(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

On 10/14/2011 1:14 PM, Lloyd E Parsons wrote:
On 10/14/11 2:57 PM, John Smith wrote:
On 10/13/2011 11:13 PM, Alan Baker wrote:
In ,
. net wrote:

"Alan wrote in message
...
In ,
. net wrote:

"Alan wrote in message
...
In ,
John wrote:

On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote:
In ,
John wrote:

On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote:
On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote:
In ,
John wrote:

Your post is an excellent example of what I have found
about
"Apple
People", they have a religious devotion to the platform
...

Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes
that
anyone
who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious
devotion...


Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse
MAC's, is
that I
write much of the software I use ... plus, I private
contract
to
develop
software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired,
for
the
most
part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it
simply
would not
make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the
business
to
make
money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked
hard in
being one
of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think
they
can
do that
without me ...

In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from
your
perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers
with
their own
OS? You can write software for that platform just as you
can
for
Windows
or for Linux.


Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their
software,
just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or
even
an
idildo,
for that matter! ROFLOL

So?

Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware
and
Microsoft
doesn't?


Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the
conversation
I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang
less
buck
will do ...

It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools
always end
up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil
just
doesn't really apply.

If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any
crimes
which
have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean,
like,
DUH!

Regards,
JS

As I said:

How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what
you do
not
must be a fool...


It's a cultural standard, today.




Hey, I am not the one into social standards!

I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC
can
just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ...

Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example...


Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high
res HD
monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do
the
same with audio ...

You mean, like this:

http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html

No like this.

http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications

CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac
Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac
Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac
Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac


snip

Like he said, Mac can't compete.


LOL

No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now.

Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that.

a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number.

Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales.

BFD

No, no.

Mac sales didn't increase by 13%. Mac sales in the US were 13% of all
personal computers sold in the last quarter.


I was just thinking, that probably only encompasses whole, complete
computers ... since I build my own, and most of my families and friends
computers, they are not even counted ... in the final analysis, you can
see that figure simply is not a meaningful representation of the total
PC market ...

Regards,
JS

Hogwash! What you build and other hobbyists also, is such a tiny part of
the sales market it has no real bearing on the issue at all. And for the
most part, few companies care about that build-your-own hobbyist market
except some parts makers.



That is BS for me, most I see are custom builds ... but I don't hang
around old people who can't use computers and own dells ...

Regards,
JS

(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

On 10/14/2011 2:22 PM, Scout wrote:


"Lloyd E Parsons" wrote in message
...
On 10/14/11 2:57 PM, John Smith wrote:
On 10/13/2011 11:13 PM, Alan Baker wrote:
In ,
. net wrote:

"Alan wrote in message
...
In ,
. net wrote:

"Alan wrote in message
...
In ,
John wrote:

On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote:
In ,
John wrote:

On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote:
On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote:
In ,
John wrote:

Your post is an excellent example of what I have found
about
"Apple
People", they have a religious devotion to the
platform ...

Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes
that
anyone
who sees value where you do not must do it out of
religious
devotion...


Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse
MAC's, is
that I
write much of the software I use ... plus, I private
contract
to
develop
software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired,
for
the
most
part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it
simply
would not
make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the
business
to
make
money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked
hard in
being one
of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think
they
can
do that
without me ...

In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows
from
your
perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers
with
their own
OS? You can write software for that platform just as
you can
for
Windows
or for Linux.


Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their
software,
just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or
even
an
idildo,
for that matter! ROFLOL

So?

Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make
hardware and
Microsoft
doesn't?


Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the
conversation
I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang
less
buck
will do ...

It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools
always end
up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil
just
doesn't really apply.

If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any
crimes
which
have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean,
like,
DUH!

Regards,
JS

As I said:

How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what
you do
not
must be a fool...


It's a cultural standard, today.




Hey, I am not the one into social standards!

I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC
can
just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ...

Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example...


Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high
res HD
monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do
the
same with audio ...

You mean, like this:

http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html

No like this.

http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications

CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac
Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac
Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac
Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac


snip

Like he said, Mac can't compete.


LOL

No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now.

Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that.

a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number.

Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales.

BFD

No, no.

Mac sales didn't increase by 13%. Mac sales in the US were 13% of all
personal computers sold in the last quarter.


I was just thinking, that probably only encompasses whole, complete
computers ... since I build my own, and most of my families and friends
computers, they are not even counted ... in the final analysis, you can
see that figure simply is not a meaningful representation of the total
PC market ...

Regards,
JS

Hogwash! What you build and other hobbyists also, is such a tiny part
of the sales market it has no real bearing on the issue at all.

Really?

I suggest you browse through the systems for sale on Ebay and take note
of how many are NOT brand systems, but component built.

Further I will note:

Looking at just the top 5 retail motherboard makers.

Own Brand Retail motherboard sales in 2010 (does NOT include OEM sales)

Asustek - 21.6 Million
Gigabyte - 18 Million
ASRock - 8 Million
ECS - 7 Million
MSI - 7 Million

Total = 61.6 Million

http://www.bit-tech.net/news/hardwar...rboard-maker/1


Given Q2 2011 PC sales were 85 Million

So let's assume that's typical.

85 * 4 = 340 million per year

plus the 61.6 million systems being sold by the top 5 motherboard makers.

equals 401.6 Million computers per year

61.6 /401.6 = Market share of over 15% (if you calculate for TOTAL
computer sales)

Which is about FOUR TIMES the TOTAL Mac sales. (3.76 Million *4) (or
about 3.7% of computer sales)

Does that mean Mac sales are "a tiny part of the sales market it has no
real bearing on the issue at all. "?

After all Mac sales are at most only about a quarter of the sales of
retail motherboards. So if component built systems are too few to
matter, then Macs would be even MORE so.



And for the most part, few companies care about that build-your-own
hobbyist market except some parts makers.

61.6 Million motherboards sold last year would tend to suggest otherwise.

Excellent research ...

Regards,
JS

(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

On 10/14/2011 1:56 PM, RD Sandman wrote:
John wrote in
:

On 10/13/2011 11:13 PM, Alan Baker wrote:
In ,
. net wrote:

"Alan wrote in message
...
In ,
. net wrote:

"Alan wrote in message
...
In ,
John wrote:

On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote:
In ,
John wrote:

On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote:
On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote:
In ,
John wrote:

Your post is an excellent example of what I have found
about "Apple
People", they have a religious devotion to the platform
...

Your post is an excellent example of someone who
believes that
anyone
who sees value where you do not must do it out of
religious devotion...


Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse
MAC's, is that I
write much of the software I use ... plus, I private
contract
to
develop
software on multiple platforms (even though I am
retired, for
the
most
part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it
simply
would not
make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the
business to
make
money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked
hard in being one
of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think
they can
do that
without me ...

In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows
from your
perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers
with their own
OS? You can write software for that platform just as you
can for
Windows
or for Linux.


Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run
their software,
just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or
even an
idildo,
for that matter! ROFLOL

So?

Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware
and Microsoft
doesn't?


Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the
conversation
I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same
bang less
buck
will do ...

It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the
fools always end
up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ...
evil just
doesn't really apply.

If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any
crimes which
have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean,
like, DUH!

Regards,
JS

As I said:

How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what
you do not
must be a fool...


It's a cultural standard, today.




Hey, I am not the one into social standards!

I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the
PC can
just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ...

Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example...


Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high
res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I
mean ... do the same with audio ...

You mean, like this:

http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html

No like this.

http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications

CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac
Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac
Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac
Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac


snip

Like he said, Mac can't compete.


LOL

No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now.

Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that.

a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number.

Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales.

BFD

No, no.

Mac sales didn't increase by 13%. Mac sales in the US were 13% of all
personal computers sold in the last quarter.


I was just thinking, that probably only encompasses whole, complete
computers ... since I build my own, and most of my families and
friends computers, they are not even counted ... in the final
analysis, you can see that figure simply is not a meaningful
representation of the total PC market ...

Interesting.....it has been for a large number of years when discussing
market share.



I need a URL confirming that?

Regards,
JS

(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

On 10/14/2011 4:43 PM, Lloyd E Parsons wrote:
On 10/14/11 6:39 PM, Scout wrote:


"Howard Brazee" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 13 Oct 2011 19:00:47 -0700, John Smith
wrote:

Like I say, outside of academia, I just don't see that many MACs

I don't see what academia use, I don't see what most companies use.
But I do see what people have in coffee houses - and there are lots of
Macs there.

That's about where you're going to find them since 3/4 of Macs being
sold are the laptops. The Mac desktop market keeps shrinking.


No, their desktop market is growing, just not as fast as their laptop
market.


For over 20 years I have been observing, "next year" was going to be the
"year of the mac", nothing has changed in that arena, in a LONG, LONG time!

Regards,
JS

(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

On 10/15/11 10:37 AM, John Smith wrote:
On 10/14/2011 4:43 PM, Lloyd E Parsons wrote:
On 10/14/11 6:39 PM, Scout wrote:


"Howard Brazee" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 13 Oct 2011 19:00:47 -0700, John Smith
wrote:

Like I say, outside of academia, I just don't see that many MACs

I don't see what academia use, I don't see what most companies use.
But I do see what people have in coffee houses - and there are lots of
Macs there.

That's about where you're going to find them since 3/4 of Macs being
sold are the laptops. The Mac desktop market keeps shrinking.


No, their desktop market is growing, just not as fast as their laptop
market.


For over 20 years I have been observing, "next year" was going to be the
"year of the mac", nothing has changed in that arena, in a LONG, LONG time!

Regards,
JS

I don't think you or I will live long enough to see the 'year of the
mac' if that is defined as Apple being the dominant tech provider. Not
going to happen.

But the 'year of the Mac' has already happened in the upscale tech
market with consumers with a few bucks.


--
Lloyd

(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

On 10/15/2011 8:41 AM, Lloyd E Parsons wrote:

...
I don't think you or I will live long enough to see the 'year of the
mac' if that is defined as Apple being the dominant tech provider. Not
going to happen.

But the 'year of the Mac' has already happened in the upscale tech
market with consumers with a few bucks.



Yes, I am sure many are heroes in their own mind, have saved the world,
dominate the markets ... and it would be evil to destroy their fantasies
.... roflol

Still, one must keep a foot in reality ...

Regards,
JS

(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

On 10/15/11 10:46 AM, John Smith wrote:
On 10/15/2011 8:41 AM, Lloyd E Parsons wrote:

...
I don't think you or I will live long enough to see the 'year of the
mac' if that is defined as Apple being the dominant tech provider. Not
going to happen.

But the 'year of the Mac' has already happened in the upscale tech
market with consumers with a few bucks.



Yes, I am sure many are heroes in their own mind, have saved the world,
dominate the markets ... and it would be evil to destroy their fantasies
... roflol

Still, one must keep a foot in reality ...

Regards,
JS

In business, the reality is growing your sales and profits. In that, it
has been the year of the Mac for quite awhile now. You are free to talk
about what volumes of sales are out there in wintel/linux world, but
that is being done at pathetic profit levels.

Overall, desktop sales on all platforms is down as more go to laptops.
Primarily because laptops now have enough performance for almost all
applications and the prices are down quite a bit. Heck for all the
bitching about Apple's prices, laptops with similar specifications and
build quality are all pretty much the same in cost.

Apple just doesn't do cheap laptops.



--
Lloyd

(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

http://www.devilfinder.com/find.php?...ories+in+China

http://www.devilfinder.com/find.php?q=The+World's+best+selling+computers

China, I have been to Chinatown in San Francisco before, in January
1964. on my way to the Land of the Midnight Cong.Hang Kong Vietnam.

I went over to Chinatown,,,,,, Ling Ting Tong,,,,, just sing this
song,,,,,,

China,,,, Chinaaa,,,, China, China Jing Jing Yayyyyy,,,,,,

I went to Cholon (the Chinese section of Saigon) a bunch of times too.
I am a World Citizen!
cuhulin

(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

John Smith wrote in :

On 10/14/2011 1:56 PM, RD Sandman wrote:
John wrote in
:

On 10/13/2011 11:13 PM, Alan Baker wrote:
In ,
. net wrote:

"Alan wrote in message
...
In ,
. net wrote:

"Alan wrote in message
...
In ,
John wrote:

On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote:
In ,
John wrote:

On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote:
On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote:
In ,
John wrote:

Your post is an excellent example of what I have found
about "Apple
People", they have a religious devotion to the
platform
...

Your post is an excellent example of someone who
believes that
anyone
who sees value where you do not must do it out of
religious devotion...


Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse
MAC's, is that I
write much of the software I use ... plus, I private
contract
to
develop
software on multiple platforms (even though I am
retired, for
the
most
part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC,
it
simply
would not
make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the
business to
make
money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked
hard in being one
of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I
think
they can
do that
without me ...

In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows
from your
perspective? The fact that they've always sold
computers
with their own
OS? You can write software for that platform just as
you
can for
Windows
or for Linux.


Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run
their software,
just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or
even an
idildo,
for that matter! ROFLOL

So?

Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make
hardware
and Microsoft
doesn't?


Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the
conversation
I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same
bang less
buck
will do ...

It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the
fools always end
up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ...
evil just
doesn't really apply.

If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any
crimes which
have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean,
like, DUH!

Regards,
JS

As I said:

How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what
you do not
must be a fool...


It's a cultural standard, today.




Hey, I am not the one into social standards!

I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the
PC can
just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ...

Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example...


Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high
res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I
mean ... do the same with audio ...

You mean, like this:

http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html

No like this.

http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs/geforce-gtx-
590/specifications

CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac
Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac
Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac
Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac


snip

Like he said, Mac can't compete.


LOL

No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now.

Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about
that.

a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number.

Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales.

BFD

No, no.

Mac sales didn't increase by 13%. Mac sales in the US were 13% of
all
personal computers sold in the last quarter.


I was just thinking, that probably only encompasses whole, complete
computers ... since I build my own, and most of my families and
friends computers, they are not even counted ... in the final
analysis, you can see that figure simply is not a meaningful
representation of the total PC market ...

Interesting.....it has been for a large number of years when
discussing
market share.



I need a URL confirming that?

Too bad. Don't hold your breath.


--
Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman)

Witnessing Republicans and Democrats bickering over
the National Debt is like watching two drunks argue
over a bar bill on the Titanic.....

(OT) Steve Jobs.
 

"Scout" wrote in
:



"RD Sandman" wrote in message
...
"Scout" wrote in
:



"John Smith" wrote in message
...
On 10/14/2011 1:36 AM, RHF wrote:
On Oct 13, 7:00 pm, John wrote:
On 10/13/2011 5:34 PM, Howard Brazee wrote:

On Thu, 13 Oct 2011 17:09:37 -0700 (PDT), David Barts
wrote:

Though that's largely irrelevant to my point. Again, if the
price premium for a Mac isn't worth it to you (and it sounds
like it's not), then just don't buy Macs (and it sounds like
you're already not buying them). No problem; my feelings are
not hurt in the least by someone making a different choice than
I would have.

How can that be? Don't you know that anybody who buys an Apple
product is an irrational Fanboy? If we weren't fooled, we
would all make the same choices, right?

Like I say, outside of academia, I just don't see that many MACs
... my niece has MACs, but she works for them ... her kids have
PCs ... as far as I know, those are the only MACs in my whole
family and group of friends ... but I am sure there must be some
around, in number, somewhere ... when I have worked for
attorneys, I have seen some used, but then, mainly by attorneys
who didn't know how to use a computer ... and yeah, I think they
just carried them as a status symbol! Or, to play solitare, card
games, match three games, tetris, etc. on the airplanes ... lol

Regards,
JS

Ah Yes an Apple/MAC Computer {Case/Luggage}
-says- "I Am An Apple/MAC Person !" [Status Symbol]
http://www.globaltang.com/images/l/A...s/MAC%20Access
or ies/M108.jpg -and-alas- you are merely a little nothing 'pc'
http://rlv.zcache.com/hi_im_a_mac_ba...47765z7tpy_152.
jp g
.

... as I just pointed out, that figure, most likely, don't not
represent all the PC's which are built-up from components ... like
most gaming computers are ... the apple share of market is
obviously a lot smaller than that being quoted ...

Anyone needing state-of-art/specialized-use obviously has a custom
built PC ...

Good point. Certainly the source I just used only talks about
computer sales for complete systems. While in reality a lot of PC
are component built either by the consumer or by local computer
stores.

Most of those, I would assume, would be PC based not MAC.

Actually, I think it would be exclusively PC, since I don't believe
they sell the primary components of Macs on the retail market. Might
be able to do something in the salvage market but that's really a
matter of reassembling a computer rather than building a new one from
unused parts.


Which would explain why I don't see as many Macs as would be
indicated by the fact that about 4.5% of all PC sales are Macs.
Because PC sales of those built up from components aren't counted.
Which would mean every system I have wouldn't count because ALL were
component built. Yet, they are active computers.

I am now down to three......going down by another after this weekend.

Replacing with premade, or just old and unused?




Neither. It is a good Toshiba laptop.....just passing it on down since I
no longer use it. I have two newer ones.

--
Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman)

Witnessing Republicans and Democrats bickering over
the National Debt is like watching two drunks argue
over a bar bill on the Titanic.....