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(OT) Steve Jobs.
In article ,
"Scout" wrote: "Howard Brazee" wrote in message ... On Thu, 13 Oct 2011 19:00:47 -0700, John Smith wrote: Like I say, outside of academia, I just don't see that many MACs I don't see what academia use, I don't see what most companies use. But I do see what people have in coffee houses - and there are lots of Macs there. That's about where you're going to find them since 3/4 of Macs being sold are the laptops. The Mac desktop market keeps shrinking. No, Scout: THE desktop market keeps shrinking. -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
In article ,
John Smith wrote: On 10/15/2011 5:46 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number. Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales. BFD No, no. Mac sales didn't increase by 13%. Mac sales in the US were 13% of all personal computers sold in the last quarter. I was just thinking, that probably only encompasses whole, complete computers ... since I build my own, and most of my families and friends computers, they are not even counted ... in the final analysis, you can see that figure simply is not a meaningful representation of the total PC market ... You are welcome to present evidence that computers purchased as components and then assemble form any significant fraction of personal computer sales... Don't have to, anyone not living under a rock knows it ... it is self-apparent ... one would have to stick their head in a hole to miss it. Regards, JS So you have nothing... -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
In article ,
John Smith wrote: LOL! MS for a non-techie, balanced comparison of the two! Ya gotta love it!! :) But keep in mind, if you buy a Mac you have both a solid OSX (unix) machine as well as a great Windows box too! A twofer! Or you can buy a bare drive PC and load whatever version of Linux you want and save a $1000 ... Or, you can just grap the components, build your own for 400 bucks, or under ... building your own, shopping sales, ebay, newegg, etc. you can put together a decent gaming computer for a grand! I realize that the zealot in you will prevent you from grasping this, but... ...most people have no interest in building their own computers. Oh, much worse than that, they don't even wish to own a decent one, the ones buying macs are proof enough of that ... No. That they are buying Macs is proof they work well for normal people. -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
In article ,
John Smith wrote: On 10/13/2011 12:05 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/12/2011 10:47 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html And with audio, do you mean like this: http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/ProFireLightbridge.html Or this: http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/Delta1010.html Or perhaps this: http://www.motu.com/products/pciaudio/HD192/specs.html No plug your SDR amateur rig into the USB port of your PC and start using it ... notice that there is no software available for the MAC ... linux is covered with an app, etc., etc., etc. Really? No software at all, huh? http://www.rfspace.com/RFSPACE/CuteSDR.html You keep putting words in my mouth, seems like I said a PC can do it better ... that was the part you choose to dispute, not the faster, cheaper ... or the fact that PC stays current with uptodate software/codecs/drivers/hardware/firmware ... I asked how it did it better and you responded with things that (apparently) you thought you couldn't do with a Mac. Got a comparison to this card for the PC: http://pressroom.nvidia.com/easyir/c...A0D622CE9F579F 09 &v ers ion=live&releasejsp=release_157&xhtml=true&prid=73 6275 I don't need one. Good thing too ... as you will have to "not need a lot of things" when running a MAC! Superior video is just one of them ... if you play video games, you can forget the ones which have no MAC version ... Regards, JS LOL And now it comes out: what you want "superior video" for is... ...video games! There are virtually NO applications which are as demanding as video games on a home PC. Since I contract to develop software, and compiler/linker speeds are important to me, it is worth considering and benchmarking ... however, what am I, one out of 10,000 who runs such a demanding commercial app? So, of course video games become the best universal benchmark -- any child can run them, even if the adults can't ... No, actually. Video games are hard on VIDEO performance, John. Almost all of the processing load they create is handled by the GPU... ...a part which plays essentially no useful role in compiling and linking software. However, you are doing the best you can. At this point, your have realized and woken up to reality, and that the MAC is vastly inferior in comparison to even mid range PC's ... when confronted with this reality, and one realizes they have taken a false position, one must switch over to personal attacks on their opposite in the argument ... abandoning any hope of proving their false positions to be correct. The Mac is better for normal people, John. They want a machine that is easy to use and that doesn't have problems. Most people don't want to modify their computers with performance add-ons any more than they want to do the analogous things to their cars. It will also help to lock your mind into denial, and think that no one here will be smart enough to see what is going on, the desperation and desperate tact's you are being forced to take, to believe they will become obfuscated by the false complexities of your diversions ... that they will not notice you switching subjects, points, facts ... etc. You mean like claiming that video card performance is important to compiling? But, I will ... you can make book on that. Regards, JS Your post shows your total lack of knowledge that the GPU processor can be utilized to run/assist in the running of demanding apps ... load up seti software (POINC, actually), a freely available app which has the capabilities and gives a good demonstration of the advantages ... you probably aren't such a bad guy, just an ignorant one who needs some prompting to seek a cure .. Sorry, but you're now deflecting. You claimed that a high-powered GPU was useful for "compiling and linking". Let's see a cite. -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
In article , John Smith
wrote: On 10/13/2011 9:45 AM, John Smith wrote: On 10/13/2011 12:05 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/12/2011 10:47 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html And with audio, do you mean like this: http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/ProFireLightbridge.html Or this: http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/Delta1010.html Or perhaps this: http://www.motu.com/products/pciaudio/HD192/specs.html No plug your SDR amateur rig into the USB port of your PC and start using it ... notice that there is no software available for the MAC ... linux is covered with an app, etc., etc., etc. Really? No software at all, huh? http://www.rfspace.com/RFSPACE/CuteSDR.html You keep putting words in my mouth, seems like I said a PC can do it better ... that was the part you choose to dispute, not the faster, cheaper ... or the fact that PC stays current with uptodate software/codecs/drivers/hardware/firmware ... I asked how it did it better and you responded with things that (apparently) you thought you couldn't do with a Mac. Got a comparison to this card for the PC: http://pressroom.nvidia.com/easyir/c...=A0D622CE9F579 F09 &v ers ion=live&releasejsp=release_157&xhtml=true&prid=73 6275 I don't need one. Good thing too ... as you will have to "not need a lot of things" when running a MAC! Superior video is just one of them ... if you play video games, you can forget the ones which have no MAC version ... Regards, JS LOL And now it comes out: what you want "superior video" for is... ...video games! There are virtually NO applications which are as demanding as video games on a home PC. Since I contract to develop software, and compiler/linker speeds are important to me, it is worth considering and benchmarking ... however, what am I, one out of 10,000 who runs such a demanding commercial app? So, of course video games become the best universal benchmark -- any child can run them, even if the adults can't ... No, actually. Video games are hard on VIDEO performance, John. Almost all of the processing load they create is handled by the GPU... ...a part which plays essentially no useful role in compiling and linking software. However, you are doing the best you can. At this point, your have realized and woken up to reality, and that the MAC is vastly inferior in comparison to even mid range PC's ... when confronted with this reality, and one realizes they have taken a false position, one must switch over to personal attacks on their opposite in the argument ... abandoning any hope of proving their false positions to be correct. The Mac is better for normal people, John. They want a machine that is easy to use and that doesn't have problems. Most people don't want to modify their computers with performance add-ons any more than they want to do the analogous things to their cars. It will also help to lock your mind into denial, and think that no one here will be smart enough to see what is going on, the desperation and desperate tact's you are being forced to take, to believe they will become obfuscated by the false complexities of your diversions ... that they will not notice you switching subjects, points, facts ... etc. You mean like claiming that video card performance is important to compiling? But, I will ... you can make book on that. Regards, JS Your post shows your total lack of knowledge that the GPU processor can be utilized to run/assist in the running of demanding apps ... load up seti software (POINC, actually), a freely available app which has the capabilities and gives a good demonstration of the advantages ... you probably aren't such a bad guy, just an ignorant one who needs some prompting to seek a cure .. Regards, JS BOINC even ... list of BOINC projects he http://boinc.berkeley.edu/projects.php Excerpt from that: "Note: if your computer is equipped with a Graphics Processing Unit (GPU), you may be able to use it to compute faster. " And not one word that says you be able to compile or link faster... -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
In article ,
John Smith wrote: On 10/13/2011 3:29 PM, Howard Brazee wrote: On Thu, 13 Oct 2011 10:45:12 -0700, John wrote: "Note: if your computer is equipped with a Graphics Processing Unit (GPU), you may be able to use it to compute faster. " We may. But the application I have which is intolerably slow is Librarian Pro. Apparently it uses the Access database engine that has troubles with libraries as large as mine. A faster graphics card won't make it faster. I wonder if I have any applications that I would notice a speed increase with a faster graphics card. Well, first a 3.0+ ghz processor, multicore/multithreaded, 64 bit OS, fast frontside buss, fast memory, fast storage devices/software, buffers created for redundant search/filing, etc. features, etc. would be the way to go ... then, with a firm base, exploit stealing GPU cycles/time ... if speed is really a valid need, water cooling and over clocking are very useful techniques -- of the CPU, itself -- applications using parallel processing, motherboards with multiple physical, and multiple cored, processors, etc. Also, the search/storage formats, methods, techniques, structure of data handling is VERY IMPORTANT ... if speed is failing, you should attempt to locate software which uses BINARY TREES in the handling of the data ... by asking 10 questions, you can find one unique element within a pool of over 1,000,000 ... these are some of the most fast, effective and efficient data processing algorithms in existence, if not THE MOST ... I am thinking, if there is a need, someone has already written it, or is writing it ... Wow. You've heard of binary trees... ....you MUST be a computer science expert! It is true, the application in question cannot use these advanced techniques, unless the application has been made capable/aware by the software engineers maintaining the app in question. It might be possible to locate one for the use in question, inquires of those in the field might put you on the right track -- if available. Often, I have been employed just to find applications/software to fit some extremely narrow slice of use ... many make a very comfortable income doing nothing else -- only consulting on software/hardware ... it is possible just to "ask around" and be privy to such valuable info., worth a try ... But then, powerful video cards are usually only found in high end game and business/production, research machines ... slapping in a high end video card is certainly not the first, or even middle of the line, upgrade one would first jump to ... indeed, probably the last after every other possible upgrade and a want/need for speed is still a necessity ... Or, simple said, it is well beyond the needs of most casual users (BOINC and computer games being a notable exception) ... however, valid when comparing/benchmarking hardware capabilities ... and, as pointed out, there are valid and valuable uses for it. You said it was important to you for "compiling and linking"... -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
In article ,
"Scout" wrote: "John Smith" wrote in message ... On 10/13/2011 12:05 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/12/2011 10:40 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , . net wrote: "Alan wrote in message ... In , John wrote: On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote: On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Your post is an excellent example of what I have found about "Apple People", they have a religious devotion to the platform ... Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes that anyone who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious devotion... Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse MAC's, is that I write much of the software I use ... plus, I private contract to develop software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired, for the most part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it simply would not make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the business to make money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked hard in being one of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think they can do that without me ... In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from your perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers with their own OS? You can write software for that platform just as you can for Windows or for Linux. Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their software, just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or even an idildo, for that matter! ROFLOL So? Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware and Microsoft doesn't? Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the conversation I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang less buck will do ... It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools always end up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil just doesn't really apply. If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any crimes which have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean, like, DUH! Regards, JS As I said: How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what you do not must be a fool... It's a cultural standard, today. Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html No like this. http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac snip Like he said, Mac can't compete. LOL No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. That can be easily explained for any number of reasons which DON'T substantiate the hardware and software of MAC being "better." I didn't present it to substantiate that. One which jumps to mind, immediately, a number of people just as ignorant as you have just went out and purchased new computers and have skewed the statistics for a short period, causing a false "blip" on those statistics ... LOL Please, John: go look at the trend. The information is out there. When I see massive changes in my family friends, the computers I maintain and repair, the industry I work in ... I will, I simply won't have a choice ... at this time, it is simply a non-issue ... makes me really question those figures ... When you control only about 4-4.5% of the market....a 13% increase in sales doesn't really show up as anything significant. I would suspect the increase is drive by I-Pad sales....not Mac. For all we know the sale of Macintosh computers has dropped off. Actually, no. We know that the Mac computers sales have increased and outgrown the rest of the personal computer market for something like 22 straight quarters. -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On Sat, 15 Oct 2011 22:22:53 -0400, "Scout"
wrote: However, they are often willing to buy component built systems because they are better or cheaper than named PC packages. Quite a few people make a living supplying people with such systems customized to their specific desires. Most of my computers have been those. But the local stores that made my computers have all closed and not been replaced. -- "In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found, than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace to the legislature, and not to the executive department." - James Madison |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On Sat, 15 Oct 2011 22:12:52 -0400, "Scout"
wrote: Already done, and by retail motherboard sales of the top 5 makers, they constitute about 15% of total computer sales, and by the same measure Macs constitute some 3.7%. Is this for 2011? For what countries? I'd like to see the source for these numbers. -- "In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found, than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace to the legislature, and not to the executive department." - James Madison |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On Sat, 15 Oct 2011 20:32:01 -0700, John Smith
wrote: You are welcome to present evidence that computers purchased as components and then assemble form any significant fraction of personal computer sales... Don't have to, anyone not living under a rock knows it ... it is self-apparent ... one would have to stick their head in a hole to miss it. Ahh, a religious belief. -- "In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found, than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace to the legislature, and not to the executive department." - James Madison |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On Sat, 15 Oct 2011 15:44:54 -0400, "Scout"
wrote: Sorry, they are selling more desktops because of an expanding market, but their share in that expanding market is decreasing. Other arguments in this thread have been claiming a shrinking desktop market. Which arguments are correct? Both. Could you explain how the market for desktop computers can be both expanding and shrinking? -- "In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found, than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace to the legislature, and not to the executive department." - James Madison |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/15/2011 6:47 PM, Don Kirkman wrote:
On Mon, 10 Oct 2011 23:04:46 -0700, John wrote: The rest of what you had to say, bad decisions, paying too much for a home, etc. ... well ya', that is covered in "Life 101." If you missed that class, problems will keep arising until you do take that class! ... don't make those bad decisions, don't pay too much for over valued property, don't buy what you can't afford, etc. You ignore the people who were *told* they could afford the houses they bought. People with a duty to be diligent--brokers, financiers, investment houses, all assured them that they deserved a good house and by heck they could afford one because they were given them a real bargain. Basically, it comes down to common sense, if you can't afford the house, don't buy it... yet ... But if you're assured that you can afford it, who is the real culprit here? Ah yes, the old Liar Loans... The only "qualification" for the loan was could you fog a mirror? If you were breathing, you qualified. |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/16/11 10:01 AM, Howard Brazee wrote:
On Sat, 15 Oct 2011 22:22:53 -0400, "Scout" wrote: However, they are often willing to buy component built systems because they are better or cheaper than named PC packages. Quite a few people make a living supplying people with such systems customized to their specific desires. Most of my computers have been those. But the local stores that made my computers have all closed and not been replaced. We still have a few around here, almost all sole owner/operator. No employees at all. -- Lloyd |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/16/11 10:09 AM, Howard Brazee wrote:
On Sat, 15 Oct 2011 15:44:54 -0400, "Scout" wrote: Sorry, they are selling more desktops because of an expanding market, but their share in that expanding market is decreasing. Other arguments in this thread have been claiming a shrinking desktop market. Which arguments are correct? Both. Could you explain how the market for desktop computers can be both expanding and shrinking? The overall desktop market is shrinking. But Apple's isn't, it just isn't growing as much as their laptop market is. -- Lloyd |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"D. Peter Maus" wrote in
: On 10/15/11 17:47 , Don Kirkman wrote: On Mon, 10 Oct 2011 23:04:46 -0700, John wrote: The rest of what you had to say, bad decisions, paying too much for a home, etc. ... well ya', that is covered in "Life 101." If you missed that class, problems will keep arising until you do take that class! ... don't make those bad decisions, don't pay too much for over valued property, don't buy what you can't afford, etc. You ignore the people who were *told* they could afford the houses they bought. People with a duty to be diligent--brokers, financiers, investment houses, all assured them that they deserved a good house and by heck they could afford one because they were given them a real bargain. Basically, it comes down to common sense, if you can't afford the house, don't buy it... yet ... But if you're assured that you can afford it, who is the real culprit here? When I bought my last house, I carefully constructed the budget. Good plan..... When I got to the financing stage, every carrier I spoke with pushed like mad to get me to take a non-traditional mortgage for far more than I'd considered, with variable interest, balloon payments, and 'creative' structures, all based on the assumption that 1) I'd be selling the property at a substantial profit within 5 years and 2) incomes always rise. What you have is several people (real estate, financial lenders, etc..) all wishing to get as much out of the deal as *they* possibly can. After all, it is up to *you* to make the payments, not them. I resisted, and stayed with a 30 year fixed at the interest that I'd shopped around for. And was told that rate was no longer available, so the non-traditional was my only option. Or a fixed at a higher rate, I presume....... They sold it hard. "You should buy the maximum amount of house you can possibly afford, and you can afford this." In general, that is true.....however, not with a VRM. "You're upwardly mobile, you'll be selling to upgrade before the interest rates increase and make a bundle in the process." "You won't be in the house by the time the balloon comes due." Yeah.......uh huh..... Even going so far as to tell me that at my age, a traditional 30 year fixed would simply not be available. But that a 15 year ARM was a virtual certainty to be approved, at nearly 50% more than I'd planned to borrow. Interestingly, they are still out there. Your estimate of the payment would be true. A $150K loan at, say 4.50% for 30 years would cost you $760 P&I while that same load at the same interest rate for 15 years would cost you $1147 P&I. Of course, your total cost of the loan would be a lot less. $273,600 for the 30 year and $206,460 for the 15 year. I eventually found the mortgage I wanted, at the rate I wanted, and when things collapsed in the housing market, and the economy slowed, I had both equity and a payment I could manage. But it was a fight to the death to get a lender to agree to the traditional mortgage. I have never had a problem with that. Few go into this kind of transaction with a fierce determination to do things his own way. Most I've encountered would be quickly swayed by both the temptation of more house than they thought they could afford, or the enticing finance opportunity when so reassured by the lending agency that the risk is small, and the benefits so great. Yep, and now you have greed on everyone's part, not just the money and real estate portions. Now, I'm not, by a long shot, opposed to creative financing. I've been quite creative in financing my businesses. And a couple of really nice cars. But only in the short term, and only for small, manageable amounts of money. Specifically, so I'd be prepared as economic fortunes change. So, though I'm hardly one of those 'invade Wall Street' protest types, who blames all ills in the universe of Man on the banking system, I can say that I've seen first hand some of the more underhanded, and manipulative behaviours that have led a lot of folk down a very turbulent river. So, yes: Who is the culprit, indeed. Depends......could be the real estate folks, the lenders, the borrower, or any combination of them or all three. -- Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman) Witnessing Republicans and Democrats bickering over the National Debt is like watching two drunks argue over a bar bill on the Titanic..... |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/15/2011 11:02 PM, Alan Baker wrote:
In , . net wrote: "Howard wrote in message ... On Thu, 13 Oct 2011 19:00:47 -0700, John wrote: Like I say, outside of academia, I just don't see that many MACs I don't see what academia use, I don't see what most companies use. But I do see what people have in coffee houses - and there are lots of Macs there. That's about where you're going to find them since 3/4 of Macs being sold are the laptops. The Mac desktop market keeps shrinking. No, Scout: THE desktop market keeps shrinking. Light duty use, traveling, you are just stuck with a laptop ... But, try to load one up with massive storage, 32 gigs ram, excellent video card, etc. and it sucks the battery like pouring water out of a bucket ... some will try to go total laptop ... but if you need powerful computing power and support hardware, forget it ... plus, no real upgrade potential ... you have to trash it every year. Regards, JS |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/16/2011 8:09 AM, Howard Brazee wrote:
On Sat, 15 Oct 2011 15:44:54 -0400, "Scout" wrote: Sorry, they are selling more desktops because of an expanding market, but their share in that expanding market is decreasing. Other arguments in this thread have been claiming a shrinking desktop market. Which arguments are correct? Both. Could you explain how the market for desktop computers can be both expanding and shrinking? Most laptops cannot even handle Secondlife! Regards, JS |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/15/2011 11:03 PM, Alan Baker wrote:
In , John wrote: On 10/15/2011 5:46 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number. Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales. BFD No, no. Mac sales didn't increase by 13%. Mac sales in the US were 13% of all personal computers sold in the last quarter. I was just thinking, that probably only encompasses whole, complete computers ... since I build my own, and most of my families and friends computers, they are not even counted ... in the final analysis, you can see that figure simply is not a meaningful representation of the total PC market ... You are welcome to present evidence that computers purchased as components and then assemble form any significant fraction of personal computer sales... Don't have to, anyone not living under a rock knows it ... it is self-apparent ... one would have to stick their head in a hole to miss it. Regards, JS So you have nothing... I got a nut claiming mac is cutting edge and going to take over the world lol ... indeed, seems to be a couple of 'em! Regards, JS |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
Y'all cats better hurry up and jump over to the Apple store and get your
new Apple 4S iPhone.I don't want one, ergo I don't tote. My old buddy is going to George Reed's funeral.Obituaries section at http://www.clarionledger.com cuhulin |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On Sun, 16 Oct 2011 11:03:04 -0700, John Smith
wrote: So you have nothing... I got a nut claiming mac is cutting edge and going to take over the world lol ... indeed, seems to be a couple of 'em! Do you have quotes of such? -- "In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found, than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace to the legislature, and not to the executive department." - James Madison |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , "Scout" wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , John Smith wrote: On 10/13/2011 8:16 PM, Tankfixer wrote: In , - Lloyd E Parsons spouted ! On 10/13/11 7:56 AM, RHF wrote: On Oct 12, 11:49 pm, John wrote: On 10/12/2011 10:40 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , . net wrote: "Alan wrote in message ... In , John wrote: On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote: On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Your post is an excellent example of what I have found about "Apple People", they have a religious devotion to the platform ... Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes that anyone who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious devotion... Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse MAC's, is that I write much of the software I use ... plus, I private contract to develop software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired, for the most part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it simply would not make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the business to make money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked hard in being one of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think they can do that without me ... In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from your perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers with their own OS? You can write software for that platform just as you can for Windows or for Linux. Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their software, just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or even an idildo, for that matter! ROFLOL So? Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware and Microsoft doesn't? Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the conversation I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang less buck will do ... It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools always end up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil just doesn't really apply. If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any crimes which have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean, like, DUH! Regards, JS As I said: How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what you do not must be a fool... It's a cultural standard, today. Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html No like this. http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac snip Like he said, Mac can't compete. LOL No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. That can be easily explained for any number of reasons which DON'T substantiate the hardware and software of MAC being "better." One which jumps to mind, immediately, a number of people just as ignorant as you have just went out and purchased new computers and have skewed the statistics for a short period, causing a false "blip" on those statistics ... Regards, JS For the Non-Techies : PC -vs- Mac http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/w...pare/pc-vs-mac non-tech-r-i ~ RHF . . LOL! MS for a non-techie, balanced comparison of the two! Ya gotta love it!! :) But keep in mind, if you buy a Mac you have both a solid OSX (unix) machine as well as a great Windows box too! A twofer! Or you can buy a bare drive PC and load whatever version of Linux you want and save a $1000 ... Or, you can just grap the components, build your own for 400 bucks, or under ... building your own, shopping sales, ebay, newegg, etc. you can put together a decent gaming computer for a grand! I realize that the zealot in you will prevent you from grasping this, but... ...most people have no interest in building their own computers. However, they are often willing to buy component built systems because they are better or cheaper than named PC packages. A very few people. You keep saying that, but a simple check of eBay, nevermind the retail sales of motherboards would clearly challenge that assertion. So what exactly do you have to show that it's only "very few people" that have a component built system? Quite a few people make a living supplying people with such systems customized to their specific desires. -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"John Smith" wrote in message ... On 10/15/2011 7:22 PM, Scout wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , John Smith wrote: On 10/13/2011 8:16 PM, Tankfixer wrote: In , - Lloyd E Parsons spouted ! On 10/13/11 7:56 AM, RHF wrote: On Oct 12, 11:49 pm, John wrote: On 10/12/2011 10:40 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , . net wrote: "Alan wrote in message ... In , John wrote: On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote: On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Your post is an excellent example of what I have found about "Apple People", they have a religious devotion to the platform ... Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes that anyone who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious devotion... Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse MAC's, is that I write much of the software I use ... plus, I private contract to develop software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired, for the most part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it simply would not make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the business to make money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked hard in being one of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think they can do that without me ... In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from your perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers with their own OS? You can write software for that platform just as you can for Windows or for Linux. Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their software, just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or even an idildo, for that matter! ROFLOL So? Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware and Microsoft doesn't? Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the conversation I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang less buck will do ... It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools always end up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil just doesn't really apply. If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any crimes which have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean, like, DUH! Regards, JS As I said: How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what you do not must be a fool... It's a cultural standard, today. Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html No like this. http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac snip Like he said, Mac can't compete. LOL No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. That can be easily explained for any number of reasons which DON'T substantiate the hardware and software of MAC being "better." One which jumps to mind, immediately, a number of people just as ignorant as you have just went out and purchased new computers and have skewed the statistics for a short period, causing a false "blip" on those statistics ... Regards, JS For the Non-Techies : PC -vs- Mac http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/w...pare/pc-vs-mac non-tech-r-i ~ RHF . . LOL! MS for a non-techie, balanced comparison of the two! Ya gotta love it!! :) But keep in mind, if you buy a Mac you have both a solid OSX (unix) machine as well as a great Windows box too! A twofer! Or you can buy a bare drive PC and load whatever version of Linux you want and save a $1000 ... Or, you can just grap the components, build your own for 400 bucks, or under ... building your own, shopping sales, ebay, newegg, etc. you can put together a decent gaming computer for a grand! I realize that the zealot in you will prevent you from grasping this, but... ...most people have no interest in building their own computers. However, they are often willing to buy component built systems because they are better or cheaper than named PC packages. Quite a few people make a living supplying people with such systems customized to their specific desires. It has been my experience, you run into a real dyed-in-the-wool-fool and all bets are off! Seems to me, I've run into a Religious fanatic (ie the Church of Mac) and anything that's contrary to his doctrine must be wrong. |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Howard Brazee" wrote in message ... On Sat, 15 Oct 2011 22:22:53 -0400, "Scout" wrote: However, they are often willing to buy component built systems because they are better or cheaper than named PC packages. Quite a few people make a living supplying people with such systems customized to their specific desires. Most of my computers have been those. But the local stores that made my computers have all closed and not been replaced. True, it's largely moved to mail order since that way you don't have the overhead of a store front, or if you do maintain a store front, it's just to pick up the occasional sale while you're processing the bulk of your business through internet orders. |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On Sun, 16 Oct 2011 12:40:51 -0600, Howard Brazee
wrote: On Sun, 16 Oct 2011 11:03:04 -0700, John Smith wrote: So you have nothing... I got a nut claiming mac is cutting edge and going to take over the world lol ... indeed, seems to be a couple of 'em! Do you have quotes of such? Howard, when are you going to realize that this dolt is the biggest effing idiot online? Pick a subject, any subject, and he's FOS about it. BK |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"John Smith" wrote in message ... On 10/15/2011 12:44 PM, Scout wrote: "Howard Brazee" wrote in message ... On Fri, 14 Oct 2011 20:12:02 -0400, "Scout" wrote: No, their desktop market is growing, just not as fast as their laptop market. Sorry, they are selling more desktops because of an expanding market, but their share in that expanding market is decreasing. Other arguments in this thread have been claiming a shrinking desktop market. Which arguments are correct? Both. Desktop computers last longer nowadays before becoming obsolete for most functions. And there are more and better alternatives to desktop computers than there used to be. Yep, but the alternatives are most expensive, less durable, limited in upgrade options, and generally poorer performance than a comparable desktop. Yes, what the world needs is a generic platform for the laptop, where as much choice of components is available as in the desktop/tower platform ... proprietary chit is always crap ... Except the conditions of a laptop are utterly different than a desktop. Thus the different processors, etc. In a desktop, power usage isn't a big deal, but in a laptop every watt used matters since it impacts battery life. In a desktop, weight isn't an issue since it's not going anywhere, but in a laptop lighter is better as heavy laptops don't sell as well In a desktop, you don't have to worry so much about size. A 3.5" drive is fine, but in a laptop you have to go with the smallest form factor you can to cut down on size and weight. In a desktop you can make it more durable because size, weight and power usage aren't a big concern, a laptop on the other hand needs to shave everything to the absolute minimum and thus durability suffers. In a desktop you can hold your CPU at a moderate temperature, by using a big heavy heat sink and having a rather large fan blowing air over it, in a laptop, you've only got so much room for the heat sink, and you can't make it any heavier than absolutely necessary, and you don't want to run the fan unless you absolutely have to (battery life), so generally your laptop CPU runs hot, damn hot, burning hot, which isn't so great for CPU life. They are just different horses with utterly different requirements. The Desktop is the Clydesdale, while a laptop is a pony. Sure the pony can do most the stuff the Clydesdale can do....by working like hell doing it....but it's going to wear that pony out that much quicker. Size, weight, power use, heat, and so on DEFINE the limits of what a laptop is and can do. Thus laptops will always be more limited in nature than a desktop. |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , John Smith wrote: On 10/15/2011 5:46 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. a 13% increase of a small number.....is still a small number. Mac sales constitute about 4.5% of all new PC sales. BFD No, no. Mac sales didn't increase by 13%. Mac sales in the US were 13% of all personal computers sold in the last quarter. I was just thinking, that probably only encompasses whole, complete computers ... since I build my own, and most of my families and friends computers, they are not even counted ... in the final analysis, you can see that figure simply is not a meaningful representation of the total PC market ... You are welcome to present evidence that computers purchased as components and then assemble form any significant fraction of personal computer sales... Don't have to, anyone not living under a rock knows it ... it is self-apparent ... one would have to stick their head in a hole to miss it. Regards, JS So you have nothing... He has what I've already presented, and which you have chosen to utterly ignore because it doesn't conform to what you wish to assert. |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , "Scout" wrote: "Lloyd E Parsons" wrote in message ... On 10/15/11 10:46 AM, John Smith wrote: On 10/15/2011 8:41 AM, Lloyd E Parsons wrote: ... I don't think you or I will live long enough to see the 'year of the mac' if that is defined as Apple being the dominant tech provider. Not going to happen. But the 'year of the Mac' has already happened in the upscale tech market with consumers with a few bucks. Yes, I am sure many are heroes in their own mind, have saved the world, dominate the markets ... and it would be evil to destroy their fantasies ... roflol Still, one must keep a foot in reality ... Regards, JS In business, the reality is growing your sales and profits. In that, it has been the year of the Mac for quite awhile now. You are free to talk about what volumes of sales are out there in wintel/linux world, but that is being done at pathetic profit levels. Overall, desktop sales on all platforms is down as more go to laptops. Primarily because laptops now have enough performance for almost all applications and the prices are down quite a bit. Heck for all the bitching about Apple's prices, laptops with similar specifications and build quality are all pretty much the same in cost. Apple just doesn't do cheap laptops. Which is why Apple sells only a small fraction of the number of laptops sold. PC dominates over Mac even in the laptop market But Apple makes most of the profit... :-) Shows they overprice their goods.... Not exactly a positive thing from the view point of anyone looking at buying their products. |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , John Smith wrote: LOL! MS for a non-techie, balanced comparison of the two! Ya gotta love it!! :) But keep in mind, if you buy a Mac you have both a solid OSX (unix) machine as well as a great Windows box too! A twofer! Or you can buy a bare drive PC and load whatever version of Linux you want and save a $1000 ... Or, you can just grap the components, build your own for 400 bucks, or under ... building your own, shopping sales, ebay, newegg, etc. you can put together a decent gaming computer for a grand! I realize that the zealot in you will prevent you from grasping this, but... ...most people have no interest in building their own computers. Oh, much worse than that, they don't even wish to own a decent one, the ones buying macs are proof enough of that ... No. That they are buying Macs is proof they work well for normal people. Hmmm.... and component built systems work 4 times as well. So what's your point? |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , "Scout" wrote: "Howard Brazee" wrote in message ... On Thu, 13 Oct 2011 19:00:47 -0700, John Smith wrote: Like I say, outside of academia, I just don't see that many MACs I don't see what academia use, I don't see what most companies use. But I do see what people have in coffee houses - and there are lots of Macs there. That's about where you're going to find them since 3/4 of Macs being sold are the laptops. The Mac desktop market keeps shrinking. No, Scout: THE desktop market keeps shrinking. Cite? |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
On 10/16/11 2:09 PM, Scout wrote:
"Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , John Smith wrote: LOL! MS for a non-techie, balanced comparison of the two! Ya gotta love it!! :) But keep in mind, if you buy a Mac you have both a solid OSX (unix) machine as well as a great Windows box too! A twofer! Or you can buy a bare drive PC and load whatever version of Linux you want and save a $1000 ... Or, you can just grap the components, build your own for 400 bucks, or under ... building your own, shopping sales, ebay, newegg, etc. you can put together a decent gaming computer for a grand! I realize that the zealot in you will prevent you from grasping this, but... ...most people have no interest in building their own computers. Oh, much worse than that, they don't even wish to own a decent one, the ones buying macs are proof enough of that ... No. That they are buying Macs is proof they work well for normal people. Hmmm.... and component built systems work 4 times as well. So what's your point? work 4 times as well doing what? Word processing, spreadsheets and most other office and home type programs for the average computer user, don't benefit much from all the 'improvements' that you gamers talk about all the time. -- Lloyd |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , John Smith wrote: On 10/13/2011 12:05 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/12/2011 10:47 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html And with audio, do you mean like this: http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/ProFireLightbridge.html Or this: http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/Delta1010.html Or perhaps this: http://www.motu.com/products/pciaudio/HD192/specs.html No plug your SDR amateur rig into the USB port of your PC and start using it ... notice that there is no software available for the MAC ... linux is covered with an app, etc., etc., etc. Really? No software at all, huh? http://www.rfspace.com/RFSPACE/CuteSDR.html You keep putting words in my mouth, seems like I said a PC can do it better ... that was the part you choose to dispute, not the faster, cheaper ... or the fact that PC stays current with uptodate software/codecs/drivers/hardware/firmware ... I asked how it did it better and you responded with things that (apparently) you thought you couldn't do with a Mac. Got a comparison to this card for the PC: http://pressroom.nvidia.com/easyir/c...A0D622CE9F579F 09 &v ers ion=live&releasejsp=release_157&xhtml=true&prid=73 6275 I don't need one. Good thing too ... as you will have to "not need a lot of things" when running a MAC! Superior video is just one of them ... if you play video games, you can forget the ones which have no MAC version ... Regards, JS LOL And now it comes out: what you want "superior video" for is... ...video games! There are virtually NO applications which are as demanding as video games on a home PC. Since I contract to develop software, and compiler/linker speeds are important to me, it is worth considering and benchmarking ... however, what am I, one out of 10,000 who runs such a demanding commercial app? So, of course video games become the best universal benchmark -- any child can run them, even if the adults can't ... No, actually. Video games are hard on VIDEO performance, John. Almost all of the processing load they create is handled by the GPU... ...a part which plays essentially no useful role in compiling and linking software. However, you are doing the best you can. At this point, your have realized and woken up to reality, and that the MAC is vastly inferior in comparison to even mid range PC's ... when confronted with this reality, and one realizes they have taken a false position, one must switch over to personal attacks on their opposite in the argument ... abandoning any hope of proving their false positions to be correct. The Mac is better for normal people, John. They want a machine that is easy to use and that doesn't have problems. Most people don't want to modify their computers with performance add-ons any more than they want to do the analogous things to their cars. It will also help to lock your mind into denial, and think that no one here will be smart enough to see what is going on, the desperation and desperate tact's you are being forced to take, to believe they will become obfuscated by the false complexities of your diversions ... that they will not notice you switching subjects, points, facts ... etc. You mean like claiming that video card performance is important to compiling? But, I will ... you can make book on that. Regards, JS Your post shows your total lack of knowledge that the GPU processor can be utilized to run/assist in the running of demanding apps ... load up seti software (POINC, actually), a freely available app which has the capabilities and gives a good demonstration of the advantages ... you probably aren't such a bad guy, just an ignorant one who needs some prompting to seek a cure .. Sorry, but you're now deflecting. You claimed that a high-powered GPU was useful for "compiling and linking". Let's see a cite. http://www.nvidia.com/object/tesla_c...solutions.html GPU, the supercomputer of the 21st century. http://www.popsci.com/science/articl...computer-again |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , John Smith wrote: On 10/13/2011 9:45 AM, John Smith wrote: On 10/13/2011 12:05 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/12/2011 10:47 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html And with audio, do you mean like this: http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/ProFireLightbridge.html Or this: http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/Delta1010.html Or perhaps this: http://www.motu.com/products/pciaudio/HD192/specs.html No plug your SDR amateur rig into the USB port of your PC and start using it ... notice that there is no software available for the MAC ... linux is covered with an app, etc., etc., etc. Really? No software at all, huh? http://www.rfspace.com/RFSPACE/CuteSDR.html You keep putting words in my mouth, seems like I said a PC can do it better ... that was the part you choose to dispute, not the faster, cheaper ... or the fact that PC stays current with uptodate software/codecs/drivers/hardware/firmware ... I asked how it did it better and you responded with things that (apparently) you thought you couldn't do with a Mac. Got a comparison to this card for the PC: http://pressroom.nvidia.com/easyir/c...=A0D622CE9F579 F09 &v ers ion=live&releasejsp=release_157&xhtml=true&prid=73 6275 I don't need one. Good thing too ... as you will have to "not need a lot of things" when running a MAC! Superior video is just one of them ... if you play video games, you can forget the ones which have no MAC version ... Regards, JS LOL And now it comes out: what you want "superior video" for is... ...video games! There are virtually NO applications which are as demanding as video games on a home PC. Since I contract to develop software, and compiler/linker speeds are important to me, it is worth considering and benchmarking ... however, what am I, one out of 10,000 who runs such a demanding commercial app? So, of course video games become the best universal benchmark -- any child can run them, even if the adults can't ... No, actually. Video games are hard on VIDEO performance, John. Almost all of the processing load they create is handled by the GPU... ...a part which plays essentially no useful role in compiling and linking software. However, you are doing the best you can. At this point, your have realized and woken up to reality, and that the MAC is vastly inferior in comparison to even mid range PC's ... when confronted with this reality, and one realizes they have taken a false position, one must switch over to personal attacks on their opposite in the argument ... abandoning any hope of proving their false positions to be correct. The Mac is better for normal people, John. They want a machine that is easy to use and that doesn't have problems. Most people don't want to modify their computers with performance add-ons any more than they want to do the analogous things to their cars. It will also help to lock your mind into denial, and think that no one here will be smart enough to see what is going on, the desperation and desperate tact's you are being forced to take, to believe they will become obfuscated by the false complexities of your diversions ... that they will not notice you switching subjects, points, facts ... etc. You mean like claiming that video card performance is important to compiling? But, I will ... you can make book on that. Regards, JS Your post shows your total lack of knowledge that the GPU processor can be utilized to run/assist in the running of demanding apps ... load up seti software (POINC, actually), a freely available app which has the capabilities and gives a good demonstration of the advantages ... you probably aren't such a bad guy, just an ignorant one who needs some prompting to seek a cure .. Regards, JS BOINC even ... list of BOINC projects he http://boinc.berkeley.edu/projects.php Excerpt from that: "Note: if your computer is equipped with a Graphics Processing Unit (GPU), you may be able to use it to compute faster. " And not one word that says you be able to compile or link faster... http://www.popsci.com/science/articl...computer-again Read it and weep. |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Scout" wrote in
: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , "Scout" wrote: "Lloyd E Parsons" wrote in message ... On 10/15/11 10:46 AM, John Smith wrote: On 10/15/2011 8:41 AM, Lloyd E Parsons wrote: ... I don't think you or I will live long enough to see the 'year of the mac' if that is defined as Apple being the dominant tech provider. Not going to happen. But the 'year of the Mac' has already happened in the upscale tech market with consumers with a few bucks. Yes, I am sure many are heroes in their own mind, have saved the world, dominate the markets ... and it would be evil to destroy their fantasies ... roflol Still, one must keep a foot in reality ... Regards, JS In business, the reality is growing your sales and profits. In that, it has been the year of the Mac for quite awhile now. You are free to talk about what volumes of sales are out there in wintel/linux world, but that is being done at pathetic profit levels. Overall, desktop sales on all platforms is down as more go to laptops. Primarily because laptops now have enough performance for almost all applications and the prices are down quite a bit. Heck for all the bitching about Apple's prices, laptops with similar specifications and build quality are all pretty much the same in cost. Apple just doesn't do cheap laptops. Which is why Apple sells only a small fraction of the number of laptops sold. PC dominates over Mac even in the laptop market But Apple makes most of the profit... :-) Shows they overprice their goods.... Not exactly a positive thing from the view point of anyone looking at buying their products. But an excellent one from theirs as long as it doesn't drastically reduce sales. With the charisma Apple seems to hold, I don't think that is much of a problem. It is like the folks who love to own Cadillacs. It doesn't cost much more to produce a Cadillac than it does Chevy, but compare the price and the cachet. -- Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman) Witnessing Republicans and Democrats bickering over the National Debt is like watching two drunks argue over a bar bill on the Titanic..... |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , "Scout" wrote: "John Smith" wrote in message ... On 10/13/2011 12:05 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/12/2011 10:40 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , . net wrote: "Alan wrote in message ... In , John wrote: On 10/12/2011 11:37 AM, Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: On 10/10/2011 2:30 PM, D Peter Maus wrote: On 10/10/11 16:27 , Alan Baker wrote: In , John wrote: Your post is an excellent example of what I have found about "Apple People", they have a religious devotion to the platform ... Your post is an excellent example of someone who believes that anyone who sees value where you do not must do it out of religious devotion... Personally, the only reason I use a PC, and refuse MAC's, is that I write much of the software I use ... plus, I private contract to develop software on multiple platforms (even though I am retired, for the most part) ... while most of that could be done on a MAC, it simply would not make economic sense, for me ... I mean, I am in the business to make money -- NOT pay money to apple ... apple has worked hard in being one of the most proprietary corps I have ever seen, I think they can do that without me ... In what way is the Mac more "proprietary" than Windows from your perspective? The fact that they've always sold computers with their own OS? You can write software for that platform just as you can for Windows or for Linux. Windows doesn't hold patents on the hardware, to run their software, just for starters ... and, they don't have an iphone, or even an idildo, for that matter! ROFLOL So? Apple's suddenly an evil empire because they make hardware and Microsoft doesn't? Actually, you have missed the point, gotten off track, the conversation I seen was focused on fools and overpaying for the same bang less buck will do ... It isn't that apple is evil for taking fools money, the fools always end up giving it to some one ... nor are the fools evil ... evil just doesn't really apply. If fools willingly give you money, I am not aware of any crimes which have been broken, nor evil criminals at fault ... I mean, like, DUH! Regards, JS As I said: How arrogant to assume that anyone who sees value in what you do not must be a fool... It's a cultural standard, today. Hey, I am not the one into social standards! I freely admit that a MAC can do anything a PC can do ... the PC can just do it faster, cheaper and usually better ... Really? Better in what way? Give a concrete example... Snap in a high end NVIDIA or ATI card into our PC with a high res HD monitor, sit in next to a MAC ... you will see what I mean ... do the same with audio ... You mean, like this: http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-quadro-4000-mac-us.html No like this. http://www.geforce.com/Hardware/GPUs...specifications CUDA cores 1024 vs 256 for the Mac Memory 3Gb vs 2 Gb for the Mac Memory Interface 768 bit vs 256 bit for the Mac Memory Bandwidth 327.7 Gb/s vs 89.6Gb/s for the Mac snip Like he said, Mac can't compete. LOL No, Scout: Nvidia has *chosen* not to compete... ...for now. Last quarter, Mac sales were up to 13% in the US. Think about that. That can be easily explained for any number of reasons which DON'T substantiate the hardware and software of MAC being "better." I didn't present it to substantiate that. One which jumps to mind, immediately, a number of people just as ignorant as you have just went out and purchased new computers and have skewed the statistics for a short period, causing a false "blip" on those statistics ... LOL Please, John: go look at the trend. The information is out there. When I see massive changes in my family friends, the computers I maintain and repair, the industry I work in ... I will, I simply won't have a choice ... at this time, it is simply a non-issue ... makes me really question those figures ... When you control only about 4-4.5% of the market....a 13% increase in sales doesn't really show up as anything significant. I would suspect the increase is drive by I-Pad sales....not Mac. For all we know the sale of Macintosh computers has dropped off. Actually, no. We know that the Mac computers sales have increased and outgrown the rest of the personal computer market for something like 22 straight quarters. I assume you have a mouse in your pocket? |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Howard Brazee" wrote in message ... On Sat, 15 Oct 2011 22:12:52 -0400, "Scout" wrote: Already done, and by retail motherboard sales of the top 5 makers, they constitute about 15% of total computer sales, and by the same measure Macs constitute some 3.7%. Is this for 2011? For what countries? I'd like to see the source for these numbers. The link is in this thread, go back a day maybe 2 from this message, and you will see where I posted the link to the data. |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Howard Brazee" wrote in message ... On Sat, 15 Oct 2011 15:44:54 -0400, "Scout" wrote: Sorry, they are selling more desktops because of an expanding market, but their share in that expanding market is decreasing. Other arguments in this thread have been claiming a shrinking desktop market. Which arguments are correct? Both. Could you explain how the market for desktop computers can be both expanding and shrinking? Simple, depends on how you are measuring the market. OEM laptop sales are up, but desktop component sales are also climbing. Seems more people are willing to build their own desktop rather than go to a vender. So depending on how you look at the market it can be either expanding or shrinking depending on your yardstick. |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
"Lloyd E Parsons" wrote in message ... On 10/16/11 2:09 PM, Scout wrote: "Alan Baker" wrote in message ... In article , John Smith wrote: LOL! MS for a non-techie, balanced comparison of the two! Ya gotta love it!! :) But keep in mind, if you buy a Mac you have both a solid OSX (unix) machine as well as a great Windows box too! A twofer! Or you can buy a bare drive PC and load whatever version of Linux you want and save a $1000 ... Or, you can just grap the components, build your own for 400 bucks, or under ... building your own, shopping sales, ebay, newegg, etc. you can put together a decent gaming computer for a grand! I realize that the zealot in you will prevent you from grasping this, but... ...most people have no interest in building their own computers. Oh, much worse than that, they don't even wish to own a decent one, the ones buying macs are proof enough of that ... No. That they are buying Macs is proof they work well for normal people. Hmmm.... and component built systems work 4 times as well. So what's your point? work 4 times as well doing what? The number of people buying them. |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
In article ,
John Smith wrote: On 10/15/2011 11:02 PM, Alan Baker wrote: In , . net wrote: "Howard wrote in message ... On Thu, 13 Oct 2011 19:00:47 -0700, John wrote: Like I say, outside of academia, I just don't see that many MACs I don't see what academia use, I don't see what most companies use. But I do see what people have in coffee houses - and there are lots of Macs there. That's about where you're going to find them since 3/4 of Macs being sold are the laptops. The Mac desktop market keeps shrinking. No, Scout: THE desktop market keeps shrinking. Light duty use, traveling, you are just stuck with a laptop ... If by "light duty use" you mean: "just about everything that the average person wants to do with a computer". But, try to load one up with massive storage, 32 gigs ram, excellent video card, etc. and it sucks the battery like pouring water out of a bucket ... some will try to go total laptop ... but if you need powerful computing power and support hardware, forget it ... plus, no real upgrade potential ... you have to trash it every year. No, actually, you don't. I'm typing this on my now nearly 4 year old MacBook Pro which does all I want it to do. And most people don't need "powerful computing power" [sic]. They didn't need what passed for powerful 5 years ago and they certainly don't need the power that a high-end desktop has. -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
(OT) Steve Jobs.
In article ,
John Smith wrote: On 10/16/2011 8:09 AM, Howard Brazee wrote: On Sat, 15 Oct 2011 15:44:54 -0400, "Scout" wrote: Sorry, they are selling more desktops because of an expanding market, but their share in that expanding market is decreasing. Other arguments in this thread have been claiming a shrinking desktop market. Which arguments are correct? Both. Could you explain how the market for desktop computers can be both expanding and shrinking? Most laptops cannot even handle Secondlife! Cite... -- Alan Baker Vancouver, British Columbia http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg |
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