"Steve" wrote in message
...
Ya, and you're not a 'real' bowler either unless you have a $500 bowling
ball.

And you're not a 'real' fisherman until you've caught a Marlin off the
coast of Mexico either.

It's only a hobby. If you don't like it, pick another one!




You use what you can afford. I bought my first ham set up for like $50
used - it was all I could afford at the time AND I had to fabricate some
things to boot. I got my feet wet with it and it kept me interested. Not
everyone can afford the "best". It doesn't mean they're any less of a
hobbiest in that particular field. "I" do not try to keep up with the Jones'
as they say. IF my friend comes home with a brand new radio - it doesn't
mean I'll run out to buy one. Same with a bowling ball, etc. That NEW radio,
bowling ball, fishing (equipment) / expedition, hunting rifle - isn't going
to promise a damned thing. Human intervention "still" counts. Take astronomy
as a hobby...... there are bigger and better(?) telescopes supported by
large universities or other groups. Still - many finds are done with the
smaller back yard telescopes. It's not the size - the cost that count. The
"user" has to do something to make it count. AND in many cases - be it
finding a rare station on the bands, an asteroid, bowling all strikes,
etc........ LUCK has a hell of a lot to do with it. Even the best in
esperience and equipment - fail - sometimes.

Given a choice between a new H.F. rig and either an old boat anchor OR a
homebrew rig to make a contact with, I'd pick the latter - hands down. It
tends to give you a tad more pride using such old equipment that maybe you
repaired or bought cheap OR built from scratch. Personally, I had an HW 101
and now have a TS440S (bought new when offered). If the Heathkit had as many
bells and whistles as the Kenwood - only in the extra bands - I'd take it
hands down. I love the audio of the tube radios over the newer radios. The
Kenwood had an Autotuner - I could tune the Heath with an outboard tuner
faster than that dumb autotuner did the Kenwood - in many cases. Point
being, those older radios are not as sophisticated as the new stuff, but
they sure still performed. Being new, being eh - better(?) isn't what it is
always about. And even the homebrew stuff, be it solid state OR tube - when
it comes alive with audio out of the speaker - or putting out that first
signal over the air waves - there is no better feeling.

You have a ham license and buy a used rig - you're a ham. Buy a used bowling
ball, go bowling as often as possible - you're a bowler. Go fishing as often
as possible even with a $10 fishing pole, you're a fisherman. Pitch a tent
with a sheet over a line - you're a camper. Too many people worry about
"impressing" others. Do you do code? IF so, is it at 5 wpm or 60? WHO
CARES - you're enjoying the hobby at your own level.

lou-ka3flu

"clfe" wrote in message
...
"Steve" wrote in message
...
Ya, and you're not a 'real' bowler either unless you have a $500 bowling
ball.

And you're not a 'real' fisherman until you've caught a Marlin off the
coast of Mexico either.

It's only a hobby. If you don't like it, pick another one!




You use what you can afford. I bought my first ham set up for like $50
used - it was all I could afford at the time AND I had to fabricate some
things to boot. I got my feet wet with it and it kept me interested. Not
everyone can afford the "best". It doesn't mean they're any less of a
hobbiest in that particular field. "I" do not try to keep up with the
Jones' as they say. IF my friend comes home with a brand new radio - it
doesn't mean I'll run out to buy one. Same with a bowling ball, etc. That
NEW radio, bowling ball, fishing (equipment) / expedition, hunting rifle -
isn't going to promise a damned thing. Human intervention "still" counts.
Take astronomy as a hobby...... there are bigger and better(?) telescopes
supported by large universities or other groups. Still - many finds are
done with the smaller back yard telescopes. It's not the size - the cost
that count. The "user" has to do something to make it count. AND in many
cases - be it finding a rare station on the bands, an asteroid, bowling
all strikes, etc........ LUCK has a hell of a lot to do with it. Even the
best in esperience and equipment - fail - sometimes.

Given a choice between a new H.F. rig and either an old boat anchor OR a
homebrew rig to make a contact with, I'd pick the latter - hands down. It
tends to give you a tad more pride using such old equipment that maybe you
repaired or bought cheap OR built from scratch. Personally, I had an HW
101 and now have a TS440S (bought new when offered). If the Heathkit had
as many bells and whistles as the Kenwood - only in the extra bands - I'd
take it hands down. I love the audio of the tube radios over the newer
radios. The Kenwood had an Autotuner - I could tune the Heath with an
outboard tuner faster than that dumb autotuner did the Kenwood - in many
cases. Point being, those older radios are not as sophisticated as the new
stuff, but they sure still performed. Being new, being eh - better(?)
isn't what it is always about. And even the homebrew stuff, be it solid
state OR tube - when it comes alive with audio out of the speaker - or
putting out that first signal over the air waves - there is no better
feeling.

You have a ham license and buy a used rig - you're a ham. Buy a used
bowling ball, go bowling as often as possible - you're a bowler. Go
fishing as often as possible even with a $10 fishing pole, you're a
fisherman. Pitch a tent with a sheet over a line - you're a camper. Too
many people worry about "impressing" others. Do you do code? IF so, is it
at 5 wpm or 60? WHO CARES - you're enjoying the hobby at your own level.

lou-ka3flu

Code - CW........ a big argument over someone doing it or not........ WHY?
When I got into Ham, I got into CW for a while, but then as now, I'm NOT in
love with it. At that time, RTTY (Radio Teletype - for those who may not
know) was still fairly big. Packet came in as did other modes. I "tried"
RTTY - to me, as CW/Code is to some of you - it was BORING. You could also
argue how RTTY could save a life. Any mode "could" under the right
conditions. Someone may be aware of a situation and have had ONLY an RTTY
machine - send the message to another with other equipment who then gets the
help enroute to help the distressed. Let's say someone in a lighthouse seen
a sinking ship and they only had the RTTY working. So - yes it may be far
fetched but show how a "single" mode "could" "help" save a life. To bring it
all together - again I say - you use what you have and to your level. IF you
help save a life - congradulations. If you merely spend a quiet evening
getting enjoyment out of it, more power to you. I would have found packet
boring too, but it was before the internet got going hot and heavy - and it
allowed me to get and receive "typed" messages to my friends who were
licensed and so equipped.- just like e-mail for those of you who aren't
familiar with packet. Pick a mode, try it - if ya like it - use it. If not,
try another one. To each - his/her own.

Slow Code wrote:
Just thought you should know that.
OTOH SC I am not disqualified from being a real ham by your title

Are you ****ing stoned???

If it weren't for no code, there would be no new Hams! Another 20 years and
all you legitimate code endorsed hams will be dx'ing with the worms. We have
to go with the times fool!

We've already lost 80% of interest to the Internet and all the IM's email
and all.. You clearly are living in the dark ages..

If we are to save amateur radio at all, we need numbers. We've already lost
too much spectrum due to the lack of use. So what if no code'rs gain access
to HF? It's either that or we loose HF to the commercial interests.

I took the 13 and used code a grand total of one time in the last 16 years.

Asshole.



"Slow Code" wrote in message
nk.net...
Just thought you should know that.


Help save Ham radio and ignore Markie to save
usenet. Thanks


1- No more automatic renewals. Individuals must retest and pass all
elements required for their license class every ten years.


2- The passing score for written exams needs to be raised to 85%.


3- Code elements should be 13 wpm for General, and 20 wpm for Extra.


4- Make the no-code license one year non-renewable.


5- Cancel your ARRL membership until they decide to work to improve
things and stop them from proposing ham radio that is like CB.

On Sun, 23 Jul 2006 21:13:25 -0700, "Jimmy Mac"
wrote:

Another 20 years and
all you legitimate code endorsed hams will be dx'ing with the worms. We have
to go with the times fool!

Oh? Then you're in favor of REAL testing about digital modes? Like
questions on how Rayleigh fading limits bit rates on HF? That sort of
"the times"? (Or didn't you know that, without frame shifting,
digital modes cause problems on HF?)

Or are you one of those who favors as little testing as can be gotten
away with?

If we are to save amateur radio at all, we need numbers.

So you'd rather have millions of unqualified hams who know nothing
about radio than a few hundred thousand who do. We already have a
Citizen's Band - we don't need a dozen more of them.

Al Klein wrote:


Or are you one of those who favors as little testing as can be gotten
away with?

Yup, as a person who has been a ham for 35 years, yup that's what I believe.

If we are to save amateur radio at all, we need numbers.

I absolutely agree.

So you'd rather have millions of unqualified hams who know nothing
about radio than a few hundred thousand who do.

Yup, that's what I also believe. Get people into the service and they
will start learning what they need to know on their own.


We already have a
Citizen's Band - we don't need a dozen more of them.

Actually the CB argument is really old. I got a CB radio for a trip two
years ago so my 20 something daughters could talk on it. The reality is
that hardly anyone is on CB either. Channel 19 was pretty quiet
compared to what is sounded like 20 years ago.

So not only are people avoiding ham radio, they are also avoiding CB.
Find a new argument Al for keeping people out of ham radio will you?

On Mon, 24 Jul 2006 08:56:58 -0400, "J. D. B."
wrote:

Yup, that's what I also believe. Get people into the service and they
will start learning what they need to know on their own.

What color is the sky on your world? (If you were correct, most CBers
would have a pretty good knowledge of electronics and propagation.)

So not only are people avoiding ham radio, they are also avoiding CB.

So how does CW enter into things?

Find a new argument Al for keeping people out of ham radio will you?

Oh? It's not MY argument that CW keeps people from using radios, it's
YOURS! And you just destroyed your own best argument.

Al, you and the rest of the old farts want CW to keep ham radio from
becoming like CB - right? CW does not keep people from using radios, it
keeps people from seeking a amateur radio license. You and the rest of
the crusty old and out-dated hams think that CW is kind of a filter or
the price of admission. It's an over-rated and over-priced ticket.

CBers do not have to have a good knowledge of electronics and
propagation to use the radio because there is little else for them to
venture into - unlike ham radio. But then again, there are darn few
CBers anymore. You, like many other crusty old hams, hang onto this
notion that there are so many CBers out there and that the CB band is
still out of control like it was 25 years ago. It's not. It's somewhat
quiet as people have left CB behind just like they are leaving ham radio
behind - but each for different reasons. CB because cell phones have
replaced its usage and the speed limit isn't 55 anymore. Ham radio has
been left behind because of its image as a hobby for morse code freaks
and glowing tubes. The CW testing requirement just reinforces that belief.

Old fart crusty hams like yourself who continue to promote CW and CW
testing keep reinforcing the belief that the hobby is old and crusty
like yourselves and keep people out in favor of other interest where
they don't have to take a test to get involved and have fun.

I am not destroying any argument, you just cannot follow simple logic.
Face it, we can spar back and forth on this forever. The reality is
that CW testing in the US is going to die soon. You cannot stop the
change. Most of the rest of the world has already changed - the US
cannot be far behind. Be it now, or ten years from now, CW testing is
going to be gone, out of here, adios, good riddance and so long.
Hopefully it will not happen too late. The longer the CW requirement
remains, the closer ham radio is to death.

Al Klein wrote:
On Mon, 24 Jul 2006 08:56:58 -0400, "J. D. B."
wrote:

Yup, that's what I also believe. Get people into the service and they
will start learning what they need to know on their own.

What color is the sky on your world? (If you were correct, most CBers
would have a pretty good knowledge of electronics and propagation.)

So not only are people avoiding ham radio, they are also avoiding CB.

So how does CW enter into things?

Find a new argument Al for keeping people out of ham radio will you?

Oh? It's not MY argument that CW keeps people from using radios, it's
YOURS! And you just destroyed your own best argument.

Slow Code wrote:
Just thought you should know that.


Help save Ham radio and ignore Markie to save
usenet. Thanks


1- No more automatic renewals. Individuals must retest and pass all
elements required for their license class every ten years.


2- The passing score for written exams needs to be raised to 85%.


3- Code elements should be 13 wpm for General, and 20 wpm for Extra.


4- Make the no-code license one year non-renewable.


5- Cancel your ARRL membership until they decide to work to improve
things and stop them from proposing ham radio that is like CB.

I can't for the life of me understand why there is so much concern over
learning code. After 20 yrs in radiation physics (ionizing, not RF
communications) as a living, I finally decided to go for an amature
radio license. It wasn't until I got here that I learned about this
rift in the community (I have seen it in a few places)....granted it
may be a few spirited individuals on each side that perpetuate this
argument of learning code. I'm very dismayed by this rift, I wanted to
join a fellow group of RF communication enthusianists. I don't need a
segration here too...there is enough of that society already, I don't
need that in a hobby too. I hear my family calling....thats were my
time needs to be spent.
Bruce
Duluth, MN

Slow Code wrote:
Just thought you should know that.


Help save Ham radio and ignore Markie to save
usenet. Thanks


1- No more automatic renewals. Individuals must retest and pass all
elements required for their license class every ten years.


2- The passing score for written exams needs to be raised to 85%.


3- Code elements should be 13 wpm for General, and 20 wpm for Extra.


4- Make the no-code license one year non-renewable.


5- Cancel your ARRL membership until they decide to work to improve
things and stop them from proposing ham radio that is like CB.