"Frank" wrote in message
news:01c3873d$fff5f5d0$0125250a@preimuffyaouanyy.. .
Jack ...

^ CW is an unmodulated transmission ...

^ Radioteletype (RTTY and AFSK) also use unmodulated carriers. On HF
^ bands, most use unmodulated Lower Sideband. As with CW, the receiver
^ reinserts the carrier, causing the AF-shifted beat note.

And CW requires only the transceiver and key while the other data types
require another, often more expensive, piece of hardware.


So am I still correct that the advantages of CW a

- Narrower bandwidth. The bandwidth is effectively even narrower because
overlapping adjacent signals can still be distinguished by the human ear.

- Greater effective range.

- Less equipment than other data types, which also have greater
bandwidth.

- Can be used without a microphone and without a key. Just open the box
and
short a couple of contacts.

Frank


Pretty close. Some of the other digital modes are narrower but as you
state, you need more hardware such as a computer. In addition each of the
other digital modes has its own unique set of advantages and disadvantages
in on air operation.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

Dee D. Flint ...

^ "Frank" news:01c3873d$fff5f5d0$0125250a@preimuffyaouanyy.. .
^ So am I still correct that the advantages of CW a
^ - Narrower bandwidth....
^ - Greater effective range.
^ - Less equipment than other data types, which also
^ have greater bandwidth.
^ - Can be used without a microphone and without a key....

^ Some of the other digital modes are narrower but as you
^ state, you need more hardware such as a computer.

That surprises me.

Frank

"Frank" wrote in message
news:01c3887f$f653d860$0125250a@kqncdrpzwptsjceo.. .
Dee D. Flint ...

^ "Frank" news:01c3873d$fff5f5d0$0125250a@preimuffyaouanyy.. .
^ So am I still correct that the advantages of CW a
^ - Narrower bandwidth....
^ - Greater effective range.
^ - Less equipment than other data types, which also
^ have greater bandwidth.
^ - Can be used without a microphone and without a key....

^ Some of the other digital modes are narrower but as you
^ state, you need more hardware such as a computer.

That surprises me.

Frank


Well PSK31 is narrower than morse code but the problem with it (according to
our local PSK31 guru) is that because it is narrower, it is hard to find the
PSK31 signals unless you know exactly where to look. I.e. just dialing
around, you easily zoom right past them without ever knowing they are there.
For that reason, I believe they have established calling frequencies in each
band so they can find each other. Plus they use some type of software to
scan and show peaks. I'm not into myself but we have several in the local
club who are.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

Dee D. Flint ...

^ Well PSK31 is narrower than morse code but the problem with
^ it ... is that because it is narrower, it is hard to find the
^ PSK31 signals unless you know exactly where to look.

I didn't know that the bandwidth was narrower but I have discovered that the
signals are hard to find. So is RTTY for me; but then I'm new at this.

This thread is in too many groups and I only read one of them so I'm backing
out of the discussion.

Thanks to you and the others who have provided informative replies.

Frank

"Dee D. Flint" wrote in message n
Well PSK31 is narrower than morse code but the problem with it (according to
our local PSK31 guru) is that because it is narrower, it is hard to find the
PSK31 signals unless you know exactly where to look. I.e. just dialing
around, you easily zoom right past them without ever knowing they are there.
For that reason, I believe they have established calling frequencies in each
band so they can find each other. Plus they use some type of software to
scan and show peaks. I'm not into myself but we have several in the local
club who are.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

PSK31 is simple. Almost all the programs have spectrum graphs, or
waterfall displays to show signals within the passband used. Yes, most
PSK is on an established freq, +- . You don't "dial around" for PSK31.
You tune the radio to the set frequency, and the software is used to
"tune". Say 20m, you would tune in 14.070.15 and all the rest is done
in the software. You see a spectrum graph that shows all the signals
in the passband. To receive one, you just click on it. Bingo, it locks
up and starts to receive. The program I use "hamscope" can receive two
at a time in separate windows. Also works rtty, bpsk, etc..Most all
the common PSK freq's are at .070.15 per each ham band. IE:
3.570.15
7.070.15
14.070.15
21.070.15
28.070.15
Maybe be others such as novice PSK, etc .. MK

"Dee D. Flint" wrote in message
.com...


Pretty close. Some of the other digital modes are narrower but as you
state, you need more hardware such as a computer. In addition each of the
other digital modes has its own unique set of advantages and disadvantages
in on air operation.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE


All good reasons to preform morse code voluntarily.

It's just that it no longer needs to be forced down people's throats
*involuntarily*

Clint
KB5ZHT

--

--

Get in touch with your soul: www.glennbeck.com
OR, if you're a liberal, maybe you can FIND one


--

Pretty close. Some of the other digital modes are narrower but as you
state, you need more hardware such as a computer. In addition each of the
other digital modes has its own unique set of advantages and disadvantages
in on air operation.

The biggest disadvantage would be narrowing down the percentage of people on
the other end that would be able to decipher your emergency message.

If you are calling for help, you want as many people on the receiving end of
your transmission to be able to UNDERSTAND your message as possible.

The emergency broadcast system (now the EAS) works on English Voice, NOT with
morse code. And it is designed to be used in an emergency. Same with
police, fire and ambulance radios.

Imagine the president addressing the public with a morse code key. Might as
well talk to a wall.

"Jeff Renkin" wrote in message
...
Pretty close. Some of the other digital modes are narrower but as you
state, you need more hardware such as a computer. In addition each of
the
other digital modes has its own unique set of advantages and
disadvantages
in on air operation.

The biggest disadvantage would be narrowing down the percentage of people
on
the other end that would be able to decipher your emergency message.

If you are calling for help, you want as many people on the receiving end
of
your transmission to be able to UNDERSTAND your message as possible.

The emergency broadcast system (now the EAS) works on English Voice, NOT
with
morse code. And it is designed to be used in an emergency. Same
with
police, fire and ambulance radios.

Imagine the president addressing the public with a morse code key.
Might as
well talk to a wall.



In emergencies hams are NOT broadcasting to the public. They are using
their skills to pass messages from the public and emergency services to the
public and emergency services via the ham network. No has to be able to
understand the message while it is in transit except the hams. Thus hams
can and will use any means at their disposal appropriate to the situation,
that includes voice, computer digital modes and good old Morse code.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

The biggest disadvantage would be narrowing down the percentage of people
on
the other end that would be able to decipher your emergency message.

If you are calling for help, you want as many people on the receiving end
of
your transmission to be able to UNDERSTAND your message as possible.

The emergency broadcast system (now the EAS) works on English Voice, NOT
with
morse code. And it is designed to be used in an emergency. Same
with
police, fire and ambulance radios.

Imagine the president addressing the public with a morse code key.
Might as
well talk to a wall.



In emergencies hams are NOT broadcasting to the public.

In an emergency anyone is broadcasting to ANYONE that is listening. If you
think a ham or anyone else in an emergency is not going to want a non-ham to
help, or will refuse to deal with a non-ham you are crazy.

In an emergency you can even use frequencies and radios at your access that you
would not normally be licensed to operate on. We are talking about
EMERGENCIES here. No time to waste playing morse code or taking the time to
pound out a cry for help one letter at a time in a mode that only ends up
sounding like silly beeps to most of the people listening on the other end that
would otherwise be hearing your cry for help.

Next time you are stranded in your car and need a tow, why don't you call on
your cell phone and punch our your problem in morse code with the touch tone pad
and see how fast you are able to get any assistance. Your call for assistance
will be taken as a prank phone call and they will hang up on you and you will
remain stranded until you decide to talk into the microphone so that someone can
hear and understand your message.

Common sense folks. You can pretend to say otherwise here on this newsgroup,
but when the real emergency arises, the last thing on your mind will be playing
with morse code! Then see how fast you can use a microphone and your voice!

They are using
their skills to pass messages from the public and emergency services to the
public and emergency services via the ham network. No has to be able to
understand the message while it is in transit except the hams.

MOST hams don't understand morse code either! The no-code tech class has
outnumbered the other license classes for years, and those that did learn the
code only did so to pass the test and many never used it after the test. (like
myself and all my ham friends)

Send code to us and it will be nothing more than beep beep beep beep. I
remember SOS and the letter R for some reason (probably since most repeaters end
with R on their id) but that won't tell me where you are or what the problem
is. Unless you talk to us, you can consider yourself dead in an emergency.

Thus hams
can and will use any means at their disposal appropriate to the situation,
that includes voice,

It sure does.

Jeff Renkin wrote in message
In emergencies hams are NOT broadcasting to the public.

In an emergency anyone is broadcasting to ANYONE that is listening. If you
think a ham or anyone else in an emergency is not going to want a non-ham to
help, or will refuse to deal with a non-ham you are crazy.

If I'm on a ham band calling for help, I don't expect non hams to be
listening.
If there are, well, so much the better, but I would never *expect* any
to be listening. If I get on a ham band, I'm transmitting to other
hams, and other hams only. If I want a non ham, I would get on my cell
phone or yell real loud.


In an emergency you can even use frequencies and radios at your access that you
would not normally be licensed to operate on. We are talking about
EMERGENCIES here. No time to waste playing morse code or taking the time to
pound out a cry for help one letter at a time in a mode that only ends up
sounding like silly beeps to most of the people listening on the other end that
would otherwise be hearing your cry for help.

B.S. Most hams on the HF bands know code well enough to get a simple
message through.
I've actually dealt with a marine emergency on the radio. Have you?
Wanna know how the boat got our attention though all the noise on 40m?
CW. They were too weak to get through on fone until we actually knew
they were there. After they got our attention, yes, we went to phone.
Mainly because the coast guard station in Miami was on phone.


Next time you are stranded in your car and need a tow, why don't you call on
your cell phone and punch our your problem in morse code with the touch tone pad
and see how fast you are able to get any assistance. Your call for assistance
will be taken as a prank phone call and they will hang up on you and you will
remain stranded until you decide to talk into the microphone so that someone can
hear and understand your message.

Yea right....Any other goofy "no one in their right mind" scenarios
you want to dream up?

Common sense folks. You can pretend to say otherwise here on this newsgroup,
but when the real emergency arises, the last thing on your mind will be playing
with morse code! Then see how fast you can use a microphone and your voice!

Speed is not usually an issue. Solid copy is more important. Sure, I
would try to use phone if possible. But if not, I can get the job done
on CW. Can you? I guess they would die. Too bad....Another day ,
another $2.34 ...


They are using
their skills to pass messages from the public and emergency services to the
public and emergency services via the ham network. No has to be able to
understand the message while it is in transit except the hams.

This is true.

MOST hams don't understand morse code either! The no-code tech class has
outnumbered the other license classes for years, and those that did learn the
code only did so to pass the test and many never used it after the test. (like
myself and all my ham friends)

"Most" hams on HF do though. At least well enough to tell someone is
trying to call them. Myself, I know code fast enough to keep up with
just about anyone. They can send 50 wpm, and I'll still copy just
fine. I can send or receive a message using CW just about as fast as
voice. To me, CW is almost voice. Just really monotone...

Send code to us and it will be nothing more than beep beep beep beep. I
remember SOS and the letter R for some reason (probably since most repeaters end
with R on their id) but that won't tell me where you are or what the problem
is.

That is a personal problem that shouldn't be confused this with "us".
I wouldn't be so fast to speak for all of hamdom. All of us semi-old
farts ain't dead yet.

Unless you talk to us, you can consider yourself dead in an
emergency.

Not me. I'd fix his ass up right fast. He can use any freaking mode he
wants.
I'm not particular. CW, RTTY, PSK, SSB, AM, FM, hell, I don't
care...Whatever works on their end.

Thus hams
can and will use any means at their disposal appropriate to the situation,
that includes voice,

It sure does.

It sure does. BTW, I could care less about the code or no-code debate.
This is just addressing overall sillyness in thinking. MK