wrote:



Is it bad to leave a charger hooked up to the battery permanently.
Mine
is a 12/2 with automatic operation.

No. Thats the whole point of the "automatic" charger. The old style
"trickle"
chargers should not be left on past full charge for long periods.
I use a 12/2 automatic, and it's on 24/7. But, same for my 706. It's
usually
on 24/7...I bought it in 2001, and it probably hasn't had a full weeks
rest
since then...When a "12v" battery thats on a charger reaches appx 14.4
volts, it's
fully charged. If you unplug the charger, or if automatic cut off, the
voltage
will drop down to about 13.8v. When it drops much lower than that, the
charger
kicks back on, charges to appx 14.4v, and cuts off...Over and
over..This manner
of charging won't hurt a battery, and can be left on all day if you
want.
A trickle charger reaches 14.4, and keeps charging, but with a lower
current
level. It won't hurt it for short periods of time, but after a while,
the battery
overheats, and thats when you start boiling off electrolyte...How bad
depends on
the charge rate...A 1 amp or less trickle charge is not near as bad as
a 3-5
amp trickle charge to a fully charged battery. But after switching to
automatic,
I could never go back to the old style manual chargers...With those,
sometimes
I would forget to cut them off...And sometimes, I would cut them off,
and forget
to plug back in, and eventually, have a dead battery...Thats worse than
overcharging..
MK

wrote in message
ups.com...
Is it bad to leave a charger hooked up to the battery permanently. Mine
is a 12/2 with automatic operation.


Geeeeez just jump in AND DO SOMETHING!!! Get your feet
wet, you going to spend the rest of your life worrying about what might
happen? Take the proper precautions and get with it. Try to ENJOY the
hobby!!!!!

This is not to say that Optima or Cyclon are bad battteries.
It's to say that ham radio backup is not what they're designed
for. Both will make a really sweet home UPS system, and there
are some obvious advantages to a sealed design, not the least
being satisfying any spousal concerns over damage to "her"
carpet, etc. But you'll get more bang for your buck with a
battery designed to deliver more amp-hours over a longer period.

Ok, so what would you reccomend for a battery that sits indoors (but in a
battery box if need be) and would be on float most of the time, with deep
discharge at say C/10 or C/20-ish rates?

"Dave VanHorn" wrote in message
...

This is not to say that Optima or Cyclon are bad battteries.
It's to say that ham radio backup is not what they're designed
for. Both will make a really sweet home UPS system, and there
are some obvious advantages to a sealed design, not the least
being satisfying any spousal concerns over damage to "her"
carpet, etc. But you'll get more bang for your buck with a
battery designed to deliver more amp-hours over a longer period.

Ok, so what would you reccomend for a battery that sits indoors (but in a
battery box if need be) and would be on float most of the time, with deep
discharge at say C/10 or C/20-ish rates?



A sealed lead acid battery. Like in airplanes.
73
H.

"Jim Higgins" wrote
"Jack Painter" wrote:

"Jim Higgins" wrote

I notice an earlier "expert" recommended against charging sealed
cells indoors. Hogwash! That's exactly one of the reasons
sealed cells like the Cyclons were developed. The other was to
eliminate the high labor expense - not to mention hassle - of
frequent checks and water additions.

I never said I was an "expert", I only described my own safe use of a 12v
deep cell marine battery indoors. But I notice your setup:

I'm sitting here looking at my own setup using a standard auto
starting battery - cheap non-sealed Walmart special

- Does NOT include a sealed battery, many of which are just cheap junk
that
could easily blow up with too much charge, and giving general advice to
someone not knowledgeable about batteries, would be don't charge them
indoors. That stands as good advice until you can demonstrate otherwise,
and
accept the responsibility for accidents resulting from misuse of
batteries
or charging equipment.

Jack Painter
Virginia Beach, Virginia

Jack, you basically don't know enough about what you're talking
about to be giving advice - especially since you now want to play
the safety card. If you're really concerned with safety, then
anecdotal advice based on limited personal experience is NOT the
way to go. I suggest you heed your own advice regarding
accepting responsibility.


OK Jim, I'll accept you were an expert in the battery field, and your advice
is appreciated. How about just quoting some of your
manufacturer-recommendations for safe battery charging? You know, the kind
that are in large, bold print, usually in red ink, in both the battery and
charger instructions? "Cautions" and "Warnings", listing various types of
personal injury, or death, that can result from misuse or failure to follow
instructions. Unfortunately, these warnings don't travel around with used
batteries and used chargers that sit in someone's garage for decades.

Jack Painter
Virginia Beach, Virginia

A sealed lead acid battery. Like in airplanes.

I suspect that having the word "aircraft" on the case will cost me dearly.

What would that equate to in terms of something I might find at battery
masters, or the inexpensive section of batteries plus?

"Dave VanHorn" wrote in message
...


A sealed lead acid battery. Like in airplanes.

I suspect that having the word "aircraft" on the case will cost me dearly.

What would that equate to in terms of something I might find at battery
masters, or the inexpensive section of batteries plus?


I think a car stereo store
But the same technology is available without FAA approval ;^)

Dave VanHorn wrote:

A sealed lead acid battery. Like in airplanes.


I suspect that having the word "aircraft" on the case will cost me dearly.

What would that equate to in terms of something I might find at battery
masters, or the inexpensive section of batteries plus?


I would never use an aircraft battery for anything other than in an
aircraft. For weight savings aircraft everything is made as light as
possible consistent with safety and operation. Light weight and battery
capacity are completely at odds with each other.

Dave WD9BDZ

"David G. Nagel" wrote in message
...
Dave VanHorn wrote:

A sealed lead acid battery. Like in airplanes.


I suspect that having the word "aircraft" on the case will cost me
dearly.

What would that equate to in terms of something I might find at battery
masters, or the inexpensive section of batteries plus?


I would never use an aircraft battery for anything other than in an
aircraft. For weight savings aircraft everything is made as light as
possible consistent with safety and operation. Light weight and battery
capacity are completely at odds with each other.

Dave WD9BDZ

The aircraft sealed lead acids and the ones at the car stereo store are
almost identical.
My point on a sealed battery has to do with hydrogen gas in a closed space.
H.
NQ5H
(And a pilot since '67)

"Jim Higgins" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 27 Jan 2005 22:22:12 -0600, in
, "H. Adam Stevens, NQ5H"
wrote:


"David G. Nagel" wrote in message
...
Dave VanHorn wrote:

A sealed lead acid battery. Like in airplanes.


I suspect that having the word "aircraft" on the case will cost me
dearly.

What would that equate to in terms of something I might find at battery
masters, or the inexpensive section of batteries plus?


I would never use an aircraft battery for anything other than in an
aircraft. For weight savings aircraft everything is made as light as
possible consistent with safety and operation. Light weight and battery
capacity are completely at odds with each other.

Dave WD9BDZ

The aircraft sealed lead acids and the ones at the car stereo store are
almost identical.
My point on a sealed battery has to do with hydrogen gas in a closed
space.
H.
NQ5H
(And a pilot since '67)


Sealed batteries don't produce hydrogen unless heavily
overcharged, and then they produce considerably less than a
flooded battery.

73 de Jim, KB3PU

Precisely.
If you were to store a battery array indoors you wouldn't want hydrogen
venting.
Or would you?
;^)
(Got a match?)

I went to SLA batteries in my Baron because of the greatly reduced
corrosion.
Aerobatic folks like 'em 'cause you can fly inverted without making a mess.

73
H.