John Smith wrote in :

On 10/6/2011 2:50 PM, RD Sandman wrote:
Thomas wrote in
:

Am 05.10.2011 15:43, schrieb SaPeIsMa:

"John wrote in message
...
On 10/4/2011 7:30 AM, Thomas Heger wrote:

...
No, I don't agree. In a democracy the government is 'We, the
people...'. These governments should never be a thread to their
own
people. That seems to be an American speciality, that we don't
have
in Germany.

TH

Oh no, you are confused, the royalty of england had it just the way
they liked it, before our forefathers pointed out what real freedom
is, and insisted upon having it ... a thing which has been stolen
away, in the last few decades, buy the would-be-royalty now
inhabiting our public servant offices ... our gangsters, like the
one in the white house, have their corresponding counterparts in
your country ...


Not to mention that the Euros have lived with that kind of
"specialty" for far longer than Americans have.
Which is why poor TH is so confused about who is what.

OK. But if you are so happy with the government, what do you need
these 'small guns, the serious protection you need ...' for?

Are you an idiot? What makes you think I have a gun to defend myself
against my government? I don't.....I have a gun to defend myself and
family against street predators. So far......so good.



You are going to need more ... more guns ...

I already have more.....more guns....

--
Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman)

Witnessing Republicans and Democrats bickering over
the National Debt is like watching two drunks argue
over a bar bill on the Titanic.....

John Smith wrote in :

On 10/6/2011 2:50 PM, RD Sandman wrote:
... ..I have a gun to defend myself and
family against street predators. So far......so good.
...

Well, the Constitution guarantees you the right to own a gun\weapons for
protections against the government ...

The Constitution recognizes my right to keep and bear arms. It does not
specify a reason to do it.

but, I think most rational men
would extend that to including what your use is.

I wouldn't care if they did or not.....if they don't like why I carry, they
can try to take the gun away from me.

--
Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman)

Witnessing Republicans and Democrats bickering over
the National Debt is like watching two drunks argue
over a bar bill on the Titanic.....

On Oct 8, 10:36*am, Thomas Heger wrote:
Am 07.10.2011 00:07, schrieb RD Sandman:









Thomas *wrote in news:9f4n06F18qU1
@mid.individual.net:

Your "state of security" is based on ignorant presumptions and a
willigness to abrogate your responsibility to yourself, your family
and
your fellow citizens.

That is blatant nonsense!
If you want less crime in your country, than it's better to solve a few
problems, than to send in troops.

I thought this conversation was about self defence of family, etc.. *That
is not a call for troops.

Crimes are usually not unavoidable like bad weather.

Some crimes are. *One can do a lot to avoid crimes like not getting
involved with gangs or drugs, but some trouble comes seeking you, not the
other way around.

(maybe I have to stick to my position. But I would agree with you somehow..)

But think about drugs, for example.

A drug is a substance, that people like to take, because it makes them a
bit relaxed, woozy or alike.

Usually the criminals don't want to make people woozy, but intend to get
money from them. To avoid drug related crimes, one should try to make it
harder, to gain something from selling drugs.

This could be done, if the drug itself is not the subject of prosecution
or the addictive person, but drug trafficking and trade.

The addictive person had to be cured, where possible and less people
should start new drug experiences.

- Than those, that remain addictive could
- be provided with the drugs in a kind of
- medical situation for free.

TH,

So then you would also Open 'RX' Bars and
Administer Unlimited Quantities of Alcohol
to Certified Habitual {Lifetime} Drunks
and Repeat DUI Drivers*.

* After Revoking their License to Drive
and Impounding their Car/Truck.

? What About Free* Cigarettes & Cigars for
All Who Can Not Quit Smoking !
* 'RX' Smoke Shops

? why should 'i' work all day and pay taxes
to support someone else not working; plus
pay for them to get high/loaded ?
=no=joy= =no=joy= =no=joy= ~ RHF

On 10/8/2011 3:48 PM, John Smith wrote:

...
? What About Free* Cigarettes& Cigars for
All Who Can Not Quit Smoking !
* 'RX' Smoke Shops

? why should 'i' work all day and pay taxes
to support someone else not working; plus
pay for them to get high/loaded ?
=no=joy= =no=joy= =no=joy= ~ RHF
...

When I was in Miami, decades ago, bought some cuban tobacco plants and
seeds. Every year I plant them in the garden and roll some killer
cigars! Use some in pipes and even have a homemade razor blade
"shredder" to get some fine enough for cigs.

When I run out of homebrew stuff, and have to buy a pack of cigs or
tobacco, I am bummed out, I grow a much superior product!

Tobacco is all in the curing, and the "curing juice" you apply (usually
a "secret" of tobacco growers/manufacturers ...

Decades ago, the knowledge was hard to come across on how to properly
grow and cure tobacco. Today, on the internet, you can obtain it for free.

Basically, since I save seed to grow my own tobacco, my only cost is
papers and cigarette tubes ... maybe 20 to 40 bucks a month for both the
wife and me ... I love tobacco growing, it is a neat hobby to get into!
The plants are enormous, except for leaf shape, the rows in the
moonlight mimic rows of corn ...

These days, I grow all my tobacco needs and keep two sisters in tobacco
for homemade cigs. (They like to smoke factory made when they go out, so
does the wife, they think roll-your-own is just too 'okie') -- I like it
when people see me rolling cigs out of a light leather pouch and start
asking me questions about it ... I always am attempting to encourage
others to do the same -- grow their own and "get off the grid!"

If I still drank, I'd homebrew my beer, if I smoked dope, I'd grow that
too ...

What we need is to legalize pot and have some classes in how to grow and
process your own ... I don't want to pay for something for someone that
they can do cheaply for themselves. If you can grow house plants and/or
a garden, you should have no problem with weed ... after all, hemp is a
common weed in some parts of the USA ...

God gave marijuana to man, men didn't ... so they damn well have no
right to take it away ... I mean get real, it is insane to try to make
any plant illegal! Not that there is a shortage of insane people, we
seem to have an abundant supply ...

Regards,
JS

Am 09.10.2011 00:23, schrieb RHF:
On Oct 8, 10:36 am, Thomas wrote:
Am 07.10.2011 00:07, schrieb RD Sandman:









Thomas wrote in news:9f4n06F18qU1
@mid.individual.net:

Your "state of security" is based on ignorant presumptions and a
willigness to abrogate your responsibility to yourself, your family
and
your fellow citizens.

That is blatant nonsense!
If you want less crime in your country, than it's better to solve a few
problems, than to send in troops.

I thought this conversation was about self defence of family, etc.. That
is not a call for troops.

Crimes are usually not unavoidable like bad weather.

Some crimes are. One can do a lot to avoid crimes like not getting
involved with gangs or drugs, but some trouble comes seeking you, not the
other way around.

(maybe I have to stick to my position. But I would agree with you somehow.)

But think about drugs, for example.

A drug is a substance, that people like to take, because it makes them a
bit relaxed, woozy or alike.

Usually the criminals don't want to make people woozy, but intend to get
money from them. To avoid drug related crimes, one should try to make it
harder, to gain something from selling drugs.

This could be done, if the drug itself is not the subject of prosecution
or the addictive person, but drug trafficking and trade.

The addictive person had to be cured, where possible and less people
should start new drug experiences.

- Than those, that remain addictive could
- be provided with the drugs in a kind of
- medical situation for free.

TH,

So then you would also Open 'RX' Bars and
Administer Unlimited Quantities of Alcohol
to Certified Habitual {Lifetime} Drunks
and Repeat DUI Drivers*.

* After Revoking their License to Drive
and Impounding their Car/Truck.

? What About Free* Cigarettes& Cigars for
All Who Can Not Quit Smoking !
* 'RX' Smoke Shops

? why should 'i' work all day and pay taxes
to support someone else not working; plus
pay for them to get high/loaded ?
=no=joy= =no=joy= =no=joy= ~ RHF
.
Alcohol is a drug in a way and cigarettes make quite addictive, but that
was not, what I meant with illegal drugs.
I mean stuff like crack or heroine. These create a certain kind of
physical addiction, that is very hard to cure and forces the addictive
person to use these substances, unless they want to get severe pain and
health problems.

Like any substance, the price depends. It is a question of the way,
these substances are produced and not of the stuff itself. In
Afghanistan a great deal of the raw material is produced. This could be
bought there for relatively moderate prices. The processing to a drug is
usual chemical work, that any good pharmaceutical plant could do.

So the single dose could be provided for very low costs - in case the
government would provide this. It should - of course - be limited to
real addictive people and in fact for free, because the objective of
such activity is not, to help people to a woozy head, but to dry out the
market for such substances.

The Dutch way of selling pot in cafés is in my eyes silly and not really
helpful. Mariuana is not as harmless as many people think. It is from my
impression very psychoactive and could create severe mental problems.


TH

On 10/8/2011 5:13 PM, Thomas Heger wrote:

...
Alcohol is a drug in a way and cigarettes make quite addictive, but that
was not, what I meant with illegal drugs.
I mean stuff like crack or heroine. These create a certain kind of
physical addiction, that is very hard to cure and forces the addictive
person to use these substances, unless they want to get severe pain and
health problems.

Like any substance, the price depends. It is a question of the way,
these substances are produced and not of the stuff itself. In
Afghanistan a great deal of the raw material is produced. This could be
bought there for relatively moderate prices. The processing to a drug is
usual chemical work, that any good pharmaceutical plant could do.
...

In areas of So. America, Coca Leaf is legal. I think the wife and I
were on a train in Bolivia when we had our first cup of coca tea --
delightful stuff! As good or better than coffee, indeed a mix of coca
leaf with coffee beans is an ideal pick-me-up!

Coca tea should certainly be available here in the USA ... and, like
pot, the government should keep their noses out of others business and
what plants they consume ... if you are in public and endangering
yourself or others, different story ... if you are committing a crime,
different story, etc.

It was an insane plan to ever attempt to outlaw God given plants. I
don't know what insanity ever made it seem different, what thinking made
us wish to punish people for using plants, etc. ... but someday we will
have to return to sanity and tell the control freaks to mind their own
business and quit locking up people for using plants and committing no
other crime(s.) For one thing, we simply can't afford it, never could,
really ...

Regards,
JS

On Oct 8, 5:13*pm, Thomas Heger wrote:
Am 09.10.2011 00:23, schrieb RHF:







On Oct 8, 10:36 am, Thomas *wrote:
Am 07.10.2011 00:07, schrieb RD Sandman:

Thomas * *wrote in news:9f4n06F18qU1
@mid.individual.net:

Your "state of security" is based on ignorant presumptions and a
willigness to abrogate your responsibility to yourself, your family
and
your fellow citizens.

That is blatant nonsense!
If you want less crime in your country, than it's better to solve a few
problems, than to send in troops.

I thought this conversation was about self defence of family, etc.. *That
is not a call for troops.

Crimes are usually not unavoidable like bad weather.

Some crimes are. *One can do a lot to avoid crimes like not getting
involved with gangs or drugs, but some trouble comes seeking you, not the
other way around.

(maybe I have to stick to my position. But I would agree with you somehow.)

But think about drugs, for example.

A drug is a substance, that people like to take, because it makes them a
bit relaxed, woozy or alike.

Usually the criminals don't want to make people woozy, but intend to get
money from them. To avoid drug related crimes, one should try to make it
harder, to gain something from selling drugs.

This could be done, if the drug itself is not the subject of prosecution
or the addictive person, but drug trafficking and trade.

The addictive person had to be cured, where possible and less people
should start new drug experiences.

- Than those, that remain addictive could
- be provided with the drugs in a kind of
- medical situation for free.

TH,

So then you would also Open 'RX' Bars and
Administer Unlimited Quantities of Alcohol
to Certified Habitual {Lifetime} Drunks
and Repeat DUI Drivers*.

* After Revoking their License to Drive
and Impounding their Car/Truck.

? What About Free* Cigarettes& *Cigars for
All Who Can Not Quit Smoking !
* 'RX' Smoke Shops

? why should 'i' work all day and pay taxes
to support someone else not working; plus
pay for them to get high/loaded ?
=no=joy= =no=joy= =no=joy= ~ RHF
* .

Alcohol is a drug in a way and cigarettes make quite addictive, but that
was not, what I meant with illegal drugs.
I mean stuff like crack or heroine. These create a certain kind of
physical addiction, that is very hard to cure and forces the addictive
person to use these substances, unless they want to get severe pain and
health problems.

Like any substance, the price depends. It is a question of the way,
these substances are produced and not of the stuff itself. In
Afghanistan a great deal of the raw material is produced. This could be
bought there for relatively moderate prices. The processing to a drug is
usual chemical work, that any good pharmaceutical plant could do.

- So the single dose could be provided for
- very low costs - in case the government
- would provide this. It should - of course
- be limited to real addictive people and
- in fact for free,

Alcoholics are 'real addictive people' too !

Equal [RX] Treatment Under the Law would
require Free Alcohol for Drunks
-if- Free Drugs is provided for Dopers.

Tobacco Smokers are 'real addictive people' too !

Equal [RX] Treatment Under the Law would
require Free Cigarettes/Cigars for Smokers
-if- Free Drugs is provided for Dopers.

-again- ? why should 'i' work all day and
pay taxes to support someone else not working;
pluspay for them to get high/loaded on
illegal drugs & alcohol & tobacco ?
=no=joy= =no=joy= =no=joy= ~ RHF

Next week on Thursday at 5:30 AM on the TCM channel, Escape from East
Berlin movie.Doggy and I will be getting our beauty sleep at that time
of the night/morning.I have seen that movie a few times before.

Wedding, in North Western Berlin, there is a reconstructed section of
the wall and a museum there.
http://www.europe-cities.com/en/583/.../19053_wedding

We gots 'The Red Baron' on the TCM channel right now, Flight Commander
movie.

Snoopy and the Red Baron.
cuhulin

Am 09.10.2011 04:18, schrieb RHF:
On Oct 8, 5:13 pm, Thomas wrote:
Am 09.10.2011 00:23, schrieb RHF:


Alcohol is a drug in a way and cigarettes make quite addictive, but that
was not, what I meant with illegal drugs.
I mean stuff like crack or heroine. These create a certain kind of
physical addiction, that is very hard to cure and forces the addictive
person to use these substances, unless they want to get severe pain and
health problems.

Like any substance, the price depends. It is a question of the way,
these substances are produced and not of the stuff itself. In
Afghanistan a great deal of the raw material is produced. This could be
bought there for relatively moderate prices. The processing to a drug is
usual chemical work, that any good pharmaceutical plant could do.

- So the single dose could be provided for
- very low costs - in case the government
- would provide this. It should - of course
- be limited to real addictive people and
- in fact for free,

Alcoholics are 'real addictive people' too !

Equal [RX] Treatment Under the Law would
require Free Alcohol for Drunks
-if- Free Drugs is provided for Dopers.

Tobacco Smokers are 'real addictive people' too !

Equal [RX] Treatment Under the Law would
require Free Cigarettes/Cigars for Smokers
-if- Free Drugs is provided for Dopers.

-again- ? why should 'i' work all day and
pay taxes to support someone else not working;
pluspay for them to get high/loaded on
illegal drugs& alcohol& tobacco ?
=no=joy= =no=joy= =no=joy= ~ RHF
.

The government is not responsible for your daily kicks.
What I have written is a (possible) way to reduce drug-related crimes.

These crimes and the addictive people produce enormous costs for the
general public, because the police has to be behind them, they occupy
prison cells and beds in hospitals. They do not really work, and if they
do something, than mostly illegal stuff.

Besides the health risk (Aids for example) and the dangers of crimes,
the costs are also worth to mention.

To reduce these costs, the policy about drugs could be changed. Than
taking the drug isn't wanted, but not a crime. Only drug-trade is
prosecuted.

And to dry out the market, the drugs are handed out for free, but only
to the real addictive people and only in special centres. This will not
allow any profit - or at least much less - from drug trading.

If the addictive person gets his daily dose, the related crimes could be
greatly reduced. This alone would be a justification. But there is more,
since the income from drugs are often used to finance other unwanted
activities. (All the third-world guerillas for example live more or less
from drugs.)

Anyhow: things like this will not happen, because positive effects for
you are negative effects for other people, that are not really happy
about loosing their income.


TH

Have Gunnnnn, Will Travel, reads the carrrd of a mannnnn,,,,,, Paladin,
Paladin, where do you roammmmm?,,,,,,,,, three sheets in the wind, and
back again,,,, Paladin, Paladin,,,,,,,
cuhulin