Ok Mark, for sure for DXing a dipole or a windom is not a beam...
From europe in SSB and barefoot (100W in SSB), with my G5RV tight EW I reach
FY, PY, midwest US, VU, 4S, UA9J,C, RA9 artic, central africa. Hard to go
farther bu these days of SSN decreasing.

My objective is Dxing first as for local QSOs this is not a problem to get
S9+.
I know very well that DX performances will be more than limited, all the
more in SSB, but this is a temporary solution waiting for a small beam 3-or
4 ele.

Thierry, ON4SKY


"Mark Keith" wrote in message
om...
"Thierry" http://www.astrosurf.com/lombry wrote in message
...
Hi,

Have you some experience on the air using a Carolina Windom 40m long
compared to a G5RV 31m (100 ft) long...

Yea. I've tried both. They both are sort of lame compared to a normal
coax fed dipole for a given band. I agree with Walt that a dipole is a
dipole as far as pattern for a given band...The difference is how much
power actually makes it to the antenna to be radiated. This is what
separates the mediocre from the better.
If I wanted to work dx, I would use neither of those antennas. But you
don't mention what band you want to work dx...The lower the band, the
better the standard coax fed dipoles in general. But on the other
hand, the lower the band, and the better a good vertical would work
compared to the dipole. :/
Anything can work dx on the higher bands unless the radiation angles
are way too high. If you want all bands with a single wire, I would
use the standard dipole cut for the lowest band, and feed with ladder
line and a good tuner. Or no tuner with the Cecil method...Myself, I
prefer paralleled dipoles fed with a single coax. Don't need a tuner,
and the efficiency is high. The G5RV and the common storebought windom
both have fairly lossy feedline systems for my tastes. And the windom
is prone to common mode problems, etc...I don't like an unbalanced
antenna unless it's a last resort. MK

"Thierry" http://www.astrosurf.com/lombry wrote in message ...
Ok Mark, for sure for DXing a dipole or a windom is not a beam...

I'd rather have the coax fed dipole over the windom any day though...I
bet many people would think it's a beam , the way it will most likely
trounce the average windom.
I tried one "windom" at a field day against a coax fed dipole. The
dipole won by 2 s units in any direction. Thats about what you would
see going from a coax dipole to an average beam...:/ Or by changing
from 100w to 500w-1 KW...



My objective is Dxing first as for local QSOs this is not a problem to get
S9+.

If it's working local, why would it not be working dx ok? Why the
change to an antenna which basically will be the same, assuming
element lengths are fairly close for a given band, barring any changes
in feedline efficiency? IE: I assume you are going to switch from a
G5RV to a windom....
Thinking about either one of those antennas makes me want to take up
golf...
I don't like either one. It's no secret though....
The only thing the G5RV has going for it, is it is nearly a EDZ on
20m. But it's a reduced efficiency version compared to one fed in a
normal manner...
Coax to a choke to ladder line as a feedline is no way to live for a
serious dx'er who wants most of his power to actually be radiated by
the antenna element...The windom is not much better in this
regard....Or at least the ones I've seen.

I know very well that DX performances will be more than limited, all the
more in SSB, but this is a temporary solution waiting for a small beam 3-or
4 ele.

You still don't mention which band/s though... There are fairly simple
wire antennas much better for dx than the usual all band compromise
wire antenna. IE: extended double zepps, phased parallel dipoles, etc,
etc. I would use something along those lines if I wanted to dx say 20m
or up...If you want to dx 80/40, you might consider a bobtail curtain
or variant, or a good vertical. Trying to increase the dx potential by
changing from one semi lame antenna , to another semi lame antenna
strikes me as counterproductive. But, it's your yard and $$$.... :/
MK

"Mark Keith" wrote in message
om...
"Thierry" http://www.astrosurf.com/lombry wrote in message
...
Ok Mark, for sure for DXing a dipole or a windom is not a beam...

I'd rather have the coax fed dipole over the windom any day though...I
Hi,

No. For a true dipole and get a low impedance etc I prefer by far the ladder
line; The coax is easier but is less performing
This is not much difference, but measurable. I always prefered the optimum
solution.

bet many people would think it's a beam , the way it will most likely
trounce the average windom.
I tried one "windom" at a field day against a coax fed dipole. The
dipole won by 2 s units in any direction. Thats about what you would
see going from a coax dipole to an average beam...:/ Or by changing
from 100w to 500w-1 KW...


Ok. I will see but 2 S-unit are much. What is sure is that the radiation
pattern of a carolina windom is next over a dipole :
http://www.astrosurf.com/lombry/Radi...on-pattern.gif
it is much more omnidorectionnal what could explain is overall better
performance.



My objective is Dxing first as for local QSOs this is not a problem to
get
S9+.

If it's working local, why would it not be working dx ok? Why the
change to an antenna which basically will be the same, assuming

Local is not DX. High takeoff angle vs. very low. This is a huge difference
if you check your receive strength signal.

73
Thierry, ON4SKY

element lengths are fairly close for a given band, barring any changes
in feedline efficiency? IE: I assume you are going to switch from a
G5RV to a windom....
Thinking about either one of those antennas makes me want to take up
golf...
I don't like either one. It's no secret though....
The only thing the G5RV has going for it, is it is nearly a EDZ on
20m. But it's a reduced efficiency version compared to one fed in a
normal manner...
Coax to a choke to ladder line as a feedline is no way to live for a
serious dx'er who wants most of his power to actually be radiated by
the antenna element...The windom is not much better in this
regard....Or at least the ones I've seen.

I know very well that DX performances will be more than limited, all the
more in SSB, but this is a temporary solution waiting for a small beam
3-or
4 ele.

You still don't mention which band/s though... There are fairly simple
wire antennas much better for dx than the usual all band compromise
wire antenna. IE: extended double zepps, phased parallel dipoles, etc,
etc. I would use something along those lines if I wanted to dx say 20m
or up...If you want to dx 80/40, you might consider a bobtail curtain
or variant, or a good vertical. Trying to increase the dx potential by
changing from one semi lame antenna , to another semi lame antenna
strikes me as counterproductive. But, it's your yard and $$$.... :/
MK