(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

In article ,
John Smith wrote:

In California, you can walk into any Best Buy, Fry's, etc. and ask them
how many PC's and motherboards they sell a day ... then stop by the
apple store on your way home and notice the employees look like the
maytag repairman (the most loneliest guy in town) unless they having a
new "iPhone rip off day."

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

You can, can you? You can ask a major retailer for its sales figures and
they'll just give them to you? Would you mind catching that on video for
us?

And Apple stores are absolutely booming. The one in New York does more
dollars per square foot than Tiffany's for goodness sake.

--
Alan Baker
Vancouver, British Columbia
http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg

(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

In article ,
John Smith wrote:

On 10/16/2011 9:54 PM, Alan Baker wrote:
In ,
John wrote:

On 10/16/2011 1:50 PM, Alan Baker wrote:
In ,
. net wrote:

"Alan wrote in message
...
In ,
John wrote:

On 10/13/2011 12:05 AM, Alan Baker wrote:
In ,
John wrote:

On 10/12/2011 10:47 PM, Alan Baker wrote:
In ,
John wrote:

Hey, I am not the one into social standards!

I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ...
the
PC
can
just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ...

Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example...


Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high
res HD
monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ...
do
the
same with audio ...

You mean, like this:

http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html

And with audio, do you mean like this:

http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/ProFireLightbridge.html

Or this:

http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/Delta1010.html

Or perhaps this:

http://www.motu.com/products/pciaudio/HD192/specs.html


No plug your SDR amateur rig into the USB port of your PC and
start
using it ... notice that there is no software available for
the
MAC
...
linux is covered with an app, etc., etc., etc.

Really? No software at all, huh?

http://www.rfspace.com/RFSPACE/CuteSDR.html


You keep putting words in my mouth, seems like I said a PC can
do
it
better ... that was the part you choose to dispute, not the
faster,
cheaper ... or the fact that PC stays current with uptodate
software/codecs/drivers/hardware/firmware ...

I asked how it did it better and you responded with things that
(apparently) you thought you couldn't do with a Mac.


Got a comparison to this card for the PC:

http://pressroom.nvidia.com/easyir/c...yirid=A0D622CE
9F
5
79F
09
&v
ers
ion=live&releasejsp=release_157&xhtml=true&prid=73 6275

I don't need one.


Good thing too ... as you will have to "not need a lot of things"
when
running a MAC! Superior video is just one of them ... if you play
video
games, you can forget the ones which have no MAC version ...

Regards,
JS

LOL

And now it comes out: what you want "superior video" for is...

...video games!


There are virtually NO applications which are as demanding as video
games on a home PC. Since I contract to develop software, and
compiler/linker speeds are important to me, it is worth considering
and
benchmarking ... however, what am I, one out of 10,000 who runs such
a
demanding commercial app? So, of course video games become the best
universal benchmark -- any child can run them, even if the adults
can't
...

No, actually. Video games are hard on VIDEO performance, John. Almost
all of the processing load they create is handled by the GPU...

...a part which plays essentially no useful role in compiling and
linking software.


However, you are doing the best you can. At this point, your have
realized and woken up to reality, and that the MAC is vastly
inferior
in
comparison to even mid range PC's ... when confronted with this
reality,
and one realizes they have taken a false position, one must switch
over
to personal attacks on their opposite in the argument ... abandoning
any
hope of proving their false positions to be correct.

The Mac is better for normal people, John. They want a machine that
is
easy to use and that doesn't have problems.

Most people don't want to modify their computers with performance
add-ons any more than they want to do the analogous things to their
cars.


It will also help to lock your mind into denial, and think that no
one
here will be smart enough to see what is going on, the desperation
and
desperate tact's you are being forced to take, to believe they will
become obfuscated by the false complexities of your diversions ...
that
they will not notice you switching subjects, points, facts ... etc.

You mean like claiming that video card performance is important to
compiling?


But, I will ... you can make book on that.

Regards,
JS


Your post shows your total lack of knowledge that the GPU processor
can
be utilized to run/assist in the running of demanding apps ... load up
seti software (POINC, actually), a freely available app which has the
capabilities and gives a good demonstration of the advantages ... you
probably aren't such a bad guy, just an ignorant one who needs some
prompting to seek a cure ..

Sorry, but you're now deflecting.

You claimed that a high-powered GPU was useful for "compiling and
linking".

Let's see a cite.

http://www.nvidia.com/object/tesla_c...solutions.html

Where does that mention "compiling and linking" on an individual
personal computer is sped up by a faster GPU?


GPU, the supercomputer of the 21st century.

http://www.popsci.com/science/articl...getting-gpu-up
gr
ade
-making-it-worlds-fastest-supercomputer-again




Gesus ... you don't even have a clue how moronic that question is, do
you? ... but you ask it as if you could understand the answer, obviously
you could not ... better yet would be a real moronic question like, why
is a GPU not a CPU? ... the answer, IT IS and, like heads, two
processors are always better than one! roflol

Regards,
JS

You claimed *YOU* needed a faster GPU in order speed up YOUR compiling
and linking, John...

...and now you're producing link after link that doesn't support that
claim.


Actually, I claimed that software can be made aware of the GPU and
utilize it to speed up the processing power of ANY application, it can,
it has been, and my claims are true.

No. That is most certainly NOT what you claimed, shall I quote you?


I also claimed I use software which uses these methods, and I gave an
example of software which can be obtained, by anyone, to demonstrated
the power of "what happens" when those methods are applied.

You have engaged in a personal attack and attempt to deceptively create
an argument to aid you ... duh! Worse yet, you are betting you will
find morons to assist and support your efforts ... and make me appear
answerable to you -- go abuse your wife ... obviously she must be a
willing subject, I am not, I eat morons like you ...

LOL

--
Alan Baker
Vancouver, British Columbia
http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg

(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

On 10/17/11 11:59 AM, RD Sandman wrote:
. net wrote in
:



"Lloyd E wrote in message
...
On 10/16/11 10:20 PM, Scout wrote:


"Lloyd E wrote in message
...
On 10/16/11 4:16 PM, Howard Brazee wrote:
On Sun, 16 Oct 2011 14:51:55 -0400, "Scout"
wrote:

Quite a few people make a living supplying people with such
systems customized to their specific desires.

Most of my computers have been those. But the local stores that
made my computers have all closed and not been replaced.

True, it's largely moved to mail order since that way you don't
have the
overhead of a store front, or if you do maintain a store front,
it's just to
pick up the occasional sale while you're processing the bulk of
your business through internet orders.

Face to face contact was good at finding out what my needs and
wants really were. Having a clone shop by mail order is as
personalized as having a big name computer by mail order.

I'd have to agree. And honestly, if that mail order clone shop is
cheaper on a per configuration basis, than most of the big names,
I'd be running away from them. It just isn't all that much cheaper
to buy the parts and put them together properly than it is to buy
ready made, UNLESS the shop has really cheap labor or doesn't
factor that in.

No, actually it is cheaper. It doesn't take very long to assemble a
computer, and properly done you easily undercut the names by
selective buying. Because the names don't get the discounts that
arise as the hardware is superseded by newer tech. A computer
they've had sitting in the warehouse for a year is not worth nearly
as much as it was a year ago, but they've already paid the higher
price for the hardware. A local supplier doesn't have this problem
because they have a much quicker supply turnover and thus they don't
lose the value in hardware at nearly the rate as the big players do.
Plus the small supplier can take advantage of price breaks, sales,
discounts, and so on, while the brand guys are limited in their
ability to change the hardware configuration at the drop of a hat.

Having been in the business for many years, I call bull**** on your
little story here.

The big boys buy in such massive quantities that they can buy current
stuff for what the little guy pays for the last cycle of parts. And
then have them built in factories with such cheap labor that any US
builder can't even come close to matching. Labor far, far less than
minimum wage here.

In the end, they sell for less than the little guy that values his
labor at all.

Odd, I've done it and even figuring my labor at $30/hr I could still
provide equal hardware at a lower price, or better hardware at the
same price and tuned to the customers exact requirements rather than
some cookie cutter. Plus I know several people who make a living out
of doing this and oddly enough they seem to be making a pretty decent
living at it.

That depends on the hardware. For example, I'm not in the PC business
anymore but on modems, routers, etc.. a person can go to a Best Buy and
get one for less than the computer shop owner pays for it. Where the
shop owner shines is in custom building. When certain configurations are
built to fill a particular niche for a particular customer. At least
that is how it was....way back when....

Back when, it was that way. Now most of the little mom and pop shops
depend on their service business to make a living as sales at the
current profit margins, aren't where it is at.

And getting a good salesman is tough when they can't make good commissions.


--
Lloyd

(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

In article ,
John Smith wrote:

On 10/16/2011 1:39 PM, Alan Baker wrote:
In ,
John wrote:

On 10/16/2011 8:09 AM, Howard Brazee wrote:
On Sat, 15 Oct 2011 15:44:54 -0400, "Scout"
wrote:

Sorry, they are selling more desktops because of an expanding market,
but
their share in that expanding market is decreasing.

Other arguments in this thread have been claiming a shrinking desktop
market. Which arguments are correct?

Both.

Could you explain how the market for desktop computers can be both
expanding and shrinking?


Most laptops cannot even handle Secondlife!

Cite...


Yours, load it up and give it a spin, it is free ... http://secondlife.com/

Sorry, but that's asking me to do the work of proving your claim.


Minimum system requirements:
http://secondlife.com/support/system-requirements/

Mac OS X requirements:

Mac OS X 10.5: check; Mac OS X 10.6.8 actually

1.5GHz Intel processor: check; 2.4GHz Intel Core 2 Duo actually.

Graphics card: Radeon9200 or above, or NVidia GeForce 2 or 4.

My MacBook Pro: GeForce 8600M GT.

That's only about 10 times faster than the GeForce4 series.


Client/viewer downloads:
http://secondlife.com/support/downloads/ (Mac/Linux versions available here)

Once in world, hang out in Sandbox Island, Sandbox Cordova, or Sandbox
Goguen -- here you will find serious "griefers" to test your hardware
and video to the max ...

When you can manage them, take a trip to the weapons testing sandbox ...
and when you want to die ... go to Rausch!

Be careful, it can become addicting ... because of low system
requirements, this is a good entry level "game" for older/aging computer
users ...

Regards,
JS

--
Alan Baker
Vancouver, British Columbia
http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg

(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

In article ,
John Smith wrote:

When you control only about 4-4.5% of the market....a 13% increase in sales
doesn't really show up as anything significant.

I would suspect the increase is drive by I-Pad sales....not Mac. For all we
know the sale of Macintosh computers has dropped off.

Actually, no. We know that the Mac computers sales have increased and
outgrown the rest of the personal computer market for something like 22
straight quarters.


Still being in a miserable condition after achieving your claims is not
a real achievement ... others opinions may vary ... mac sucks for
industrial/scientific/production uses ... and playing home computer
games ... end of story.

So a computer specifically designed for *PEOPLE* to use allegedly
"sucks" at industrial and production uses, huh? Wow. Quite the
revelation.

Fact: scientists are a big market for Macs.

As for the rest, where people have a reasonable income, Macs sell more
than 10% of all the computers out there.

Just look around here, the mac does fine for newsgroups ...

Does fine in North America, Europe, Australia, etc. too!

--
Alan Baker
Vancouver, British Columbia
http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg

(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

On 10/16/2011 8:01 PM, Scout wrote:


"Alan Baker" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"Scout" wrote:

"Alan Baker" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"Scout" wrote:

"Howard Brazee" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 13 Oct 2011 19:00:47 -0700, John Smith
wrote:

Like I say, outside of academia, I just don't see that many MACs

I don't see what academia use, I don't see what most companies use.
But I do see what people have in coffee houses - and there are
lots of
Macs there.

That's about where you're going to find them since 3/4 of Macs
being sold
are the laptops. The Mac desktop market keeps shrinking.


No, Scout:

THE desktop market keeps shrinking.

Cite?


http://www.etforecasts.com/products/ES_pcww1203.htm

http://srl.gatech.edu/Members/ashah/...is_aditya_abhi
nav.pdf

http://www.inquisitr.com/76157/table...-sales-by-2015
-laptops-will-still-reign/

Sorry, but somehow I don't see little tables (iPad and knockoffs) as
being a adequate replacement for desktop and laptop systems. IOW, people
are buying these new toys rather than upgrading their perfectly adequate
desktop. I suspect this to be merely a phase and as the mobile market is
saturated you will find a sudden drop off in sales.

However, I will agree that at the moment desktop sales are down,
however, looking around I don't see a lot of people trading in their
desktop for a laptop, but rather getting a laptop for use in conjunction
with their desktop.



Like tobacco, alcohol and marijuana (probably coffee too) are referred
to as "gateway drugs", let us hope that the tablets and other toys
become "gateway computers." Introducing all to the true value of
adequate computing machines!

Regards,
JS

(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

On 10/16/2011 8:09 PM, J R wrote:
A Ford will get you anywhere a Rolls Royce/Bentley will, and do it much
better too.
cuhulin


But, web TV won't ... if an apple is like a toy when compared to a
powerful PC ... WEB TV is simply a drawing of a toy ... what it is!

Regards,
JS

(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

Lloyd E Parsons wrote in
:

On 10/17/11 11:59 AM, RD Sandman wrote:
. net wrote in
:



"Lloyd E wrote in message
...
On 10/16/11 10:20 PM, Scout wrote:


"Lloyd E wrote in message
...
On 10/16/11 4:16 PM, Howard Brazee wrote:
On Sun, 16 Oct 2011 14:51:55 -0400, "Scout"
wrote:

Quite a few people make a living supplying people with such
systems customized to their specific desires.

Most of my computers have been those. But the local stores
that made my computers have all closed and not been replaced.

True, it's largely moved to mail order since that way you don't
have the
overhead of a store front, or if you do maintain a store front,
it's just to
pick up the occasional sale while you're processing the bulk of
your business through internet orders.

Face to face contact was good at finding out what my needs and
wants really were. Having a clone shop by mail order is as
personalized as having a big name computer by mail order.

I'd have to agree. And honestly, if that mail order clone shop is
cheaper on a per configuration basis, than most of the big names,
I'd be running away from them. It just isn't all that much
cheaper to buy the parts and put them together properly than it
is to buy ready made, UNLESS the shop has really cheap labor or
doesn't factor that in.

No, actually it is cheaper. It doesn't take very long to assemble
a computer, and properly done you easily undercut the names by
selective buying. Because the names don't get the discounts that
arise as the hardware is superseded by newer tech. A computer
they've had sitting in the warehouse for a year is not worth
nearly as much as it was a year ago, but they've already paid the
higher price for the hardware. A local supplier doesn't have this
problem because they have a much quicker supply turnover and thus
they don't lose the value in hardware at nearly the rate as the
big players do. Plus the small supplier can take advantage of
price breaks, sales, discounts, and so on, while the brand guys
are limited in their ability to change the hardware configuration
at the drop of a hat.

Having been in the business for many years, I call bull**** on your
little story here.

The big boys buy in such massive quantities that they can buy
current stuff for what the little guy pays for the last cycle of
parts. And then have them built in factories with such cheap labor
that any US builder can't even come close to matching. Labor far,
far less than minimum wage here.

In the end, they sell for less than the little guy that values his
labor at all.

Odd, I've done it and even figuring my labor at $30/hr I could still
provide equal hardware at a lower price, or better hardware at the
same price and tuned to the customers exact requirements rather than
some cookie cutter. Plus I know several people who make a living out
of doing this and oddly enough they seem to be making a pretty
decent living at it.

That depends on the hardware. For example, I'm not in the PC
business anymore but on modems, routers, etc.. a person can go to a
Best Buy and get one for less than the computer shop owner pays for
it. Where the shop owner shines is in custom building. When certain
configurations are built to fill a particular niche for a particular
customer. At least that is how it was....way back when....

Back when, it was that way. Now most of the little mom and pop shops
depend on their service business to make a living as sales at the
current profit margins, aren't where it is at.

Yes, it was the same way back when, but that wasn't what was being
discussed was it.

And getting a good salesman is tough when they can't make good
commissions.

Most of the ones that I knew didn't have a separate marketing entity. It
was owner-do-all with maybe a couple of shop people or someone to go on
site.


--
Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman)

Witnessing Republicans and Democrats bickering over
the National Debt is like watching two drunks argue
over a bar bill on the Titanic.....

(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

On Mon, 17 Oct 2011 09:14:27 -0700, John Smith
wrote:

In California, you can walk into any Best Buy, Fry's, etc. and ask them
how many PC's and motherboards they sell a day ... then stop by the
apple store on your way home and notice the employees look like the
maytag repairman (the most loneliest guy in town) unless they having a
new "iPhone rip off day."

For whatever reason, Apple Stores are the most profitable retail
stores per square foot in the country. The ones I've seen have lots
of busy employees.

--
"In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found,
than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace
to the legislature, and not to the executive department."

- James Madison

(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

WebTV can, and does easily access some newsgroups that people using
computers can not access.Lets see you beat that.I am not saying WebTV is
better (oviously it isn't.Consider, WebTV can not get a virus.) than
PCs.
cuhulin