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(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/14/2011 1:14 PM, Lloyd E Parsons wrote:
On 10/14/11 2:57 PM, John Smith wrote: On 10/13/2011 11:13 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , . net wrote: "Alan wrote in message ... In , . net wrote: "Alan wrote in message ... In , John wrote: On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote: On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Your post is an excellent example of what I have found about "Apple People", they have a religious devotion to the platform ... Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes that anyone who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious devotion... Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse MAC's, is that I write much of the software I use ... plus, I private contract to develop software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired, for the most part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it simply would not make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the business to make money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked hard in being one of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think they can do that without me ... In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from your perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers with their own OS? You can write software for that platform just as you can for Windows or for Linux. Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their software, just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or even an idildo, for that matter! ROFLOL So? Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware and Microsoft doesn't? Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the conversation I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang less buck will do ... It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools always end up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil just doesn't really apply. If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any crimes which have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean, like, DUH! Regards, JS As I said: How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what you do not must be a fool... It's a cultural standard, today. Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html No like this. http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac snip Like he said, Mac can't compete. LOL No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number. Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales. BFD No, no. Mac sales didn't increase by 13%. Mac sales in the US were 13% of all personal computers sold in the last quarter. I was just thinking, that probably only encompasses whole, complete computers ... since I build my own, and most of my families and friends computers, they are not even counted ... in the final analysis, you can see that figure simply is not a meaningful representation of the total PC market ... Regards, JS Hogwash! What you build and other hobbyists also, is such a tiny part of the sales market it has no real bearing on the issue at all. And for the most part, few companies care about that build-your-own hobbyist market except some parts makers. That is BS for me, most I see are custom builds ... but I don't hang around old people who can't use computers and own dells ... Regards, JS |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/14/2011 2:22 PM, Scout wrote:
"Lloyd E Parsons" wrote in message ... On 10/14/11 2:57 PM, John Smith wrote: On 10/13/2011 11:13 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , . net wrote: "Alan wrote in message ... In , . net wrote: "Alan wrote in message ... In , John wrote: On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote: On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Your post is an excellent example of what I have found about "Apple People", they have a religious devotion to the platform ... Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes that anyone who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious devotion... Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse MAC's, is that I write much of the software I use ... plus, I private contract to develop software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired, for the most part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it simply would not make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the business to make money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked hard in being one of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think they can do that without me ... In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from your perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers with their own OS? You can write software for that platform just as you can for Windows or for Linux. Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their software, just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or even an idildo, for that matter! ROFLOL So? Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware and Microsoft doesn't? Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the conversation I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang less buck will do ... It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools always end up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil just doesn't really apply. If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any crimes which have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean, like, DUH! Regards, JS As I said: How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what you do not must be a fool... It's a cultural standard, today. Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html No like this. http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac snip Like he said, Mac can't compete. LOL No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number. Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales. BFD No, no. Mac sales didn't increase by 13%. Mac sales in the US were 13% of all personal computers sold in the last quarter. I was just thinking, that probably only encompasses whole, complete computers ... since I build my own, and most of my families and friends computers, they are not even counted ... in the final analysis, you can see that figure simply is not a meaningful representation of the total PC market ... Regards, JS Hogwash! What you build and other hobbyists also, is such a tiny part of the sales market it has no real bearing on the issue at all. Really? I suggest you browse through the systems for sale on Ebay and take note of how many are NOT brand systems, but component built. Further I will note: Looking at just the top 5 retail motherboard makers. Own Brand Retail motherboard sales in 2010 (does NOT include OEM sales) Asustek - 21.6 Million Gigabyte - 18 Million ASRock - 8 Million ECS - 7 Million MSI - 7 Million Total = 61.6 Million http://www.bit-tech.net/news/hardwar...rboard-maker/1 Given Q2 2011 PC sales were 85 Million So let's assume that's typical. 85 * 4 = 340 million per year plus the 61.6 million systems being sold by the top 5 motherboard makers. equals 401.6 Million computers per year 61.6 /401.6 = Market share of over 15% (if you calculate for TOTAL computer sales) Which is about FOUR TIMES the TOTAL Mac sales. (3.76 Million *4) (or about 3.7% of computer sales) Does that mean Mac sales are "a tiny part of the sales market it has no real bearing on the issue at all. "? After all Mac sales are at most only about a quarter of the sales of retail motherboards. So if component built systems are too few to matter, then Macs would be even MORE so. And for the most part, few companies care about that build-your-own hobbyist market except some parts makers. 61.6 Million motherboards sold last year would tend to suggest otherwise. Excellent research ... Regards, JS |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/14/2011 1:56 PM, RD Sandman wrote:
John wrote in : On 10/13/2011 11:13 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , . net wrote: "Alan wrote in message ... In , . net wrote: "Alan wrote in message ... In , John wrote: On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote: On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Your post is an excellent example of what I have found about "Apple People", they have a religious devotion to the platform ... Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes that anyone who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious devotion... Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse MAC's, is that I write much of the software I use ... plus, I private contract to develop software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired, for the most part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it simply would not make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the business to make money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked hard in being one of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think they can do that without me ... In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from your perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers with their own OS? You can write software for that platform just as you can for Windows or for Linux. Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their software, just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or even an idildo, for that matter! ROFLOL So? Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware and Microsoft doesn't? Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the conversation I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang less buck will do ... It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools always end up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil just doesn't really apply. If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any crimes which have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean, like, DUH! Regards, JS As I said: How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what you do not must be a fool... It's a cultural standard, today. Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html No like this. http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac snip Like he said, Mac can't compete. LOL No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number. Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales. BFD No, no. Mac sales didn't increase by 13%. Mac sales in the US were 13% of all personal computers sold in the last quarter. I was just thinking, that probably only encompasses whole, complete computers ... since I build my own, and most of my families and friends computers, they are not even counted ... in the final analysis, you can see that figure simply is not a meaningful representation of the total PC market ... Interesting.....it has been for a large number of years when discussing market share. I need a URL confirming that? Regards, JS |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/14/2011 4:43 PM, Lloyd E Parsons wrote:
On 10/14/11 6:39 PM, Scout wrote: "Howard Brazee" wrote in message ... On Thu, 13 Oct 2011 19:00:47 -0700, John Smith wrote: Like I say, outside of academia, I just don't see that many MACs I don't see what academia use, I don't see what most companies use. But I do see what people have in coffee houses - and there are lots of Macs there. That's about where you're going to find them since 3/4 of Macs being sold are the laptops. The Mac desktop market keeps shrinking. No, their desktop market is growing, just not as fast as their laptop market. For over 20 years I have been observing, "next year" was going to be the "year of the mac", nothing has changed in that arena, in a LONG, LONG time! Regards, JS |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/15/11 10:37 AM, John Smith wrote:
On 10/14/2011 4:43 PM, Lloyd E Parsons wrote: On 10/14/11 6:39 PM, Scout wrote: "Howard Brazee" wrote in message ... On Thu, 13 Oct 2011 19:00:47 -0700, John Smith wrote: Like I say, outside of academia, I just don't see that many MACs I don't see what academia use, I don't see what most companies use. But I do see what people have in coffee houses - and there are lots of Macs there. That's about where you're going to find them since 3/4 of Macs being sold are the laptops. The Mac desktop market keeps shrinking. No, their desktop market is growing, just not as fast as their laptop market. For over 20 years I have been observing, "next year" was going to be the "year of the mac", nothing has changed in that arena, in a LONG, LONG time! Regards, JS I don't think you or I will live long enough to see the 'year of the mac' if that is defined as Apple being the dominant tech provider. Not going to happen. But the 'year of the Mac' has already happened in the upscale tech market with consumers with a few bucks. -- Lloyd |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/15/2011 8:41 AM, Lloyd E Parsons wrote:
... I don't think you or I will live long enough to see the 'year of the mac' if that is defined as Apple being the dominant tech provider. Not going to happen. But the 'year of the Mac' has already happened in the upscale tech market with consumers with a few bucks. Yes, I am sure many are heroes in their own mind, have saved the world, dominate the markets ... and it would be evil to destroy their fantasies .... roflol Still, one must keep a foot in reality ... Regards, JS |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/15/11 10:46 AM, John Smith wrote:
On 10/15/2011 8:41 AM, Lloyd E Parsons wrote: ... I don't think you or I will live long enough to see the 'year of the mac' if that is defined as Apple being the dominant tech provider. Not going to happen. But the 'year of the Mac' has already happened in the upscale tech market with consumers with a few bucks. Yes, I am sure many are heroes in their own mind, have saved the world, dominate the markets ... and it would be evil to destroy their fantasies ... roflol Still, one must keep a foot in reality ... Regards, JS In business, the reality is growing your sales and profits. In that, it has been the year of the Mac for quite awhile now. You are free to talk about what volumes of sales are out there in wintel/linux world, but that is being done at pathetic profit levels. Overall, desktop sales on all platforms is down as more go to laptops. Primarily because laptops now have enough performance for almost all applications and the prices are down quite a bit. Heck for all the bitching about Apple's prices, laptops with similar specifications and build quality are all pretty much the same in cost. Apple just doesn't do cheap laptops. -- Lloyd |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
http://www.devilfinder.com/find.php?...ories+in+China
http://www.devilfinder.com/find.php?q=The+World's+best+selling+computers China, I have been to Chinatown in San Francisco before, in January 1964. on my way to the Land of the Midnight Cong.Hang Kong Vietnam. I went over to Chinatown,,,,,, Ling Ting Tong,,,,, just sing this song,,,,,, China,,,, Chinaaa,,,, China, China Jing Jing Yayyyyy,,,,,, I went to Cholon (the Chinese section of Saigon) a bunch of times too. I am a World Citizen! cuhulin |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
John Smith wrote in :
On 10/14/2011 1:56 PM, RD Sandman wrote: John wrote in : On 10/13/2011 11:13 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , . net wrote: "Alan wrote in message ... In , . net wrote: "Alan wrote in message ... In , John wrote: On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote: On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Your post is an excellent example of what I have found about "Apple People", they have a religious devotion to the platform ... Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes that anyone who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious devotion... Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse MAC's, is that I write much of the software I use ... plus, I private contract to develop software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired, for the most part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it simply would not make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the business to make money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked hard in being one of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think they can do that without me ... In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from your perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers with their own OS? You can write software for that platform just as you can for Windows or for Linux. Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their software, just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or even an idildo, for that matter! ROFLOL So? Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware and Microsoft doesn't? Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the conversation I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang less buck will do ... It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools always end up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil just doesn't really apply. If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any crimes which have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean, like, DUH! Regards, JS As I said: How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what you do not must be a fool... It's a cultural standard, today. Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html No like this. http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs/geforce-gtx- 590/specifications CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac snip Like he said, Mac can't compete. LOL No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number. Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales. BFD No, no. Mac sales didn't increase by 13%. Mac sales in the US were 13% of all personal computers sold in the last quarter. I was just thinking, that probably only encompasses whole, complete computers ... since I build my own, and most of my families and friends computers, they are not even counted ... in the final analysis, you can see that figure simply is not a meaningful representation of the total PC market ... Interesting.....it has been for a large number of years when discussing market share. I need a URL confirming that? Too bad. Don't hold your breath. -- Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman) Witnessing Republicans and Democrats bickering over the National Debt is like watching two drunks argue over a bar bill on the Titanic..... |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Scout" wrote in
: "RD Sandman" wrote in message ... "Scout" wrote in : "John Smith" wrote in message ... On 10/14/2011 1:36 AM, RHF wrote: On Oct 13, 7:00 pm, John wrote: On 10/13/2011 5:34 PM, Howard Brazee wrote: On Thu, 13 Oct 2011 17:09:37 -0700 (PDT), David Barts wrote: Though that's largely irrelevant to my point. Again, if the price premium for a Mac isn't worth it to you (and it sounds like it's not), then just don't buy Macs (and it sounds like you're already not buying them). No problem; my feelings are not hurt in the least by someone making a different choice than I would have. How can that be? Don't you know that anybody who buys an Apple product is an irrational Fanboy? If we weren't fooled, we would all make the same choices, right? Like I say, outside of academia, I just don't see that many MACs ... my niece has MACs, but she works for them ... her kids have PCs ... as far as I know, those are the only MACs in my whole family and group of friends ... but I am sure there must be some around, in number, somewhere ... when I have worked for attorneys, I have seen some used, but then, mainly by attorneys who didn't know how to use a computer ... and yeah, I think they just carried them as a status symbol! Or, to play solitare, card games, match three games, tetris, etc. on the airplanes ... lol Regards, JS Ah Yes an Apple/MAC Computer {Case/Luggage} -says- "I Am An Apple/MAC Person !" [Status Symbol] http://www.globaltang.com/images/l/A...s/MAC%20Access or ies/M108.jpg -and-alas- you are merely a little nothing 'pc' http://rlv.zcache.com/hi_im_a_mac_ba...47765z7tpy_152. jp g . ... as I just pointed out, that figure, most likely, don't not represent all the PC's which are built-up from components ... like most gaming computers are ... the apple share of market is obviously a lot smaller than that being quoted ... Anyone needing state-of-art/specialized-use obviously has a custom built PC ... Good point. Certainly the source I just used only talks about computer sales for complete systems. While in reality a lot of PC are component built either by the consumer or by local computer stores. Most of those, I would assume, would be PC based not MAC. Actually, I think it would be exclusively PC, since I don't believe they sell the primary components of Macs on the retail market. Might be able to do something in the salvage market but that's really a matter of reassembling a computer rather than building a new one from unused parts. Which would explain why I don't see as many Macs as would be indicated by the fact that about 4.5% of all PC sales are Macs. Because PC sales of those built up from components aren't counted. Which would mean every system I have wouldn't count because ALL were component built. Yet, they are active computers. I am now down to three......going down by another after this weekend. Replacing with premade, or just old and unused? Neither. It is a good Toshiba laptop.....just passing it on down since I no longer use it. I have two newer ones. -- Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman) Witnessing Republicans and Democrats bickering over the National Debt is like watching two drunks argue over a bar bill on the Titanic..... |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Scout" wrote in
: "Lloyd E Parsons" wrote in message ... On 10/14/11 4:24 PM, John Smith wrote: Your text, once again, demonstrates the "status symbol" of the MAC: " You must go to some really poor spots!! :) Most places I've been all have brand name boxes there." Indeed, that is the only part of your whole post which has any relevancy! I just went with a relative to social security, while assisting him (is partially blind), I noticed every computer at every desk was a PC ... and mostly custom built ... apparently their IT dept. puts them together ... unless the workers have to bring their own! ROFLOL Regards, JS I can tell you that the local SS offices sure don't have no brand computers in their offices. But whatever the market share of what is, the profits are not with wintel or Linux desktop boxes. No matter who or how they are built, tiny profits seem to be the norm. Except at Apple... Now we can argue that all you want. But keep in mind, IBM got out of the wintel desktop/laptop market years ago, and it looks like HP is going to follow. No profits will do that. No, IBM got out of the RETAIL computer market. They still provide computers for the BUSINESS market, and make quite a bit of money doing so. The problem is the PC market is very competitive and being a name brand just isn't enough that people will pay lots more money to own inferior hardware. What were the IBM laptops are now manufactured and marketed by and under the name Lenovo. -- Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman) Witnessing Republicans and Democrats bickering over the National Debt is like watching two drunks argue over a bar bill on the Titanic..... |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
Lloyd E Parsons wrote in
: On 10/14/11 6:35 PM, Scout wrote: "Lloyd E Parsons" wrote in message ... On 10/14/11 4:24 PM, John Smith wrote: Your text, once again, demonstrates the "status symbol" of the MAC: " You must go to some really poor spots!! :) Most places I've been all have brand name boxes there." Indeed, that is the only part of your whole post which has any relevancy! I just went with a relative to social security, while assisting him (is partially blind), I noticed every computer at every desk was a PC ... and mostly custom built ... apparently their IT dept. puts them together ... unless the workers have to bring their own! ROFLOL Regards, JS I can tell you that the local SS offices sure don't have no brand computers in their offices. But whatever the market share of what is, the profits are not with wintel or Linux desktop boxes. No matter who or how they are built, tiny profits seem to be the norm. Except at Apple... Now we can argue that all you want. But keep in mind, IBM got out of the wintel desktop/laptop market years ago, and it looks like HP is going to follow. No profits will do that. No, IBM got out of the RETAIL computer market. They still provide computers for the BUSINESS market, and make quite a bit of money doing so. No, in fact, IBM does not make any personal computers. They do provide Lenovo branded computers. http://www.ibm.com/ibm/us/en/pcannouncement/ Which came about when IBM added to its laptop development venture in the early 90s with Legend out of China who made some of its components. In the mid-90s development moved from Boca Raton, FL to Raleigh, NC. In the early 2000s, the Lenovo name was introduced although it had been in internal use for some time. In 2004 IBM announced that Lenovo would take over IBM's PC Division. Yes, IBM still produces computers, but not laptops or PCs. They concentrate on the "BIG" market. The problem is the PC market is very competitive and being a name brand just isn't enough that people will pay lots more money to own inferior hardware. You don't need to tell me how competitive it is, I was in the biz for over 20 years. Your statement would ring truer if Apple wasn't able to sell upscale computers at premium prices. Hell, they sell everything at premium prices and make a hell of a big profit margin on all of it. Yes, they do........of which part of that goes to why they are a much smaller (although wildly devoted) segment of the industry. -- Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman) Witnessing Republicans and Democrats bickering over the National Debt is like watching two drunks argue over a bar bill on the Titanic..... |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Scout" wrote in
: "Lloyd E Parsons" wrote in message ... On 10/14/11 6:35 PM, Scout wrote: "Lloyd E Parsons" wrote in message ... On 10/14/11 4:24 PM, John Smith wrote: Your text, once again, demonstrates the "status symbol" of the MAC: " You must go to some really poor spots!! :) Most places I've been all have brand name boxes there." Indeed, that is the only part of your whole post which has any relevancy! I just went with a relative to social security, while assisting him (is partially blind), I noticed every computer at every desk was a PC ... and mostly custom built ... apparently their IT dept. puts them together ... unless the workers have to bring their own! ROFLOL Regards, JS I can tell you that the local SS offices sure don't have no brand computers in their offices. But whatever the market share of what is, the profits are not with wintel or Linux desktop boxes. No matter who or how they are built, tiny profits seem to be the norm. Except at Apple... Now we can argue that all you want. But keep in mind, IBM got out of the wintel desktop/laptop market years ago, and it looks like HP is going to follow. No profits will do that. No, IBM got out of the RETAIL computer market. They still provide computers for the BUSINESS market, and make quite a bit of money doing so. No, in fact, IBM does not make any personal computers. They do provide Lenovo branded computers. http://www.ibm.com/ibm/us/en/pcannouncement/ Hate tell you this....but nothing you said contradicts me in the least. The problem is the PC market is very competitive and being a name brand just isn't enough that people will pay lots more money to own inferior hardware. You don't need to tell me how competitive it is, I was in the biz for over 20 years. Your statement would ring truer if Apple wasn't able to sell upscale computers at premium prices. Hell, they sell everything at premium prices and make a hell of a big profit margin on all of it. Yep, it's a small nitch market among a following of people sold on the brand. That doesn't happen in the PC market because the O/S isn't brand specific. At one point it was....although it was a joint development effort with MS. -- Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman) Witnessing Republicans and Democrats bickering over the National Debt is like watching two drunks argue over a bar bill on the Titanic..... |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On Sat, 15 Oct 2011 08:37:10 -0700, John Smith
wrote: For over 20 years I have been observing, "next year" was going to be the "year of the mac", nothing has changed in that arena, in a LONG, LONG time! Interesting. Where did you observe this? (That is something I haven't observed myself, but nobody can observe everything). But I have observed changes in Macs in the last 20 years. -- "In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found, than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace to the legislature, and not to the executive department." - James Madison |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Howard Brazee" wrote in message ... On Fri, 14 Oct 2011 20:12:02 -0400, "Scout" wrote: No, their desktop market is growing, just not as fast as their laptop market. Sorry, they are selling more desktops because of an expanding market, but their share in that expanding market is decreasing. Other arguments in this thread have been claiming a shrinking desktop market. Which arguments are correct? Both. Desktop computers last longer nowadays before becoming obsolete for most functions. And there are more and better alternatives to desktop computers than there used to be. Yep, but the alternatives are most expensive, less durable, limited in upgrade options, and generally poorer performance than a comparable desktop. |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Lloyd E Parsons" wrote in message ... On 10/15/11 10:46 AM, John Smith wrote: On 10/15/2011 8:41 AM, Lloyd E Parsons wrote: ... I don't think you or I will live long enough to see the 'year of the mac' if that is defined as Apple being the dominant tech provider. Not going to happen. But the 'year of the Mac' has already happened in the upscale tech market with consumers with a few bucks. Yes, I am sure many are heroes in their own mind, have saved the world, dominate the markets ... and it would be evil to destroy their fantasies ... roflol Still, one must keep a foot in reality ... Regards, JS In business, the reality is growing your sales and profits. In that, it has been the year of the Mac for quite awhile now. You are free to talk about what volumes of sales are out there in wintel/linux world, but that is being done at pathetic profit levels. Overall, desktop sales on all platforms is down as more go to laptops. Primarily because laptops now have enough performance for almost all applications and the prices are down quite a bit. Heck for all the bitching about Apple's prices, laptops with similar specifications and build quality are all pretty much the same in cost. Apple just doesn't do cheap laptops. Which is why Apple sells only a small fraction of the number of laptops sold. PC dominates over Mac even in the laptop market |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/15/11 2:53 PM, Scout wrote:
"Lloyd E Parsons" wrote in message ... On 10/15/11 10:46 AM, John Smith wrote: On 10/15/2011 8:41 AM, Lloyd E Parsons wrote: ... I don't think you or I will live long enough to see the 'year of the mac' if that is defined as Apple being the dominant tech provider. Not going to happen. But the 'year of the Mac' has already happened in the upscale tech market with consumers with a few bucks. Yes, I am sure many are heroes in their own mind, have saved the world, dominate the markets ... and it would be evil to destroy their fantasies ... roflol Still, one must keep a foot in reality ... Regards, JS In business, the reality is growing your sales and profits. In that, it has been the year of the Mac for quite awhile now. You are free to talk about what volumes of sales are out there in wintel/linux world, but that is being done at pathetic profit levels. Overall, desktop sales on all platforms is down as more go to laptops. Primarily because laptops now have enough performance for almost all applications and the prices are down quite a bit. Heck for all the bitching about Apple's prices, laptops with similar specifications and build quality are all pretty much the same in cost. Apple just doesn't do cheap laptops. Which is why Apple sells only a small fraction of the number of laptops sold. PC dominates over Mac even in the laptop market At such a low profit margin that HP, one of the biggest in the biz is seriously looking at dumping wintel desktop/laptop production and sales. Apple has been making all the right moves these days. Good products that are very popular at a price point that makes them great profits. A success by any measure except for the 'market share at any cost' types. They literaly own the tablet market at the moment. But will they own the desktop/laptop market? Nope, there will always be a market for a low priced product. -- Lloyd |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
There are a lot of new houses that were poorly built.
You gonna get a free house!,,,, you gonna get free gas!,,,,, gonna pay off your mortgage!,,,,, you gonna get free health care!,,,,,,, cuhulin |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/15/11 17:47 , Don Kirkman wrote:
On Mon, 10 Oct 2011 23:04:46 -0700, John wrote: The rest of what you had to say, bad decisions, paying too much for a home, etc. ... well ya', that is covered in "Life 101." If you missed that class, problems will keep arising until you do take that class! ... don't make those bad decisions, don't pay too much for over valued property, don't buy what you can't afford, etc. You ignore the people who were *told* they could afford the houses they bought. People with a duty to be diligent--brokers, financiers, investment houses, all assured them that they deserved a good house and by heck they could afford one because they were given them a real bargain. Basically, it comes down to common sense, if you can't afford the house, don't buy it... yet ... But if you're assured that you can afford it, who is the real culprit here? When I bought my last house, I carefully constructed the budget. When I got to the financing stage, every carrier I spoke with pushed like mad to get me to take a non-traditional mortgage for far more than I'd considered, with variable interest, balloon payments, and 'creative' structures, all based on the assumption that 1) I'd be selling the property at a substantial profit within 5 years and 2) incomes always rise. I resisted, and stayed with a 30 year fixed at the interest that I'd shopped around for. And was told that rate was no longer available, so the non-traditional was my only option. They sold it hard. "You should buy the maximum amount of house you can possibly afford, and you can afford this." "You're upwardly mobile, you'll be selling to upgrade before the interest rates increase and make a bundle in the process." "You won't be in the house by the time the balloon comes due." Even going so far as to tell me that at my age, a traditional 30 year fixed would simply not be available. But that a 15 year ARM was a virtual certainty to be approved, at nearly 50% more than I'd planned to borrow. I eventually found the mortgage I wanted, at the rate I wanted, and when things collapsed in the housing market, and the economy slowed, I had both equity and a payment I could manage. But it was a fight to the death to get a lender to agree to the traditional mortgage. Few go into this kind of transaction with a fierce determination to do things his own way. Most I've encountered would be quickly swayed by both the temptation of more house than they thought they could afford, or the enticing finance opportunity when so reassured by the lending agency that the risk is small, and the benefits so great. Now, I'm not, by a long shot, opposed to creative financing. I've been quite creative in financing my businesses. And a couple of really nice cars. But only in the short term, and only for small, manageable amounts of money. Specifically, so I'd be prepared as economic fortunes change. So, though I'm hardly one of those 'invade Wall Street' protest types, who blames all ills in the universe of Man on the banking system, I can say that I've seen first hand some of the more underhanded, and manipulative behaviours that have led a lot of folk down a very turbulent river. So, yes: Who is the culprit, indeed. p |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
In article ,
John Smith wrote: No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number. Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales. BFD No, no. Mac sales didn't increase by 13%. Mac sales in the US were 13% of all personal computers sold in the last quarter. I was just thinking, that probably only encompasses whole, complete computers ... since I build my own, and most of my families and friends computers, they are not even counted ... in the final analysis, you can see that figure simply is not a meaningful representation of the total PC market ... You are welcome to present evidence that computers purchased as components and then assemble form any significant fraction of personal computer sales... -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
In article ,
John Smith wrote: Mac sales didn't increase by 13%. Mac sales in the US were 13% of all personal computers sold in the last quarter. I was just thinking, that probably only encompasses whole, complete computers ... since I build my own, and most of my families and friends computers, they are not even counted ... in the final analysis, you can see that figure simply is not a meaningful representation of the total PC market ... Regards, JS Hogwash! What you build and other hobbyists also, is such a tiny part of the sales market it has no real bearing on the issue at all. And for the most part, few companies care about that build-your-own hobbyist market except some parts makers. That is BS for me, most I see are custom builds ... but I don't hang around old people who can't use computers and own dells ... There's the true religion! -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
In article ,
"Scout" wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , "Scout" wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , "Scout" wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , John Smith wrote: On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote: On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Your post is an excellent example of what I have found about "Apple People", they have a religious devotion to the platform ... Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes that anyone who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious devotion... Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse MAC's, is that I write much of the software I use ... plus, I private contract to develop software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired, for the most part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it simply would not make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the business to make money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked hard in being one of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think they can do that without me ... In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from your perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers with their own OS? You can write software for that platform just as you can for Windows or for Linux. Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their software, just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or even an idildo, for that matter! ROFLOL So? Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware and Microsoft doesn't? Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the conversation I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang less buck will do ... It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools always end up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil just doesn't really apply. If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any crimes which have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean, like, DUH! Regards, JS As I said: How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what you do not must be a fool... It's a cultural standard, today. Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html No like this. http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac snip Like he said, Mac can't compete. LOL No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number. Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales. BFD No, no. Mac sales didn't increase by 13%. Mac sales in the US were 13% of all personal computers sold in the last quarter. Wrong, that is the amount sales have increased. Incorrect. http://www.appleinsider.com/articles...ow_13_of_us_ma rket_as_ipad_snags_dollars_away_from_pcs.html Mac sales still only constitute about 4.5% of total PC sales. Not in the US they don't. You should learn to read. PC sales in Q2 2011 "Overall, the number of units reached 85 million, of which HP, Dell, Lenovo, Acer and ASUS accounted for 17.5%, 12.5%, 12%, 10.9% and 5.2%, respectively." http://news.softpedia.com/news/Gartn...se-in-Q2-2011- 211780.shtml Meanwhile: Mac sales a Mac sales in Q2 2011 "Mac sales increased 28 percent from last year, with 3.76 million sold" http://gigaom.com/apple/apple-q2-201...lso-sold-4-69- million-ipads/ 3.76/85 = 4.4% So sales are actually less than my estimate of 4.5% That's a LONG way from the 13% you assert. You should learn to read. No, bubba, sales of Macs increased by 13% (probably from Q1 2011) not that Mac sales constitute 13% of all PC sales. In the U.S. You should learn to read. IOW, sales of Mac increased from about 3.25 Million to 3.76 Million per quarter. Incorrect. Your a quarter behind. But next to total PC sales of 85 Million.....that's a pretty minimal change representing a difference of only about 0.6% increase in market share for that quarter. You should take into consideration that some considerable number of non-Mac PCs are bought for non-personal computer use in industrial applications, etc. Further if we look the BULK of Mac sales are the mobiles. Desktop Mac sales continue to drop off. "Apple sold 2.75 million laptops, compared to 1.01 million desktops, with laptops accounting for 73 percent of Mac sales for the quarter. By the end of the calendar year, it's likely three out of four Macs sold will be portables. The inexorable trend towards niche status for desktops continues." http://gigaom.com/apple/apple-q2-201...lso-sold-4-69- million-ipads/ Seems people don't want a Mac sitting on their computer desk, unless they can walk away with it. Laptops are on the rise all over, silly. -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
In article ,
John Smith wrote: On 10/13/2011 8:16 PM, Tankfixer wrote: In , - Lloyd E Parsons spouted ! On 10/13/11 7:56 AM, RHF wrote: On Oct 12, 11:49 pm, John wrote: On 10/12/2011 10:40 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , . net wrote: "Alan wrote in message ... In , John wrote: On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote: On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Your post is an excellent example of what I have found about "Apple People", they have a religious devotion to the platform ... Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes that anyone who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious devotion... Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse MAC's, is that I write much of the software I use ... plus, I private contract to develop software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired, for the most part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it simply would not make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the business to make money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked hard in being one of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think they can do that without me ... In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from your perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers with their own OS? You can write software for that platform just as you can for Windows or for Linux. Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their software, just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or even an idildo, for that matter! ROFLOL So? Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware and Microsoft doesn't? Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the conversation I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang less buck will do ... It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools always end up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil just doesn't really apply. If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any crimes which have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean, like, DUH! Regards, JS As I said: How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what you do not must be a fool... It's a cultural standard, today. Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html No like this. http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac snip Like he said, Mac can't compete. LOL No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. That can be easily explained for any number of reasons which DON'T substantiate the hardware and software of MAC being "better." One which jumps to mind, immediately, a number of people just as ignorant as you have just went out and purchased new computers and have skewed the statistics for a short period, causing a false "blip" on those statistics ... Regards, JS For the Non-Techies : PC -vs- Mac http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/w...pare/pc-vs-mac non-tech-r-i ~ RHF . . LOL! MS for a non-techie, balanced comparison of the two! Ya gotta love it!! :) But keep in mind, if you buy a Mac you have both a solid OSX (unix) machine as well as a great Windows box too! A twofer! Or you can buy a bare drive PC and load whatever version of Linux you want and save a $1000 ... Or, you can just grap the components, build your own for 400 bucks, or under ... building your own, shopping sales, ebay, newegg, etc. you can put together a decent gaming computer for a grand! I realize that the zealot in you will prevent you from grasping this, but... ....most people have no interest in building their own computers. -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
In article ,
"Scout" wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , "Scout" wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , John Smith wrote: On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote: On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Your post is an excellent example of what I have found about "Apple People", they have a religious devotion to the platform ... Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes that anyone who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious devotion... Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse MAC's, is that I write much of the software I use ... plus, I private contract to develop software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired, for the most part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it simply would not make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the business to make money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked hard in being one of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think they can do that without me ... In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from your perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers with their own OS? You can write software for that platform just as you can for Windows or for Linux. Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their software, just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or even an idildo, for that matter! ROFLOL So? Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware and Microsoft doesn't? Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the conversation I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang less buck will do ... It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools always end up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil just doesn't really apply. If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any crimes which have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean, like, DUH! Regards, JS As I said: How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what you do not must be a fool... It's a cultural standard, today. Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html No like this. http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac snip Like he said, Mac can't compete. LOL No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number. Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales. BFD A very big deal. 1. Macs are almost solely used as personal computers where as generic PCs are also in other markets, but their sales are counted as being in the same bucket as Mac sales. 2. Mac sales have more than doubled in the last 5 years. 3. Mac sales in the more affluent parts of the world are now well over 10%. The people who develop software are more interested in customers who have the money to also purchase more software than the barebones personal computer purchasers in India and China. -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , John Smith wrote: No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number. Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales. BFD No, no. Mac sales didn't increase by 13%. Mac sales in the US were 13% of all personal computers sold in the last quarter. I was just thinking, that probably only encompasses whole, complete computers ... since I build my own, and most of my families and friends computers, they are not even counted ... in the final analysis, you can see that figure simply is not a meaningful representation of the total PC market ... You are welcome to present evidence that computers purchased as components and then assemble form any significant fraction of personal computer sales... Already done, and by retail motherboard sales of the top 5 makers, they constitute about 15% of total computer sales, and by the same measure Macs constitute some 3.7%. If one is irrelevent, then the other is even more so. |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , "Scout" wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , "Scout" wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , "Scout" wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , John Smith wrote: On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote: On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Your post is an excellent example of what I have found about "Apple People", they have a religious devotion to the platform ... Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes that anyone who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious devotion... Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse MAC's, is that I write much of the software I use ... plus, I private contract to develop software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired, for the most part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it simply would not make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the business to make money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked hard in being one of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think they can do that without me ... In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from your perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers with their own OS? You can write software for that platform just as you can for Windows or for Linux. Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their software, just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or even an idildo, for that matter! ROFLOL So? Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware and Microsoft doesn't? Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the conversation I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang less buck will do ... It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools always end up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil just doesn't really apply. If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any crimes which have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean, like, DUH! Regards, JS As I said: How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what you do not must be a fool... It's a cultural standard, today. Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html No like this. http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac snip Like he said, Mac can't compete. LOL No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number. Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales. BFD No, no. Mac sales didn't increase by 13%. Mac sales in the US were 13% of all personal computers sold in the last quarter. Wrong, that is the amount sales have increased. Incorrect. http://www.appleinsider.com/articles...ow_13_of_us_ma rket_as_ipad_snags_dollars_away_from_pcs.html Read your own source. "Apple's Mac now 13% of US market as iPad snags dollars away from PCs" It should be noted that the iPad is NOT a Mac, as such Mac sales do NOT constitute 13% of all PC sales. Mac sales still only constitute about 4.5% of total PC sales. Not in the US they don't. You should learn to read. PC sales in Q2 2011 "Overall, the number of units reached 85 million, of which HP, Dell, Lenovo, Acer and ASUS accounted for 17.5%, 12.5%, 12%, 10.9% and 5.2%, respectively." http://news.softpedia.com/news/Gartn...se-in-Q2-2011- 211780.shtml Meanwhile: Mac sales a Mac sales in Q2 2011 "Mac sales increased 28 percent from last year, with 3.76 million sold" http://gigaom.com/apple/apple-q2-201...lso-sold-4-69- million-ipads/ 3.76/85 = 4.4% So sales are actually less than my estimate of 4.5% That's a LONG way from the 13% you assert. You should learn to read. I think you should consider following your own advice since I looked at Mac sales as specified while your source includes iPad sales and who knows what else as "Mac sales". Don't blame me if your headliner writer can't tell the different between a Mac and an iPad, or that you're too stupid to notice the difference. No, bubba, sales of Macs increased by 13% (probably from Q1 2011) not that Mac sales constitute 13% of all PC sales. In the U.S. You should learn to read. IOW, sales of Mac increased from about 3.25 Million to 3.76 Million per quarter. Incorrect. Your a quarter behind. Somehow I doubt 1 quarter is going to significantly alter the numbers, my proofs, my conclusions, or bolster your BS assertion that Mac sales constitute 13% of all PC sales. But next to total PC sales of 85 Million.....that's a pretty minimal change representing a difference of only about 0.6% increase in market share for that quarter. You should take into consideration that some considerable number of non-Mac PCs are bought for non-personal computer use in industrial applications, etc. Agreed, but that should be included in the above numbers as long as they are actual personal computers and not computer based controls. Further if we look the BULK of Mac sales are the mobiles. Desktop Mac sales continue to drop off. "Apple sold 2.75 million laptops, compared to 1.01 million desktops, with laptops accounting for 73 percent of Mac sales for the quarter. By the end of the calendar year, it's likely three out of four Macs sold will be portables. The inexorable trend towards niche status for desktops continues." http://gigaom.com/apple/apple-q2-201...lso-sold-4-69- million-ipads/ Seems people don't want a Mac sitting on their computer desk, unless they can walk away with it. Laptops are on the rise all over, silly. Yep, which doesn't refute my point. |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , John Smith wrote: On 10/13/2011 8:16 PM, Tankfixer wrote: In , - Lloyd E Parsons spouted ! On 10/13/11 7:56 AM, RHF wrote: On Oct 12, 11:49 pm, John wrote: On 10/12/2011 10:40 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , . net wrote: "Alan wrote in message ... In , John wrote: On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote: On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Your post is an excellent example of what I have found about "Apple People", they have a religious devotion to the platform ... Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes that anyone who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious devotion... Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse MAC's, is that I write much of the software I use ... plus, I private contract to develop software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired, for the most part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it simply would not make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the business to make money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked hard in being one of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think they can do that without me ... In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from your perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers with their own OS? You can write software for that platform just as you can for Windows or for Linux. Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their software, just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or even an idildo, for that matter! ROFLOL So? Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware and Microsoft doesn't? Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the conversation I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang less buck will do ... It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools always end up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil just doesn't really apply. If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any crimes which have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean, like, DUH! Regards, JS As I said: How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what you do not must be a fool... It's a cultural standard, today. Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html No like this. http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac snip Like he said, Mac can't compete. LOL No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. That can be easily explained for any number of reasons which DON'T substantiate the hardware and software of MAC being "better." One which jumps to mind, immediately, a number of people just as ignorant as you have just went out and purchased new computers and have skewed the statistics for a short period, causing a false "blip" on those statistics ... Regards, JS For the Non-Techies : PC -vs- Mac http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/w...pare/pc-vs-mac non-tech-r-i ~ RHF . . LOL! MS for a non-techie, balanced comparison of the two! Ya gotta love it!! :) But keep in mind, if you buy a Mac you have both a solid OSX (unix) machine as well as a great Windows box too! A twofer! Or you can buy a bare drive PC and load whatever version of Linux you want and save a $1000 ... Or, you can just grap the components, build your own for 400 bucks, or under ... building your own, shopping sales, ebay, newegg, etc. you can put together a decent gaming computer for a grand! I realize that the zealot in you will prevent you from grasping this, but... ...most people have no interest in building their own computers. However, they are often willing to buy component built systems because they are better or cheaper than named PC packages. Quite a few people make a living supplying people with such systems customized to their specific desires. |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , "Scout" wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , "Scout" wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , John Smith wrote: On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote: On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Your post is an excellent example of what I have found about "Apple People", they have a religious devotion to the platform ... Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes that anyone who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious devotion... Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse MAC's, is that I write much of the software I use ... plus, I private contract to develop software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired, for the most part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it simply would not make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the business to make money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked hard in being one of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think they can do that without me ... In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from your perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers with their own OS? You can write software for that platform just as you can for Windows or for Linux. Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their software, just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or even an idildo, for that matter! ROFLOL So? Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware and Microsoft doesn't? Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the conversation I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang less buck will do ... It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools always end up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil just doesn't really apply. If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any crimes which have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean, like, DUH! Regards, JS As I said: How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what you do not must be a fool... It's a cultural standard, today. Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html No like this. http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac snip Like he said, Mac can't compete. LOL No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number. Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales. BFD A very big deal. 1. Macs are almost solely used as personal computers where as generic PCs are also in other markets, but their sales are counted as being in the same bucket as Mac sales. Cite. 2. Mac sales have more than doubled in the last 5 years. So has the computer market. 3. Mac sales in the more affluent parts of the world are now well over 10%. India? The people who develop software are more interested in customers who have the money to also purchase more software than the barebones personal computer purchasers in India and China. Oddly, India is one of Mac's fastest growing markets. |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
In article ,
"Scout" wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , "Scout" wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , "Scout" wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , "Scout" wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , John Smith wrote: On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote: On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Your post is an excellent example of what I have found about "Apple People", they have a religious devotion to the platform ... Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes that anyone who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious devotion... Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse MAC's, is that I write much of the software I use ... plus, I private contract to develop software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired, for the most part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it simply would not make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the business to make money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked hard in being one of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think they can do that without me ... In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from your perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers with their own OS? You can write software for that platform just as you can for Windows or for Linux. Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their software, just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or even an idildo, for that matter! ROFLOL So? Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware and Microsoft doesn't? Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the conversation I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang less buck will do ... It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools always end up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil just doesn't really apply. If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any crimes which have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean, like, DUH! Regards, JS As I said: How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what you do not must be a fool... It's a cultural standard, today. Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html No like this. http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac snip Like he said, Mac can't compete. LOL No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number. Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales. BFD No, no. Mac sales didn't increase by 13%. Mac sales in the US were 13% of all personal computers sold in the last quarter. Wrong, that is the amount sales have increased. Incorrect. http://www.appleinsider.com/articles...ow_13_of_us_ma rket_as_ipad_snags_dollars_away_from_pcs.html Read your own source. "Apple's Mac now 13% of US market as iPad snags dollars away from PCs" It should be noted that the iPad is NOT a Mac, as such Mac sales do NOT constitute 13% of all PC sales. And the source was not counting iPads as Macs. It was noting that there is a class of non-Mac personal computers that people are buying less of: netbooks; instead they're buying iPads. In the personal computer sales area, that means fewer non-Mac PCs which, in conjunction with rising Mac sales, means a greater percentage of Macs. Mac sales still only constitute about 4.5% of total PC sales. Not in the US they don't. You should learn to read. PC sales in Q2 2011 "Overall, the number of units reached 85 million, of which HP, Dell, Lenovo, Acer and ASUS accounted for 17.5%, 12.5%, 12%, 10.9% and 5.2%, respectively." http://news.softpedia.com/news/Gartn...-Rose-in-Q2-20 11- 211780.shtml Meanwhile: Mac sales a Mac sales in Q2 2011 "Mac sales increased 28 percent from last year, with 3.76 million sold" http://gigaom.com/apple/apple-q2-201...e-also-sold-4- 69- million-ipads/ 3.76/85 = 4.4% So sales are actually less than my estimate of 4.5% That's a LONG way from the 13% you assert. You should learn to read. I think you should consider following your own advice since I looked at Mac sales as specified while your source includes iPad sales and who knows what else as "Mac sales". Don't blame me if your headliner writer can't tell the different between a Mac and an iPad, or that you're too stupid to notice the difference. I blame you for misreading the article. No, bubba, sales of Macs increased by 13% (probably from Q1 2011) not that Mac sales constitute 13% of all PC sales. In the U.S. You should learn to read. IOW, sales of Mac increased from about 3.25 Million to 3.76 Million per quarter. Incorrect. Your a quarter behind. Somehow I doubt 1 quarter is going to significantly alter the numbers, my proofs, my conclusions, or bolster your BS assertion that Mac sales constitute 13% of all PC sales. The original sources was Gartner: "Preliminary United States PC Vendor Unit Shipment Estimates for 3Q11 (Units) Company 3Q11 Shipments 3Q11 Market Share (%) HP 5,132,614 28.9 Dell 3,886,864 21.9 Apple 2,300,000 12.9" http://www.gartner.com/it/page.jsp?id=1821731 And, yeah: "Note: Data includes desk-based PCs, mobile PCs, including mini-notebooks but not media tablets such as the iPad. " Which explains the headline just as I said. You lose. But next to total PC sales of 85 Million.....that's a pretty minimal change representing a difference of only about 0.6% increase in market share for that quarter. You should take into consideration that some considerable number of non-Mac PCs are bought for non-personal computer use in industrial applications, etc. Agreed, but that should be included in the above numbers as long as they are actual personal computers and not computer based controls. Why? Further if we look the BULK of Mac sales are the mobiles. Desktop Mac sales continue to drop off. "Apple sold 2.75 million laptops, compared to 1.01 million desktops, with laptops accounting for 73 percent of Mac sales for the quarter. By the end of the calendar year, it's likely three out of four Macs sold will be portables. The inexorable trend towards niche status for desktops continues." http://gigaom.com/apple/apple-q2-201...e-also-sold-4- 69- million-ipads/ Seems people don't want a Mac sitting on their computer desk, unless they can walk away with it. Laptops are on the rise all over, silly. Yep, which doesn't refute my point. What was your point, then? -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
In article ,
"Scout" wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , John Smith wrote: On 10/13/2011 8:16 PM, Tankfixer wrote: In , - Lloyd E Parsons spouted ! On 10/13/11 7:56 AM, RHF wrote: On Oct 12, 11:49 pm, John wrote: On 10/12/2011 10:40 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , . net wrote: "Alan wrote in message ... In , John wrote: On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote: On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Your post is an excellent example of what I have found about "Apple People", they have a religious devotion to the platform ... Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes that anyone who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious devotion... Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse MAC's, is that I write much of the software I use ... plus, I private contract to develop software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired, for the most part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it simply would not make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the business to make money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked hard in being one of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think they can do that without me ... In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from your perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers with their own OS? You can write software for that platform just as you can for Windows or for Linux. Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their software, just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or even an idildo, for that matter! ROFLOL So? Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware and Microsoft doesn't? Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the conversation I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang less buck will do ... It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools always end up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil just doesn't really apply. If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any crimes which have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean, like, DUH! Regards, JS As I said: How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what you do not must be a fool... It's a cultural standard, today. Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html No like this. http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac snip Like he said, Mac can't compete. LOL No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. That can be easily explained for any number of reasons which DON'T substantiate the hardware and software of MAC being "better." One which jumps to mind, immediately, a number of people just as ignorant as you have just went out and purchased new computers and have skewed the statistics for a short period, causing a false "blip" on those statistics ... Regards, JS For the Non-Techies : PC -vs- Mac http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/w...pare/pc-vs-mac non-tech-r-i ~ RHF . . LOL! MS for a non-techie, balanced comparison of the two! Ya gotta love it!! :) But keep in mind, if you buy a Mac you have both a solid OSX (unix) machine as well as a great Windows box too! A twofer! Or you can buy a bare drive PC and load whatever version of Linux you want and save a $1000 ... Or, you can just grap the components, build your own for 400 bucks, or under ... building your own, shopping sales, ebay, newegg, etc. you can put together a decent gaming computer for a grand! I realize that the zealot in you will prevent you from grasping this, but... ...most people have no interest in building their own computers. However, they are often willing to buy component built systems because they are better or cheaper than named PC packages. A very few people. Quite a few people make a living supplying people with such systems customized to their specific desires. -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
In article ,
"Scout" wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , "Scout" wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , "Scout" wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , John Smith wrote: On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote: On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Your post is an excellent example of what I have found about "Apple People", they have a religious devotion to the platform ... Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes that anyone who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious devotion... Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse MAC's, is that I write much of the software I use ... plus, I private contract to develop software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired, for the most part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it simply would not make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the business to make money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked hard in being one of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think they can do that without me ... In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from your perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers with their own OS? You can write software for that platform just as you can for Windows or for Linux. Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their software, just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or even an idildo, for that matter! ROFLOL So? Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware and Microsoft doesn't? Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the conversation I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang less buck will do ... It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools always end up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil just doesn't really apply. If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any crimes which have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean, like, DUH! Regards, JS As I said: How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what you do not must be a fool... It's a cultural standard, today. Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html No like this. http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac snip Like he said, Mac can't compete. LOL No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number. Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales. BFD A very big deal. 1. Macs are almost solely used as personal computers where as generic PCs are also in other markets, but their sales are counted as being in the same bucket as Mac sales. Cite. Do you really believe that that statement isn't true? 2. Mac sales have more than doubled in the last 5 years. So has the computer market. sigh The Mac's MARKET SHARE has more than doubled. 3. Mac sales in the more affluent parts of the world are now well over 10%. India? No. Not India. That's the point. The people who develop software are more interested in customers who have the money to also purchase more software than the barebones personal computer purchasers in India and China. Oddly, India is one of Mac's fastest growing markets. Cite? -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/15/2011 8:56 AM, Lloyd E Parsons wrote:
On 10/15/11 10:46 AM, John Smith wrote: On 10/15/2011 8:41 AM, Lloyd E Parsons wrote: ... I don't think you or I will live long enough to see the 'year of the mac' if that is defined as Apple being the dominant tech provider. Not going to happen. But the 'year of the Mac' has already happened in the upscale tech market with consumers with a few bucks. Yes, I am sure many are heroes in their own mind, have saved the world, dominate the markets ... and it would be evil to destroy their fantasies ... roflol Still, one must keep a foot in reality ... Regards, JS In business, the reality is growing your sales and profits. In that, it has been the year of the Mac for quite awhile now. You are free to talk about what volumes of sales are out there in wintel/linux world, but that is being done at pathetic profit levels. Overall, desktop sales on all platforms is down as more go to laptops. Primarily because laptops now have enough performance for almost all applications and the prices are down quite a bit. Heck for all the bitching about Apple's prices, laptops with similar specifications and build quality are all pretty much the same in cost. Apple just doesn't do cheap laptops. They do! The just sell them for a lot ... not-a-days, it is claimed barnum didn't say but, but none-the-less true ... one is born every minute ... today, it seems every second! Regards, JS |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/15/2011 12:44 PM, Scout wrote:
"Howard Brazee" wrote in message ... On Fri, 14 Oct 2011 20:12:02 -0400, "Scout" wrote: No, their desktop market is growing, just not as fast as their laptop market. Sorry, they are selling more desktops because of an expanding market, but their share in that expanding market is decreasing. Other arguments in this thread have been claiming a shrinking desktop market. Which arguments are correct? Both. Desktop computers last longer nowadays before becoming obsolete for most functions. And there are more and better alternatives to desktop computers than there used to be. Yep, but the alternatives are most expensive, less durable, limited in upgrade options, and generally poorer performance than a comparable desktop. Yes, what the world needs is a generic platform for the laptop, where as much choice of components is available as in the desktop/tower platform .... proprietary chit is always crap ... Regards, JS |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
In article ,
John Smith wrote: On 10/15/2011 8:56 AM, Lloyd E Parsons wrote: On 10/15/11 10:46 AM, John Smith wrote: On 10/15/2011 8:41 AM, Lloyd E Parsons wrote: ... I don't think you or I will live long enough to see the 'year of the mac' if that is defined as Apple being the dominant tech provider. Not going to happen. But the 'year of the Mac' has already happened in the upscale tech market with consumers with a few bucks. Yes, I am sure many are heroes in their own mind, have saved the world, dominate the markets ... and it would be evil to destroy their fantasies ... roflol Still, one must keep a foot in reality ... Regards, JS In business, the reality is growing your sales and profits. In that, it has been the year of the Mac for quite awhile now. You are free to talk about what volumes of sales are out there in wintel/linux world, but that is being done at pathetic profit levels. Overall, desktop sales on all platforms is down as more go to laptops. Primarily because laptops now have enough performance for almost all applications and the prices are down quite a bit. Heck for all the bitching about Apple's prices, laptops with similar specifications and build quality are all pretty much the same in cost. Apple just doesn't do cheap laptops. They do! The just sell them for a lot ... not-a-days, it is claimed barnum didn't say but, but none-the-less true ... one is born every minute ... today, it seems every second! Which is why other PC manufacturers have been pressuring Intel to lower their pricing so that they can better compete with Apple's laptops... -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/15/2011 5:46 PM, Alan Baker wrote:
In , John wrote: No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number. Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales. BFD No, no. Mac sales didn't increase by 13%. Mac sales in the US were 13% of all personal computers sold in the last quarter. I was just thinking, that probably only encompasses whole, complete computers ... since I build my own, and most of my families and friends computers, they are not even counted ... in the final analysis, you can see that figure simply is not a meaningful representation of the total PC market ... You are welcome to present evidence that computers purchased as components and then assemble form any significant fraction of personal computer sales... Don't have to, anyone not living under a rock knows it ... it is self-apparent ... one would have to stick their head in a hole to miss it. Regards, JS |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
In article ,
"Scout" wrote: "Lloyd E Parsons" wrote in message ... On 10/15/11 10:46 AM, John Smith wrote: On 10/15/2011 8:41 AM, Lloyd E Parsons wrote: ... I don't think you or I will live long enough to see the 'year of the mac' if that is defined as Apple being the dominant tech provider. Not going to happen. But the 'year of the Mac' has already happened in the upscale tech market with consumers with a few bucks. Yes, I am sure many are heroes in their own mind, have saved the world, dominate the markets ... and it would be evil to destroy their fantasies ... roflol Still, one must keep a foot in reality ... Regards, JS In business, the reality is growing your sales and profits. In that, it has been the year of the Mac for quite awhile now. You are free to talk about what volumes of sales are out there in wintel/linux world, but that is being done at pathetic profit levels. Overall, desktop sales on all platforms is down as more go to laptops. Primarily because laptops now have enough performance for almost all applications and the prices are down quite a bit. Heck for all the bitching about Apple's prices, laptops with similar specifications and build quality are all pretty much the same in cost. Apple just doesn't do cheap laptops. Which is why Apple sells only a small fraction of the number of laptops sold. PC dominates over Mac even in the laptop market But Apple makes most of the profit... :-) -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/15/2011 3:47 PM, Don Kirkman wrote:
On Mon, 10 Oct 2011 23:04:46 -0700, John wrote: The rest of what you had to say, bad decisions, paying too much for a home, etc. ... well ya', that is covered in "Life 101." If you missed that class, problems will keep arising until you do take that class! ... don't make those bad decisions, don't pay too much for over valued property, don't buy what you can't afford, etc. You ignore the people who were *told* they could afford the houses they bought. People with a duty to be diligent--brokers, financiers, investment houses, all assured them that they deserved a good house and by heck they could afford one because they were given them a real bargain. I guess some missed the basic education of where the teacher asked you, "If someone told you to jump off a cliff, would you?" Basically, it comes down to common sense, if you can't afford the house, don't buy it... yet ... But if you're assured that you can afford it, who is the real culprit here? If you are into trusting, I got something to tell you, "Give me your money to hold, for five years, I'll give you back double!" ROFLOL You were kidding, right? Regards, JS |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/15/2011 5:58 PM, Alan Baker wrote:
In , John wrote: On 10/13/2011 8:16 PM, Tankfixer wrote: In , - Lloyd E Parsons spouted ! On 10/13/11 7:56 AM, RHF wrote: On Oct 12, 11:49 pm, John wrote: On 10/12/2011 10:40 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , . net wrote: "Alan wrote in message ... In , John wrote: On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote: On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Your post is an excellent example of what I have found about "Apple People", they have a religious devotion to the platform ... Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes that anyone who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious devotion... Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse MAC's, is that I write much of the software I use ... plus, I private contract to develop software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired, for the most part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it simply would not make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the business to make money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked hard in being one of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think they can do that without me ... In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from your perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers with their own OS? You can write software for that platform just as you can for Windows or for Linux. Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their software, just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or even an idildo, for that matter! ROFLOL So? Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware and Microsoft doesn't? Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the conversation I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang less buck will do ... It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools always end up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil just doesn't really apply. If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any crimes which have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean, like, DUH! Regards, JS As I said: How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what you do not must be a fool... It's a cultural standard, today. Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html No like this. http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac snip Like he said, Mac can't compete. LOL No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. That can be easily explained for any number of reasons which DON'T substantiate the hardware and software of MAC being "better." One which jumps to mind, immediately, a number of people just as ignorant as you have just went out and purchased new computers and have skewed the statistics for a short period, causing a false "blip" on those statistics ... Regards, JS For the Non-Techies : PC -vs- Mac http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/w...pare/pc-vs-mac non-tech-r-i ~ RHF . . LOL! MS for a non-techie, balanced comparison of the two! Ya gotta love it!! :) But keep in mind, if you buy a Mac you have both a solid OSX (unix) machine as well as a great Windows box too! A twofer! Or you can buy a bare drive PC and load whatever version of Linux you want and save a $1000 ... Or, you can just grap the components, build your own for 400 bucks, or under ... building your own, shopping sales, ebay, newegg, etc. you can put together a decent gaming computer for a grand! I realize that the zealot in you will prevent you from grasping this, but... ...most people have no interest in building their own computers. Oh, much worse than that, they don't even wish to own a decent one, the ones buying macs are proof enough of that ... Regards, JS |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/15/2011 7:22 PM, Scout wrote:
"Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , John Smith wrote: On 10/13/2011 8:16 PM, Tankfixer wrote: In , - Lloyd E Parsons spouted ! On 10/13/11 7:56 AM, RHF wrote: On Oct 12, 11:49 pm, John wrote: On 10/12/2011 10:40 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , . net wrote: "Alan wrote in message ... In , John wrote: On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote: On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Your post is an excellent example of what I have found about "Apple People", they have a religious devotion to the platform ... Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes that anyone who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious devotion... Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse MAC's, is that I write much of the software I use ... plus, I private contract to develop software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired, for the most part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it simply would not make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the business to make money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked hard in being one of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think they can do that without me ... In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from your perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers with their own OS? You can write software for that platform just as you can for Windows or for Linux. Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their software, just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or even an idildo, for that matter! ROFLOL So? Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware and Microsoft doesn't? Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the conversation I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang less buck will do ... It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools always end up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil just doesn't really apply. If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any crimes which have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean, like, DUH! Regards, JS As I said: How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what you do not must be a fool... It's a cultural standard, today. Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html No like this. http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac snip Like he said, Mac can't compete. LOL No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. That can be easily explained for any number of reasons which DON'T substantiate the hardware and software of MAC being "better." One which jumps to mind, immediately, a number of people just as ignorant as you have just went out and purchased new computers and have skewed the statistics for a short period, causing a false "blip" on those statistics ... Regards, JS For the Non-Techies : PC -vs- Mac http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/w...pare/pc-vs-mac non-tech-r-i ~ RHF . . LOL! MS for a non-techie, balanced comparison of the two! Ya gotta love it!! :) But keep in mind, if you buy a Mac you have both a solid OSX (unix) machine as well as a great Windows box too! A twofer! Or you can buy a bare drive PC and load whatever version of Linux you want and save a $1000 ... Or, you can just grap the components, build your own for 400 bucks, or under ... building your own, shopping sales, ebay, newegg, etc. you can put together a decent gaming computer for a grand! I realize that the zealot in you will prevent you from grasping this, but... ...most people have no interest in building their own computers. However, they are often willing to buy component built systems because they are better or cheaper than named PC packages. Quite a few people make a living supplying people with such systems customized to their specific desires. It has been my experience, you run into a real dyed-in-the-wool-fool and all bets are off! Regards, JS |
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