wrote:
From: on Sat, Nov 26 2005 4:49 pm
Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
From: on Tues, Nov 22 2005 8:12 pm

Hmmm...not a brand I recognize in this corner of the USA. The
"Newman's Own" line of food products may not be popular farther
east in the USA? I've tried "Newman's Own" Ranch dressing but
personally prefer the "Hidden Valley" brand for Ranch dressing.

I had you pegged as a "Hidden Agenda" man.

Says "Sun-dried Tomato" from WV.

Squash him before he spoils everything...

Too late. He's gone balsamic on us.

Morsemen can do anything in impunity...or is it "special
dispensation?" They have a "mass" of lies. If only they
would go to confessional and admit them...
They have black mass and wrenchysnitch. Egg nog afterwards.

Some have "hot buttered rum" in foursomes around a fire of
oak leaves and discuss Anderson PowerPole connectors.

That may have been the topic in the cozy lodge or it may have been your
tiny, old, dusty Johnson. That Anderson Powerpole bit may be a bit of
self-aggrandizement on your part.

Everyone seems to have "thier" own opinion on the subject.

"Obvioulsy"

Anyway, probably a better solution than a twisted pair and a wire nut.
;^)

Appears to be a popular ceremony along the Atlantic states.

What was it that your Nordic ancestors did--paint their faces blue and
howl at the moon?

Or ate sardines for breakfast?

Marinated herring is pretty good with rye bread, but kippers
became the IN thing for breakfast in jolly old UK. The British
Isles had the blue face paint thing. See the fictious film
biography of Scotsman William Wallce in "Braveheart."

That wasn't factual?

See you in the CQ Worldwide DX CW 'test this weekend, Len or do you plan
to stick with the Wordwide?

Dave K8MN

Is there a CQ WWW this weekend? Never heard of it.

:-)

Maybe John Dorr could shed some light on your "assertion of fact."

Don't let the Dorr hit Davie's assertion on the way out...




A free issue of World Radio magazine showed up in my mail last week.
One editorial had some interesting things to say about emergency comms
(or is that "coms?") being incompatible with a rtty contest.

wrote:
From: on Nov 26, 8:02 pm


wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Mon 21 Nov 2005 09:41
wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Nov 20, 9:25 am

Amateur radio might be operating weak signal UHF SSB with a multi-mode,
multi-band rig. It might be operating 2m FM through a local repeater.
It might be ragchewing on 40m CW. One constant is that you aren't involved.
I don't do any RF transmission in amateur bands, with the
exception of those bands which are shared with other radio
services.
That's a very good thing!

Why? Are you morsemen so elitist you can't get along with others?

Where's my obligation to get along with you? You seemingly don't feel
any need to get along with me.

Yet I am able to communicate worldwide without
an amateur radio license or using morse code!

But not by direct radio contact.

Most absolutely INCORRECT, Jim-Jim.

Naw, he's CORRECT, Len-Len.

DIRECT from a maritime transceiver as a civilian.

You really need to work on sentence structure.

You can communicate worldwide from a maritime transceiver, Len?

DIRECT from a
government radio transmitter.

That's just a clause, Santa. Do you know where you can lay your mitts
on a government transmitter?

DIRECT as in laying on of hands,
moving controls, operating, all that stuff.

I get the feeling that your knowledge of radio operating might be a
little light. Are you of the opinion that operating a radio falls under
"all that stuff"?

And 24/7
without worrying about the ionospheric conditions! :-)

Telephone and internet. We can all do that, Len.

Then why do you fuss with morse and standards that are over
70 years old?

Do you remember that amateur radio is done for the love of radio? The
internet isn't amateur radio. A cellular telephone isn't amateur radio.
If you'd like to spend your days on the internet, that's fine. If your
thing is spending money to telephone folks via cellular phone, then have
at it.


Why do you live in the past?

Tsk, I don't.

You sure talk about it a lot, though.

You were born before 1951? YOU talked much of it in previous post.

YOU have talked much about Reggie Fessenden and his carbon-mike-in-
the-antenna "AM voice transmission" of 1906 and (allegedly) 1900.
Are you 105 years old?!?

You've written about Fessenden a number of times. Aren't you nearly
thirty-five years shy of 105?

Jimmy Noserve loves the past, always
bringing up little factoids of amateur radio history
that happened before his time.

Gee, Len, you're always bringing up little factoids of
history that happened before *your* time.

When did MY "time" begin, Jimmy? My "first radio job" in HF comms
began in 1953. I was there then, did it, came back. Never used
any morse code then on three dozen transmitters, never had to.

....and because you never had to (in your time), no one should be using
morse code in this enlightened day and age?

Are you the only one allowed to do that?

Tsk, you are getting disturbed. Calm down, just keep on bringing
up all those tidbits of "radio history" as you need to. Be mindful
of some critics, though. Not all of those are me. :-)

You've brought up numerous bits of radio history, Len. Some of them
were even correct.

"Radio" is a subset of electrical engineering.

Incorrect. It is a part of electronics, a technology discipline.


"Electronics" is a subset of electrical engineering.

INCORRECT.

Electronics is one TECHNOLOGY DISCIPLINE of physics.

Didn't Dexter teach you the correct way to look at
physics...like everyone else does?


Radio and electronics have some things in common, but they are not
identical, and one is not a subset of the other.

Amateur radio definitions seldom jibe with the rest of the
world of electronics...and radio. :-)

They seem to track pretty well, Len. You, on the other hand, haven't
done very well in here with definitions.


Do you consider U.S. amateur radio to be a HOBBY?

And much more.

And, of course, YOU do so much more... :-)

Jim does much more in amateur radio than you do. I do much more in
amateur radio than you do. The guy who received his amateur radio
license last week does so much more in amateur radio than you do.

Have you defeated any enemies of Homeland Security with your
amateur morsemanship?

Has an opportunity arisen, Len?

Have you saved any lives in the Gulf States with your amateur
morsemanship?

Many radio amateurs did so. Jim is quite some distance from the scenes
of the recent hurricanes.

NPRM 05-143 is singularly about the telegraphy test. [that's
what this "english teacher" of the thread title was commenting
on] That NPRM has NOTHING to do with radiotelephony, radiodata,
teletypewriter over radio, slow or fast-scan television,
facsimile over radio. The amateur radio license tests have
NO test elements for physically OPERATING any radio, are not
required to have radio equipment AT a license exam site.

So? Why is that significant?

Why do you consider yourself so "significant?" :-)

That wasn't a good answer, Len. Can you attach any significance to what
you've offered? Is it supposed to have meaning for us?

The sole manual test for anything at any amateur license exam
is about telegraphy, telegraphy as used on amateur radio (there
is NO landline telegraphy tested), more technically,
radiotelegraphy. As it is NOW, that is.

And that's a good thing.

It is a "good thing" only to those that took that test and
passed it, thus fulfilling the "proper jump through hoops"
of "tradition." :-)

That sounds like sour grapes on your part, Leonard. Those of us who
took and passed such an exam demonstrated that we'd reached a certain
level of competence in what is a useful skill in amateur radio.

The written test elements are prepared, both questions and
multiple-choice question answers, by the VEC QPC.

And approved by the FCC

Who else? :-)

YOU are NOT in the FCC.

I didn't see any statement by Jim that he's the FCC.

Am I saying that many radio amateurs don't know squat about
radio theory? ABSOLUTELY.

Your opinion only. And as you have demonstrated, you are not
exactly unbiased in your opinions.

Yes, MY OPINION! :-) Do you think someone else is writing
all this? :-)

It would seem to be that you've not bothered to substantiate your
opinion with fact. How many is many? How many radio amateurs have you
encountered who are deficient. What percentage of all licensed radio
amateurs do they represent?

Many radio amateurs know much more about radio theory than
you, Len.

Why is that a factor in AMATEUR radio?

I'd think it'd be something to crow about. I think many folks would be
pleased to know more about radio theory than a PROFESSIONAL.


The "National Association for Amateur Radio" (nee' ARRL) is
the "club." Even so, their membership is only one of every
five U.S. amateur radio licensees. Why aren't there more?

Some disagree with League policies
Some think membership costs too much.
Some are inactive
Some don't understand why a national organization is needed.

You have taken a Poll to confirm this? :-)

You can take it upon yourself to conduct one, Len. If you weren't
prepared to accept Jim's answers, why'd you pose the question?

Jimmy boy, YOU are a League BELIEVER. You are so far into
bias on that that all you generate are square waves.

Well, Lennie boy, what is it that you believe in? Do you believe that
the ARRL is an evil organization? You've leveled charges of dishonesty
toward the League, but you never substantiated them.

btw, No-Code International's membership is less than 1% of US amateurs
even though there are no dues and NCI membership never expires.

Highly irrelevant. NCI is NOT a "national association for amateur
radio."

No, it isn't. Can you name any such organization except for the ARRL?

It exists for ONE purpose: Elimination of the code test
from amateur radio license examinations worldwide. That's it.

There seems to have been at least one exception to that stated purpose
already.

You have no activity in amateur radio and except for one outburst almost
six years ago, there's no indication you'll ever get an amateur license.

"Outburst?!?" BWAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I prefer to call it an episode of braggadocio. It has come back to
haunt you repeatedly.

Why, oh WHY must I show "an indication of interest?!?"

One reason could be that you'd be seen as something other than a
sidewalk superintendent in amateur radio. If you have no interest, as
you've alternately claimed, you are irrelevant to amateur radio and you
become a kook who haunts an amateur radio newsgroup.

Who the fork are you to presume *I* MUST demonstrate to YOU
some kind of committment and dedication?!?!?

"Commitment", Len. Nobody forces you to show commitment or dedication.
You needn't obtain or even attempt to obtain an amateur radio license.
If you don't, you won't appear to be very credible. Your extensive
rants will be marginalized. You'll be in the same boat as a certain
English teacher.

If your ego is THAT big, then you should go over to Coslo's BBS
since you will "reach the threashold of space" long before his
big balloon will...

Are you telling him to leave, Len?

So you and the English teacher have the same level of involvement.

Nope. I am as involved as can be with my wife. None other.

....and you wife isn't amateur radio. ZIC/ZID.

As a bachelor I had an "involvement" with an English teacher,
a very nice one, in fact.

Sure, Leonard, and you're getting an "Extra right out of the box".

Try to think about marriage for YOU, Jimmy. It would make you
less of a one-track Believer.

When it was said that you have the same level of involvement as the
English teacher, you said, "I am as involved as can be with my wife.
None other". Here you seem to indicate that marriage makes one "less of
a one-track Believer". You can't even agree with you.

You're not a licensee and and except for one outburst almost
six years ago, there's no indication you'll ever get an amateur
license.

Oh, oh, there goes that control-freak EGO again, Jimmy.

Nobody is controlling you, including yourself. You shot off your mouth
when you made your boast six years ago. You haven't lived up to that
billing.

Work on that. It's bad socially.

If you think that's bad socially, you should be in the shoes of one who
shoots off his yap, saying he's going to do something, but who doesn't
follow through.

Perhaps the FCC chuckles over your comments, Len.

Irrelevant. Chances are they will take my comments seriously.

I don't think you should make that assumption, Len.

Doesn't matter, the PUBLIC has spoken to the FCC 3,794 times
through WT Docket 05-235.

It matters. How many times were you "the public" in regard to 05-235?
Of the members of the PUBLIC who spoke, how many (excluding you) didn't
share your view?


Tsk, tsk, you DO! See little gems of an accusatory nature
such as I should have obtained an amateur radio license
before accepting professional radio employment!
Who wrote that?

Dave Heil. Why aren't you paying ATTENTION to the flow? :-(

You've made another factual error, Leonard. You seem to be the person
who needs to pay ATTENTION.


See, this is what I mean when I say that you make frequent factual
errors. I invite you to tune your Icom receiver to the low ends of the
bands 160-10m this coming weekend.

Why? I have no personal interest in morse code and no interest
in amateur radio contesting. Invitation denied.

Afraid you'll be proven wrong?

Tsk, there you go again with nasty attitude. An evangelical
Believer,
wet proselyte for a battery of morse gods, an acidic base.

I offered a simple experiment. You declined. You shrunk from the
challenge.

Jimmy boy, I'm quite aware of the EM spectrum and who occupies what
"bands."

Well, Lennie boy, you'll find those radio amateur morse signals at the
low end of the bands marked "160, 80, 40, 20, 15 and 10 meters" this
weekend. They're there all the time but you'll find them in profusion
this weekend.

Have been for a very long time...ever since getting my
"first job in radio." I know spectrum occupany OUTSIDE of the ham
bands on HF, on MF, on VHF, on UHF, and on up to 2.4 GHz. WHAT are
YOU going to tell ME?

It'd be tough to reach you. You spend too much time with your
transmitter on and not enough time using the receiver.

That contests are "popular?" I could find
that out by seeing the boosterism for that in print in CQ or QST.

Was the intent to prove that contests are popular or was it to show that
morse code is alive and well in amateur radio?

Is contesting "operation" your main interest in amateur radio?
Are you more interested in awards, trophies, pretty certificates
than radio for radio's sake? It sure sounds like it since you
love getting praise, even from friends and neighbors. :-)

What would any of that be to you, Len? You aren't in amateur radio and
you wouldn't even turn on your receiver to find if the morse code is
alive and well.

This Thursday and Friday I was involved in Thanksgiving in the
literal sense. Good friends got together, didn't talk at all
about amateur radio or morse code. Sunday is another nice
get-together with good people, and I don't expect any of the
talk will be about amateur radio or morse code or contests or
the beeping state of the radio art. No "contests" of any real
kind. Sunnuvagun!

I went to an apple festival this fall. No one there talked about
amateur radio or morse code. Is that supposed to prove that morse code
is dead? I didn't hear a single person there discussing NASA, Darwin or
jazz either.

Have fun in your amateur beeping contests. Those sound very,
Very, VERY important to you. Enjoy.

Thanks for your good wishes. Those things are far more important to me
than obtaining an amateur radio license seems to be for you. Your
participation is not required.

Dave K8MN

wrote:
From: on Nov 26, 8:02 pm
wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Mon 21 Nov 2005 09:41
wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Nov 20, 9:25 am

Amateur radio might be operating weak signal UHF SSB with a multi-mode,
multi-band rig. It might be operating 2m FM through a local repeater.
It might be ragchewing on 40m CW. One constant is that you aren't involved.

I don't do any RF transmission in amateur bands, with the
exception of those bands which are shared with other radio
services.

That's a very good thing!

Why?

Because if you did "RF transmission in amateur bands" without the
proper
license, you could be breaking the law, Len. That would be a very bad
thing.

Are you morsemen so elitist you can't get along with others?

I get along with all sorts of people, Len. Including many who disagree
with
me. You're the one that has the problem getting along with others if
they
don't agree with everything you say.

Yet I am able to communicate worldwide without
an amateur radio license or using morse code!

But not by direct radio contact.

Most absolutely INCORRECT, Jim-Jim.

DIRECT from a maritime transceiver as a civilian.

Worldwide? I don't think so.

DIRECT from a government radio transmitter.

Are you authorized to do so?

DIRECT as in laying on of hands,
moving controls, operating, all that stuff.

Neither of those are *your* equipment, licensed to *you*, are they?

And 24/7
without worrying about the ionospheric conditions! :-)

Telephone and internet. We can all do that, Len.

Then why do you fuss with morse and standards that are over
70 years old?

The standards are a lot newer than "70 years old", Len.

As to why anyone would fuss with Morse Code in 2005, the
reasons are the same as why anyone would fuss with:

- cars that have manual transmissions instead of automatics
- sailboats instead of power boats
- Drawing and painting instead of photography
- Performing music instead of playing recordings
- Bicycles, running and walking for transport instead of motor vehicles
- Stairs instead of elevators
- Homemade food instead of packaged

And many more.

Why do you live in the past?

Tsk, I don't.

You sure talk about it a lot, though.

You were born before 1951?

No. Were you born before 1932? You sure talk about it a lot.

YOU talked much of it in previous post.

Because I know something of those times and the creation of the
Extra class license.

YOU have talked much about Reggie Fessenden and his carbon-mike-in-
the-antenna "AM voice transmission" of 1906 and (allegedly) 1900.

That's right. Was any of my information incorrect?

Are you 105 years old?!?

No - are you? Because you sure take issue about Fessenden's
accomplishments
even though they are before you were born.

Jimmy Noserve loves the past, always
bringing up little factoids of amateur radio history
that happened before his time.

Gee, Len, you're always bringing up little factoids of
history that happened before *your* time.

When did MY "time" begin, Jimmy? My "first radio job" in HF comms
began in 1953.

Yet you talk about 1951 and amateur radio, even though you had nothing
to do with amateur radio then.

I was there then, did it, came back. Never used
any morse code then on three dozen transmitters, never had to.

Because you were a transmitter technician, not a radio operator.

It's odd that you take pride in what you did *not* do...

Are you the only one allowed to do that?

Tsk, you are getting disturbed.

Not me.

It sure does seem that you talk about things that happened long
before you were born, but get mad when others talk about things
that happened long before *they* were born. As if it's OK for
you to do but not others.

Calm down, just keep on bringing
up all those tidbits of "radio history" as you need to. Be mindful
of some critics, though. Not all of those are me. :-)

Like who?

"Radio" is a subset of electrical engineering.

Incorrect. It is a part of electronics, a technology discipline.

Nope. It's a separate subset. Electronics does not include things
like antennas. Radio does.

"Electronics" is a subset of electrical engineering.

INCORRECT.

What parts of electronics are not covered by electrical engineering,
Len?

Electronics is one TECHNOLOGY DISCIPLINE of physics.

No, it isn't.

Physics is a science. Electrical engineering is a form of engineering,
and electronics is a subset of that.

Do try to keep up, Len. Your mistakes (like the ones Hans pointed out
about DD-214s) are embarrassing.

Didn't Dexter teach you the correct way to look at
physics...like everyone else does?

Who is "Dexter", Len?

Radio and electronics have some things in common, but they are not
identical, and one is not a subset of the other.

Amateur radio definitions seldom jibe with the rest of the
world of electronics...and radio. :-)

Yours don't jive with anything - like your spelling. Shall we call you
"Vshah101"?

Do you consider U.S. amateur radio to be a HOBBY?

And much more.

And, of course, YOU do so much more... :-)

Yes, I do. You don't.

NPRM 05-143 is singularly about the telegraphy test. [that's
what this "english teacher" of the thread title was commenting
on] That NPRM has NOTHING to do with radiotelephony, radiodata,
teletypewriter over radio, slow or fast-scan television,
facsimile over radio. The amateur radio license tests have
NO test elements for physically OPERATING any radio, are not
required to have radio equipment AT a license exam site.

So? Why is that significant?

Why do you consider yourself so "significant?" :-)

It's not about me, Len.

The sole manual test for anything at any amateur license exam
is about telegraphy, telegraphy as used on amateur radio (there
is NO landline telegraphy tested), more technically,
radiotelegraphy. As it is NOW, that is.

And that's a good thing.

It is a "good thing" only to those that took that test and
passed it, thus fulfilling the "proper jump through hoops"
of "tradition." :-)

Incorrect. There were comments to the FCC by people who had
not passed the Morse Code test which said it was a good thing
and should be retained. The English Teacher is one of them,
but not the only one.

If you actually read all of the comments, you'd know that.

When you make a sweeping general statement, and someone
proves an exception, the statement is shown to be false. That's
basic logic.

So your sweeping general statement:

"It is a "good thing" only to those that took that test and passed it"

has been proven to be untrue and invalid.

The written test elements are prepared, both questions and
multiple-choice question answers, by the VEC QPC.

And approved by the FCC

Who else? :-)

YOU are NOT in the FCC.

Neither are you, Len.

Am I saying that many radio amateurs don't know squat about
radio theory? ABSOLUTELY.

Your opinion only. And as you have demonstrated, you are not
exactly unbiased in your opinions.

Yes, MY OPINION! :-) Do you think someone else is writing
all this? :-)

Your bloviating is so voluminuous that there could be more than one
of you....;-)

Many radio amateurs know much more about radio theory than
you, Len.

I charge that based on MY life
experience in answering, as politely as possible, questions
of rather elementary level on radio theory.

Your politeness isn't exactly legendary, Len.

Tsk, your definition of "polite" seems to be everyone agreeing
with you and giving your gratuitous praise for whatever you do.

Nope. That's *your* definition.

How did they pass their written tests if they're so ignorant? Did
they get a look at a 1957 Extra test?

Why is that important here...other than satisfying your nasty
little nyah-nyahs?

Yet FCC disagrees with you, Len.

No, sweetums, YOU disagree with me. YOU are NOT the FCC.

FCC hasn't revoked their licenses. Nor has FCC required widespread
retesting of amateurs. FCC considers those folks you disdain to be
qualified to operate amateur radio stations. FCC does not consider
*you* to be qualified to operate an amateur radio station, though.

Operating is what amateur radio is really all about. All types of
operating, with all sorts of modes and equipment.

INCORRECT.

No, correct. The license is for operating, not for building.

Modes and frequencies are specifically allocated
and given in Part 97, Title 47 C.F.R. NOT "all types" as you
state. [tsk, tsk] NOT "all sorts of modes" since those are
limited. NOT "all sorts of equipment" either since there are
exceptions stated in Part 97. Look those up.

Don't have to look them up, I know them.

Technical stuff is just a means to that end.

Unimportant? Hardly important? Irrelevant?

No, just not of primary importance. A means to an end,
not the end in itself.

Then why do you permit the FCC to keep all those TECHNICAL
regulations?

Which ones? The technical regulations for amateur radio are very few,
very basic, and offer radio amateurs a lot of variety and freedom.

You just don't seem to understand that.

I just don't understand YOU, Jimmy.

It's understandable that you'd not understand a superior intellect, Len
;-) ;-)

OTOH I understand you all too well. That's why you're so hostile to me.

The "National Association for Amateur Radio" (nee' ARRL) is
the "club." Even so, their membership is only one of every
five U.S. amateur radio licensees. Why aren't there more?

Some disagree with League policies
Some think membership costs too much.
Some are inactive
Some don't understand why a national organization is needed.

You have taken a Poll to confirm this? :-)

Yes ;-)

btw, No-Code International's membership is less than 1% of US amateurs
even though there are no dues and NCI membership never expires.

Highly irrelevant.

Completely relevant. Proves the point.

NCI is NOT a "national association for amateur
radio."

That's true - it's "International". Or perhaps "Internationale"?

It exists for ONE purpose: Elimination of the code test
from amateur radio license examinations worldwide. That's it.

Len, you're and NCI BELIEVER. You're so biased that you cannot
conduct enough to see what really happens.

At least twice, NCI has gotten involved in proposed FCC rules
changes that have *nothing* to do with Morse Code testing. Of
course they have every right to comment on such changes, but
doing so disproves the claim that NCI exists for ONE purpose.

You have no activity in amateur radio and except for one outburst almost
six years ago, there's no indication you'll ever get an amateur license.

"Outburst?!?" BWAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yes. Back in January of 2000, with your 'Extra out of the box' claim.

But it's still in the box.

Why, oh WHY must I show "an indication of interest?!?"

You don't. Neither does the English Teacher you criticize so much.

Who the fork are you to presume *I* MUST demonstrate to YOU
some kind of committment and dedication?!?!?

Who do I have to be?

If your ego is THAT big, then you should go over to Coslo's BBS
since you will "reach the threashold of space" long before his
big balloon will...

So you and the English teacher have the same level of involvement.

Nope. I am as involved as can be with my wife. None other.

As a bachelor I had an "involvement" with an English teacher,
a very nice one, in fact.

Try to think about marriage for YOU, Jimmy. It would make you
less of a one-track Believer.

Len, for all you know, I could have more marriage experience than
you have.

Really burns you not to know more about my personal life, huh?

You're not a licensee and and except for one outburst almost
six years ago, there's no indication you'll ever get an amateur
license.

Oh, oh, there goes that control-freak EGO again, Jimmy.

Yes, Len, your control-freak ego sure does go off at times.
Telling everyone How It Should Be.

Work on that. It's bad socially.

Perhaps the FCC chuckles over your comments, Len.

Irrelevant. Chances are they will take my comments seriously.

Odds are they chuckle, if not guffaw.

Doesn't matter, the PUBLIC has spoken to the FCC 3,794 times
through WT Docket 05-235.

And most of the PUBLIC wants at least some Morse Code testing
to be retained.

Tsk, tsk, you DO! See little gems of an accusatory nature
such as I should have obtained an amateur radio license
before accepting professional radio employment!

Who wrote that?

Dave Heil.

Where?

Show us the exact quote where he said you should have obtained
an amateur radio license before accepting professional radio
employment!

C'mon, show us the quote. Or maybe you can't, because it doesn't exist.

See, this is what I mean when I say that you make frequent factual
errors. I invite you to tune your Icom receiver to the low ends of the
bands 160-10m this coming weekend.

Why? I have no personal interest in morse code and no interest
in amateur radio contesting. Invitation denied.

Afraid you'll be proven wrong?

Tsk, there you go again with nasty attitude.

IOW, yes, you're afraid.

Jimmy boy, I'm quite aware of the EM spectrum and who occupies what
"bands."

But obviously not what goes on in the amateur radio bands.

Have been for a very long time...ever since getting my
"first job in radio."

So you're old. Big deal. You want a merit badge?

I know spectrum occupany OUTSIDE of the ham
bands on HF, on MF, on VHF, on UHF, and on up to 2.4 GHz.

Obviously not.

WHAT are YOU going to tell ME?

That Morse Code is alive and well in the amateur bands. As much
as that may bother you, it's true.

That contests are "popular?" I could find
that out by seeing the boosterism for that in print in CQ or QST.

Is contesting "operation" your main interest in amateur radio?

One of my main interests in amateur radio. I have several. You don't
seem
to have any.

Are you more interested in awards, trophies, pretty certificates
than radio for radio's sake? It sure sounds like it since you
love getting praise, even from friends and neighbors. :-)

Actually, I enjoy the competition, the operating, testing my skill and
equipment against others and my previous efforts. Awards, trophies
and certificates aren't why I contest.

This Thursday and Friday I was involved in Thanksgiving in the
literal sense.

ï‚· That's nice. What has it got to do with amateur radio?
ï‚·
ï‚· Good friends got together, didn't talk at all about amateur
radio
ï‚· or morse code.
ï‚·
Considering your near-complete ignorance of Morse Code and
amateur radio, it's a good thing you didn't talk about those
subjects.

Sunday is another nice
get-together with good people, and I don't expect any of the
talk will be about amateur radio or morse code or contests or
the beeping state of the radio art.

That's good, considering that you're hardly a good role model.

No "contests" of any real kind. Sunnuvagun!

Can't take the competition, huh?

This past weekend I hosted Thanksgiving for 12 people –
friends and family. I cooked a 21 pound turkey with homemade
stuffing, made homemade bread, did it up right. Others did the
vegetables and desserts.

Can you cook, Len?

wrote:
wrote:
From: on Nov 26, 8:02 pm
wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Mon 21 Nov 2005 09:41
wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Nov 20, 9:25 am

Amateur radio might be operating weak signal UHF SSB with a multi-mode,
multi-band rig. It might be operating 2m FM through a local repeater.
It might be ragchewing on 40m CW. One constant is that you aren't involved.

I don't do any RF transmission in amateur bands, with the
exception of those bands which are shared with other radio
services.

That's a very good thing!

Why?

Because if you did "RF transmission in amateur bands" without the
proper
license, you could be breaking the law, Len. That would be a very bad
thing.

not to condone the full range of freebanding but isn't this sentment
going a bit far

generating RF in Ham Bands without a license should be relitively low
on the rangeof Good/Bad stuff

Murder is generaly very bad
cut Worldwide? I don't think so.

DIRECT from a government radio transmitter.

Are you authorized to do so?

why is it your place to ask?
cut.

Then why do you fuss with morse and standards that are over
70 years old?

The standards are a lot newer than "70 years old", Len.

not realy
cut

Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
From: on Nov 26, 8:02 pm
wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Mon 21 Nov 2005 09:41
wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Nov 20, 9:25 am

DIRECT as in laying on of hands,
moving controls, operating, all that stuff.

I get the feeling that your knowledge of radio operating might be a
little light. Are you of the opinion that operating a radio falls under
"all that stuff"?

Len does not consider "operating skills" to be of much (if any) value.

You sure talk about it a lot, though.

You were born before 1951? YOU talked much of it in previous post.

YOU have talked much about Reggie Fessenden and his carbon-mike-in-
the-antenna "AM voice transmission" of 1906 and (allegedly) 1900.
Are you 105 years old?!?

You've written about Fessenden a number of times. Aren't you nearly
thirty-five years shy of 105?

All that noise is Len's diversion from the fact that Fessenden was
transmitting
understandable voice by radio in 1900, and by November 1906 had
reliable two-way
transatlantic *voice* communication working.

When Len doesn't like facts, he goes for the messenger.

Jimmy Noserve loves the past, always
bringing up little factoids of amateur radio history
that happened before his time.

See? Just like that.

Gee, Len, you're always bringing up little factoids of
history that happened before *your* time.

When did MY "time" begin, Jimmy? My "first radio job" in HF comms
began in 1953. I was there then, did it, came back. Never used
any morse code then on three dozen transmitters, never had to.

...and because you never had to (in your time), no one should be using
morse code in this enlightened day and age?

That about sums it up.
Radio and electronics have some things in common, but they are not
identical, and one is not a subset of the other.

Amateur radio definitions seldom jibe with the rest of the
world of electronics...and radio. :-)

They seem to track pretty well, Len. You, on the other hand, haven't
done very well in here with definitions.

"Usenet"...."UCMJ".......

The sole manual test for anything at any amateur license exam
is about telegraphy, telegraphy as used on amateur radio (there
is NO landline telegraphy tested), more technically,
radiotelegraphy. As it is NOW, that is.

And that's a good thing.

It is a "good thing" only to those that took that test and
passed it, thus fulfilling the "proper jump through hoops"
of "tradition." :-)

That sounds like sour grapes on your part, Leonard. Those of us who
took and passed such an exam demonstrated that we'd reached a certain
level of competence in what is a useful skill in amateur radio.

Like I said about Len not valuing operating skills....

The written test elements are prepared, both questions and
multiple-choice question answers, by the VEC QPC.

And approved by the FCC

Who else? :-)

YOU are NOT in the FCC.

I didn't see any statement by Jim that he's the FCC.

Am I saying that many radio amateurs don't know squat about
radio theory? ABSOLUTELY.

Your opinion only. And as you have demonstrated, you are not
exactly unbiased in your opinions.

Yes, MY OPINION! :-) Do you think someone else is writing
all this? :-)

It would seem to be that you've not bothered to substantiate your
opinion with fact. How many is many? How many radio amateurs have you
encountered who are deficient. What percentage of all licensed radio
amateurs do they represent?

Most important of all - what level would be adequate? And what has Len
done
to make hams reach that level? (Recommending an age requirement doesn't
cut it).

Many radio amateurs know much more about radio theory than
you, Len.

Why is that a factor in AMATEUR radio?

I'd think it'd be something to crow about. I think many folks would be
pleased to know more about radio theory than a PROFESSIONAL.


The "National Association for Amateur Radio" (nee' ARRL) is
the "club." Even so, their membership is only one of every
five U.S. amateur radio licensees. Why aren't there more?

Some disagree with League policies
Some think membership costs too much.
Some are inactive
Some don't understand why a national organization is needed.

You have taken a Poll to confirm this? :-)

You can take it upon yourself to conduct one, Len. If you weren't
prepared to accept Jim's answers, why'd you pose the question?

Jimmy boy, YOU are a League BELIEVER. You are so far into
bias on that that all you generate are square waves.

Well, Lennie boy, what is it that you believe in? Do you believe that
the ARRL is an evil organization? You've leveled charges of dishonesty
toward the League, but you never substantiated them.

I'd almost forgotten that.

btw, No-Code International's membership is less than 1% of US amateurs
even though there are no dues and NCI membership never expires.

Highly irrelevant. NCI is NOT a "national association for amateur
radio."

No, it isn't. Can you name any such organization except for the ARRL?

It exists for ONE purpose: Elimination of the code test
from amateur radio license examinations worldwide. That's it.

There seems to have been at least one exception to that stated purpose
already.

Actually, at least two:

NCI opposed "weak signal" subbands on the 50, 144 and 432 MHz bands.
The
proposal was intended to create subbands where Morse Code, SSB, PSK31
and
other relatively-narrow-bandwidth signals would be free of QRM from FM
and other
wider-bandwidth signals. Had absolutely *nothing* to do with Morse Code
testing,
yet NCI opposed it.

NCI also supported an ARRL proposal that would have given automatic
free upgrades to a significant number of amateurs by waiving the
*written* tests for those upgrades. Again, had absolutely *nothing* to
do with Morse Code testing, yet NCI supported it.

You have no activity in amateur radio and except for one outburst almost
six years ago, there's no indication you'll ever get an amateur license.

"Outburst?!?" BWAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I prefer to call it an episode of braggadocio. It has come back to
haunt you repeatedly.

Jan 19, 2000, as Lenof21 IIRC. (Len has had multiple screen names here
for some
unfathomable reason).

Why, oh WHY must I show "an indication of interest?!?"

One reason could be that you'd be seen as something other than a
sidewalk superintendent in amateur radio. If you have no interest, as
you've alternately claimed, you are irrelevant to amateur radio and you
become a kook who haunts an amateur radio newsgroup.

Who the fork are you to presume *I* MUST demonstrate to YOU
some kind of committment and dedication?!?!?

"Commitment", Len. Nobody forces you to show commitment or dedication.
You needn't obtain or even attempt to obtain an amateur radio license.
If you don't, you won't appear to be very credible. Your extensive
rants will be marginalized. You'll be in the same boat as a certain
English teacher.

Actually the English teacher is more credible because she admits her
lack of involvement and interest.

If your ego is THAT big, then you should go over to Coslo's BBS
since you will "reach the threashold of space" long before his
big balloon will...

Are you telling him to leave, Len?

So you and the English teacher have the same level of involvement.

Nope. I am as involved as can be with my wife. None other.

...and you wife isn't amateur radio. ZIC/ZID.

As a bachelor I had an "involvement" with an English teacher,
a very nice one, in fact.

Sure, Leonard, and you're getting an "Extra right out of the box".

Try to think about marriage for YOU, Jimmy. It would make you
less of a one-track Believer.

When it was said that you have the same level of involvement as the
English teacher, you said, "I am as involved as can be with my wife.
None other". Here you seem to indicate that marriage makes one "less of
a one-track Believer". You can't even agree with you.

You're not a licensee and and except for one outburst almost
six years ago, there's no indication you'll ever get an amateur
license.

Oh, oh, there goes that control-freak EGO again, Jimmy.

Nobody is controlling you, including yourself. You shot off your mouth
when you made your boast six years ago. You haven't lived up to that
billing.

Suppose the FCC does drop Element 1 (which is really quite likely).

Does anyone think Len will become a ham, set up a station, and get on
the air?

Work on that. It's bad socially.

If you think that's bad socially, you should be in the shoes of one who
shoots off his yap, saying he's going to do something, but who doesn't
follow through.

Perhaps the FCC chuckles over your comments, Len.

Irrelevant. Chances are they will take my comments seriously.

I don't think you should make that assumption, Len.

Doesn't matter, the PUBLIC has spoken to the FCC 3,794 times
through WT Docket 05-235.

It matters. How many times were you "the public" in regard to 05-235?
Of the members of the PUBLIC who spoke, how many (excluding you) didn't
share your view?

Tsk, tsk, you DO! See little gems of an accusatory nature
such as I should have obtained an amateur radio license
before accepting professional radio employment!
Who wrote that?

Dave Heil. Why aren't you paying ATTENTION to the flow? :-(

You've made another factual error, Leonard. You seem to be the person
who needs to pay ATTENTION.


See, this is what I mean when I say that you make frequent factual
errors. I invite you to tune your Icom receiver to the low ends of the
bands 160-10m this coming weekend.

Why? I have no personal interest in morse code and no interest
in amateur radio contesting. Invitation denied.

Afraid you'll be proven wrong?

Tsk, there you go again with nasty attitude. An evangelical
Believer,
wet proselyte for a battery of morse gods, an acidic base.

I offered a simple experiment. You declined. You shrunk from the
challenge.

Jimmy boy, I'm quite aware of the EM spectrum and who occupies what
"bands."

Well, Lennie boy, you'll find those radio amateur morse signals at the
low end of the bands marked "160, 80, 40, 20, 15 and 10 meters" this
weekend. They're there all the time but you'll find them in profusion
this weekend.

Len doesn't listen.

Have been for a very long time...ever since getting my
"first job in radio." I know spectrum occupany OUTSIDE of the ham
bands on HF, on MF, on VHF, on UHF, and on up to 2.4 GHz. WHAT are
YOU going to tell ME?

It'd be tough to reach you. You spend too much time with your
transmitter on and not enough time using the receiver.

That contests are "popular?" I could find
that out by seeing the boosterism for that in print in CQ or QST.

Was the intent to prove that contests are popular or was it to show that
morse code is alive and well in amateur radio?

Is contesting "operation" your main interest in amateur radio?
Are you more interested in awards, trophies, pretty certificates
than radio for radio's sake? It sure sounds like it since you
love getting praise, even from friends and neighbors. :-)

What would any of that be to you, Len? You aren't in amateur radio and
you wouldn't even turn on your receiver to find if the morse code is
alive and well.

This Thursday and Friday I was involved in Thanksgiving in the
literal sense. Good friends got together, didn't talk at all
about amateur radio or morse code. Sunday is another nice
get-together with good people, and I don't expect any of the
talk will be about amateur radio or morse code or contests or
the beeping state of the radio art. No "contests" of any real
kind. Sunnuvagun!

I went to an apple festival this fall. No one there talked about
amateur radio or morse code. Is that supposed to prove that morse code
is dead? I didn't hear a single person there discussing NASA, Darwin or
jazz either.

Have fun in your amateur beeping contests. Those sound very,
Very, VERY important to you. Enjoy.

Thanks for your good wishes. Those things are far more important to me
than obtaining an amateur radio license seems to be for you. Your
participation is not required.

Len's hobby is wasting time. Your time.

73 de Jim, N2EY

wrote:
Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
From: on Nov 26, 8:02 pm
wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Mon 21 Nov 2005 09:41
wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Nov 20, 9:25 am

DIRECT as in laying on of hands,
moving controls, operating, all that stuff.

I get the feeling that your knowledge of radio operating might be a
little light. Are you of the opinion that operating a radio falls under
"all that stuff"?

Len does not consider "operating skills" to be of much (if any) value.

a fair enough assesment of len views

but your point
cut

From: on Nov 27, 7:21 am

wrote:
From: on Sat, Nov 26 2005 4:49 pm
Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
From: on Tues, Nov 22 2005 8:12 pm

Hmmm...not a brand I recognize in this corner of the USA. The
"Newman's Own" line of food products may not be popular farther
east in the USA? I've tried "Newman's Own" Ranch dressing but
personally prefer the "Hidden Valley" brand for Ranch dressing.

I had you pegged as a "Hidden Agenda" man.

Says "Sun-dried Tomato" from WV.

Squash him before he spoils everything...

Too late. He's gone balsamic on us.

...forever sour and bitter... :-)


That may have been the topic in the cozy lodge or it may have been your
tiny, old, dusty Johnson. That Anderson Powerpole bit may be a bit of
self-aggrandizement on your part.

Everyone seems to have "thier" own opinion on the subject.

"Obvioulsy"

Anyway, probably a better solution than a twisted pair and a wire nut.
;^)

Tsk, Davie missed the discussion on Anderson PowerPole connectors
for mobile and portable radio installations that went on for
quite a while in rec.radio.amateur.homebrew. I think he should
have jumped right in and sprinkled his usual balsamic vinegar
in there...showing everyone his mighty radioness... :-)


Marinated herring is pretty good with rye bread, but kippers
became the IN thing for breakfast in jolly old UK. The British
Isles had the blue face paint thing. See the fictious film
biography of Scotsman William Wallace in "Braveheart."

That wasn't factual?

Names and dates were correct. The rest is up to history buffs
of the northern British Isles...

Heil wishes to have all who disagree with him drawn and quartered
in the manner of William Wallace? [with the five remaining body
parts buried in far-distant locations?]


Is there a CQ WWW this weekend? Never heard of it.

:-)

Maybe John Dorr could shed some light on your "assertion of fact."

Don't let the Dorr hit Davie's assertion on the way out...

A free issue of World Radio magazine showed up in my mail last week.
One editorial had some interesting things to say about emergency comms
(or is that "coms?") being incompatible with a rtty contest.

shrug Morse code MUST shine forever and ever just as it did
in 1912. Radio amateurs have always been first responders in
each and every emergency/disaster with their miraculous CW
rigs that managed to survive when the entire infrastructure of
commercial/professional communications failed.

Ergo, cellphones are no huckin good for anything. :-)

From: "an old friend" on Sun, Nov 27 2005 6:55 pm


wrote:
Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
From: on Nov 26, 8:02 pm
wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Mon 21 Nov 2005 09:41
wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Nov 20, 9:25 am

DIRECT as in laying on of hands,
moving controls, operating, all that stuff.

I get the feeling that your knowledge of radio operating might be a
little light. Are you of the opinion that operating a radio falls under
"all that stuff"?

Len does not consider "operating skills" to be of much (if any) value.

a fair enough assesment of len views

I disagree, Mark. I do not consider a RADIOTELEGRAPHY TEST to be
any "operating skill" worthy of being part of an amateur radio
operator's license.

The FCC has had that viewpoint. They said so in public documents.

Stupor-patriot morsemen think morse code telegraphy skills are
all that is "operating skill."

From: on Nov 27, 3:55 pm

wrote:
From: on Nov 26, 8:02 pm
wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Mon 21 Nov 2005 09:41
wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Nov 20, 9:25 am



Because if you did "RF transmission in amateur bands" without the proper
license, you could be breaking the law, Len. That would be a very bad thing.

Feel free to attempt a citizens' arrest any time... :-)


I get along with all sorts of people, Len. Including many who disagree with
me.

Not absolutely true... :-)

You're the one that has the problem getting along with others if they
don't agree with everything you say.

Tsk, with Jimmy it's always the other guy's fault... :-)



DIRECT from a maritime transceiver as a civilian.

Worldwide? I don't think so.

Depends on the ionosphere... :-)


DIRECT from a government radio transmitter.

Are you authorized to do so?

Yes. :-)


DIRECT as in laying on of hands,
moving controls, operating, all that stuff.

Neither of those are *your* equipment, licensed to *you*, are they?

No problem on whose radios those are..."direct operation" is just
doing as I said... :-)


The standards are a lot newer than "70 years old", Len.

Name some.

The morse code test has been in amateur radio regulations
for 71 years. :-)

As to why anyone would fuss with Morse Code in 2005, the
reasons are the same as why anyone would fuss with:

- cars that have manual transmissions instead of automatics

No problem to me...I learned to drive in a manual-transmission auto.
Didn't have to know morse code to drive...

- sailboats instead of power boats

Sailing under the wind takes much less fuel than power boats...and
it is nice to do. didn't have to know morse code to sail.

- Drawing and painting instead of photography

No problem to me...I did all three as a kid, still do. Didn't
have to know morse code to do any of those three.

- Performing music instead of playing recordings

Tsk, how do you think recordings got to BE recordings? :-)

No morse code knowledge required in music.

- Bicycles, running and walking for transport instead of motor vehicles

No problem to me. Last California DMV retest (and every one
before that) didn't require any morse code skill.

- Stairs instead of elevators

How do you categorize escalators? :-)

No morse code knowledge required for stairs, escalators, or
elevators.

- Homemade food instead of packaged

How do you categorize campfire cooking? :-)

Cooking doesn't require morse code knowledge.



Because I know something of those times and the creation of the
Extra class license.

Ah, but you weren't THERE in all those times... :-)


YOU have talked much about Reggie Fessenden and his carbon-mike-in-
the-antenna "AM voice transmission" of 1906 and (allegedly) 1900.

That's right. Was any of my information incorrect?

Weren't you reading from your own lab notes when you described
all that happening 99 to 105 years ago? :-)

Show me ANY evidence that ANY AM transmitter since 1906 has
used amplitude modulation via a carbon microphone in series
with the antenna lead... :-)


I was there then, did it, came back. Never used
any morse code then on three dozen transmitters, never had to.

Because you were a transmitter technician, not a radio operator.

That's not what the U.S. Army said. :-)

Wasn't a single morse code "operating" facility in that whole
large station, Jimmy.


It's odd that you take pride in what you did *not* do...

You betcha...I took pride in NOT breaking any regulations or
Articles in the UCMJ. :-)


It sure does seem that you talk about things that happened long
before you were born, but get mad when others talk about things
that happened long before *they* were born. As if it's OK for
you to do but not others.

Tsk, I was 20 years old in 1953, Jimmy. Already been born
two decades prior. :-)


"Radio" is a subset of electrical engineering.

Incorrect. It is a part of electronics, a technology discipline.

Nope. It's a separate subset. Electronics does not include things
like antennas. Radio does.

Are "antennas" a whole separate field of physics? :-)


"Electronics" is a subset of electrical engineering.

INCORRECT.

What parts of electronics are not covered by electrical engineering,
Len?

Tsk, tsk, trying to get around your gaffe by bringing in
"engineering?" :-)


Electronics is one TECHNOLOGY DISCIPLINE of physics.

No, it isn't.

Physics is a science. Electrical engineering is a form of engineering,
and electronics is a subset of that.

Sigh...you still haven't gotten the correct definitions... :-(


Your mistakes (like the ones Hans pointed out
about DD-214s) are embarrassing.

You are confused. I made NO mistake about DD-214s. I have one.
You don't have one, can never have one...



Radio and electronics have some things in common, but they are not
identical, and one is not a subset of the other.

Amateur radio definitions seldom jibe with the rest of the
world of electronics...and radio. :-)

Yours don't jive with anything - like your spelling.

The word "jibe" (with a B, not a V) is perfectly correct in my
context. Look it up. :-)


NPRM 05-143 is singularly about the telegraphy test. [that's
what this "english teacher" of the thread title was commenting
on] That NPRM has NOTHING to do with radiotelephony, radiodata,
teletypewriter over radio, slow or fast-scan television,
facsimile over radio. The amateur radio license tests have
NO test elements for physically OPERATING any radio, are not
required to have radio equipment AT a license exam site.

So? Why is that significant?

Why do you consider yourself so "significant?" :-)

It's not about me, Len.

Tsk, everything you post in here is about YOU. :-)


The sole manual test for anything at any amateur license exam
is about telegraphy, telegraphy as used on amateur radio (there
is NO landline telegraphy tested), more technically,
radiotelegraphy. As it is NOW, that is.

And that's a good thing.

It is a "good thing" only to those that took that test and
passed it, thus fulfilling the "proper jump through hoops"
of "tradition." :-)

Incorrect. There were comments to the FCC by people who had
not passed the Morse Code test which said it was a good thing
and should be retained.

Sorry, Jimmy, they were outnumbered by those who wanted the TEST
gone. :-)

If you actually read all of the comments, you'd know that.

Each and every filing from 15 July 2005 to 23 November 2005.
3,795 of them. :-)


When you make a sweeping general statement, and someone
proves an exception, the statement is shown to be false. That's
basic logic.

No, Jimmy, all that proves is EXCEPTIONS. :-)

There's NO "logic" in your exceptions statements, only spite...


YOU are NOT in the FCC.

Neither are you, Len.

YOU are NOT in the FCC. Never were. It doesn't look like you
will ever be in the FCC...



Tsk, your definition of "polite" seems to be everyone agreeing
with you and giving your gratuitous praise for whatever you do.

Nope. That's *your* definition.

Tsk, another morseman with the "mirror syndrome" displayed.

Whatever will your friends and neighbors think? :-)


FCC does not consider
*you* to be qualified to operate an amateur radio station, though.

Wrong on two accounts. First of all, I already got a Commercial
Radiotelephone license 49 years ago so the FCC "qualified" me
(legally) to do so. Secondly, I've never tested for any amateur
radio license so the FCC cannot say I am either "qualified" or
"unqualified." Third, by law, to operate ON THE FREQUENCIES
allocated only to radio amateurs requires an amateur radio
license, neither "qualification" or "unqualification" but just
a condition of the regulations.


limited. NOT "all sorts of equipment" either since there are
exceptions stated in Part 97. Look those up.

Don't have to look them up, I know them.

Try a dictionary...look up "jibe." :-)



It's understandable that you'd not understand a superior intellect, Len

When one shows up, I'll be sure NOT to understand them.


OTOH I understand you all too well. That's why you're so hostile to me.

"Hostile?" What you mean "hostile," white man?

Po' bebbe, y'all been trin' ta shoot down all them NCTAs fer
years and ya dint do it. Tsk, tsk. All dat HOSTILE in-tent
of yourn.


You have taken a Poll to confirm this? :-)

Yes ;-)

Prove that.



Len, you're and NCI BELIEVER. You're so biased that you cannot
conduct enough to see what really happens.

Oh, my, you are doing the word-twisting thing today!

I was against the code test long before Bruce Perens put NCI
together. Pay attention.

I don't speak FOR NCI but you are going to try to MISDIRECT
the thread flow to make that a cause celebre'. Not buying
that.


Who the fork are you to presume *I* MUST demonstrate to YOU
some kind of committment and dedication?!?!?

Who do I have to be?

A normal, logical person instead of the behavior you display here.



Try to think about marriage for YOU, Jimmy. It would make you
less of a one-track Believer.

Len, for all you know, I could have more marriage experience than
you have.

Judging by all the time you spend in here...I'd say you have NO
"experience" right now. :-) Or you don't really work for a
living (thereby getting more free time to surf the newsgroup).

You are already in the Dudly the Imposter category, saying so
many things yet not proving them.


Yes, Len, your control-freak ego sure does go off at times.
Telling everyone How It Should Be.

Tsk, more mirror gazing on your part, Jimmy.

All I'm doing - in between replying to some of the PCTA heckling -
is trying to get rid of the code test.

You've already taken that test, will never have to test for it
again unless you miss the last renewal date and expire that
license.

YOU are telling ALL NEWCOMERS to test for morse code. You've been
doing that for years. Why are you so hostile to newcomers?



Afraid you'll be proven wrong?

Tsk, there you go again with nasty attitude.

IOW, yes, you're afraid.

You are nuts.


Have been for a very long time...ever since getting my
"first job in radio."

So you're old. Big deal. You want a merit badge?

At the end of my "first job in radio" I got a DD-214. You don't
have one. You will never have one of your own. You are too old.


WHAT are YOU going to tell ME?

That Morse Code is alive and well in the amateur bands.

Wonderful for you, then. You will always have a morseman to play
with.



Is contesting "operation" your main interest in amateur radio?

One of my main interests in amateur radio. I have several. You don't
seem to have any.

"It must drive you nuts not knowing" what my interests are... :-)


Considering your near-complete ignorance of Morse Code and
amateur radio, it's a good thing you didn't talk about those
subjects.

"Near-complete ignorance?!?"

insert three lines of Dudly cackling in here


Sunday is another nice
get-together with good people, and I don't expect any of the
talk will be about amateur radio or morse code or contests or
the beeping state of the radio art.

That's good, considering that you're hardly a good role model.

"Hardly a good role model?!?"

Tsk, tsk, that is HOSTILITY, Jimmy. Why are you so hostile?


No "contests" of any real kind. Sunnuvagun!

Can't take the competition, huh?

Try to understand that normal social behavior is NOT about
"competition." Normal, that is, not some HOSTILE type who
always has to sound more important than the group...such
behavior exemplified by the PCTA.


This past weekend I hosted Thanksgiving for 12 people ?
friends and family.

What has that to do with amateur radio?

I cooked a 21 pound turkey with homemade
stuffing, made homemade bread, did it up right. Others did the
vegetables and desserts.

Do you want a BSA cooking merit badge for that?

Can you cook, Len?

Of course I can...do you need lessons?

wrote:
From: "an old friend" on Sun, Nov 27 2005 6:55 pm


wrote:
Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
From: on Nov 26, 8:02 pm
wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Mon 21 Nov 2005 09:41
wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Nov 20, 9:25 am

DIRECT as in laying on of hands,
moving controls, operating, all that stuff.

I get the feeling that your knowledge of radio operating might be a
little light. Are you of the opinion that operating a radio falls under
"all that stuff"?

Len does not consider "operating skills" to be of much (if any) value.

a fair enough assesment of len views

I disagree, Mark. I do not consider a RADIOTELEGRAPHY TEST to be
any "operating skill" worthy of being part of an amateur radio
operator's license.

my apologies I was trying to simply agee on paper with Jim as a
Retorical tactic I was also accepting the screwed up procode difer that
says Cw test was the same as operating skill (just tryin some
hypothecials to see if Jim could get past the nonsense or if Jim is as
traped as Stevie and Dave

The FCC has had that viewpoint. They said so in public documents.

Stupor-patriot morsemen think morse code telegraphy skills are
all that is "operating skill."