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KØHB April 18th 05 06:38 PM

wrote in message
oups.com...


TTY rates jumped from 60 WPM to
100 WPM,

Hardly a "jump", Len. More like a slide.


I'll have to side with Len on this one. It was a JUMP, not a slide or a
slither.

When the USN fleet broadcasts shifted to JASON cover (100WPM) from black
uncovered (60WPM), estimates are that the TTY casualty rate approached 75%.

Machines which had been happily chugging along for years on 60WPM gears
literally self-destructed when 100WPM gears were installed.

73, de Hans, K0HB
Master Chief Radioman, US Navy

KØHB April 18th 05 06:45 PM

wrote in message
oups.com...

That was necessary to insure the secure "rotor machine"
encryption terminals (on-line or off-line capable)
for Command orders and responses.

No, it wasn't necessary. The most popular "rotor machine" crypto system in us
in ALL Navy ships was the off-line KL7 "ADONIS" system. It was incapable of
on-line connection, and did not require TTY to transmit messages. Morse worked
just fine, and 98% of all the "5-letter-coded-group" messages were generated on
KL7 off-line machines.

73, de Hans, K0HB
Master Chief Radioman, US Navy

Lloyd April 18th 05 07:16 PM

"KØHB" wrote in message
ink.net...

wrote in message
oups.com...

That was necessary to insure the secure "rotor machine"
encryption terminals (on-line or off-line capable)
for Command orders and responses.

No, it wasn't necessary. The most popular "rotor machine" crypto system
in us in ALL Navy ships was the off-line KL7 "ADONIS" system. It was
incapable of on-line connection, and did not require TTY to transmit
messages. Morse worked just fine, and 98% of all the
"5-letter-coded-group" messages were generated on KL7 off-line machines.

73, de Hans, K0HB
Master Chief Radioman, US Navy


How many other crypto systems were there in existence that you
did not have a "Need To Know" about?

73,

Lloyd

Paul W. Schleck April 18th 05 08:03 PM
In . com writes:

wrote:
From: on Apr 12, 8:00 pm
wrote:
From: N2EY on Apr 12, 4:20 pm

*snip!*

Yet you make this BIG THING about morse code
in a window display...

Is it wrong to mention an interesting architectural feature?

Morse code is NOW an "interesting architectural feature?"

The windows are an interesting architectural feature.


Way back in Usenet history(early 90's), there were posts signed by an
author named "Serdar Argic" who repetitively posted about the Armenian
murders of Turks in 1918:

http://www.jaedworks.com/shoebox/zumabot.html

(Reputable historians agree that the killing was the other way around.)

Some interesting similarities to Len:


- Serdar responded to each and every mention of "Turkey" or "Armenia,"
no matter the context, with long harangues about his interpretation of
history.

- Len responds to each and every mention of "Morse Code," no matter the
context, with long harangues about his interpretation of history.


- Any attempt to engage Serdar in debate resulted in him insulting
others with invectives like "Gum Brain," "Wieneramus," "your
Criminal Armenian Grandparents" (even others who were, say, ethnic
Japanese), and "A mouthpiece for the fascist x-Soviet Armenian
Government."

- Any attempt to engage Len in debate results in him insulting others
with invectives like "Gunnery Nurse," "Katapult King," "Macho
Morsemen," and "A believer in the Church of St. Hiram."


- While somewhat amusing at first, with posters able to easily rebut
Serdar, even writing parodies mocking the overwrought style of the
posts, the amusement turned to annoyance when the sheer volume of his
posts overwhelmed any on-topic discussion.

- While somewhat amusing at first, with posters able to easily rebut
Len, even writing parodies mocking the overwrought style of the posts,
the amusement turned to annoyance when the sheer volume of his posts
overwhelmed any on-topic discussion.


- Serdar failed his Turing Test for human intelligence when it became
clear that he could not distinguish between Turkey, the country, and
Turkey, the meat. For example, his postings went up dramatically in
the first two weeks preceding American Thanksgiving, strongly
suggesting that the posts were written and posted by some kind of AI
or "bot."

- Len's sentience, and ability to pass the Turing Test, is left as an
exercise for the reader. As a first test, Len is invited to guess my
positions on Morse Code.


--
73, Paul W. Schleck, K3FU

http://www.novia.net/~pschleck/
Finger for PGP Public Key

[email protected] April 18th 05 10:34 PM
From: "K4YZ" on Mon,Apr 18 2005 2:26 am

wrote:
From: "bb" on Sun,Apr 17 2005 4:37 pm

Case in point is others' opinions. Robeson labels those
as "LIES," perhaps even "deceit" even though those are
just personal opinions. Apparently, in Stevieworld,
only Stevie Robeson has the "truth." Ergo, in the logic
of Stevieworld, ALL contrary (to Robeson's) opinions
are "LIES" as well as "errors" and "deceit."

That's quite sick. Irrational. Opinions are just
opinions.

Opinions are just opinions when they start off "My opinion on the
subject is..." Or "I think it would be better if..." THOSE are
opinions.

Stop blabbering like a petulant child. Get with the program
in computer-modem communications. YOU DON'T DO WHAT YOU
YOU JUST COMMANDED.

You are NOT a "commander" of a damn thing in here. You can't
control yourself or your angry, petulant, emotional outbursts.

Lies and deceit are things like "The ARRL BoD is dishonest" or
"ARES won't be able to respond becasue their members are too old and
oover obligated

"...oover obligated..." Finish what you write.

Those are OPINIONS. No "law" requires prefacing "every"
OPINION with your orders of the day. Kiss off.


Quite true, but Robeson hasn't learned to communicate
with rational people yet. He simply drives home a
blunt point that HE IS RIGHT with no proof or other
reference that it IS right.

(A) Neither Leonard H Anderson or Brian P Burke are rational.
They both make statements in public forum contrary to the presence of
data that contradicts their assertions.

WHAT "data?" Robeson has presented NO "data."

(B) Nice try on the "no proof" assertions, Lennie....And only
MORE proof that I am correct in calling you a liar.

Robeson has NO "proof." All Robeson has is a seemingly
unending list of personal insults against all those who
disagree with him.

Your marionette is presently avoiding answering questions about
his assertions of the viability of ARES in the face of NUMEROUS news
releases to the contrary.

NO ONE is any "marionette."

Your (usual) petulant outburst in another demonstrated
fit of anger shows you have little "proof" of anything
but your own anger and hatred of anyone saying the least
negative thing about your own opinions.

Huge snip of ususal obnxious verbosity to.....

Other Amateur Extras seem unable to take any strong
action to stop his pollution of all threads in this
newsgroup. All threads eventually turn into Robeson's
insults of all his "opponents" in any discussion.
A few have made negative comments to his style, notably
Hans Brakob. Responses to those by Robeson were less
than civil and uncomplimentary.

While I have no doubt that not everyone approves of my "up in
your
face" methology of dealing with the two of you, I DO notice that NONE
of them, other than to acknowledge your "First Amendment Right" to do
so, "support" YOUR presence here, Lennie.

Tsk. Robeson should have all kinds of "doubt." :-)

Robeson not only acts like the sociopath but has a
monstrous EGO thinking that his "in your face" insult-
fest is "approved" by those that count. :-)

It dosen't take one of those "inquiring minds" to know why....

You are both liiars.

What is a "liiar?" List the "LIES" supposedly said in here.

You don't do what you'll say you'll do.

Robeson has yet to "do what he says he will do." :-)

Namely PROVE the existance of this imaginary "fitrep"
person he says evaluated me at NADC 34 years ago. :-)

Robeson has yet to acknowledge that the Department of
Defense DOES DIRECT MARS...even when given the link to the
latest document issued by the DoD.

Robeson has yet to state the WHEN and WHERE of his mighty
"hostile action" experiences.

They're tired of the same "Back in 1953...." war satories.

Well, regardless of the anger-induced typos ("satories"),
I did work big-time HF communications for three straight
years beginning in 1953. Robeson has NOT done anything
close to that. Robeson has NEVER worked in electronics
engineering as either civilian or military member, yet
presumes to be "knowledgeable" about engineering after a
very short-term job as a purchasing agent!

You'e deceitful.

Present the "proof." Describe the WHY where ALL MUST
do exactly what they (allegedly) "promised" years ago.

Robeson does little else but hurl personal insults at
those who do not agree with him. That gets him the
attention he seems to be desperately seeking. Robeson
manages to turn EVERY thread in this newsgroup into his
own "FIGHT" with all those who disagree with him.

It really is THAT simple.

Robeson IS "that simple."

Robeson is an EXAMPLE of a modern U.S. Amateur Extra.

[email protected] April 18th 05 10:53 PM
K=D8HB wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...

TTY rates jumped from 60 WPM to
100 WPM,

Hardly a "jump", Len. More like a slide.

I'll have to side with Len on this one. It was a JUMP, not a slide
or a
slither.

Poor choice of words on my part, Hans.

A better choice would be "step up" or "incremental increase".
I think of a "jump" as an order-of-magnitude increase, like
60 wpm to 600 wpm, etc.

When the USN fleet broadcasts shifted to JASON cover (100WPM) from
black
uncovered (60WPM), estimates are that the TTY casualty rate
approached 75%.

I can understand why!

Machines which had been happily chugging along for years on 60WPM
gears
literally self-destructed when 100WPM gears were installed.

didn't they test the machines at 100 before the changeover?

73 de Jim, N2EY

[email protected] April 18th 05 11:28 PM
wrote:
From: on Sun,Apr 17 2005 9:29 am

wrote:
From: on Sat,Apr 16 2005 8:44 am

You're misquoting all over the place, Len. But it doesn't matter.
Here, I'll clear it up:

This is NOT a court of law and "exactness" of quoting
is NOT required...

Are you afraid of exact quotes, Len? You seem to be.

except by those who live for the
pitiful "word battle" and self-glorification.

You mean like someone who needs to talk about his past
as a PROFESSIONAL over and over and over again?

MARS and amateur radio aren't the same thing. But many radio
amateurs
are involved in MARS.

The MILITARY Affiliate Radio System is DIRECTED by the
Department of Defense. They function quite well by
sole use of military personnel.

No hams are involved in MARS?

See the links to the
actual words of the DoD DIRECTIVE posted in here...see
the links to several of the "Grecian Firebolt" radio
exercises posted in here.

Were you a part of that exercise, Len?

That's my position. If Steve says different, argue with *him*.

Considering that James P. Miccolis is a "good buddie"
of that wonderful representative of a modern U.S.
Amateur Extra, that is a specious comment of yours. :-)

Not specious at all, Len. You hold me responsible for what someone
else does. Doesn't work like that, Len.

You HAVE supported him in the recent past and not long
ago disavowed any attempt to control his emotional
outbursts.

What you're saying is that if I agree with him on something,
I'm somehow responsible for everything he does.

MARS always was and remains a MILITARY radio system.

But most of the participants aren't in the military.

How do YOU know?

I have sources, Len.

Tsk, tsk, tsk. That is acceptible

"acceptable", Len. A PROFESSIONAL writer doesn't make
such mistakes. ;-)

ONLY to reputable
journalistic practice. YOU are NOT a "reputable
journalist." You do NOT have the qualifications.
You are NOT INVOLVED in journalism. :-)

Neither are you, Len.

Do you feel insulted by my posts, Len? It seems so - you seem to
find
insult in everything.

Not me.

Yes, you.

You are the one with daydreaming about the
"need" of morsemanship in amateur radio licensing
test.

You really are unable to handle opposition and difference of
viewpoints, Len.

Oh, yes, that ties right in with a Canadian museum
having morse code in its window...sure...

Those windows really seem to bother you.

? I wash windows. I like Microsoft windows.

I figured you for a Mac user, Len. ;-)

What "bothers" me is that a NON-SERVUNG

"SERVUNG"?

What does that mean?

(EVER) person
tried to make out like he was the "expert" on the
United States military use of radio.

I don't claim to be an expert on anything, Len. I think
the fact that I pointed out some of your mistakes really
burns your bacon.

You are NOT QUALIFIED for such a judgement. shrug

Sure I am.

What has that to do with your claim that:

"If you ain't got the guts to tell the details, you AIN'T done it.
Simple as that."

That's what you wrote, Len. Does it only apply to Steve and not to
Brian.

Simple. Brian has NOT insulted me personally, not even
many times over. Robeson HAS and continues to do it.

Ah, I see.

If someone agrees with you and demonstrates the proper kudos,
you accept what they say as absolute fact, without any details or
supporting evidence.

But if someone disagrees with you, and maybe "returns your fire"
in the form of name calling and other jackass behavior, you
demand "proof" and deny the reality of their experience. In fact,
you claim that:

"If you ain't got the guts to tell the details, you AIN'T done it.
Simple as that."

Of course you've also demonstrated that no matter what proof is
presented, you won't accept it, and will attack the messenger.

So there's no reason to give you details or proof.

I'm just showing what a damn LIAR he is.

What lie?

The claim he has made is that he found someone who knew you from
when
you were allegedly at NADC. And that someone says you didn't do such
a
great job there.

That's the LIE you are referring to.

That he found someone, or what the person said?

Why do you say "allegedly" there?

Because I don't know for sure. You've made mistakes before.

Why should I accept your words as fact when you don't accept mine?

If you don't believe I
was there (I was), then Robeson's claim is irrelevant.

No, it isn't.

Either you were there, or you weren't. That's objective reality.
Whether I believe it or not doesn't affect whether you were
there or not.

You claim without proof that no such person exists. So it's your
word against his.

Why do you feel you are INVOLVED with Robeson?

What involvement? I'm simply pointing out some facts.

You've already disavowed any capability of controlling
his emotional tantrums in here.

So? *You* can't control his emotional tantrums "in here", either,
despite all your alleged knowledge of human nature and psychology, etc.

In fact, Len, you can't even control your own emotional tantrums "in
here" ;-)

Now maybe it's true and maybe it isn't. But it's basically your word
against that of some unknown person.

IMAGINARY person.

The only way that could be proved true is if:

1) You were never at NADC, so nobody could know you from there.

2) Everyone who knew you there is now dead or otherwise unable to
communicate with Steve.

3) You have complete information that no one you knew there has
communicated with Steve.

I can't "disprove" something that doesn't exist.

So it's your word against his. Nothing more or less.

If you wish a reference to the fact that I WAS at NADC
or that I worked with NADC engineers in the 1970s, you
can verify that with KD6JG.

Why? Was he there with you? How do I know his information is reliable?

More important - how would it prove that Steve has not communicated
with someone who knew you there?

Jimmie boy, you are getting VERY tiring with all this
"intellectual word gaming" in here.

Now there you go, Len, trying to make me angry by calling me names.

The fact is you know you've painted yourself into a logical corner,
and you're trying to bluff and bluster your way out.

Can't you take "strong opposition"?

All you are doing
is WASTING TIME of others.

How? I'm simply pointing out some of your mistakes and holes in your
logic. Do you consider what you write to be a waste of time?

I have plenty of time but
grow tired of your constant petulance.

What "petulance", Len? I'm not calling you names.

You have NO return on any investment.

That's not what my monthly statements say! ;-)

All you seem to do is follow
your buddie's word and SUPPORT him. You have NO proof
that this imaginary "reference" of Robeson exists,
can NOT present it to anyone else.

I'm not trying to prove it one way or the other. That's for
you and Steve to do. I'm just pointing out that your claims
are as unproven as his.

It's just your word against his. Nothing more.


Why bother with
all your foolish word games in here?

Typing practice. Spelling practice. Logic practice.

Plus it's mildly amusing.

Are you that hard
up for something to do?

Not me. Obviously *you* are, though...

Bye. Off.

Sounds like a veiled command for me to shut up.

At least you won't call me a "feldwebel".

K4YZ April 18th 05 11:39 PM

wrote:
From: "K4YZ" on Mon,Apr 18 2005 2:26 am

That's quite sick. Irrational. Opinions are just
opinions.

Opinions are just opinions when they start off "My opinion on
the
subject is..." Or "I think it would be better if..." THOSE are
opinions.

Stop blabbering like a petulant child. Get with the program
in computer-modem communications. YOU DON'T DO WHAT YOU
YOU JUST COMMANDED.

I didn't "COMMAND" anything, Lennie.

You are NOT a "commander" of a damn thing in here.

Whoa! Profantiy! I am so impressed, Lennie! You are so strong
when you start hurling profanity in a fitful rage!

You can't
control yourself or your angry, petulant, emotional outbursts.

You insist I am in an angry, petulant mode, Lennie, but from
what...?!?! "Expressing my opinion"...?!?!

That "NCTA" double standard sneaking in???

Lies and deceit are things like "The ARRL BoD is dishonest" or
"ARES won't be able to respond becasue their members are too old and
oover obligated

"...oover obligated..." Finish what you write.

That was it, Lennie.

Those are OPINIONS. No "law" requires prefacing "every"
OPINION with your orders of the day. Kiss off.

OH! Now THAT was a COMMAND, Lennie! And one that even further
endears you to the ones you would seek to dominate and rule.

Too bad were on to you, eh,...?!?!

(A) Neither Leonard H Anderson or Brian P Burke are rational.
They both make statements in public forum contrary to the presence
of
data that contradicts their assertions.

WHAT "data?" Robeson has presented NO "data."

Sure I have!

Brian insisted ARES's usefulness and ability to respond to calls
was "overblown".

In the last week alone I have provided no fewer than four
references that absolutely disprove his assertion, and all of those
from news releases within DAYS of his comments.

(B) Nice try on the "no proof" assertions, Lennie....And only
MORE proof that I am correct in calling you a liar.

Robeson has NO "proof." All Robeson has is a seemingly
unending list of personal insults against all those who
disagree with him.

There's no "unending list of personal insults", Lennie.

All I have to do is recite what YOU have said and what YOU have
said you'd do then point out that you've not done it to make my point.

Your marionette is presently avoiding answering questions about
his assertions of the viability of ARES in the face of NUMEROUS news
releases to the contrary.

NO ONE is any "marionette."

Brain P Burke is. He's yours, as a matter of fact.

But he may get jealous...You've started tossing affectionate
sounding conversation in Todd's direction...We may be ringside for a
cat fight soon!

Your (usual) petulant outburst in another demonstrated
fit of anger shows you have little "proof" of anything
but your own anger and hatred of anyone saying the least
negative thing about your own opinions.

No outburst. That's your imagination running amok, Lennie.

While I have no doubt that not everyone approves of my "up in your
face" methology of dealing with the two of you, I DO notice that
NONE
of them, other than to acknowledge your "First Amendment Right" to
do
so, "support" YOUR presence here, Lennie.

Tsk. Robeson should have all kinds of "doubt."

But why?

Robeson not only acts like the sociopath but has a
monstrous EGO thinking that his "in your face" insult-
fest is "approved" by those that count.

Lennie, you ARE the complete idiot I suggest you are.

In the very paragraph YOU quoted, I stated very clearly that I
"have no doubt" about who does or doesn't approve of my methodology of
dealing with you.

Why would you then make so assinine an assertion as to suggest
that I have some ego to suggest I believe it's "approved"...?!?!

Another snip of ususal pejorative laden rhetoric (that he claims
is only used AGAINST him...)....

Robeson IS "that simple."

Not as "simple" as the alleged ex-radio engineer who makes
assinine assertions based upon quotes that clearly undermine it.

Robeson is an EXAMPLE of a modern U.S. Amateur Extra.



And the IEEE should sue to get you to stop using an IEEE address in
public. You're a humiliation to one and all.

Steve, K4YZ

KØHB April 19th 05 12:16 AM

wrote in message
oups.com...

didn't they test the machines at 100 before the changeover?

Ponder that question a minute! It's pretty hard to test a 60WPM machine at
100WPM until you convert it to 100WPM. Duh!!!

In some cases (CVA's, CL's, CA's, and flag-configured platforms) that was
possible with spare machines, but most hulls did not have that luxury. You just
swapped out the gearset and crossed your fingers. If it broke, you could always
send a CASREPT and shift to the FOX broadcast.

73, de Hans, K0HB

Mike Coslo April 19th 05 12:39 AM
wrote:

I figured you for a Mac user, Len. ;-)

Easy, Jim! I'm a Mac user. As well a PC user. But for my real work, its
a Mac.

- Mike KB3EIA -


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