Brenda Ann wrote:


"running dogg" wrote in message
...
Brenda Ann wrote:


"running dogg" wrote in message
...

You claim that double digit growth starting from zero is not
impressive.
But considering how backward China was 30 years ago, much like the
Soviet Union was in the 80s, China's progress is remarkable indeed.
Russia hasn't managed to turn things around as well as China has (at
least economically speaking). Yes, salaries in China are low compared
to
the US. But in China, it takes a lot less money to live large than in
the US. In India, many workers earn US$70 a month, but in India, that
puts them solidly into the middle class. Meanwhile, Americans who make
$50k a year struggle to pay their bills. It's all relative.


I'm glad someone besides me can see this. I've always marvelled at the
people that talk about 'sweat shops' in second and third world countries
that pay very small percentages of what we make in the US being evil.
Thing
is, as you stated above, the standard of living in those countries
allows
for making much less money than in the US for a comparable lifestyle. In
Thailand for instance, the median annual income is around $6000, yet
most
there still have most of the same conveniences we take for granted, and
there are many US products available in the stores at much less than we
pay
for them.

Well, working conditions in China still aren't that great, and some of
the workplaces there would qualify as sweatshops by most measures of
working conditions, but they pay well enough for urban Chinese to enjoy
a pretty good standard of living. In the countryside, things are much
worse, however, since agriculture is still collectivized from what I
know, and most rural peasants barely scrape by. Most of the anger at the
CCP is in the countryside. Also, many Asian cultures will tolerate much
more political repression than Americans if they have lots of economic
freedom and lots of money. Look at Singapore-very rich, very capitalist,
yet very repressive politically. Vietnam is another prosperous Asian
nation where the Communist Party still rules with an iron fist. For
decades South Korea, where you live, was very repressed politically yet
very capitalist. Westerners tend to assume that capitalism and democracy
go together, I guess it's the result of decades of Cold War propaganda.
But that's not necessarily the case. Deng Xiaoping acheived what
Gorbachev could not-turn a communist country capitalist without chaos
breaking out and the whole society falling to pieces.



Agreed on the working conditions. As far as rural versus urban living, this
is often the case, even in more open and prosperous societies.

Small farmers have never had it easy, even in America. But collective
farms greatly worsen the situation.

Gorby (whom I still think got the shaft, and did a lot to change the former
USSR) never got the chance to make his reforms under his much more
reasonable timetable. You can't change a disaster into a success overnight,
which is what his political opponents were insisting he do. Had he been
given the chance, I'm sure that Russia would be doing quite well by now.
The man had guts, that's for sure.

I always viewed it as a situation where events got away from him. China
was able to make the transition mostly without the West noticing. Russia
had the US hounding them, plus 15,000 nukes pointed at their heads with
the person at the switch avidly reading Hal Lindsey. On top of that,
Russians had been listening to VOA for 30 years and wanted all of
America's goodies right now. Gorby's situation was a lot less favorable
for a successful transition to capitalism than Deng's.


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How much time have you two spent living in China???????????????????????