ve3... wrote:
I have heard from a usually reliable source ( he usually pays for my
coffee) that new computers, television sets, cellphones and cable
boxes are fitted with audio devices that can listen to what is said in
the area and transmit the audio to a monitoring center. Certainly the
Onstar has this potential and so do cellphones. The source says that
there is a little subassembly on the mainboard as they have not yet
integrated the listening device in the mainboard of a computer.
Supposedly you can disconnect this device to ensure privacy. It is
supposedly required by Homeland security so they can listen in to
terrorists etc, but it responds to key words a la Eschalon to determine
public trends. All my equipment is too old to have such a thing and I
wonder if anyone has heard of this or is it just an urban myth. I think
my 8-track is safe. My first reaction is to think that the audio would
be too muffled and echoed to be of much use. I know that someone ( I
think Sony) has developed a picture tube that will produce a picture
and transmit the room image at the same time. There can only be one
purpose for this device.



First, it's ECHELON.

BTW, if you look up both ECHELON and CARNIVORE, there's some great
information there.

Second, the On-Star device may, indeed listen in to the interior of
the vehicle. It's not something that's left to the discretion of the
On-Star operator, and requires an instrument of authority to activate,
although, like nearly everything abuses are possible. Activating the
On-Star system, though, does alert the driver that the system is listening.


Third, authority can, indeed listen to cellphones, intercept e-mail,
VoIP conversations, and audio/video chats. That's just the way it is,
today. And there are some trojans that have been released into the wild
that activate webcams and microphones without the users's knowledge or
consent.

That said, there are no daughterboards being installed in CPU's,
television sets, radio that listen to, monitor and rebroadcast your
activities.

Cable boxes, are something different. Cable boxes have, for a very
long time, reported back to the cable company what you watch, when you
watch it, and with the new generation of cable boxes containing DVRs,
they now report what you record, when you play it back; when, if, and
how often you pause and replay live TV, and the content you replay. And
with ratings services now using the so called people meters to ehance
accuracy of the surveys, they also can keep track of the number of
people in the room during any activity.

But to date, there is no listening device in the cable box.

Though, given the cable company's broad discretion to gather, use and
abuse personal information, I'm not going to say that this is to be
ruled out entirely.

So, you may upgrade your audio gear, your TV and your entertainment
electronics in comfort--step into the 90's, as you will--secure in the
knowledge, that, at least for now, you may speak your mind in your own
home without fear of repercussion.

But I would be very careful about doing so with someone else in the
room. The times, they are a-changing.

D Peter Maus wrote:
ve3... wrote:
I have heard from a usually reliable source ( he usually pays for my
coffee) that new computers, television sets, cellphones and cable
boxes are fitted with audio devices that can listen to what is said in
the area and transmit the audio to a monitoring center



First, it's ECHELON.

BTW, if you look up both ECHELON and CARNIVORE, there's some great
information there.....

So, you may upgrade your audio gear, your TV and your entertainment
electronics in comfort--step into the 90's, as you will--secure in the
knowledge, that, at least for now, you may speak your mind in your own
home without fear of repercussion.

But I would be very careful about doing so with someone else in the
room. The times, they are a-changing.
'''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' ''''
Thanks for the response. Maybe it's just the shape of things to come.
I think I feel better about upgrading. I will get that casette outfit
and get rid of the KT66's.

www.devilfinder.com
google developes eavesdropping software

I had to scratch me arse fifty times before I halfway reckymembered it.
cuhulin

Not only do we worry about these organizations "listening", but your
employer is most certainly tracking what you are doing - to the point
of firing people -- or making their life a living hell -- if the person
happens to look at publilc information websites that contain
detrimental information about certain employees. It's happened where I
work. And the company for which I am employed now has a "big brother
system" that not only blocks the websites the company deems bad -- but
also reports who has been to those websites and when and how many
times. This includes, where I work, almost all media outlets and
publishing houses. Never mind that I am in charge of ordering
published materials for the company.

But worse than that is the ability of people in this kind of user group
to track who you are and what you stand for. That's come back to bite
me twice in groups that I no longer participate in. If the user group
can access and negatively use this information -- I shudder to think
what the government or other interested parties can do. !!!

D Peter Maus wrote:
ve3... wrote:
I have heard from a usually reliable source ( he usually pays for my
coffee) that new computers, television sets, cellphones and cable
boxes are fitted with audio devices that can listen to what is said in
the area and transmit the audio to a monitoring center. Certainly the
Onstar has this potential and so do cellphones. The source says that
there is a little subassembly on the mainboard as they have not yet
integrated the listening device in the mainboard of a computer.
Supposedly you can disconnect this device to ensure privacy. It is
supposedly required by Homeland security so they can listen in to
terrorists etc, but it responds to key words a la Eschalon to determine
public trends. All my equipment is too old to have such a thing and I
wonder if anyone has heard of this or is it just an urban myth. I think
my 8-track is safe. My first reaction is to think that the audio would
be too muffled and echoed to be of much use. I know that someone ( I
think Sony) has developed a picture tube that will produce a picture
and transmit the room image at the same time. There can only be one
purpose for this device.



First, it's ECHELON.

BTW, if you look up both ECHELON and CARNIVORE, there's some great
information there.

Second, the On-Star device may, indeed listen in to the interior of
the vehicle. It's not something that's left to the discretion of the
On-Star operator, and requires an instrument of authority to activate,
although, like nearly everything abuses are possible. Activating the
On-Star system, though, does alert the driver that the system is listening.


Third, authority can, indeed listen to cellphones, intercept e-mail,
VoIP conversations, and audio/video chats. That's just the way it is,
today. And there are some trojans that have been released into the wild
that activate webcams and microphones without the users's knowledge or
consent.

That said, there are no daughterboards being installed in CPU's,
television sets, radio that listen to, monitor and rebroadcast your
activities.

Cable boxes, are something different. Cable boxes have, for a very
long time, reported back to the cable company what you watch, when you
watch it, and with the new generation of cable boxes containing DVRs,
they now report what you record, when you play it back; when, if, and
how often you pause and replay live TV, and the content you replay. And
with ratings services now using the so called people meters to ehance
accuracy of the surveys, they also can keep track of the number of
people in the room during any activity.

But to date, there is no listening device in the cable box.

Though, given the cable company's broad discretion to gather, use and
abuse personal information, I'm not going to say that this is to be
ruled out entirely.

So, you may upgrade your audio gear, your TV and your entertainment
electronics in comfort--step into the 90's, as you will--secure in the
knowledge, that, at least for now, you may speak your mind in your own
home without fear of repercussion.

But I would be very careful about doing so with someone else in the
room. The times, they are a-changing.

Not only do we worry about these organizations "listening", but your
employer is most certainly tracking what you are doing - to the point
of firing people -- or making their life a living hell -- if the person
happens to look at publilc information websites that contain
detrimental information about certain employees. It's happened where I
work. And the company for which I am employed now has a "big brother
system" that not only blocks the websites the company deems bad -- but
also reports who has been to those websites and when and how many
times. This includes, where I work, almost all media outlets and
publishing houses. Never mind that I am in charge of ordering
published materials for the company.

But worse than that is the ability of people in this kind of user group
to track who you are and what you stand for. That's come back to bite
me twice in groups that I no longer participate in. If the user group
can access and negatively use this information -- I shudder to think
what the government or other interested parties can do. !!!

D Peter Maus wrote:
ve3... wrote:
I have heard from a usually reliable source ( he usually pays for my
coffee) that new computers, television sets, cellphones and cable
boxes are fitted with audio devices that can listen to what is said in
the area and transmit the audio to a monitoring center. Certainly the
Onstar has this potential and so do cellphones. The source says that
there is a little subassembly on the mainboard as they have not yet
integrated the listening device in the mainboard of a computer.
Supposedly you can disconnect this device to ensure privacy. It is
supposedly required by Homeland security so they can listen in to
terrorists etc, but it responds to key words a la Eschalon to determine
public trends. All my equipment is too old to have such a thing and I
wonder if anyone has heard of this or is it just an urban myth. I think
my 8-track is safe. My first reaction is to think that the audio would
be too muffled and echoed to be of much use. I know that someone ( I
think Sony) has developed a picture tube that will produce a picture
and transmit the room image at the same time. There can only be one
purpose for this device.



First, it's ECHELON.

BTW, if you look up both ECHELON and CARNIVORE, there's some great
information there.

Second, the On-Star device may, indeed listen in to the interior of
the vehicle. It's not something that's left to the discretion of the
On-Star operator, and requires an instrument of authority to activate,
although, like nearly everything abuses are possible. Activating the
On-Star system, though, does alert the driver that the system is listening.


Third, authority can, indeed listen to cellphones, intercept e-mail,
VoIP conversations, and audio/video chats. That's just the way it is,
today. And there are some trojans that have been released into the wild
that activate webcams and microphones without the users's knowledge or
consent.

That said, there are no daughterboards being installed in CPU's,
television sets, radio that listen to, monitor and rebroadcast your
activities.

Cable boxes, are something different. Cable boxes have, for a very
long time, reported back to the cable company what you watch, when you
watch it, and with the new generation of cable boxes containing DVRs,
they now report what you record, when you play it back; when, if, and
how often you pause and replay live TV, and the content you replay. And
with ratings services now using the so called people meters to ehance
accuracy of the surveys, they also can keep track of the number of
people in the room during any activity.

But to date, there is no listening device in the cable box.

Though, given the cable company's broad discretion to gather, use and
abuse personal information, I'm not going to say that this is to be
ruled out entirely.

So, you may upgrade your audio gear, your TV and your entertainment
electronics in comfort--step into the 90's, as you will--secure in the
knowledge, that, at least for now, you may speak your mind in your own
home without fear of repercussion.

But I would be very careful about doing so with someone else in the
room. The times, they are a-changing.

Let them spy on me,if they want to see me lounging on my couch butt
naked,,,, let them spy.
cuhulin

wrote:
Not only do we worry about these organizations "listening", but your
employer is most certainly tracking what you are doing - to the point
of firing people -- or making their life a living hell -- if the person
happens to look at publilc information websites that contain
detrimental information about certain employees. It's happened where I
work. And the company for which I am employed now has a "big brother
system" that not only blocks the websites the company deems bad -- but
also reports who has been to those websites and when and how many
times. This includes, where I work, almost all media outlets and
publishing houses. Never mind that I am in charge of ordering
published materials for the company.

But worse than that is the ability of people in this kind of user group
to track who you are and what you stand for. That's come back to bite
me twice in groups that I no longer participate in. If the user group
can access and negatively use this information -- I shudder to think
what the government or other interested parties can do. !!!




Well, now that you brought THAT up. Most HR departments have access
to a number of databases that serve up gathered, and collated,
digestible information about employees under their purview, as well as
candidates for employment. These databases include things like education
histories, employment histories, legal troubles, property ownership and
all the usual employee interest. But they also include things like
internet activities, blogging content, USENet posts, groups belonged to.

What really surprised me--and this goes back a few years, to when I
was at CBS--was when a colleague threw a couple of huge parties during
the summer months, and one day got called in for a little private face
time with not only the GM, but an HR rep and a couple of men in suits,
to discuss his significant purchases of alcohol. We all knew he was a
professional drinker, but we were kind of stunned that his place of
employment could present documents about his alcohol purchase history.

In the end, it was a small matter, with some long shadows. Several of
the staff had been at the parties, and had confirmed his assertion that
the booze was for large group entertainment gatherings. But we all
looked over our shoulders after that.

I was dating the HR manager for one of the newspapers at the time,
and she showed me how she could access the databases that the Company
had used to acquire this information. It was all there. Collated
according to credit card purchases, by date, location, content, and
amount...with remarks on some that included things like names engraved
on jewelry, and the names of his cats and other such trivia. Even the
time of the purchase. All of this information was linked to his Jewel
Preferred Club Card.

All you need to do to access these databases, is to subscribe. It's
not cheap, but you don't need any particular credentials to subscribe.

This information is being gathered and collated about all of us every
day. This is information that the government is precluded by the
Constitution from gathering, on its own. However, BUSINESS, is not so
encumbered. And once the information is gathered, all it takes is a
court order, or a warrant for government to access it. With some
companies, as we've read recently, releasing these data upon request, or
even volunteering it.

So, the Era of Big Brother is upon us, and has been for a while, now.

The concerns of the OP are valid. Someone IS listening. Not through
your television, radio, or cassette player, but through credit cards,
webcams and microphones, telephones, e-mail, and as Wal-Mart has
demonstrated, even cash transactions.

That someone is listening is alone something to be concerned about.
But it's who has access to what is being listened to that has me
concerned. Because, unlike some countries where such information is
highly protected, there are no such protections here.

And once you're on the grid, your life can be opened for public
scrutiny by anyone with a motive. Anyone with a grudge. Anyone.

For most of us, no one will care what we do. For the unlucky, however....

And don't think your life is so boring as to not be attracting
attention. It's not what YOU think is important, it's what SOMEONE ELSE
thinks is useful that matters.

Vigilance.

What do you mean by viligilance?? Are you recommending that is the
course of action to take??

Well, thanks for the encouraging words. So then, in conclusio, one
just has to be paranoid?? I have friends that work in HR. That, in
and of itself, is scary enough -- but if Wal-Mart is tracking my
purchases, then we are all in trouble. Another interesting point with
all of this: The records of professional organizations one belongs to,
of course, is easily accessed by the public. But what of medical
issues.?? Can those be tracked as well. I suppose if one got a hold
of my master card -- you could pretty well determine any treatments I
was undergoing -- Now for a run of the mill cold -- that's not such a
big deal. But for a disability?? Then your employer can dismiss you.
Of course, they will hide the reason in "reduction in force" and trust
me - the
DRS agrees with me on this one. What about some awful dreaded disease
like aids?? That, too, can then be tracked. But shouldn't there be
some things that are personal and not available to big brother?? We do
after all sign a privacy act document whenever you are treated by a
medical professional. Wonder how that applies to Public Aid? I would
guess all of those records are easily accessable?? I work with a lot
of clients on public aid -- with all sorts of issues. I never actually
thought that through. And I wonder about unemployment. If you file
for that, can employers or others get those records too? Then I wonder
what about charities or churches -- could they access this kind of
background information and then deny you membership?? Gosh, this is
just enough to make me never want to leave my home again -- but then I
would have to rely on charging groceries and other more personal bills
and then we're right back where we started - aren't we. Oh, and what
about books you buy at AMAZON or check out of the library?

OK. I'll stop now -- it's starting to sound like Morgan Freedman in
S7V7N.
D Peter Maus wrote:
wrote:
Not only do we worry about these organizations "listening", but your
employer is most certainly tracking what you are doing - to the point
of firing people -- or making their life a living hell -- if the person
happens to look at publilc information websites that contain
detrimental information about certain employees. It's happened where I
work. And the company for which I am employed now has a "big brother
system" that not only blocks the websites the company deems bad -- but
also reports who has been to those websites and when and how many
times. This includes, where I work, almost all media outlets and
publishing houses. Never mind that I am in charge of ordering
published materials for the company.

But worse than that is the ability of people in this kind of user group
to track who you are and what you stand for. That's come back to bite
me twice in groups that I no longer participate in. If the user group
can access and negatively use this information -- I shudder to think
what the government or other interested parties can do. !!!




Well, now that you brought THAT up. Most HR departments have access
to a number of databases that serve up gathered, and collated,
digestible information about employees under their purview, as well as
candidates for employment. These databases include things like education
histories, employment histories, legal troubles, property ownership and
all the usual employee interest. But they also include things like
internet activities, blogging content, USENet posts, groups belonged to.

What really surprised me--and this goes back a few years, to when I
was at CBS--was when a colleague threw a couple of huge parties during
the summer months, and one day got called in for a little private face
time with not only the GM, but an HR rep and a couple of men in suits,
to discuss his significant purchases of alcohol. We all knew he was a
professional drinker, but we were kind of stunned that his place of
employment could present documents about his alcohol purchase history.

In the end, it was a small matter, with some long shadows. Several of
the staff had been at the parties, and had confirmed his assertion that
the booze was for large group entertainment gatherings. But we all
looked over our shoulders after that.

I was dating the HR manager for one of the newspapers at the time,
and she showed me how she could access the databases that the Company
had used to acquire this information. It was all there. Collated
according to credit card purchases, by date, location, content, and
amount...with remarks on some that included things like names engraved
on jewelry, and the names of his cats and other such trivia. Even the
time of the purchase. All of this information was linked to his Jewel
Preferred Club Card.

All you need to do to access these databases, is to subscribe. It's
not cheap, but you don't need any particular credentials to subscribe.

This information is being gathered and collated about all of us every
day. This is information that the government is precluded by the
Constitution from gathering, on its own. However, BUSINESS, is not so
encumbered. And once the information is gathered, all it takes is a
court order, or a warrant for government to access it. With some
companies, as we've read recently, releasing these data upon request, or
even volunteering it.

So, the Era of Big Brother is upon us, and has been for a while, now.

The concerns of the OP are valid. Someone IS listening. Not through
your television, radio, or cassette player, but through credit cards,
webcams and microphones, telephones, e-mail, and as Wal-Mart has
demonstrated, even cash transactions.

That someone is listening is alone something to be concerned about.
But it's who has access to what is being listened to that has me
concerned. Because, unlike some countries where such information is
highly protected, there are no such protections here.

And once you're on the grid, your life can be opened for public
scrutiny by anyone with a motive. Anyone with a grudge. Anyone.

For most of us, no one will care what we do. For the unlucky, however....

And don't think your life is so boring as to not be attracting
attention. It's not what YOU think is important, it's what SOMEONE ELSE
thinks is useful that matters.

Vigilance.

"ve3..." wrote in message
oups.com...
I have heard from a usually reliable source ( he usually pays for my
coffee) that new computers, television sets, cellphones and cable
boxes are fitted with audio devices that can listen to what is said in
the area and transmit the audio to a monitoring center. Certainly the
Onstar has this potential and so do cellphones. The source says that
there is a little subassembly on the mainboard as they have not yet
integrated the listening device in the mainboard of a computer.
Supposedly you can disconnect this device to ensure privacy. It is
supposedly required by Homeland security so they can listen in to
terrorists etc, but it responds to key words a la Eschalon to determine
public trends. All my equipment is too old to have such a thing and I
wonder if anyone has heard of this or is it just an urban myth. I think
my 8-track is safe. My first reaction is to think that the audio would
be too muffled and echoed to be of much use. I know that someone ( I
think Sony) has developed a picture tube that will produce a picture
and transmit the room image at the same time. There can only be one
purpose for this device.



Worse then "Big Government", Google may be listening to the TV shows in the
background. According to the Kim Komando radio talk show 9/10/06, Google may
be listing to the background audio provided you have an open mic, such as a
web cam mic, to gather personal data on TV viewing habits. The website is
www.komando.com. There is an opinion poll on this issue, but so far I
haven't found a detailed link.