"N2EY" wrote in message
m...
"Ryan, KC8PMX" wrote in message
...
"N2EY" wrote in message
...
In article , Mike Coslo
writes:


But you guys have training sessions, right?

Twice a month as required by law, and also sometimes more than that.

Well, there you go. For a lot of hams, Field Day is their only and/or
first training.

You can't simulate all of them by any means, but FD simulates some of
them.

I wasn't saying that we can simulate all but I do think we should be
simulating in more realistic locations. That is provided that we can
get
permission to set up there, as it is not actually during an emergency.

The question is, what constitutes a "realistic" location? Depending on
the type of emergency, all sorts of sites are realistic.

For example, look at the search for shuttle parts. People were spread
out over a large area, and needed communications over relatively short
paths but in many directions - in rural areas, mostly.

One of the biggest challenges of FD has become finding a site.
Consider what we want to do:

- Make noise all night long

- Put wires and tubing high in the air during a time of year when
thunderstorms are common

- Pound things into the ground, set up tents, cook food, etc.

- Be away from noise generators like power lines.

Plus there's the whole liability question...

Here's a scenario for ya:

Months in advance, everyone who wants to participate is required to
fill
out a
form listing what equipment, time, and skills they can volunteer for
FD.
Everyone is responsible for keeping their FD forms updated of changes

(equipment /schedule changes, license upgrades, etc.)

The forms are collected and the FD committee of no more than 3 people
puts
together a Field Day master plan.

48-72 hours before FD, everyone who is signed up gets their "sealed
orders"
which detail where they are to go, what they are expected to bring
with
them
and what they are expected to do for FD. It could be as simple as
"show up
at X
on or before time T and operate station S" or as complex as "head the
team
running station S, bring a this list of equipment..."

Included could be things bringing like foul-weather gear even though
the
forecast is perfect. You don't have to wear it but you have to have it
with
you. Could also simulate equipment breakdowns and unavailability -
although
that sort of thing often happens anyway.

Except for the FD committee, nobody knows what they're going to be
doing
until
shortly before FD. To more realistically simulate, some very good
resources
(rigs, antennas, generators, etc.) might be left completely unused
while
less
than perfect substitutes are pressed into service.

You'd probably love a Field Day like that, Ryan. Would be a great
learning
experience for all. But I can guarantee you that more than half
(probably
more
than 3/4) of the FD regulars in your club would walk away if the club
tried
such a plan cold turkey.

Actually, with a little bit of fine tuning, I believe that would be even
better than my idea.

Thanks!

My idea was that we WILL know which weekend, but the
location won't be announced till either that morning OR the night
before,
and we have to adapt.

That's in my idea too. The date would be about the only thing known in
advance outside of the planning committee.

And that location being decided (where possible) by
the county EC/RO. Actually in our specific case, we hold a regular net
on
Thursdays, so that would be the best I would imagine......

There ya go. And the committee could toss in all sorts of surprises:
Somebody brings a nice new rig, makes 100 contacts, and then a
committee person suddenly slaps a red post-it on the thing. Which
means it's busted and cannot be used for X hours. Team has to
improvise another rig and get back on the air ASAP.

Or maybe the announcement is made on Thursday night that *all*
antennas have to be homebrewed at the site, starting no earlier than
24 hours before FD. Bring all the coax, wire, rope, connectors, line,
insulators, tubing and PVC you want, but everything in the antennas
has to be built from-scratch.

As I said before, if you drop something like this on most people
cold-turkey they'll rebel or simply vote with their feet. But if
they're brought to it gradually...

73 de Jim, N2EY


True, as it stands right now, it looks like the group is gonna splinter off
into two distinct groups. So, probably next year you guys can work 2
different Midland County, Michigan stations. The "old school" group will do
things their way, and the "new school" group can do things their own way
too.... Almost sounds like a second club overall forming for this county
instead of just the one.


Ryan
KC8PMX

In article , "Ryan, KC8PMX"
writes:

it looks like the group is gonna splinter off
into two distinct groups.

Happens all the time. Some "clubs" exist solely to put on Field Day.

So, probably next year you guys can work 2
different Midland County, Michigan stations.

More points for me. That's a good thing.

The "old school" group will do
things their way, and the "new school" group can do things their own way
too.... Almost sounds like a second club overall forming for this county
instead of just the one.

Better than fighting. And often both groups learn something in the process!

73 de Jim, N2EY

"N2EY" wrote in message
...
In article , "Ryan, KC8PMX"
writes:

it looks like the group is gonna splinter off
into two distinct groups.

Happens all the time. Some "clubs" exist solely to put on Field Day.

So, probably next year you guys can work 2
different Midland County, Michigan stations.

More points for me. That's a good thing.

The "old school" group will do
things their way, and the "new school" group can do things their own way
too.... Almost sounds like a second club overall forming for this county
instead of just the one.

Better than fighting. And often both groups learn something in the
process!

73 de Jim, N2EY

Unfortunately, many times the club sizes drop below "critical mass" and both
end up folding.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

In article , "Dee D. Flint"
writes:

Unfortunately, many times the club sizes drop below "critical mass" and both
end up folding.

Yes, that does happen.

However, FD can be done at any level, from a one-person show to massive
multi-multi operation with dozens of transmitters on the air and hundreds of
people involved. The appropriately-callsigned N1FD operation is one example of
the latter.

Last year I did a low-intensity solo effort - 1B-1 battery. Still made over
2400 points.

73 de Jim, N2EY

"N2EY" wrote in message
...
In article , "Dee D. Flint"
writes:

Unfortunately, many times the club sizes drop below "critical mass" and
both
end up folding.

Yes, that does happen.

However, FD can be done at any level, from a one-person show to massive
multi-multi operation with dozens of transmitters on the air and hundreds
of
people involved. The appropriately-callsigned N1FD operation is one
example of
the latter.

Last year I did a low-intensity solo effort - 1B-1 battery. Still made
over
2400 points.

73 de Jim, N2EY

That's basically what I was trying to get at. People can do FD on their own
or with a club but it may be better NOT to split off as a separate club. We
have some members who do FD on their own in our club or they belong to more
than one club already and do FD with them. But they do not go form yet
another club.

I think doing different things year to year is good. Our club tried
different antennas this year for example. Next year I and the OM my try
going on our own just for variety simply to see what two people can do.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

In article , "Dee D. Flint"
writes:

People can do FD on their own
or with a club but it may be better NOT to split off as a separate club. We
have some members who do FD on their own in our club or they belong to more
than one club already and do FD with them. But they do not go form yet
another club.

Ah - now I see. Evenutally you have a lot of little clubs, none of which have
critical mass to do anyhting serious.

I think doing different things year to year is good. Our club tried
different antennas this year for example. Next year I and the OM my try
going on our own just for variety simply to see what two people can do.

A lot depends on what goals are defined and resources available. For max
points, it's important to be ready to go on right at 2 PM (1 PM your time?) and
run all through the 24 hours with no breaks. Which usually means starting setup
before Saturday morning and going all night.

OTOH, sometimes FD can be a shakedown for bigger things. Like trying out an
antenna "in the field" before committing all the work needed by a permanent
home installation.

73 de Jim, N2EY

"N2EY" wrote in message
...
In article , "Dee D. Flint"
writes:

People can do FD on their own
or with a club but it may be better NOT to split off as a separate club.
We
have some members who do FD on their own in our club or they belong to
more
than one club already and do FD with them. But they do not go form yet
another club.

Ah - now I see. Evenutally you have a lot of little clubs, none of which
have
critical mass to do anyhting serious.


Precisely!

I think doing different things year to year is good. Our club tried
different antennas this year for example. Next year I and the OM my try
going on our own just for variety simply to see what two people can do.

A lot depends on what goals are defined and resources available. For max
points, it's important to be ready to go on right at 2 PM (1 PM your
time?) and
run all through the 24 hours with no breaks. Which usually means starting
setup
before Saturday morning and going all night.


I'm in the Eastern time zone. With just I and the OM running (if we go that
route), we will set our goals so that we will NOT try to run 24 hours.
Neither one of us fairs all that well on lack of sleep.

OTOH, sometimes FD can be a shakedown for bigger things. Like trying out
an
antenna "in the field" before committing all the work needed by a
permanent
home installation.

73 de Jim, N2EY


Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

"Dee D. Flint" wrote in message ...
"N2EY" wrote in message
...
In article , "Ryan, KC8PMX"
writes:

it looks like the group is gonna splinter off
into two distinct groups.

Happens all the time. Some "clubs" exist solely to put on Field Day.

So, probably next year you guys can work 2
different Midland County, Michigan stations.

More points for me. That's a good thing.

The "old school" group will do
things their way, and the "new school" group can do things their own way
too.... Almost sounds like a second club overall forming for this county
instead of just the one.

Better than fighting. And often both groups learn something in the
process!

73 de Jim, N2EY

Unfortunately, many times the club sizes drop below "critical mass" and both
end up folding.

Oddly we have the reverse scenario here. Four clubs pool their
resources and put together a single joint FD operation.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

w3rv

"Brian Kelly" wrote in message
m...
"Dee D. Flint" wrote in message
...
[snip]
Unfortunately, many times the club sizes drop below "critical mass" and
both
end up folding.

Oddly we have the reverse scenario here. Four clubs pool their
resources and put together a single joint FD operation.


That's an excellent idea too as learning to coordinate such an effort is
valuable training.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE