On Mon, 27 Aug 2007 09:36:27 -0700, Bart Bailey
wrote:

In posted on
Mon, 27 Aug 2007 05:52:28 -0800, David wrote: Begin

Here we have:

780 KKOH
790 KABC
810 KGO

all obliterating each other and all owned by the same company. AM is
about to die.

I only get KGO at night as expected, but am much closer to KABC 790 and
especially XESPN 800, neither of which 'obliterate' KGO, even when D
layer propagation is poor.

This guy sure messes with KGO:

http://www.fccinfo.com/CMDProEngine....02979&sHours=N

On Aug 27, 7:46 pm, David wrote:
On Mon, 27 Aug 2007 09:36:27 -0700, Bart Bailey
wrote:

In posted on
Mon, 27 Aug 2007 05:52:28 -0800, David wrote: Begin

Here we have:

780 KKOH
790 KABC
810 KGO

all obliterating each other and all owned by the same company. AM is
about to die.

I only get KGO at night as expected, but am much closer to KABC 790 and
especially XESPN 800, neither of which 'obliterate' KGO, even when D
layer propagation is poor.

This guy sure messes with KGO:

http://www.fccinfo.com/CMDProEngine....=AM&tabSearchT...

David,

Usually get all these very well at Night
with out any interference :
KSFO 560 kHz to the West
KMJ 580 kHz to the South
KEAR 610 kHz to the West
KFI 640 kHz to the South
KNBR 680 kHz to the West
KDWN 720 kHz to the South
KCBS 740 kHz to the West
KFMB 760 kHz to the South
KKOH 780 kHz to the North
KGO 810 kHz to the West
KTRB 860 kHz to the West
But they have to make the Trip up over
the Hill and Down into the Valley.

~ RHF Twain Harte, CA
North of Yosemite NP.

Pete KE9OA wrote:
You are correct...........iBiquity didn't make that claim. The local radio
station on 97.1 calls theirselves "high definition radio".
When I spoke to one of the PR folks at iBiquity a couple of years ago, they
made the claim that when I heard the hi fidilety capabilities of IBOC on the
MW band that I would be impressed. When I asked them about eliminating the
interference to the adjacent channels, they didn't have an answer.


LOL...no....and why would they?

iBiquity is very good at not answering questions, I've noticed. You'd
think for the kind of money they get for licensing alone, they'd be a
little less with the Microsoft attitude and a little more appreciative
of the pigeons paying tribute.

But, I expect too much.


Like interference free broadcasting.



What the hell was I thinking.....







Pete

"D Peter Maus" wrote in message
...
Pete KE9OA wrote:
Perfectly put, Brenda. IBOC is the biggest joke that I have seen in a
long time. And they have the nerve to call it "high definition radio". As
big a joke as Windows Vista.

Pete




iBiquity specifically states that "HD" in "HD Radio" does not stand for
"High Definition." At one time, it stood for "Hybrid Digital," as the
intent was to make the transition to full time digital only broadcasting.

Today, iBiquity claims "HD" stands for nothing....


Which, if you think about it.....


And as for the idea of apply synchronous detection to get rid of IBOC
interference....yes...well....ahem....

Not so.


You're not that far from me, and there is no end of IBOC rash over the
stations worth hearing, up here. I think this is a solution desperately
looking for a reason to execute the perpetrator.

Radio isn't going to give up on this crap easily, though. Not with the
investment they've already made in hardware and licensing. But it's not a
solution that will bring the results Radio was hoping for. First, it's not
CONTENT focussed in its marketing...And it's CONTENT that drives
listening. That's why we're all so willing to sit through the noise and
static to hear programs that are not broadcast locally....we're want the
content, not the gimmick. (Well, except for one, whose logs reflected at
most 2 minutes each of the stations in the ILG database.)

Until Radio gets this, and starts creating content that listeners want
to hear, and making it availble only on the digital streams, IBOC will
continue to languish.

No matter what HD salesmen claim.

The data tells a different tune than a claim about a commission check.
















"Brenda Ann" wrote in message
...
wrote in message
ups.com...
You must have a very dull life - nothing to do but post your very
stupid remarks about HD Radio.

The auto industry is gearing up to add HD Radio to nearly every make
and model automobile within the next 3 years or so. All 2007 BMW's
now offer HD Radio as an option. For 2008, Jaguar has added the
option. Also for 2008, the new luxury car being offered by Hyundai
will have HD Radio as standard, I believe. And the list goes on.

The same nonsense was said about FM Radio, about radio itself when
television took off, about tv dinners, etc. etc. Things don't happen
overnight.
FM did not interfere with anyone's ability to listen to their favorite
AM station. TV didn't interfere with anyone's ability to listen to their
favorite AM or FM station. FM stereo did not interfere with anyone's
ability to listen to their favorite FM station in monaural. AM stereo
did not interfere with anyone's ability to listen to their favorite AM
station in monaural (in fact, it enhanced the experience because of the
allowed extra bandwidth. IBOC DOES interfere with people's abilities to
listen to their favorite stations. Not only does AM-IBOC interfere with
stations up to three channels away from an IBOC station's carrier
frequency, but it has meant that the audio bandwidth now used for AM
analog is little or no better than a telephone. FM-IBOC interferes with
first and second adjacent channels, making them difficult or impossible
to receive. And anyone who lives in a high population area, such as the
east coast, knows that their 'local' stations are not the only ones they
can hear. Areas between say, New York and Boston, or New York and
Philadelphia, can hear stations easily from either city. Not with IBOC..

On Aug 28, 1:07 am, "Brenda Ann" wrote:
"D Peter Maus" wrote in ...





Pete KE9OA wrote:
You are correct...........iBiquity didn't make that claim. The local
radio station on 97.1 calls theirselves "high definition radio".
When I spoke to one of the PR folks at iBiquity a couple of years ago,
they made the claim that when I heard the hi fidilety capabilities of
IBOC on the MW band that I would be impressed. When I asked them about
eliminating the interference to the adjacent channels, they didn't have
an answer.

LOL...no....and why would they?

iBiquity is very good at not answering questions, I've noticed. You'd
think for the kind of money they get for licensing alone, they'd be a
little less with the Microsoft attitude and a little more appreciative of
the pigeons paying tribute.

But, I expect too much.

Like interference free broadcasting.

What the hell was I thinking.....

That's why the NAB fought tooth and nail to keep the pirates from getting a
legal toehold... they wanted to use all that bandwidth so THEY could legally
interfere with their competition. - Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

BAD - Yes IBOC will 'localize' the Radio Market and keep
Non-Local Broadcasters OUT of that "Local" Radio Market.

After all the Radio Broadcasters Own the Listeners Ears ~ RHF

Brenda Ann wrote:
"D Peter Maus" wrote in message
...
Pete KE9OA wrote:
You are correct...........iBiquity didn't make that claim. The local
radio station on 97.1 calls theirselves "high definition radio".
When I spoke to one of the PR folks at iBiquity a couple of years ago,
they made the claim that when I heard the hi fidilety capabilities of
IBOC on the MW band that I would be impressed. When I asked them about
eliminating the interference to the adjacent channels, they didn't have
an answer.

LOL...no....and why would they?

iBiquity is very good at not answering questions, I've noticed. You'd
think for the kind of money they get for licensing alone, they'd be a
little less with the Microsoft attitude and a little more appreciative of
the pigeons paying tribute.

But, I expect too much.


Like interference free broadcasting.



What the hell was I thinking.....

That's why the NAB fought tooth and nail to keep the pirates from getting a
legal toehold... they wanted to use all that bandwidth so THEY could legally
interfere with their competition.






You know, if it weren't so true, that would be funny.

On Mon, 27 Aug 2007 20:17:15 -0700, Bart Bailey
wrote:



That Ciudad Juarez station you referred to isn't heard here because of
its co-channel in Tijuana. I'm line of sight (13 miles) from this one:
http://tinyurl.com/2jsxjz
and can still manage to pull KGO from underneath, unlike back when it
was XEMM an over modulated splattering Mariachi Machine that no amount
of filtration could overcome.

When I lived in Phoenix I could hear X-Rock 80 at high noon in my '56
Cadillac. But that was a REAL radio.

In article
,
D Peter Maus wrote:

Stephanie Weil wrote:
On Aug 27, 12:38 pm, Bart Bailey wrote:

Orban's Opti-Mod I think it's called, and station personnel that can't
seem to resist adjusting them for maximum smoke.

Processors were always set "hot" way before IBOC came on the scene,
and I never heard station audio clip and distort the way it does now
on the analog side of AM HD. Reducing the available bandwith for
analog to +/- 5 khz to shoehorn the digital portion sure hasn't helped
either.

The whole idea with HD is that you have to back off on the processing
a bit. You can't overdrive digital the way you can with analog and
have it come out sounding good. It's like slightly overdriving a
recording on cassette tape vs. Minidisc. If you try it with Minidisc,
you hit a brick wall and everything above that starts sounding like so
much mush.

Stephanie Weil
New York City, USA



Clipping has been part of audio processing since the early days of
audio processing. It's usually inaudible. AM processing has been using
'smart' clipping for awhile, now. Smart clipping is not quite as
hard--rounded edges--but for a number of years CRL openly hard clipped
the composite baseband and let the **** fall into the filter where it may.

And not all analog clipping is that objectionable. It adds even order
harmonics, which are pleasing to the ear. If over done...well, that's
another story...but lightly, it can be a good thing...

One of the problems we have with digital audio, is the number of
analog engineers applyin analog thinking to digital audio. And this
applies to both recording and live audio, as well. You're right, digital
audio is a brick wall at '0', and anything beyond that becomes some
serious trash. Analog engineers, especially in the recording industry,
routinely try to recreate 'tape compression' at the top end, by driving
preamps and other pre conversion electronics mildly to their top end.
Especially if they're using tube preamps. This takes a delicate hand.
But who's that delicate is broadcasting, today? Not many.

The most common complaint I hear about HD reception, today, and this
applies to both AM and FM, is the audio quality isn't what is expected.
It's not CD quality, which according to Philips and Sony was only
supposed to be medium-fi in the first place. And the HD audio is nearly
always loaded with some kind of distortion artifact resulting from
trying to pack 5 lbs in a 4 lb bag.

Snip

The bit rate is not high enough for high quality sound.

--
Telamon
Ventura, California

In article ,
D Peter Maus wrote:

Pete KE9OA wrote:
Perfectly put, Brenda. IBOC is the biggest joke that I have seen in a long
time. And they have the nerve to call it "high definition radio". As big a
joke as Windows Vista.

Pete





iBiquity specifically states that "HD" in "HD Radio" does not stand
for "High Definition." At one time, it stood for "Hybrid Digital," as
the intent was to make the transition to full time digital only
broadcasting.

Today, iBiquity claims "HD" stands for nothing....


Which, if you think about it.....

Snip

I have though about it. It stands for High Distortion.

--
Telamon
Ventura, California

Then, there come to town,,,, a Gun faster than Lightning,,,,,,, the
fastest Gun you seennnnnnnnn,,,,,,,,

I was at home on a tree day leave anna I wents downatowna and I sawed
that Cat Ballou movie flick.I think that was before news broke about
Hanoie Jane Fonda in Hanoi though.
cuhulin, faster than Greased Owl S..T!

On Sep 1, 10:41 am, Telamon
wrote:
In article ,
D Peter Maus wrote:





Pete KE9OA wrote:
Perfectly put, Brenda. IBOC is the biggest joke that I have seen in a long
time. And they have the nerve to call it "high definition radio". As big a
joke as Windows Vista.

Pete

iBiquity specifically states that "HD" in "HD Radio" does not stand
for "High Definition." At one time, it stood for "Hybrid Digital," as
the intent was to make the transition to full time digital only
broadcasting.

Today, iBiquity claims "HD" stands for nothing....

Which, if you think about it.....

Snip

- I have though about it. It stands for High Distortion.
-
- --
- Telamon
- Ventura, California

Telamon - Beyond the 10mv/m Contour "HD" stands for
the 'Hell & Damned' again Blinking Blue Light. ~ RHF