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#1
June 21st 04, 11:00 PM
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#2
June 22nd 04, 12:10 AM
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In article , Radio Amateur KC2HMZ
writes: On 21 Jun 2004 21:42:13 GMT, (Len Over 21) wrote: No need. There's a cellular telephone subscription for one out of three U.S. citizens according to the U.S. Census Bureau. (cellphones are not Part 15 devices) CB radios number somewhere between 2 and 5 MILLION, estimated by NTIA. (CB is not under Part 15) I don't know how many FRS/GMRS HTs have been sold, but they are regular consumer electronics items as consumer electronics stores and are good for 5 to 10 miles communications range. (FRS isn't under Part 15 either) One-way communications has been provided in emergencies for decades by broadcasting (also not under Part 15). In real emergencies the Public Land Mobile Radio Service (PLMRS) radios have been invaluable for local government and utility and medical aid agencies. (PLMRS isn't under Part 15). I think maybe you're half right, Len. believe it or not, even my ham rigs are Part 15 devices and come with the usual Part 15 warning sticker on them. Part 15 regulations apply to INCIDENTAL EMITTERS such as receivers, data couplers (if you have software controlled anything as a peripheral) and so forth. The stickers are there by the manufacturer and are intended to make the buying public believe in the sanctity of the product. :-) Remember the radios and TV sets of old from brand [which] which said "For best results always use [which] tubes?" :-) The Parts of Title 47 C.F.R. that apply to various radio services are listed after a link on the FCC Office of Engineering and Technology page. Under those parts one gets a link to the GPO which has the PDF repros of all the Parts of Title 47. The current issue date at the GPO (Government Printing Office) for Title 47 is 1 October 2003. That facility is a lot better than buying the same thing in hardcopy from the GPO. The last of five volumes of Title 47 (Part 80 to end) cost more than $50 even if shipping costs are free. The GPO does accept VISA and Mastercard and can take orders over the phone for local GPO outlets. The transmitter on cell phones (which are radios, not telephones), CB rigs, FRS/GMRS/PLMRS radios, and ham rigs are covered under those portions of FCC regulations that authorize the user to operate the transmitter (part 95 for CB, part 97 for ham, etc.). However, the receiver portion of the device is covered under Part 15. True enough. Problem is, nursie doesn't know which Part is which and becomes emotionally unstable when opposed to any of his postings. It is very inaccurate to state anyone has "insisted unlicensed devices play a 'major' role" in emergencies. Those radios ARE used by emergency communications groups in real emergencies. As I said, I did not see the original posts, but I am aware of instances where such equipment is used by governmental and emergency services personnel, as well as by ARES/RACES and other "civilian" EmComm groups (like REACT). Nursie doesn't want to see that. The original ranting and raving against anything "unlicensed" came from a mild comment by Brian Burke in here over a month ago. There's two worlds being discussed in here. The major one is reality - where you and I live - and the fantasylands wherein all the existing radio communication infrastructure fails in any emergency, only ham radio being able to save the day. Not only that, REACT grew through CB radio and the fantasyland livers think that all CB is evil, wicked, mean, and nasty, unfit for proper morsemen to ever approach let alone use. CB is unlicensed, of course, therefore it isn't any good since no test need be passed to operate one. :-) You and I know that most real emergencies are very local in nature and those can be aided by relatively short-range radios having 2 to 15 mile ranges. Those can be any of the presently unlicensed radios as well as licensed, such as PLMRS. Unfortunately, the vast majority of messaging in here, other than the "learned" pontificating of political pundits, involves arguing the fantasyland worlds of the various angry PCTA or those who wish to seek gurudom of the newsgroup (and whose words are golden, never ever to be talked against). Unless one is a regular reader in here it is difficult to follow some threads...even those that don't evolve into the flame wars you see. :-) |
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#3
June 22nd 04, 11:39 AM
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Subject: The Game's Afoot!
From: (Len Over 21) Date: 6/21/2004 6:10 PM Central Standard Time Message-id: In article , Radio Amateur KC2HMZ writes: I think maybe you're half right, Len. believe it or not, even my ham rigs are Part 15 devices and come with the usual Part 15 warning sticker on them. Part 15 regulations apply to INCIDENTAL EMITTERS such as receivers, data couplers (if you have software controlled anything as a peripheral) and so forth. They also pertain to INTENTIONAL EMMITERS, including those who operate license free walkie talkies, "broadcast transmitters", etc. Of course you know this...You've "threatened" to get on 20 meters with a Part 15 legal "station" before. You never carried through, though...Just like a dozen other "promises"... Steve, K4YZ |
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#5
June 23rd 04, 03:05 AM
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Subject: The Game's Afoot!
From: (Len Over 21) Date: 6/22/2004 4:26 PM Central Standard Time Message-id: Change WILL happen. All the vile name-calling, angry shouts and veiled threats won't stop it. Change can't be stopped, but it can be steered, directed into new vectors that are more navigable, better suited for the majority and those yet to enter the activity. Yes, it will. Too bad it's happening despite you instead of with you, eh...???? Steve, K4YZ |
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#6
June 23rd 04, 06:13 AM
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In article , (Steve
Robeson K4CAP) writes: Subject: The Game's Afoot! From: (Len Over 21) Date: 6/22/2004 4:26 PM Central Standard Time Message-id: Change WILL happen. All the vile name-calling, angry shouts and veiled threats won't stop it. Change can't be stopped, but it can be steered, directed into new vectors that are more navigable, better suited for the majority and those yet to enter the activity. Yes, it will. Too bad it's happening despite you instead of with you, eh...???? Nursie be idiot. Still. Idiot just doesn't understand my original purpose about amateur radio policy. Nursie never will, too determined to FIGHT with anyone who disagrees (even the slightest) with him. Tsk, tsk. Those who want to FIGHT all the time just aren't right in the head...aren't like average, normal folks. No "degree" or pretty license document needed to see that. Poor nursie. Never been involved with the larger world of radio, only other amateurs and posturing, always FIGHTING. I've been in the larger world of radio for half a century. Radio is not a magical mystery to me nor is communications of any sort by visual or audible means, Despite your FIGHT-challenging Phrazors, no one needs to be some kind of federal merit badge in amaterism to talk, discuss, or consider laws and regulations on radio subjects. That sort of demand is for weak-minded idiots who can't debate anything requiring intellect above and beyond 16 neurons. Nursie, you don't show any evidence of being able to intellectualize a damn thing. You can be shown government documents defining describing and detailing a radio service and you still REFUSE to accept that. You call all who disagree with you for "liars." You want to have physical confrontations with some who disagree with you. In short, all you want to do in here is FIGHT. That's insane. Get some help. Get some tranquilizers. Whatever. It's tiring to come into this forum and finding you FIGHTING with others all the time, talking crazy things. Nuts. |
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#7
June 23rd 04, 09:17 AM
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Subject: The Game's Afoot!
From: (Len Over 21) Date: 6/23/2004 12:13 AM Central Standard Time Message-id: Idiot just doesn't understand my original purpose about amateur radio policy. Nursie never will, too determined to FIGHT with anyone who disagrees (even the slightest) with him. Tsk, tsk. I understand fine, Lennie. You hate Amateur Radio and Amateur Radio licensees. That's blatantly obvious. Some Amateur made a fool out of you at some point in time (not that THAT is hard to do...) and you are determined to antagonize the rest of us as long as you can. No problem. I understand fine. Here's MY "purpose"...It's a proven fact that those who bark the loudest or longest are usually the one's who get the most attention. You have taken it upon yourself to try and discredit ANY contributions to technology, public service, emergency communications or education and training that Amateur Radio offers. It's vile, repugnant, and untruthful. As long as you deem it your "purpose" to do so, I will do MY best to expose you for the antagonist and mistruthful putz that you are. It's not fighting, Lennie. It's self defense. It really is THAT simple. Those who want to FIGHT all the time just aren't right in the head...aren't like average, normal folks. No "degree" or pretty license document needed to see that. Then you're admitting you have a problem, Lennie? You're up to YOUR neck in fighting. You intentionally harass a group of people involved in a practice that you clearly have no vested interest in nor do you have anything constructive to offer. Poor nursie. Never been involved with the larger world of radio, only other amateurs and posturing, always FIGHTING. I've been in the larger world of radio for half a century. Radio is not a magical mystery to me nor is communications of any sort by visual or audible means. Seems to me you're the one who brought the fight in, Lennie. You were offered SEVERAL apologies and offers to move on, but your answers were clearly designed to simply perpetuate an argument. You have nothing to offer. Never did...never will...Your only "argument" is that other radio services don't use Morse Code, ergo Amateur Radio should not. Proof once again that you dont understand a lot of what Amateur Radio is about. But that's just par for the course. Despite your FIGHT-challenging Phrazors, no one needs to be some kind of federal merit badge in amaterism to talk, discuss, or consider laws and regulations on radio subjects. That sort of demand is for weak-minded idiots who can't debate anything requiring intellect above and beyond 16 neurons. The difference here, Lennie, is that I have experience in Amateur Radio. You don't. You are still determined to see that Amateur Radio heels to your barked order despite having no real idea of what Amateur Radio is or what it's really all about, save for what you read on websites. Amateur Radio is NOT the "aerospace industry". Amatuer Radio is NOT PLMRS, GMRS, FRS or MURS. Amateur Radio is NOT military communications. Amateur Radio is NOT "commercial" or "professional" communications. I'd dare say that everyone else in this forum EXCEPT you knows those things and accepts them, yet you keep trying to force Amateur Radio into one of those molds. It won't work. Nursie, you don't show any evidence of being able to intellectualize a damn thing. You can be shown government documents defining describing and detailing a radio service and you still REFUSE to accept that. You call all who disagree with you for "liars." You want to have physical confrontations with some who disagree with you. In short, all you want to do in here is FIGHT. That's insane. The only thing here "insane", Lennie, is your refusal to act your age. And that's considerable. I already acknowledged the enabling directives of MARS. They are not in question. YOU are the idiot for trying to argue that they are. MARS, without the thousands of volunteer Amateurs who man it, would not be able to carry out those duties those directives require. Period. Only a major manpower restructuring in the Armed Forces would allow it, and under present circumstances, that is highly unlikely. And I don't need to "intellectualize" anything. (Nice touch, byt the way, Lennie...lamenting my allegedged inability to "intellectualize" with yet more profanity...THAT was truly "intellectual") As for being a liar, Lennie, if you would tell the truth and stop your antgonistic constructs, I wouldn't have anything to work with. You have been repeatedly caught not telling the truth. You make accusations and assertions you cannot/will not substantiate. You assert that you intend to do things, but then never do them. Get some help. Get some tranquilizers. Whatever. It's tiring to come into this forum and finding you FIGHTING with others all the time, talking crazy things. Nuts. Then stop posting obviously inflammatory, profane, obnoxious and incorrect stuff, Lennie. We don't care how well you can candy coat your rants with cut-and-pastes from other websites. Life DOES exist outside of websites, although you seem to insist that if it's "on the website", that's the end of it. How foolish. We don't care about how many messages you watched flash across the teleprinter in 1953, or how many jobs you held. We don't care about some articles you had published in a magazine that failed, nor do we care about your manufactured experiences in aviation or emergency communications. You have zero-point-zero experience in Amateur Radio. None. You accuse ME of doing nothing but "fighting", yet name calling, accusations and harrassment is ALL you have rendered up, even to those who treat you with respect or patience. Sorry you can't be happy, Lennie. Steve, K4YZ |
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#8
June 24th 04, 04:11 PM
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Len Over 21 wrote:
In article , (Steve Robeson K4CAP) writes: Subject: The Game's Afoot! From: (Len Over 21) Date: 6/22/2004 4:26 PM Central Standard Time Message-id: Poor nursie. Never been involved with the larger world of radio, only other amateurs and posturing, always FIGHTING. I've been in the larger world of radio for half a century. Radio is not a magical mystery to me nor is communications of any sort by visual or audible means, Why does it always have to be about you, Len? Radio amateurs are free to seek out information about the "larger world of radio" in any number of venues. Many radio amateurs have been or are participants in the "larger world of radio". If you'd like to impress us, obtain an amateur radio license of any class and regale us with those tales. Dave K8MN |
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#10
June 22nd 04, 12:20 AM
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Radio Amateur KC2HMZ wrote in
: On 21 Jun 2004 21:42:13 GMT, (Len Over 21) wrote: No need. There's a cellular telephone subscription for one out of three U.S. citizens according to the U.S. Census Bureau. (cellphones are not Part 15 devices) CB radios number somewhere between 2 and 5 MILLION, estimated by NTIA. (CB is not under Part 15) I don't know how many FRS/GMRS HTs have been sold, but they are regular consumer electronics items as consumer electronics stores and are good for 5 to 10 miles communications range. (FRS isn't under Part 15 either) One-way communications has been provided in emergencies for decades by broadcasting (also not under Part 15). In real emergencies the Public Land Mobile Radio Service (PLMRS) radios have been invaluable for local government and utility and medical aid agencies. (PLMRS isn't under Part 15). I think maybe you're half right, Len. believe it or not, even my ham rigs are Part 15 devices and come with the usual Part 15 warning sticker on them. They are only under Part 15 for unwanted radiated emmissions, i.e. RF leakage from the case. The transmitter on cell phones (which are radios, not telephones), CB rigs, FRS/GMRS/PLMRS radios, and ham rigs are covered under those portions of FCC regulations that authorize the user to operate the transmitter (part 95 for CB, part 97 for ham, etc.). However, the receiver portion of the device is covered under Part 15. It is very inaccurate to state anyone has "insisted unlicensed devices play a 'major' role" in emergencies. Those radios ARE used by emergency communications groups in real emergencies. As I said, I did not see the original posts, but I am aware of instances where such equipment is used by governmental and emergency services personnel, as well as by ARES/RACES and other "civilian" EmComm groups (like REACT). 73 DE John D. Kasupski Tonawanda, New York, USA Amateur Radio (KC2HMZ), HF/VHF/UHF Monitoring (KNY2VS) Member ARATS, ARES, RACES, WUN |
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