"D Peter Maus" wrote in message
...

Splitting frog hairs, brother. Conditional access is conditional access.
It's ALL data. Audio, weather, traffic, stock quotes--In the digital
universe it's ALL data. If conditional access can be applied to ONE
commodity in a digital feed, it can be applied to ALL commodities in a
digital feed.

Subscription radio. By definition.

To me, it ain't radio if it does not talk after being decoded. A pure data
stream never consisted of audio at the other end, and that is what is being
or was being tested.

David Eduardo wrote:

"D Peter Maus" wrote in message
...

Splitting frog hairs, brother. Conditional access is conditional access.
It's ALL data. Audio, weather, traffic, stock quotes--In the digital
universe it's ALL data. If conditional access can be applied to ONE
commodity in a digital feed, it can be applied to ALL commodities in a
digital feed.

Subscription radio. By definition.

To me, it ain't radio if it does not talk after being decoded. A pure data
stream never consisted of audio at the other end, and that is what is being
or was being tested.

Nice spin, 'Eduardo'.

David Eduardo wrote:
"D Peter Maus" wrote in message
...
Splitting frog hairs, brother. Conditional access is conditional access.
It's ALL data. Audio, weather, traffic, stock quotes--In the digital
universe it's ALL data. If conditional access can be applied to ONE
commodity in a digital feed, it can be applied to ALL commodities in a
digital feed.

Subscription radio. By definition.

To me, it ain't radio if it does not talk after being decoded. A pure data
stream never consisted of audio at the other end, and that is what is being
or was being tested.



Frog hairs, again, Brother. We're not talking 'to you'. We're
talking what is, the realities of this technology, and the intentions of
the gatekeepers who dole it out.


And, Sweetheart...ALL digital audio is a pure data stream.

In article ,
"David Eduardo" wrote:

"Frank Dresser" wrote in message
...

"David Eduardo" wrote in message
. ..

[snip]


The first generation is a description of the pre-FCC authorization
receivers. Second generation is what is out now, and thirds is
what you will see in Q3 to Q4.



OK, so what's the actual difference between these generations?
Hardware? Software?

Chipset, software.

SNIP

You mean chips and salsa?

Or maybe salsa chips?

I like guacamole with my chips and salsa.

--
Telamon
Ventura, California

"Telamon" wrote in message
...

[snip]

Is that would be the vaporware chip-set and the BS software?

Oh, set us straight on the details with some links please.


It would seem, in the HD radio biz, that no plan happens until it happens.

From about a year ago:

"RadioGuard-capable radio receivers are planned to be introduced to the
market by the holidays."

http://www.orbitcast.com/archives/ibiquity-to-int.html

Frank Dresser

Wet TV,,,,, do y'all cats ''git it? Wet''
cuhulin

Frank Dresser wrote:
"Telamon" wrote in
message
...


[snip]
Is that would be the vaporware chip-set and the BS software?

Oh, set us straight on the details with some links please.


It would seem, in the HD radio biz, that no plan happens until it
happens.

From about a year ago:

"RadioGuard-capable radio receivers are planned to be introduced to
the market by the holidays."

http://www.orbitcast.com/archives/ibiquity-to-int.html

Frank Dresser





Not also, in direct conflict to David's denial, that the conditional
access specifically includes subscription access to audio content.


This passage particularly says it all:



"We believe this will be key for monetizing HD Radio," said Tom
Rucktenwald, director of data applications security for NDS.

Services that could be made possible through RadioGuard include
pay-per-listen options for live concerts or other events, improved
reading services for the blind, private channels for emergency
services, and free opt-in events sponsored by advertisers. So HD
Radio will not just be competing with satellite radio
Siriusly-Speaking May-07 for listening time, but soon will be
competing for subscription dollars as well.




You'd think he'd get the message: We're not buying it.

"D Peter Maus" wrote in message
news
Frank Dresser wrote:
"Telamon" wrote in
message
...


[snip]
Is that would be the vaporware chip-set and the BS software?

Oh, set us straight on the details with some links please.


It would seem, in the HD radio biz, that no plan happens until it
happens.

From about a year ago:

"RadioGuard-capable radio receivers are planned to be introduced to
the market by the holidays."

http://www.orbitcast.com/archives/ibiquity-to-int.html

Frank Dresser





Not also, in direct conflict to David's denial, that the conditional
access specifically includes subscription access to audio content.

I've never heard of pay per program or pay per channel propositions; the
ability of even a cluster of several stations to garner subscriptions looks
bleak. When you can get channels at about a dime each on satellite, that
means that the HD's of one company would be worth less than a buck a
month... and the processing charges would eat most of that. There does not
seem to be a viable model, while FMeXtra is on with hundreds of channels in
SCA-like subscriptions with locked receivers... I know of one LA station
renting facilities to two Chinese broadcasts and one in Japanese under
FMeXtra.

There does not look to be a viable business model for HD pay channels for
audio services, although data services may create revenue.

David Eduardo wrote:
"D Peter Maus" wrote in message
...
David Eduardo wrote:
"D Peter Maus" wrote in message
...
David Eduardo wrote:
"D Peter Maus" wrote in message
news Frank Dresser wrote:
"Telamon" wrote in
message
...


[snip]
Is that would be the vaporware chip-set and the BS software?

Oh, set us straight on the details with some links please.

It would seem, in the HD radio biz, that no plan happens until it
happens.

From about a year ago:

"RadioGuard-capable radio receivers are planned to be introduced to
the market by the holidays."

http://www.orbitcast.com/archives/ibiquity-to-int.html

Frank Dresser



Not also, in direct conflict to David's denial, that the conditional
access specifically includes subscription access to audio content.
I've never heard of pay per program or pay per channel propositions;
That's false on it's face. We discussed them here. I fact, Frank was
the one who came up with the information that testing was underway, and
you acknowledged that he was correct.
There is data via HD-3, but nothing I have ever heard indicates audio
programming fpr pay.

Once again, for those not wishing to admit they've participated in
the conversation:


From about a year ago:

"Services that could be made possible through RadioGuard include
pay-per-listen options for live concerts or other events, improved reading
services for the blind, private channels for emergency services, and free
opt-in events sponsored by advertisers. So HD Radio will not just be
competing with satellite radio for listening time, but soon will be
competing for subscription dollars as well."


Straight from iBiquity at NAB. That's audio. Concerts are audio.
Advertiser sponsored events...that includes audio, too. Competing for
subscription dollars with satellite radio....That's not just aviation
weather, there, Brother. That's audio.

And you participated in this conversation a year ago. At the same time
iBiquity was making this announcement.

So, once again, you've got inside information about future 'trade
secret' HD technology, but you're ignorant about iBiquity's own publicly
announced tests?

That won't fly.

Either you're an informed broadcaster or you aren't. Which is it?

Either way, you're not telling the truth to somebody.

iBiquity simply confirmed that the HD system was capable of addressing
receivers were this a requested feature. At present, I do not believe any
radio in production is addressable.


Nice try. That's not the suject of this convesation. And your
continuing attempt to divert the discussion to your denials of fact say
a lot about the intent of much of what you've posted in this forum.

The topic of conversation is:

Are they trying to do it? And are you telling the truth? You've
been saying all along conditional programming access is not in the plan
for HD, and you know this by virtue of your specialized and internal
knowledge not available to the public. By iBiquity's own admission, in
published word and practical test, conditional programming access IS
part of the HD plan. So, you're either knowingly not telling the truth,
or you're not as intimately informed as you claim.

Either way....Yes, they are trying to implement conditional access.

And no...you're not telling the truth.

By iBiquity's press. And your own words.



Which indicates that your arguments shilling HD are largely
irrelevant, as either mis- or dis- information.

"D Peter Maus" wrote in message
...
David Eduardo wrote:

iBiquity simply confirmed that the HD system was capable of addressing
receivers were this a requested feature. At present, I do not believe any
radio in production is addressable.

..


Nice try. That's not the suject of this convesation. And your
continuing attempt to divert the discussion to your denials of fact say a
lot about the intent of much of what you've posted in this forum.


Right now, no chip and no receiver is adressable. in other words, there is
no way in hell to do paid services on HD today or in the near future.

There were some tests, and the system is able to do data transmission in any
channel other than HD-1. There is no use yet for this type of service and
there is no chipset or receiver that can pick such a service up.


The topic of conversation is:

Are they trying to do it? And are you telling the truth? You've been
saying all along conditional programming access is not in the plan for HD,
and you know this by virtue of your specialized and internal knowledge not
available to the public.

As far as I know, there has been no testing of controlled limited access
programming with a subscription model in mind. There have been limited tests
of data streams, with examples being traffic data and stock quotes. Nobody
is doing this, and no equipment exists to do it.

By iBiquity's own admission, in published word and practical test,
conditional programming access IS part of the HD plan. So, you're either
knowingly not telling the truth, or you're not as intimately informed as
you claim.

My read is that conditional access can be made available. it is not at
present. And I know of no station planning to do this, as there is, so far,
no practical model for the economic part.

Either way....Yes, they are trying to implement conditional access.

Proving it can be done and doing it are two different things. With FMeXtra
and SCA, there is no apparent demand or advantage.

And no...you're not telling the truth.

Something that can be done and something radio stations want to do are very
different things.