On Wed, 01 Jun 2005 01:14:55 -0400, Buck wrote:

On Tue, 31 May 2005 17:52:10 -0400, C. J. Clegg
wrote:


I have an IC-706 mounted on my Honda Gold Wing motorcycle. The
motorcycle has a dealer-installed CB radio with the CB antenna mounted
in back on the left side of the trunk. I have a 7-foot loaded
vertical for 40 meters mounted to the rear crash bar, only about a
foot to a foot and a half from the CB antenna.

My question is, if I transmit on 40 meters SSB at full power
(nominally 100 watts, actually more like about 70 watts or so), am I
likely to damage the front end of the CB radio? Will it matter if the
CB radio is turned on or off?

I could crank the power on the IC-706 back to as little as 10 watts
but it's going to be hard enough to raise any QSOs with the full 100
watts of power.

On the other hand, the motorcycle CB is big bucks to replace and I'd
be just as happy not to damage it...

Thanks...
If the CB is off, you are likely not to have problems. If it is on,
it is possible. I don't know how likely, tho, as the quality of the
front end may make all the difference.

Personally, at 70 watts PEP on a motocycle, I'd be more concerned with
RF damage to the operator than I would be damage to any other
electronics...
Raymond Sirois KU2S
SysOp: The Lost Chord BBS
607-733-5745
telnet://thelostchord.dns2go.com:6000

On Wed, 1 Jun 2005 14:33:26 -0700, "Joel Kolstad"
wrote:



He'd be breaking the letter of the law but -- assuming he dialed the 706 back
to 5W -- not really the intent, IMO. I really can't imagine the FCC pursuing
the issue. True story: I used to live next door to a guy with a linear amp on
his CB, I called up the FCC field office, and they told me there wasn't
anything they could do. Said they had official monitoring stations that, if
they picked up the guy's transmission, they could go after him, but they just
didn't have the resources to pursue complaints from people calling in
violators. And, oh, did I want their free brochure on mitigating interference
to my own electronics?

:-(

I bet a Goldwing CB is also closer to $1k than $150!

---Joel Kolstad


YOu have me on the Goldwing CB price, I wouldn't have a clue about it,
but as for the law, I don't recall where it is, but there are FCC
enforcement records that you can read on the internet at their site,
or someone has them posted. I used to read them regularly. They are
filled with enforcement letters to CBers who are using modified rigs
that are non-type accepted or non-certified. They are often fined
$8000 or more and, if a ham, they are ordered to get rid of the rig,
modify it so it can't operate out of band and then cover it in some
form of epoxy so it can't be re-modified again. Loss of license is a
risk.

It may be that only one in a million gets the FCC ticket, but then the
lotto has much lower odds (1:10s of millions) yet someone hits the
jackpot almost every day. The FCC is getting enough complaints to
start going after truck-drivers so all it takes is for that motorcycle
to be in the enforcement area when the FCC is monitoring.

Each radio has it's own finger-print that the FCC can read. Many
times, they can tell the make and model by the signature before ever
seeing the rig. I would think that the most popular HF mobile rig
ever is recognized by the FCC.

As for the local enforcement officers having permission to enforce the
illegal CBs, I believe I remember that that bill was overturned. I
hope so and am glad if it was. I don't know many police that know the
difference between the CB and Ham radio. My goodness, they can't even
tell the difference between a ham rig and a cell phone even when you
hand them a copy of the law that tells them to leave radio operators
alone.



--
73 for now
Buck
N4PGW

On Thu, 02 Jun 2005 00:54:30 GMT, "TJ" wrote:

The cost of a CB intigrated system radio on a Honda Goldwing is around $900
US and it's made by Panisonic. As for the FCC nabbing a motorcyclist for
operating his amateur radio on CB, well even if they could track him it's
not worth the effort. AKA how many truckers are using a lot more than 5
watts and you don't see many of them being targetted by the FCC. I know
because I used my 706 on 11 meters when my Cobra went up in smoke on me on a
trip to Arizona. And would you believe the state tropper in the Port of
entry scale was more interested in my scanner than anything else. And then
only till he found out I was a licenced amateur, then he wasn't interested
at all. What he told me was that state law had no aurthority to do anything
when it came to radios if I held an amateur radio licence. He said the last
thing they want is the Feds breathing down on him for causing trouble to a
licenced amateur radio operator, regardless if he's from Canada, USA or
Mexico it's the same thing. But now watch yourself in the state of
Washington, the FCC is hot and heavy in this state, I think it has a lot to
do with the military bases on the Pacific Northwest.
I had my 706 on my old GL1200 and it worked like a charm, mind you I didn't
run full power, a motorcyle battery is no where near as hefty as a car or
truck battery and my head is a little too close to the antenna to suite me.

Is it legal? No. Will he get caught? buy a lottery ticket, it may
stand a similar chance of hitting. I can't say what might happen that
he could get caught. People die of strange accidents every day and
crooks get caught even when they have the flawless plan. There is a
risk that he could get caught and the penalty would be in the
thousands of dollars. (or was the OP in canada?) Regardless, I
wouldn't recommend it. Raymond may have the better point... What is
his RF exposure?

I have to admit that this is one of the more benign suggestions for
using a rig out of band. I really suspect CB band is the safest place
to do this, but I really cringe when I hear someone say they want to
modify a rig so they can call the sheriff on his own frequency "in
case of life/death emergency." I read a lot of reports on those
too...








You do know wher the term "hothead" came from.

no, actually, i never looked that one up.

73.....ve7agw




--
73 for now
Buck
N4PGW

On Thu, 02 Jun 2005 03:43:07 GMT, KU2S wrote:

Personally, at 70 watts PEP on a motocycle, I'd be more concerned with
RF damage to the operator than I would be damage to any other
electronics...
Raymond Sirois KU2S

Wouldn't that be closer to 100 w PEP? Icom 706.
--
73 for now
Buck
N4PGW

On Thu, 02 Jun 2005 02:11:44 -0400, Buck wrote:



Each radio has it's own finger-print that the FCC can read. Many
times, they can tell the make and model by the signature before ever
seeing the rig. I would think that the most popular HF mobile rig
ever is recognized by the FCC.

Rig fingerprint? How does that work?

bob
k5qwg

Bob Miller wrote:
Rig fingerprint? How does that work?

The signal emitted by each transmitter possesses
unique identifiable measurable characteristics.
--
73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp

----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups
----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----

In article ,
Buck wrote:

As for the local enforcement officers having permission to enforce the
illegal CBs, I believe I remember that that bill was overturned. I
hope so and am glad if it was. I don't know many police that know the
difference between the CB and Ham radio. My goodness, they can't even
tell the difference between a ham rig and a cell phone even when you
hand them a copy of the law that tells them to leave radio operators
alone.

I checked, and it appears that the bill passed back in 2000. It
amended the Communications Act of 1934, adding subsection (f) to USC
47 chapter 5 subchapter III Part I Section 302a [whew!].

The new subsection allows a state or local government to pass a law
which forbids the use of any CB radio not authorized by the FCC,
and/or the unauthorized use of CB equipment on frequencies between 24
and 35 MHz. In effect, this subsection overrides the general rule
that only the FCC has jurisdiction over radio operation - it grants
local governments the right to claim a limited jurisdiction in this
case.

So, the local police don't end up enforcing an FCC regulation
directly... but they can enforce a *local* law which has the
same effect, if the local government chooses to pass one. If the
local government doesn't pass a local law to this effect, the police
have no jurisdiction.

There's a whole bunch of verbiage about appealing local decisions to
the FCC, about the FCC's responsibility for providing technical
guidance to local governments about doing this right, etc.

For the gory details, see http://uscode.house.gov/download/pls/47C5.txt
about 40% of the way down through the text.

It's possible that this subsection has been challenged in court, or
even overturned, but I'm not aware of any case in which this is
happened.

I have no idea how many state and local governments (if any) have
passed laws, or prosecuted illegal CB operation, under the authority
granted by this subsection.

--
Dave Platt AE6EO
Hosting the Jade Warrior home page: http://www.radagast.org/jade-warrior
I do _not_ wish to receive unsolicited commercial email, and I will
boycott any company which has the gall to send me such ads!

On Thu, 02 Jun 2005 02:21:35 -0400, Buck wrote:

On Thu, 02 Jun 2005 03:43:07 GMT, KU2S wrote:

Personally, at 70 watts PEP on a motocycle, I'd be more concerned with
RF damage to the operator than I would be damage to any other
electronics...
Raymond Sirois KU2S

Wouldn't that be closer to 100 w PEP? Icom 706.


The poster said 70, so I went with his numbers. I use an IC-720a, and
certainly don't go two-wheeled mobile with it. Hell, MY Goldwing
doesn't even have a fairing!


Raymond Sirois KU2S
SysOp: The Lost Chord BBS
607-733-5745
telnet://thelostchord.dns2go.com:6000

On Thu, 02 Jun 2005 12:33:44 GMT, Bob Miller
wrote:

On Thu, 02 Jun 2005 02:11:44 -0400, Buck wrote:



Each radio has it's own finger-print that the FCC can read. Many
times, they can tell the make and model by the signature before ever
seeing the rig. I would think that the most popular HF mobile rig
ever is recognized by the FCC.

Rig fingerprint? How does that work?

bob
k5qwg



I don't know, the FCC mentions them in letters to the owners of the
rigs they are requiring inspection on.


--
73 for now
Buck
N4PGW

On Fri, 03 Jun 2005 10:01:39 -0400, Buck wrote:

On Thu, 02 Jun 2005 12:33:44 GMT, Bob Miller
wrote:

On Thu, 02 Jun 2005 02:11:44 -0400, Buck wrote:



Each radio has it's own finger-print that the FCC can read. Many
times, they can tell the make and model by the signature before ever
seeing the rig. I would think that the most popular HF mobile rig
ever is recognized by the FCC.

Rig fingerprint? How does that work?

bob
k5qwg



I don't know, the FCC mentions them in letters to the owners of the
rigs they are requiring inspection on.

It's called "signature analysis". Every emitter, whether the human
voice, a transmiiter or a piece of vibrating machinery puts out its
vibrations in a unique pattern that can be determined by careful
analysis of the signal. There are mathmatical analysis tools that can
break down the patterns into frequency bands and time signatures that
all together, show that your Icom IC-706 MarkIIG is uniquely different
from my friend's. The math isn't particularly difficult, there are
specialty chip sets that will do it. The trick is doing it fast and
accurately enough. The "waterfall" display in WINPSK is doing the
math, but only enough to show the signals and decode the PSK protocol.
If it were accurate enough it would show the differences between all
the transmitters.

Russ - kf4wxd