David Eduardo wrote:
"Steve" wrote in message
oups.com...

David Eduardo wrote:

In LA, which is actually a heavier user of AM than many markets, less
than
10% of the 12-24 listening is to AM. In 12-34, it is 6%, with 6 different
FMs each having more 12-34 listening than the entire AM band in that age
group.

You didn't know that, did you!


It's gradual decline would be far preferable to the fate you would hand
it. Jerk.

Gradual? Having less audience for the whole band than any of 6 FM stations
is not slow death... it is death already in the younger demos, where the ad
money is. In a few years, the 35-44 will be gone entirely, and the 45-54
will shrink. At that point, there is no ad revenue. Not one national buy in
LA this year has been for 55+.

The sad thing is that we waited, as an industry, till now.


It's rapid decline would be far preferable to the fate you would hand
it. Jerk.

David Eduardo wrote:
wrote in message

And I've heard C-Quam STEREO signals from
hundreds of miles away via skywave at night. But, lo and behold, my
firends who have been ripped off by buying HD radios, can't seem to get
their digital carriers from across town...works welll... and the
buzzsaw on the main and adjacent channels, I just love it.

The stations love it. It enhances the coverage of analog AMs where it
matters, in the local market.

CQuam is dead. It was dead in 1985. Move on.



CQuam is dead for reasons other than industrial delays in
implementation. Although, in my never to be humble opinion, it's a
better solution, you hit the nail he

it is not about stereo. It is about being digital.

FCC will not approve any new modulation technology that isn't digital.

This despite earlier mandates that X-band allocations must be C-Quam
equipped. Now, that mandate is dead in favor of the Powell FCC's digital
mandate.

And while it may be here, and it may be inevitable, now, the
implementation has been poorly orchestrated, and with IBOC rash trashing
the bands before receivers have been widely available, short sighted in
the extreme.

What's been done, sadly, is far more deleterious to AM usage than
doing nothing. Because it's not only DXers who are affected, here. It's
users in local coverage areas, who are now dealing with noises that they
never had to before, in areas which, like where I live, are protected as
local coverage but protected local stations are hit with IBOC
interference. And if noise is one of the primary objections to AM usage,
any system that introduces noise to the bands, even if that noise is
gone in the digital mode, will only add to the objections of users who
have marginal interst in AM anyway. Especially when the hardware to
enjoy the new mode is both widely unavailable, and costly. Even if it's
coming. The negative impression made by IBOC rash today, will plant
seeds of undesirability that will persist. And you'll not get a fair
trial when the new hardware is widely available.

What I'm seeing, is interest in HD-AM by users who are interested in
AM content, and who regularly use AM anyway. But little or no interest
in users who do not regularly use AM. Regardless of the audio
quality....if there is no interest in the programming, there will be
little interest in how good it may or may not sound.

The only potential uptick I see is in those auto systems where HD is
included as a standard feature. Sampling of HD, at that point, would be
a natural extension of radio sampling in general...playing with a new
radio in a new car is fairly commonplace. See what it sounds like, on
both bands...even if only to set the presets...there's still sampling
going on. In that context, HD may get a fair hearing, and perhaps some
encouraging acceptance. So, as with most radio techological innovations,
it's going to have to be in the cars in order to expose that captive
audience to a fair hearing of HD-AM for an interest to be generated.
(This, despite the fact that a majority of listening is not in cars.)
But for those listeners who would have to actively pursue an HD
experience without current regular AM usage...I'm not seeing it.

So far, you've been talking about how the stations love HD-AM. You
and I know that the success of any radio station is found in listener
centric product and behaviour. The point that radio stations love HD-AM
is unimportant. It's the listener's embrace that matters. And outside
of controlled demostrations, there is nothing to suggest that there is
more interest in HD-AM than in C-Quam. And the jury will be out for
some time to come.

David Eduardo wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...

I don't know whether you're retarded or a Univision employee (or both),
but this guy is a complete piece of ****. He comes to this group
spouting all kinds of bull**** that is hostile to the interests of the
people here, whines like a baby when he catches hell and says the same
thing over and over and over....all to elicit a reaction of outrage and
indignation on the part of the posters here. He is good at trolling.
I'll give him that. But he's a piece of ****. No one denies that AM is
dying, but in that case let it die with dignity instead of ****ing on
it when it's down.

AM is not a person. There is no dignity in its death, but there is the loss
off tens of thousands of jobs, and the losses to maybe hundreds of thousands
of mutual fund shareholders, insurance companies and pension plans.

Further, whether you agree with me or not, HD is coming and it is time to
discuss whether any of the remaining receiver manufacturers, like ICOM, will
produce receivers or receiver modules for HD. This is going to be the new
reality, and countries like Mexico and Colombia and Brazil in this
Hemisphere are already reviewing or have adopted the standard. Rede Globo in
Brazil has ordered $2 million in HD devices, for example, and plans to
convert all its AMs in the next several years.

You should really be ashamed of yourself.

It's one thing troll a newsgroup. It's not a nice thing, but it's
forgiveable. But to mount a moral high horse and lament the loss of
jobs and pension funds that you are personally, and intentionally,
destroying is beyond rude. It is extremely distasteful, and sad. You
obviously get some sort of 'kick' out of visiting this group, saying
bizarre things, deriding the interests of others and just generally
****ting where other people live. Do you ever wonder why? Why do you
derive more satisfaction out of putting other people down than from
pursing interests of your own? Might be worth a moment's reflection.

In article ,
"David Eduardo" wrote:

"Steve" wrote in message
ps.com...

David Eduardo wrote:
"Steve" wrote in message
oups.com...

David Eduardo wrote:

If it's put into the hands of scum like you, it will die
immediately.
Jerk

I have built, managed and programmed AMs for the last 42 years. The
decline
is technology based, and can be corrected... with technology.

That's like "correcting" someone's crooked teeth by blowing their head
off.

You're a liar, a fool, a troll and a one of the few men I've ever known
who is accurate described by the term "bitch". Go ahead troll, troll
your little heart out.

Well, over $300,000,000 has already been spent on HD installs. There is
no
lie in stating that HD is happening, and there is a major commitment by
every large broadcaster except Salem to the technology. There is also
great
concern about preventing the loss of AM, and HD is being emplyed as the
ONLY
solution.

If you think this is exaggeration, trolling, a lie or whatever, you are
simply trying to cover the sky with you hand.

You mean you're trying to pull the wool over our eyes, don't you? You
are a liar and a shill. Like I said, thinking you can 'save' AM with HD
is like thinking you can "correct" a toothache by blowing the person's
head off. Any one who denies this is simply afraid to face stark
realities.

The problem with AM, in everybody's proprietary research, is that the sound
is such a barrier that nobody in the most recent two generations will listen
to it. Until the sound is "fixed" there is no way to prevent the decline,
ageing and eventual obsolescence of AM. Already, 75% of the band's listeners
are over the age that advertisers are interested in.

In LA, which is actually a heavier user of AM than many markets, less than
10% of the 12-24 listening is to AM. In 12-34, it is 6%, with 6 different
FMs each having more 12-34 listening than the entire AM band in that age
group.

You didn't know that, did you!

Again with the problem of how AMBCB sounds. AMBCB sounds just fine.

--
Telamon
Ventura, California

"D Peter Maus" wrote in message
...

What I'm seeing, is interest in HD-AM by users who are interested in AM
content, and who regularly use AM anyway. But little or no interest in
users who do not regularly use AM. Regardless of the audio quality....if
there is no interest in the programming, there will be little interest in
how good it may or may not sound.

Viscious circle there... until there is an audio quality that under-45's can
tolerate, there will be no programming. And as the clock ticks, the band
dies.

The only potential uptick I see is in those auto systems where HD is
included as a standard feature. Sampling of HD, at that point, would be a
natural extension of radio sampling in general...playing with a new radio
in a new car is fairly commonplace. See what it sounds like, on both
bands...even if only to set the presets...there's still sampling going on.
In that context, HD may get a fair hearing, and perhaps some encouraging
acceptance.

That is exactly what will be the make-or-break as to AM. FM is healthy. It
will become healthier with HD 2 channels. It can potentially drage AM back
into the game. This is why none of the big operators has sold a viable AM in
years... all believe the value will be enhanced by HD. That is a
many-billion-dollar gamble.

So, as with most radio techological innovations, it's going to have to be
in the cars in order to expose that captive audience to a fair hearing of
HD-AM for an interest to be generated. (This, despite the fact that a
majority of listening is not in cars.) But for those listeners who would
have to actively pursue an HD experience without current regular AM
usage...I'm not seeing it.

Cars are where Americans are forced to get a new radio. Obviously, there is
a trickle down aspect, as not everyone buys new cars (ever) and not everyone
buys a new car every year or two. But this is the opportunity for AM. It is
not an overnighter, but the band is fading, not exploding.

So far, you've been talking about how the stations love HD-AM. You and
I know that the success of any radio station is found in listener centric
product and behaviour. The point that radio stations love HD-AM is
unimportant. It's the listener's embrace that matters. And outside of
controlled demostrations, there is nothing to suggest that there is more
interest in HD-AM than in C-Quam. And the jury will be out for some time
to come.

We are years away from being able to evaluate listener response, which will
be based on product demand. But the few reports that have started coming in
are favorable. On the FM side, we put a Tejano format on last week ont he
KLTN HD2 channel, and we have registered several hundred calls (the format
is on a marginal AM as well) asking about how to buy radios and all were
very excited. This, perhaps and even hopefully will rub off on AM.

wrote in message
ups.com...

David Eduardo wrote:
wrote in message
You should really be ashamed of yourself.

It's one thing troll a newsgroup. It's not a nice thing, but it's
forgiveable. But to mount a moral high horse and lament the loss of
jobs and pension funds that you are personally, and intentionally,
destroying is beyond rude.

Huh? We are trying to preserve the value of tens of billions of dollars
worth of AM stations by keeping them viable for longer.

It is extremely distasteful, and sad. You
obviously get some sort of 'kick' out of visiting this group, saying
bizarre things, deriding the interests of others and just generally
****ting where other people live.

The facts are that 1) I did not invent HD, 2) I had nothing to do with its
FCC approval and, 3) never thought it was the best system.

However, it is _the_ system and only system because AM does not have the
time for a different one and because any system that is not on the same chip
as the FM digital system will fail automatically.

This is how AM radio in the Western Hemisphere and, probably, Asia is going
to be. If you think reality is in disagreement with your interests, don't
blame me. Go see a psychiatrist.

Do you ever wonder why? Why do you
derive more satisfaction out of putting other people down than from
pursing interests of your own? Might be worth a moment's reflection.


Putting down? Do you have any inkling of how fast AM is losing its economic
viability in the USA? Most of the listeners are over 55, a group no large
advertiser buys, and the younger demos are shrinking each year as the
average age of AM listeners goes up. HD is as good as we are going to get to
have a second chance on keeping AM viable.

And did I forget to mention... in the Spanish / Portuguese equivalent of
Radio World, several of the Brazilian operators were quoted as considering
HD for domestic Short Wave.

You might want me to blame me for that, too.

"Brenda Ann" wrote in message
...


There ya go. A REAL compatible system, and it doesn't annihilate the
adjacents, either. It's also just as likely to save AM as IBOC (moreso,
imho), and there are already tens of thousands of radios already out there
to receive it.

In one word, this will not work: DIGITAL

C-Quam was tried and failed in the mid 80's. Any system that does not come
on the same chip as the FM digital system will also fail. Any system that is
not digital will fail at the marketing stage.

Oh, and David Eduardo... this should have some meaning to you....

En boca cerrada no entran moscas..

Irrelevant in this case.

"Telamon" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"David Eduardo" wrote:

"dxAce" wrote in message
...
Jerk

I have built, managed and programmed AMs for the last 42 years.
The decline is technology based, and can be corrected... with
technology.

Nothing wrong with the technology, 'tard boy. AM (MW) comes in just
fine here. And it comes in even better without the HD/IBOC QRM.

There is everything wrong with the technology. It sounds so inferior
that nobody who "grew up" on FM will touch it, as it is irritating.
Two generations now have no use for AM. The only users, like you, are
old farts who do not look at the future or have lost most of their
hearing.

I don't know where you are coming from on this. I grew up listening to
FM and AM and I think AMBCB sounds just fine.

The fact that you are on this group means you are not an average listener.

I have posted data from a variety of US markets, as well as national
averages. Again: in 12-34 year old listeners, in LA, the total share for AM
is less than the indvidual station shares for the 6 highest rated FMs. 6%.
Nearly nobody. AM may sound good to you, but to nearly everyone under 45, it
is presently irrelevant and sucks.

AMBCB has good fidelity
and so does FM. AMBCB is not stereo but I don't care as I listen to
talk radio and news on that band. I don't spend much time with FM.
Generally I listen to AMBCB, short wave, and spend time on the Internet
for news.

The problem is just that. Only talk shows and such get on AM, because
anything else that requires fidelty will not work. Talk appeals to a very
old audience, and in many cases, it is getting harder and harder to sell.

This is what is bothering me about the move to HD. The move is supposed
to be an improvement but it does not seem that way to me. The move to HD
is just going to cost me money, not make an improvement, and change my
listening in ways I don't want. It's a lousy deal for me to spend money
I don't need to spend to keep getting what I already have. Same problem
for DRM on short wave.

DRM is an effort to make SW relevant, just as HD is for MW, to newer
generations that are looking for digital quality (in developed nations) and
at least FM quality in others.

"Telamon" wrote in message
news:telamon_spamshield-

Again with the problem of how AMBCB sounds. AMBCB sounds just fine.

Even when music is available on FM, such as Mexico (loads of music stations
still there) the younger audience does not listen. In fact, FM listening in
Mexico is higher than that of the US! It is nearly all about quality of the
sound, not the programming... because most Mexican cities have more viable
AM signals than US cities do.

David Frackelton Gleason, posing as 'Eduardo' and whoring for Univision
Radio/iBiquity wrote:

"Telamon" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"David Eduardo" wrote:

"dxAce" wrote in message
...
Jerk

I have built, managed and programmed AMs for the last 42 years.
The decline is technology based, and can be corrected... with
technology.

Nothing wrong with the technology, 'tard boy. AM (MW) comes in just
fine here. And it comes in even better without the HD/IBOC QRM.

There is everything wrong with the technology. It sounds so inferior
that nobody who "grew up" on FM will touch it, as it is irritating.
Two generations now have no use for AM. The only users, like you, are
old farts who do not look at the future or have lost most of their
hearing.

I don't know where you are coming from on this. I grew up listening to
FM and AM and I think AMBCB sounds just fine.

The fact that you are on this group means you are not an average listener.

I have posted data from a variety of US markets, as well as national
averages. Again: in 12-34 year old listeners, in LA, the total share for AM
is less than the indvidual station shares for the 6 highest rated FMs. 6%.
Nearly nobody. AM may sound good to you, but to nearly everyone under 45, it
is presently irrelevant and sucks.

AMBCB has good fidelity
and so does FM. AMBCB is not stereo but I don't care as I listen to
talk radio and news on that band. I don't spend much time with FM.
Generally I listen to AMBCB, short wave, and spend time on the Internet
for news.

The problem is just that. Only talk shows and such get on AM, because
anything else that requires fidelty will not work. Talk appeals to a very
old audience, and in many cases, it is getting harder and harder to sell.

This is what is bothering me about the move to HD. The move is supposed
to be an improvement but it does not seem that way to me. The move to HD
is just going to cost me money, not make an improvement, and change my
listening in ways I don't want. It's a lousy deal for me to spend money
I don't need to spend to keep getting what I already have. Same problem
for DRM on short wave.

DRM is an effort to make SW relevant, just as HD is for MW, to newer
generations that are looking for digital quality (in developed nations) and
at least FM quality in others.

Hey, Edweenie, stuff your panty hose in it, boy.