateursEV5 For special event licensesSuffixes YAA - YZZ female operatorSuffixes, beginning with W, X, Z Club stationEV1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 7, 8, Suffixes A - Z World War II veterans, special memorial event stations. __________________________________________________ ________________________ Kirghizia EX. ==============EX2, 8, 0 one-letter suffixes Extra licenseEX6, 7, 8 two-letter suffixes I CategoryEX8, three-letter suffixes - 2, 3 CategoryEX9, second letter in a suffix - W, X, Y, Z - Club stationOblast identification by the 1st letter in a suffix (excluding Extrastations)M Chuyskaya oblast, Bishkek BishkekN Oshskaya oblast OshP Narynskaya oblast NarynQ Issyk-kul'skaya oblast PrzhevalskT Talasskaya oblast TalasV Dzhalal-Abadskaya oblast Dzhalal-Abad __________________________________________________ ________________________ Tadjikistan EY. =================EY1, 2, 3, 0 - In reserveSuffixes ZA - ZZ, ZAA - ZZZ - Club stationEY4 Gorno-Badakhshanskaya Autonomous Oblast KhorogEY5 Khatlonskaya oblast (region of Kulyab)EY6 Khatlonskaya oblast (region of Kurgan-Tyube)EY7 Leninabadskaya oblast KhodzhentEY8 DushanbeEY9 Nurek and Republican subordinate regions __________________________________________________ ________________________ Turkmenia EZ. =============EZ3 Akhalsky veloyatEZ4 Balkansky veloyatEZ5 Maryisky veloyatEZ6 Dashkhovuzsky veloyatEZ7 Lebapsky veloyatEZ8 AshgabadOne-letter suffixes Club stationOne-letter suffixes W,X,X,Z For special event licenses __________________________________________________ ________________________Uzbekistan UK================UK7, 8, 9UJ, UL, UM - In reserveSuffixes WA - ZZ Club stationU8 World War II veteransOblast identification by the 1st letter of a suffix:A TashkentB Tashkentskaya oblast TashkentC Kashkardar'inskaya oblast KarshiD Syrdar'inskaya oblast GulistanF Andizhanskaya oblast AndizhanG Ferganskaya oblast FerganaI Samarkandskaya oblast SamarkandL Bukharskaya oblast BukharaO Namanganskaya oblast NamanganQ Navoiyskaya oblast NavoiT Surkhandar'inskaya oblast TermezU Khorezmskaya oblast UrgenchV Dzhizakskaya oblast DzhizakZ Karakalpakia Nukus __________________________________________________ ________________________ Kazakhstan UN =============UN ordinary licensesUP For special event licensesSuffixes XA - XZ Emergency servicesUN1, UO, UQ In reserveOne-letter suffixes: Extra licenseTwo-letter suffixes: I CategoryThree-letter suffixes: 2, 3, 4 categoryOblast identification by the 1st letter of a suffix:A Mangistauskaya oblast MangistauB Akmolinskaya oblast AkmolinskC Severo-Kazakhstanskaya oblast PetropavlovskD Semipalatinskaya oblast SemipalatinskE Kokchetavskaya (Kokshetau) oblast KokchetavF Pavlodarskaya oblast PavlodarG Alma-Ata (Almaty)I Aktyubinskaya oblast AktyubinskJ Vostochno-Kazakhstanskaya oblast Ust' KamenogorskK Kzyl-Ordinskaya oblast Kzyl OrdaL Kustanayskaya oblast KustanayM Ural'skaya oblast UralskN Chimkentskaya oblast Chimkent(Shymkent)O Atyrauskaya oblast AtyrauP Karagandinskaya oblast KaragandaQ Alma-Atinskaya oblast Alma-Ata(Alamaty)R Dzhezkazganskaya oblast Dzhezkazgan (Zhezkazgan)S Leninsk (Baikonur)T Dzhambulskaya oblast Dzhambul(Zhambyl)V Taldy-Kurganskaya oblast Taldy-Kurgan (Taldykorgan)Y rgayskaya oblast Arkalyk __________________________________________________ ________________________ Ukraine UR-UY. ===============UR - UY ordinary licensesEM - EO For special event licensesUV, UW, UZ In reserveU5 World War II veteransTwo-letter suffixes: I CategoryThree-letter suffixes: 2, 3, 4 CategiriesSecond letter of a suffix: W, X, Y, Z - Club stationsUU1-8J, UU0J Crimea (KR) SimferopolUU9J Sevastopol (SL)Oblast identification by the 1st letter of a suffix:A Sumskaya oblast (SU) SumyB Ternopolskaya oblast (TE) TernopolC Cherkasskaya oblast (CH) CherkassyD Zakarpatskaya oblast (ZA) UzhgorodE Dnepropetrovskaya oblast (DN) DnepropetrovskF Odesskaya oblast (OD) OdessaG Khersonskaya oblast (HE) KhersonH Poltavskaya oblast (PO) PoltavaI Donetskaya oblast (DO) DonetskK Rovenskaya oblast (RI) Rovno (Rivno)L Kharkovskaya oblast (HA) KharkovM Luganskaya oblast (LU) LuganskN Vinnitskaya oblast (VI) VinnitsaP Volynskaya oblast (VO) LutskQ Zaporozhskaya oblast (ZP) ZaporozhieR Chernigovskaya oblast (CR) ChernigovS Ivano-Frankovskaya oblast (IF) Ivano-Frankovsk (Ivano-Frankivsk)T Khmelnitskaya oblast (HM) KhmelnitskyU Kievskaya oblast (KO) KievU Kiev (KV)V Kirovogradskaya oblast (KI) KirovogradW Lvovskaya oblast (LV) Lvov (Lviv)X Zhitomirskaya oblast (ZH) ZhitomirY Chernovitskaya oblast (CN) ChernovtsyZ Nikolaevskaya oblast (NI) Nikolaev __________________________________________________ ________________________ Azerbaijan 4J. 4K. ====================4J, 4K1, 0 For special event licenses and foreign amateurs.Suffixes AWA - ZZZ Club station AAA - ZVZ 2, 3 Category AA - ZZ 1 Category A - Z Extra licenses4J2, 4K2 Nakhichevan'4J4-9, 4K4-9 Baku city4J3, 4K3 Azerbaijan territories excluding Baku and Nakhichevan' __________________________________________________ ________________________ Georgia 4L. ==============4L1, 4L4, 4L6, 4L7, 4L0 ordinary licenses2, 3, 5, 8, 9 In reserveOne-letter suffiz Extra licenses

PAMNO (N2EY) wrote in message ...
In article , (Steve
Robeson K4YZ) writes:

KH2D, who has *been there* says differently. See his posts on the subject.

I read it.

He refered to "CBers" with Amateur licenses. He did not specify that
ther
were licenses obtained from VE exams held at foreign hamfests. Sounded to me
like "locals"...

Unless I'm mistaken, only an Extra can be a VE that gives Extra exams. So you
have a chicken-and-egg scenario about how such a setup could get started.

There's nothing "chicken and egg" about it. We were discussing
off shore US Amateur Radio exams. Jim chimed in about "CBer's with
Extra licenses" on Guam, but not a word about them being FOREIGNERS,
which is what I was addressing.

Neither you, the other Jim nor Hans have provided a single bit of
evidence that the tests administered OFF SHORE (in my definition
meaning not conducted under the US flag, regardless if on US soil, an
embassy or US military installation) has been done so inappropriately.

And I said that if he didn't get the desired results, he should push
it with DoJ.

And they would do what? It's an offense committed outside US territory and US
jurisdiction, unless it's at an embassy or similar place.

It would, hopefully, get the licenses of the offenders revoked
thereby depriving them of the basic premise for them BEING a VE, Jim.

No US tickee no US testee. OK G.I.?

Yet we HAVE had more than a small number of VE test session right here
in
the US that WERE just that (license for sale). I am sure there have been
cases
of fines, but in most cases, revocation of of licensure for both "licensee"
and
"examiner" was the only penalty enforced.

And a US citizen cannot use a foreign amateur license in the USA. So the
penalty is much tougher on them.

That's not the point.

Sure it is.

No, it's not.

The whole thread was initiated by Hans' lamentation over US
exams being conducted overseas. US licenses being used by
foreigners...Not foreign licenses being used by Americans.

You brought up how to enforce regulations on foreign Amateurs who may
allow some misconduct in the performance of a VE session.

And the answer is...

Determine wrongdoing (if any) by that Amateur and revoke his/her
license.

No US tickee, no US testee. OK, G.I.?

No where did I say ANYthing about using a foreign license in the United
States.

What I DID say was that in VE session right here at home, conducted
by
Americans, the "most" penalties usually enforced are license revocation of
both
the licensee and the "examiner".

Are you suggesting any GREATER penalty on a foreigner who commits the
same
crime?

Do you dispute this fact?

Cool down and think about the main point:

I'm perfectly cool, Jim.

I'm wondering how YOU are going from Hans' lamentations over US
tests being conducted overseas to this being a discussion about
Americans being able to use foreign licenses here.

THAT was specifically codified in Part 97 as a no-no. No debate.
Against the rules. Period.

Besides the fact that it's just plain wrong, hams who live in US territory have
two reasons not to cheat as VEs:

1) If they're caught, they could face fines and even jail time

Uh huh...And how many VE's caught cheating have so far FACED jail
time,

2) If they're caught, they could lose their FCC licenses, which means no ham
radio on US territory, and maybe none at all. Ever.

American licensees HAVE lost their licenses for cheating. So far
just

A nonresident alien with both a foreeign and US license doesn't face the same
possible consequences.

A non-resident alien DOES face the same consequences as US
Amateurs...Revocation of licensure....Just like the others who HAVE
lost their tickets, Jim.

OK...then send a copy of the document to me and I'd be glad to sign on
as
a
co-sponsor. But right now there's not much to argue with since what's
going
on
appears to be legal and there's no other legal precedent for the FCC to say
"No, We won't accept license applications from non-resident foreign
nationals".

Don't need a precedent.

Sure you do.

Why would the government revoke ANY privilege unless there was some
misconduct or abuse of that privilege?

Because they think it's not a good thing for the ARS, or for radio in general.
Look at the multiple choice code tests - they were eliminated as part of the
2000 restructuring after many years of use - because hams complained that they
weren't doing the job.

Stop.

Go back and read what I said previously and what YOU just wrote,
Jim.

Your own example examplifies MY point, Jim...there were
COMPLAINTS. The Federal Government did not spontaneously decide to
remove the test format.

Allow me to reiterate uncase your scrollback isn't working:

But right now there's not much to argue with since what's
going
on
appears to be legal and there's no other legal precedent for the FCC to say
"No, We won't accept license applications from non-resident foreign
nationals".

Don't need a precedent.

Sure you do.

Why would the government revoke ANY privilege unless there was some
misconduct or abuse of that privilege?

"Why would the government revoke ANY privilege unless there was
some misconduct or abuse of that privilege".

While you can argue the choice of words "misconduct" or "abuse"
when applied to the multiple choice format, Jim, there as certainly no
move afooot by the FCC to change it until there was a precedent
(complaints) from the field to do so.

If you force THAT issue, then "they" can adequately argue that there are
even far greater abuses right here at home and the whole program goes out the
window!

So?

Proof of discrimination, Jim.

To act against them where no evidence of misconduct exists is
discrimination.

Why? If it's someone "new", they will have never known any other
way...and
I specifically stated that all those already licensed would not be forced to
make any changes.

Because the new folks would be subject to conditions that the existing hams
didn't face.

Amateurs getting licnesed today do not face the same conditions
you and I faced 20-30 years ago, Jim.

New licensees would not face any revocation of service they
previously enjoyed. Old licensees would keep their old calls.

Big deal.

The FCC continues to offer the different "Group" callsigns, but if the
licensee wants a call other than what was issued, they pony up the
change...No
more "sequential" calls other than the 2x3 they were issued.

hooboy

Why? Do you walk up to Burger King and just take the food?

Fee-for-service is the way of the future if we continue to enact tax
cuts.

How much service is required to issue a sequential callsign?

Enough that the FCC has, on several occassions, demanded to know
why a particular licensee made several license changes within specific
time frames.

If it was no big deal, why would they fuss?

As a matter of fact...I often wonder why they fuss over frequent
Vanity changes...It's the one thing they ARE getting paid for, and the
fee charged far exceeds the expected outlay of materials and manpower
to accomplish.

If some idiot has more money than common sense and wants to
change his call every three months...let him. He paid for it.

And no one looking for a 2-land call would wind up working someone in
PA!

Is that *really* such a problem? Many of the rarest states are in call
districts that contain a lot of states, so even if that rule were reenacted the
hunt is only slightly reduced.

Jim...have you worked so many that you forgot this one basic
premise of award hunting? Until it's worked and confirmed, they are
ALL "rare"...! ! !

How about we make it even easier: Carve up the callsign blocks into
state-specific ones so you could tell which exact state someone was in just
from the call. For example, in the 3rd call district, all calls with an M, R or
Y in the suffix could be restricted to Maryland only, all calls with D, E or L
could be restricted to Delaware, and all the rest would go to PA. (Adjust as
needed for population variation) So you could just look at a callsign and know
which state the ham was in.

Been nipping the cooking sherry a bit, have we, Jim...???

"dadididadit didididadah" takes about 1 second extra at 20WPM. Big
deal.

It is when you do it a couple thousand times in a weekend.

Then how do you account for guys with "longer" calls that manage
to do pretty well in the contests, Jim?

Would I have to pay the fee to get a 3 land call?

What did I say?

What if all the 3-land 1x2s are gone?

Ominus Feces Occurum. There'd be 3-laders living in FL and other places
force to give up their "out-of-dictrict" calls too.

Right. Somebody who's been a ham for 60+ years and held the same call, then
moved to SFL 15 years ago would have to give it up or sign portable. Thanks a
lot.

Oh well...How many "desireable" 3 calls are in FL, Jim?

The actual cost of the licensing program would go down since the FCC
would
no longer be issuing tons of "sequential" callsigns gratis, and fees
collected
would go up since you couldn't get any other format of call without ponying
up
the change to do so.

Issuing sequentials costs almost nothing because the computer simply spits
them
out automatically.

Still costs time to attend the computer, input the data, and pay for the
actual forms and postage.

No more time than the basic modification. Which are free anyway.

"Free" to you. It still costs the FCC per-item processed.

How's this for example: "Where a change of address is requested and no
other change of callsign would be required due to location within the same
call
district, attaching a copy of the letter of notification sent to the
Commission
to the original station records shall be considered adequate. A change of
address on the original license document will be reflected upon the next
routine renewal or paid license transaction."

No good. FCC is supposed to know how to contact licensees. That's why they need
some sort of current address.

I didn't say "don't send it in", Jim.

I said attach a copy to your original station documents. You'd
still send it in, and the FCC could update their records. They just
wouldn't necessarily sned out a new document with each and every
modification.

They can find your transmitter by DF ing, but to send you a letter they need an
address. Or at least a PO box.

Uh huh. And what I proposed changed...what...???

and the fees would go up
since they were no longer issuing (save for the initial call) gratis
licenses.
And the FCC would be getting paid to process what extra paperwork they DID
receive.

But do vanity fees go to FCC or to the general fund?

Again, Jim, you're the one suggesting changes...

I'm pointing out that your proposed changes would increase admin work that
serves "no regulatory purpose". Making my search for WAS easier isn't FCC's
job.

No, it's not. But under your system, it no longer matters where
the licensee is. So let's stop issuing a "6" call to Californians and
"0" to Minnesotans, 4 to Tennesseeans, etc...Just start at KC1AAA (or
wherever they are in the current sequential system) and keep on going
until they get to WZ1ZZZ. Then start with KD2AAA and go to WZ2ZZZ,
etc etc etc until we get to WZ0ZZZ, regardless of whether they are in
Bangor Maine or Irvine, California. It doesn't matter, right...???

73

Steve, K4YZ

In article . net, "KØHB"
writes:

One of those petitions asked that they
allow amateurs to retain their calls when moving because many hams had
become 'connected' to their call signs, almost as a 'name', and did not
wish to surrender the call when moving. Finding no regulatory,
enforcement, nor "good operating practice" reason that a ham shouldn't
keep their callsign, they ruled in favor of the petitioner.

Yep.

There's also another factor: availability of callsigns in the new area.

There was a time, back when the ARS was much smaller, that FCC would try to
give "corresponding" calls when someone moved. W1ICP was W0ICP, for example.
But that became "impractical".

I got N2EY (sequentially issued) when I moved from EPA to WNY in 1977. By the
time I moved back (1979), the FCC was not reissuing "abandoned" 1x2 calls.
Something about their computer system.

What it meant in my case was that if I'd asked for a 3-land call, I could have
gotten a sequentially-issued 3-land 1x2. But N2EY would not have been reissued
to anyone. So there would be one less Extra with a 1x2, and I decided to keep
N2EY.

Did I do the wrong thing?

I guess it's no problem when you are running a full gallon and
have the Internet right there at the operating position, Hans.

Whether I'm running a "full gallon" or 100mW (which is closer to what I
normally run) doesn't make it any easier to devine the source of a CQ.
And what does the internet have to do with it?

If you have internet access in the shack, you could look up a callsign heard
and see what state the ham is in. Not a new idea, though - there used to be
this thing called a "callbook"

73 de Jim, N2EY