RadioBanter - The First 13 Days of the Revolution

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What Revolution?

From: Dave Heil on Mon, 09 Apr 2007 04:21:08 GMT

Subject: What Revolution?

AF6AY wrote:
From: on 8 Apr 2007 08:47:20 -0700
On Apr 7, 5:31 pm, wrote:
On Apr 3, 1:34?pm, "AF6AY" wrote:
On Mar 29, 6:24?pm, Dave Heil wrote:

Has anyone doubted that, Len?

[yes, a few have, notably Heil who once said "you never did
that in your life!"]

Your statement is a falsehood, "Anderson". Your quote of me is
manufactured by you.

It is terribly ACCURATE, sweetums, goes all the way back to
my mentioning my service with an Army radio station that
operated 24/7. You stated that I "never worked 24/7 in my
life!" :-)

Are you doing Eastertide funnies, Leonard?

Easter for 2007 is PAST, old man. :-)

Try to stay current...even if your voltage isn't up.

And a couple of weeks as a licensed radio amateur. That makes you an
amateur radio neophyte, Len. A beginner, novice, newcomer, wet-behind-
the-ears tyro.Not that there's anything wrong with that.

Right. Are you running for ARRL office as well? Sure sounds like it.

Sigh. Another east coastie, warm and welcoming...but
demanding that I bow down in "respect" to their mighty
macho morsemanship and "years of national service" by
twiddling their paddles and beeping in the cause of
"homeland security."

I must have missed the demand that you bow down in respect or anything
else, Len.

You've MISSED a whole lot of things, old man. One is getting
someone to pound it into your head that "welcoming" anyone
does NOT mean constantly, unremittingly TRYING to PUT OTHERS
DOWN as if you were some nasty SOB of a drill instructor.
You are NOT a drill instructor but you act like some self-
righteous, holier-than-thou SOB.

It is a fact that you're a brand new amateur radio licensee.

Yes, as of 7 March 2007 with my FIRST amateur radio license
class of Amateur Extra. :-)

As of March 1956 I've held a First Class Radiotelephone
(Commercial) Operator license...which changed to a General
Radiotelephone (Commercial) Operator license...and both
kept renewed until the "GROL" became Lifetime (without the
need for renewal). That's IN the FCC's records available
on-line. You know how LONG that license has been granted
to me? 51 years.

You know what else? I have been IN radio-electronics since
1952...55 years, not only working in it but also using it
from land, from the air, and on the sea. All very legal,
and, except for lately, WITHOUT needing any "amateur radio
license 'first'." Indeed, when working on some DoD contracts
the FCC's jurisdiction on radio DID NOT APPLY and I needed
NO license! All absolutely LEGAL.

You have FABRICATED a whole lot of pure, unadultered horse****
in regarding Amateur Radio as being some kind of extra-special
"different kind of radio" AS IF it is "not related" to any
other radio service, civilian or government. That isn't just
horse****, Heil, it is pure bull****...as "pure" as the
dumping grounds of diary farms and cattle grazing grounds...
and as evil-smelling as any ****ed-off morseman who despises
what the FCC did to "his amateur radio" in license testing.

What ****es Jimmie off is that I took and passed ALL
the test elements at one exam session...without asking
for His Permission, too!

I've seen no evidence that your claim is true. He's probably just noted
that you acted like a horse's patoot before you obtained an amateur
radio license and that you've carried that behavior into amateur radio.

Poor baby! Tsk, tsk, you've held a Personality Conflict
about me for a decade and you just can't let go of your
pesonal hatred, can you? :-)

"Extra out of the box!" Heil says I "didn't do it,"
yet I did. Sunnuvagun!

You can't have, Len. You announced it over seven years back and waited
for the regs to change before you took any amateur radio licensing
exams. That's not "right out" of anything. If someone tells me, "I'll
be right out", no one expects that to mean, "I'll be there in seven years."

"Extra Out Of The Box" is a common [U.S.} amateur radio
colloquial expression meaning one who takes ALL the test
elements and passes them in the SAME exam session. That
is what I did on 25 February 2007 at an ARRL VEC group's
exam session held at Old Fire House 77 on Glenoaks Blvd
in the Los Angeles suburb of Sun Valley.

I decided to take all the tests on 17 February 2007. NOT
"seven years ago." That's the truth no matter how or what
you write to the contrary.

Here is the posting where YOU said "I didn't do it,"
right from Google archives so you don't have to injure
a precious neuron to search for it:

================================================== =======================

324. Dave Heil View profile
More options Apr 6, 9:25 pm

Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy
From: Dave Heil
Date: Sat, 07 Apr 2007 05:25:54 GMT
Local: Fri, Apr 6 2007 9:25 pm
Subject: The First Month of the Revolution in USA Amateur Radio
Reply | Reply to author | Forward | Print | Individual message | Show
original | Report this message | Find messages by this author

AF6AY wrote:
Tsk, Brian, there ain't NO booze, branch water, or aqvavit to
make Davey say such a thing without the adjective of
"neophyte," "beginner" or whatever he needs to PUT DOWN
OTHERS he no like! :-)

I'm sorry that you don't like it, Len, but you are a beginner or
neophyte in amateur radio. You're just getting started. You're just
getting your feet wet.

Don't worry, you'll get the hang of it.

73, Len AF6AY [Extra Out Of The Box!]

...after a delay of seven long years. "Right out of the
box"
never took place.

Dave K8MN
================================================== ====================

? ?Are you one of the peasants, Len? You act more?
? ?like you are one of the arrogant nobility.?

Len, nobility? He's merely your peer... your equal.

ONLY in amateur radio, Brian...as far as all the privileges,
rank, status, etc., which must REALLY **** him off! :-)

You haven't had enough time in amateur radio to be equal to anyone but
another neophyte, Len.

Go FU yourself, Heil. The FCC says I'm an Amateur Extra.
YOU don't give licenses...You have NO authority, only a
big Ego.

Brian, like you, I've voluntarily served the US military;
Jimmie never did that.

...to your knowledge.

To EVERYONE's knowledge, sweetums. Miccolis finally admitted
in public he had NEVER SERVED in the military. Period.

I've worked in radio-electronics
full-time since 1952; we don't know where Jimmie is
supposed to work or what it is he really does for a living.

It is apparent that not knowing bugs the hell out of you.

No, it should be "apparent" that there are FAKERS out
there telling lots of LIES. "Major Dud" Robeson is one
of those. You lean in that direction...by very careful
wording to avoid details of yourself, only the overall
"big picture" phrasing (giving no details) is what you've
used. Sound like someone familiar? It should be, that
technique was tried by some civilian "major" of the CAP.

You have a good family and children and I have a good wife
who was my high school sweetheart; we don't know anything
about Jimmie's personal life except that he has a younger
brother "into radio."

It is also apparent that your lack of information on Jim's personal life
also bugs the hell out of you.

No, only that some want to keep things hidden from public view.
We will all know when he comes out of the closet.

Is Jimmie Greater or Lesser than
any of us? We don't know enough about Him to compare.

It can be demonstrated that Jim has over 40 times as much experience in
amateur radio than you, Leonard.

Oh, WOW! Forty years as an amateur! When do you think he will
turn Professional? :-)

Chew on that for a while.

Go bite your own horse's ass.

Jimmie PRETENDS to be a "Somebody."

I've never seen evidence that he is pretending anything, Len.

He PRETENDS to be a "military expert." He doesn't know squat
about the military. He PRETENDS to be an "amateur radio
historian," yet all his "writings" are cribbings from other,
real historians. He PRETENDS to be a professional (salaried)
engineer, yet he can't say ONE thing in here about what he does
or what his "products" are. He PRETENDS to know "all about"
other modes in amateur radio but all he can talk about is his
own OOK CW morsemanship. He PRETENDS to be a "knowledgeable
expert on southern California real estate but he knows squat
about that. He is a PRETENDER on par with the infamous Robesin.

Jim's analogy of real estate zoning changes in your local area to your
attempts as an outsider to effect change in amateur radio licensing (all
the while insisting that it was not for your personal benefit) was an
apt one. You didn't like that one single bit.

It was INEPT. Learn to spell.

There was NEVER any analogue, not even a corollary to "amateur
radio." You KNOW that, but you are sooooo enjoying your PUT
DOWN attempt that you can't help yourself. Miccolis FABRICATED
his case out of wispy cloth used for the Emperor's New Clothes.

You say that Jim pretends, yet he has posted the data on a regular
basis.

Erich von Daniken has written FIVE books on "ancient astronauts."
Is he "right?"

I can find no errors in the material he has submitted.

You better not...those numbers are straight from the ARRL's own
page on "FCC License Counts."

Are you now a "Mathematician," Heil? Some kind of "numbers guru?"
Who awarded you that title? One of your alternate personalities?

It isn't about fear, Len. It should be about exercising restraint and
using civility. You just plain honk people off.

I "honk" morsemen off. TS. Who the hell are YOU to be such a
"judge and jury" of what goes on in US amateur radio?

You've had a deep Personality Conflict with me ever since I didn't
care for your Guinea-Bisseau "morsemanship saves the RTTY day" for
you STORY you posted in here long ago. Wow, you REALLY tried to
shine yourself on the average regular in here then...you with the
STATE DEPARTMENT and all that stuff, posted to a little third-world
African country whose major export was cashew nuts. You got your
nuts off on my response, big expert on radio.

My work experience AND radio licensing is
public record if anyone cares to look for it...

...or if anyone cares.

The FBI cared. Lots of federal agencies cared. I've had several
background investigations without problems. Neither have I ever
been fired from an electronics engineering job for incompetence
or anything else.

...and I DO have
documented evidence to prove that (unlike The Robesin).

There is no one named "Robesin" who has posted here.

Yes there is. He goes by several different pseudonyms.

If you mean Steve
Robeson, he hasn't submitted proof of his military service to you.
That's not the same as it not haven taken place.

It hasn't. He's a FAKE, pure and simple. A poseur.

I have plenty of proof of my military service, but I'm not going to
submit it to you.

Submit to EVERYBODY. Make it public. Show everyone how
gloriously you served the nation in "a country at war."

You've squawked about that and you've insulted me
over my Vietnam service a number of times, that despite your claims that
you've never denigrated the military service of a fellow veteran.

Poor baby. Still crying over not being believed by telling
NO DETAILS of that glorious service? Good sales technique
but you don't have much of a product.

It isn't an "insult" to challenge a salesman-type who can't
come up with DETAILS on his "service." You might not have
"lied" but - with so few details and so many generalities -
you never told the TRUTH, either.

What has YOUR MILITARY SERVICE to do with RADIO? Did you ever
operate a radio in Vietnam? If so, what and under which
circumstances? Come ON, Heil, you can get very creative here,
no photographs need be reproduced, you can MAKE UP nice heroic
stories to really convince the folks!

I'm an old timer.

Yes, with that weight and continued smoking you need not
worry about any future.

I do not use Morse Code exclusively.

That's difficult to believe.

I'm an amateur radio operator.

You were granted an amateur radio license. It is the SAME
class license as the FCC granted me for my FIRST amateur radio
license. So?

I PUT you DOWN because you continue to act like a horse's ass.

Bull****. You have this deep abiding hatred called a Personality
Conflict with me. TS. Better get that disorder fixed. I'm not
going away any time soon.

No one here has done more "I am better than you" bragging, than Leonard
H. Anderson, a man who, up until a few weeks back, was not an amateur
radio op.

What "bragging?" "It ain't braggin' if ya done it!" a slight
misquote written by Miccolis several times in here. :-)

I done it, sweetums. It can be verified if you haven't seen it
already. No need to "brag" for me.

You really showed everyone.

What was there to "show?" I decided to take all the tests, did
that, passed them all, was granted my amateur radio license.
It complements the First 'Phone that I passed in one session
back in 1956. I waited about two weeks to take my First 'Phone
test, only about a week (plus a day) to take my Extra test.

Did I surprise you? Make you ANGRY at my audacity? :-)

Are you disturbed that I didn't ask your royal permission to
take a ham test? Was I supposed to kiss your ass and deliver
unto you a bunch of gratuitous nice-nice words first? :-)

Poor baby. Before the "TEST" you couldn't say enough nasty
about my NOT having an amateur radio license. NOW you can't
say enough nasty about my HAVING an amateur radio license!
You are a paragon of the paradigm of paradox...all hung up
on Hate because your prideful feathers got ruffled a long
time ago. Tsk, tsk.

You can't handle the use of Morse.

...that you know of. :-)

Colonel Jessup, one thing for damn sure is that YOU CAN'T
HANDLE THE TRUTH!

I've told truth in here. Others who have similar Personality
Conflicts with me have MANUFACTURED LIES out of my statements.

I expect such manufacturing of lies out of my truth in a
computer-modem communications venue. It's par for the course
in here. What I didn't expect was the lonnnng-running Hatred
that a few have over others' accomplishments. Surprise,
surprise, Gomer! :-)

Like it or not (we know you HATE it), I have my amateur radio
license, at Amateur Extra class. I intend to enjoy it despite
all your cat-calling, LIES, and general personal insults in this
newsgroup. Know what? YOU really DON'T MATTER in what I decide
to do for myself. Not one whit.

Like it or not, I *AM* part of the "revolution" in U.S. amateur
radio, one who DID do "Extra Out Of The Box" AFTER the code test
was eliminated by the FCC. There aren't many of us who are PART
of that "revolution," fewer still who did it ALL in one test
session. But, WE did it. There will be MORE in the future.

Eventually, all the morsemen of today will have gone SK and the
only licensed radio amateurs will be those who NEVER HAD TO TAKE
ANY MORSE CODE TEST! Oh, there will be some niche interested
morsemen in U.S. amateur radio in the future just as there are
niche interests in other modes. On the way to that future, the
morsemen will be sitting around whining and crying for days when
They were the "leaders" and "keepers of 'tradition'." That is
already disappearing. The "revolution" happened but guys like
you were so deep in self-righteous wrath you went into denial.
Not my problem. It is yours.

Enjoy your hate. You seem to have earned it. :-)

AF6AY

What Revolution?

AF6AY wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Mon, 09 Apr 2007 04:21:08 GMT

Subject: What Revolution?

AF6AY wrote:
From: on 8 Apr 2007 08:47:20 -0700
On Apr 7, 5:31 pm, wrote:
On Apr 3, 1:34?pm, "AF6AY" wrote:
On Mar 29, 6:24?pm, Dave Heil wrote:

Has anyone doubted that, Len?

[yes, a few have, notably Heil who once said "you never did
that in your life!"]

Your statement is a falsehood, "Anderson". Your quote of me is
manufactured by you.

It is terribly ACCURATE, sweetums, goes all the way back to
my mentioning my service with an Army radio station that
operated 24/7. You stated that I "never worked 24/7 in my
life!" :-)

:-) :-) :-)

Well, well. I never wrote that you hadn't worked at ADA, Len. You nor
anyone else has ever worked 24/7. It is physically impossible.

Are you doing Eastertide funnies, Leonard?

Easter for 2007 is PAST, old man. :-)

Try to stay current...even if your voltage isn't up.

Don't be a horse's patoot, Len. The date you wrote the words is evident.

And a couple of weeks as a licensed radio amateur. That makes you an
amateur radio neophyte, Len. A beginner, novice, newcomer, wet-behind-
the-ears tyro.Not that there's anything wrong with that.

Right. Are you running for ARRL office as well? Sure sounds like it.

Sigh. Another east coastie, warm and welcoming...but
demanding that I bow down in "respect" to their mighty
macho morsemanship and "years of national service" by
twiddling their paddles and beeping in the cause of
"homeland security."

I must have missed the demand that you bow down in respect or anything
else, Len.

You've MISSED a whole lot of things, old man.

They're easy to miss if they've not been written here. :-)

One is getting
someone to pound it into your head that "welcoming" anyone
does NOT mean constantly, unremittingly TRYING to PUT OTHERS
DOWN as if you were some nasty SOB of a drill instructor.

You aren't going to pound anything but sand, Leonard and I'm not the
welcoming committee. Your attitude isn't conducive to welcoming.

You are NOT a drill instructor but you act like some self-
righteous, holier-than-thou SOB.

I've not claimed to be a drill instructor, Len. It works out for both
of us.

It is a fact that you're a brand new amateur radio licensee.

Yes, as of 7 March 2007 with my FIRST amateur radio license
class of Amateur Extra. :-)

Yep. You have a brand new license and you are a brand new ham.

As of March 1956 I've held a First Class Radiotelephone
(Commercial) Operator license...

snip of unrelated reruns

You know what else?

further snip of unrelated reruns

You have FABRICATED a whole lot of pure, unadultered horse****
in regarding Amateur Radio as being some kind of extra-special
"different kind of radio" AS IF it is "not related" to any
other radio service, civilian or government.

A Corvair is related to a Corvette. That doesn't make them the same.

What ****es Jimmie off is that I took and passed ALL
the test elements at one exam session...without asking
for His Permission, too!

I've seen no evidence that your claim is true. He's probably just noted
that you acted like a horse's patoot before you obtained an amateur
radio license and that you've carried that behavior into amateur radio.

Poor baby! Tsk, tsk, you've held a Personality Conflict
about me for a decade and you just can't let go of your
pesonal hatred, can you? :-)

Well, poor baby, you're hanging on to some personal enmity toward me
which has gone on for ten years or better. You just can't let go of
your personal hatred or of being a horse's patoot, can you?

"Extra out of the box!" Heil says I "didn't do it,"
yet I did. Sunnuvagun!

You can't have, Len. You announced it over seven years back and waited
for the regs to change before you took any amateur radio licensing
exams. That's not "right out" of anything. If someone tells me, "I'll
be right out", no one expects that to mean, "I'll be there in seven years."

"Extra Out Of The Box" is a common [U.S.} amateur radio
colloquial expression meaning one who takes ALL the test
elements and passes them in the SAME exam session.

You keep trying to ignore the word "right", Len. It was there.
You didn't get any "Extra right out of the box". That's a fact.

That
is what I did on 25 February 2007 at an ARRL VEC group's
exam session held at Old Fire House 77 on Glenoaks Blvd
in the Los Angeles suburb of Sun Valley.

No, Leonard, you got no "Extra right out of the box". You didn't open
the box for over seven years after making your boast.

I decided to take all the tests on 17 February 2007. NOT
"seven years ago." That's the truth no matter how or what
you write to the contrary.

Your archived words exist. They give lie to your present tale.

Here is the posting where YOU said "I didn't do it,"
right from Google archives so you don't have to injure
a precious neuron to search for it:

================================================== =======================

324. Dave Heil View profile
More options Apr 6, 9:25 pm

Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy
From: Dave Heil
Date: Sat, 07 Apr 2007 05:25:54 GMT
Local: Fri, Apr 6 2007 9:25 pm
Subject: The First Month of the Revolution in USA Amateur Radio
Reply | Reply to author | Forward | Print | Individual message | Show
original | Report this message | Find messages by this author

AF6AY wrote:
Tsk, Brian, there ain't NO booze, branch water, or aqvavit to
make Davey say such a thing without the adjective of
"neophyte," "beginner" or whatever he needs to PUT DOWN
OTHERS he no like! :-)

I'm sorry that you don't like it, Len, but you are a beginner or
neophyte in amateur radio. You're just getting started. You're just
getting your feet wet.

Don't worry, you'll get the hang of it.

73, Len AF6AY [Extra Out Of The Box!]

...after a delay of seven long years. "Right out of the
box"
never took place.

Dave K8MN
================================================== ====================

It was as true then as it ever way, Leonard. You didn't get the Extra
"right out of the box". It didn't happen. You put it off for over
seven years.

? ?Are you one of the peasants, Len? You act more?
? ?like you are one of the arrogant nobility.?

Len, nobility? He's merely your peer... your equal.

ONLY in amateur radio, Brian...as far as all the privileges,
rank, status, etc., which must REALLY **** him off! :-)

You haven't had enough time in amateur radio to be equal to anyone but
another neophyte, Len.

Go FU yourself, Heil.

I'm an FSU fan.

The FCC says I'm an Amateur Extra.

....and so you are. By the grace of God and the changing of the
regulations, you got yourself off dead center seven years after a
foolish boast and passed the exams. Now you're a brand new ham.

YOU don't give licenses...You have NO authority, only a
big Ego.

Naw, I don't give licenses. I've given exams for licenses. I had all
the authority I needed for doing so.

Brian, like you, I've voluntarily served the US military;
Jimmie never did that.

...to your knowledge.

To EVERYONE's knowledge, sweetums. Miccolis finally admitted
in public he had NEVER SERVED in the military. Period.

DID he? What ARE WE to MAKE of it, super citizen?

I've worked in radio-electronics
full-time since 1952; we don't know where Jimmie is
supposed to work or what it is he really does for a living.

It is apparent that not knowing bugs the hell out of you.

No, it should be "apparent" that there are FAKERS out
there telling lots of LIES.

Should IT BE, Len? Has Jim FAKED ANYTHING by not telling you about HIS
JOB? What faking has he done? What outrageous claims has he made about
his job?

"Major Dud" Robeson is one
of those.

There is no one by the name of "Major Dud", Len. I've already told you
that there is a web site which confirms his Marine Corps service. You
either can't find it or haven't looked for it. You go on accusing folks
of being liars or fakers, but you're simply shooting blanks, old sojer.

You lean in that direction...by very careful
wording to avoid details of yourself, only the overall
"big picture" phrasing (giving no details) is what you've
used.

Yeah? What is my military service to you?

Bugs you, doesn't it?

Sound like someone familiar?

No, not really.

It should be, that
technique was tried by some civilian "major" of the CAP.

You've fired a lot of blanks, Leonard. Steve Robeson doesn't owe you
proof of his military service. I don't owe you proof of military
service. Live with it.

You have a good family and children and I have a good wife
who was my high school sweetheart; we don't know anything
about Jimmie's personal life except that he has a younger
brother "into radio."

It is also apparent that your lack of information on Jim's personal life
also bugs the hell out of you.

No, only that some want to keep things hidden from public view.

Did you have a point? What information does Jim owe you? He's seen
what you do with a little information. I've seen what you do with a
little information. You don't have much information about Jim. You
don't have much information about my Air Force service in or out of
Vietnam. Outside of throwing a tantrum, there's not much you can do
about it.

We will all know when he comes out of the closet.

Comes out of the closet? Are you nuts?

Is Jimmie Greater or Lesser than
any of us? We don't know enough about Him to compare.

It can be demonstrated that Jim has over 40 times as much experience in
amateur radio than you, Leonard.

Oh, WOW! Forty years as an amateur!

Right. Jim has been a radio amateur for over forty years. Do you think
you have an outside chance of equaling that number of years?

When do you think he will
turn Professional? :-)

You're obsessed with PROFESSIONALS. :-)

Chew on that for a while.

Go bite your own horse's ass.

I'm not going to bite you, Len. There are times that I think you've
been assigned as my own personal horse's ass.

Jimmie PRETENDS to be a "Somebody."
I've never seen evidence that he is pretending anything, Len.

He PRETENDS to be a "military expert." He doesn't know squat
about the military.

I've read his posts on military matters. His information is usually
quite accurate. He's never called himself a military expert. Are you a
military expert?

He PRETENDS to be an "amateur radio
historian," yet all his "writings" are cribbings from other,
real historians.

Who are the real amateur radio historians, Len? Since Jim has never
called himself an "amateur radio historian", you'll have a tough time
making your silly accusations stick.

He PRETENDS to be a professional (salaried)
engineer, yet he can't say ONE thing in here about what he does
or what his "products" are.

I think he say much more than ONE thing about his job. He has chosen
not to do so. Now what are you going to do? Why don't you PRETEND that
it's none of your business?

He PRETENDS to know "all about"
other modes in amateur radio but all he can talk about is his
own OOK CW morsemanship.

You don't have any idea if CW is all Jim can talk about. You're
PRETENDING to know.

He PRETENDS to be a "knowledgeable
expert on southern California real estate but he knows squat
about that.

I've never seen any post where Jim has claimed to be an expert in real
estate anywhere. You're PRETENDING that he said so.

He is a PRETENDER on par with the infamous Robesin.

You're still a horse's patoot, Len--and you aren't PRETENDING.

Jim's analogy of real estate zoning changes in your local area to your
attempts as an outsider to effect change in amateur radio licensing (all
the while insisting that it was not for your personal benefit) was an
apt one. You didn't like that one single bit.

It was INEPT.

It was both apt and "EPT".

Learn to spell.

You don't give orders, old sojer.

There was NEVER any analogue, not even a corollary to "amateur
radio."

The comparison was spot on, Len. You didn't like it.

You KNOW that, but you are sooooo enjoying your PUT
DOWN attempt that you can't help yourself.

No, Len, I don't KNOW that.

Miccolis FABRICATED
his case out of wispy cloth used for the Emperor's New Clothes.

No, Len, he did not.

You say that Jim pretends, yet he has posted the data on a regular
basis.

Erich von Daniken has written FIVE books on "ancient astronauts."
Is he "right?"

What do you think, Len? Has he written anything about American amateur
radio licensing statistics?

I can find no errors in the material he has submitted.

You better not...those numbers are straight from the ARRL's own
page on "FCC License Counts."

Are they?

Are you now a "Mathematician," Heil?

Are you a mathematician, Anderson?

Some kind of "numbers guru?"

Are you a "numbers guru" or simply the "Maharishi of Math", Len?

Who awarded you that title?

Where'd your math credentials come from?

One of your alternate personalities?

What?

It isn't about fear, Len. It should be about exercising restraint and
using civility. You just plain honk people off.

I "honk" morsemen off. TS.

You've honked off people who supported the elimination of Morse testing.
You've honked off folks who were in favor of the retention of Morse tests.

Who the hell are YOU to be such a
"judge and jury" of what goes on in US amateur radio?

I'm a person you've honked off. I'm a guy who has forty-three years in
amateur radio. I'm one who doesn't believe that you've suddenly become
civil just because you've finally obtained an amateur radio license.

You've had a deep Personality Conflict with me ever since I didn't
care for your Guinea-Bisseau "morsemanship saves the RTTY day" for
you STORY you posted in here long ago.

You honked me off way before any discussion of Guinea-Bissau, Len.
I've never written anything to the effect that Morse Code save the day,
but that hasn't stopped you from writing such things. You play fast and
loose with the truth. You manufacture statements. You're disingenuous.

Wow, you REALLY tried to
shine yourself on the average regular in here then...you with the
STATE DEPARTMENT and all that stuff, posted to a little third-world
African country whose major export was cashew nuts. You got your
nuts off on my response, big expert on radio.

You revealed yourself to be an unpleasant little man back then. You
show yourself as a still unpleasant little man today. You honk people off.

My work experience AND radio licensing is
public record if anyone cares to look for it...

...or if anyone cares.

The FBI cared. Lots of federal agencies cared. I've had several
background investigations without problems.

Those folks were paid to look at it, Len. It isn't that they found you
fascinating.

Neither have I ever
been fired from an electronics engineering job for incompetence
or anything else.

Well sir, that's very nice for you. Yep, that's something in which you
can take a great deal of pride. I'm not sure what we're supposed to
make of the information in an amateur radio newsgroup, but it must mean
a lot to you.

...and I DO have
documented evidence to prove that (unlike The Robesin).

There is no one named "Robesin" who has posted here.

Yes there is.

No, Len, there isn't.

He goes by several different pseudonyms.

Ahhh! He's undercover, is he?

If you mean Steve
Robeson, he hasn't submitted proof of his military service to you.
That's not the same as it not haven taken place.

It hasn't.

You've not been able to demonstrate otherwise.

He's a FAKE, pure and simple. A poseur.

That's not what the easily found web site says of his Marine Corps
service. It sounds like you're the fake.

I have plenty of proof of my military service, but I'm not going to
submit it to you.

Submit to EVERYBODY. Make it public.

My Vietnam service is documented on a couple of veterans organization
web sites. I even got in contact with the fellow I replaced in Vietnam.
Have you found even one of those sites?

Show everyone how
gloriously you served the nation in "a country at war."

What claims of glorious service have I made, Len? I certainly served in
the country where the war was taking place. That's at odds with your
Korean War tale of what it is like to undergo an artillery barrage,
while you were in Japan.

You've squawked about that and you've insulted me
over my Vietnam service a number of times, that despite your claims that
you've never denigrated the military service of a fellow veteran.

Poor baby. Still crying over not being believed by telling
NO DETAILS of that glorious service? Good sales technique
but you don't have much of a product.

Poor Leonard. Tsk, tsk. He has nothing further to go on. It bugs the
hell out of him!

It isn't an "insult" to challenge a salesman-type who can't
come up with DETAILS on his "service."

There's no "can't" involved, Len. I've chosen not to reveal the details
of my military service to you. I have lots of DETAILS. I'm not sharing
them with Leonard H. Anderson, super citizen.

You might not have
"lied" but - with so few details and so many generalities -
you never told the TRUTH, either.

Anything and everything I've shared concerning my military service is
absolutely true. That's all you're getting.

What has YOUR MILITARY SERVICE to do with RADIO? Did you ever
operate a radio in Vietnam? If so, what and under which
circumstances? Come ON, Heil, you can get very creative here,
no photographs need be reproduced, you can MAKE UP nice heroic
stories to really convince the folks!

I have no need to get creative. You have little to go on. Now what
will you do?

I'm an old timer.

Yes, with that weight and continued smoking you need not
worry about any future.

The odds are very good that I'll be around longer than Leonard H. Anderson.

I do not use Morse Code exclusively.

That's difficult to believe.

Then again, you're a brand new ham.

I'm an amateur radio operator.

You were granted an amateur radio license. It is the SAME
class license as the FCC granted me for my FIRST amateur radio
license. So?

I've forty-three years of experience as an amateur radio op. Thirty of
them have been as an Extra Class licensee. You're short a bunch of
decades and at least one operating mode. Quit trying to be an instant
expert, Len.

I PUT you DOWN because you continue to act like a horse's ass.

Bull****.

That's not the kind that comes from a horse, Len.

You have this deep abiding hatred called a Personality
Conflict with me. TS.

I don't hate you, Len. I don't like you.

Better get that disorder fixed. I'm not
going away any time soon.

Define "soon."

No one here has done more "I am better than you" bragging, than Leonard
H. Anderson, a man who, up until a few weeks back, was not an amateur
radio op.

What "bragging?" "It ain't braggin' if ya done it!" a slight
misquote written by Miccolis several times in here. :-)

You've bragged about a number of things you hadn't done. The "Extra
right out of the box" and the "spincter post" immediately come to mind.

I done it, sweetums.

You've certainly boasted, Sugar Dumpling.

It can be verified if you haven't seen it
already.

I'm still waiting for confirmation of that artillery barrage.

No need to "brag" for me.

I agree. You're doing fine all by yourself.

You really showed everyone.

What was there to "show?" I decided to take all the tests, did
that, passed them all, was granted my amateur radio license.

....after seven years and a reg change.

It complements the First 'Phone that I passed in one session
back in 1956. I waited about two weeks to take my First 'Phone
test, only about a week (plus a day) to take my Extra test.

How does an amateur radio license compliment your commercial ticket, Len?

Did I surprise you?

You surely did. I was expecting you to act seven years back.

Make you ANGRY at my audacity? :-)

It is hardly audacious to sit on your duff for seven years.

Are you disturbed that I didn't ask your royal permission to
take a ham test?

Were you considering asking?

Was I supposed to kiss your ass and deliver
unto you a bunch of gratuitous nice-nice words first? :-)

Just remember, Leonard: It is never too late!

Poor baby. Before the "TEST" you couldn't say enough nasty
about my NOT having an amateur radio license.

Yep, you boasted and fell. You were a boor and you acted like a horse's
patoot.

NOW you can't
say enough nasty about my HAVING an amateur radio license!

You're still a boor and you still act like a horse's patoot.

You've now become a brand new radio amateur. Do something with the
license. Don't feel compelled to tell old timers of your expertise.
If you use your receiver more than your transmitter and pay attention,
you just may learn a bit.

You are a paragon of the paradigm of paradox...all hung up
on Hate because your prideful feathers got ruffled a long
time ago. Tsk, tsk.

I don't hate you, Len. I just don't like you. You grate on people.

You can't handle the use of Morse.

...that you know of. :-)

I'm sure that someone would be pleased to have a QSO with you, using
that mode. I'm not going to be the someone.

Colonel Jessup, one thing for damn sure is that YOU CAN'T
HANDLE THE TRUTH!

I'm not Colonel Jessup and you're short on truth, old sojer.

I've told truth in here.

It has been a distinct rarity in your posts. They have generally been
filled with factual errors and deliberate falsehoods.

Others who have similar Personality
Conflicts with me have MANUFACTURED LIES out of my statements.

You're a riot, Len.

I expect such manufacturing of lies out of my truth in a
computer-modem communications venue. It's par for the course
in here.

This can't be the first place where you've encountered numbers of people
who believe you to be a horse's ass, Len.

What I didn't expect was the lonnnng-running Hatred
that a few have over others' accomplishments.

I'm sure we're all simply envious of your deeds, Mr. Mitty.

Surprise,
surprise, Gomer! :-)

I was never a Marine and never served on TV.

Like it or not (we know you HATE it), I have my amateur radio
license, at Amateur Extra class.

I don't hate the fact that you have an amateur radio license nor do I
hate you. I just wouldn't want you to hang around me or move next door.
I don't want a QSO with you on the air.

I intend to enjoy it despite
all your cat-calling, LIES, and general personal insults in this
newsgroup.

I've not engaged in lies, Len. You have received the cat calls and
personal insults your demeanor has generated. I'm sure that you've
become used to such in numerous venues. If you act on the amateur radio
bands as you've acted here, don't be surprised if the QSOs are few and
far between. Give the attitude a rest and try your very best to be a
warm and pleasant individual. If you succeed at that, you may find that
amteur radio *is* enjoyable for you. If not, you may find that it isn't
to your liking.

Know what? YOU really DON'T MATTER in what I decide
to do for myself. Not one whit.

There's no reason for you to waste your valuable remaining time in
responding to my posts. To date, it seems that I've mattered.

Like it or not, I *AM* part of the "revolution" in U.S. amateur
radio

I've not seen any revolution, Len. The numbers do not support your claim.

...one who DID do "Extra Out Of The Box" AFTER the code test
was eliminated by the FCC.

That word "right" keeps tripping you up. You got no amateur license
"right out" of anything. You waited over seven years from the time of
your boast to obtain the "Extra right out of the box". That didn't happen.

There aren't many of us who are PART
of that "revolution," fewer still who did it ALL in one test
session. But, WE did it. There will be MORE in the future.

You didn't, as you've told us a number of times, do it for yourself.
You were, you said, motivated by altruism in eliminating Morse testing
for *others*. That simply wasn't true. The "revolution" has had the
immediate impact of a fart in a wind storm.

Eventually, all the morsemen of today will have gone SK and the
only licensed radio amateurs will be those who NEVER HAD TO TAKE
ANY MORSE CODE TEST!

Wave the banners! Storm the Winter Palace! I'm betting that at least
part of the vanguard of this silent revolution will be long gone before
I take my leave of amateur radio.

Oh, there will be some niche interested
morsemen in U.S. amateur radio in the future just as there are
niche interests in other modes.

Son of a niche!

On the way to that future, the
morsemen will be sitting around whining and crying for days when
They were the "leaders" and "keepers of 'tradition'."

You've demonstrated little respect for the traditions and values of
amateur radio. Your tenure will be, of necessity, a short one.

That is
already disappearing.

What is already disappearing? Whining? Days? Leaders?

The "revolution" happened but guys like
you were so deep in self-righteous wrath you went into denial.

I guess most of us expected something to happen. The expected swarms of
the "otherwise qualified" hasn't materialized.

Not my problem.
It is yours.

That's right. When you are a part of a problem, you are somebody else's
problem.

Enjoy your hate.

I don't hate you, Len. I just don't like you. Carry your "revolution"
idea into amateur radio and see what it gets you.

You seem to have earned it. :-)

....and you've earned the respect of all those you've encountered?

Tsk, tsk. Poor baby.

Dave K8MN

What Revolution?

On Apr 9, 1:05 pm, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
On Apr 9, 2:05 am, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
On Apr 7, 5:31 pm, wrote:
On Apr 3, 1:34?pm, "AF6AY" wrote:
On Mar 29, 6:24?pm, Dave Heil wrote a typical
warm, wonderful "welcome" message of:
Well, Len, you're just reaping what you've sown.
Jim, when life appears to be treating you unfairly, it isn't. You just
reap what you sow.
I wish you guys would start choosing your words more carefully. You'll
have Mark accusing both of you of promoting *reap*.

Ha! Dave makes a funny about Robesin's accusations of rape. Great
subject to joke about.

? ?Does having been granted a Commercial radiotelephone
? ?operator license 51 years ago NOT count? ?
Count for what, Len?
What do you think it should count for, when the subject is amateur
radio?
Welp, according to Heil, he was able to bypass military comms training
as he held an amateur license. He was DDA.
You continue to misquote me.

I see no quote.

You used the words "according to Heil". I never made such a statement.
You are in error.

Yes I did, but that is no substitute for a quote.

My amateur radio license gave me the
knowledge to pass the Bypassed Specialist exams.

Wrong. False. The knowledge comes before the license, otherwise how
could you have passed the amateur exam?

The Bypassed Specialist exam was not an amateur radio exam.

So how could it be that your amateur radio knowledge was useful in
passing such a non-amateur radio exam?

A number of
individuals here have pointed out that an amateur radio license is only
the beginning.

If the exam is only the beginning, then multiple exams and multiple
license classes are superfluous. A number of individuals here have
pointed that out.

Passing the exams
allowed me to bypass tech school.

So you really did bypass military comms training? Exactly how did I
"misquote" you?

You misquoted me when you wrote "according to Heil" and follow it with
something I've not stated.

Yet it is what you did.

The Air Force did not provide a pass on
training because I held an amateur radio license. The Air Force allowed
me to skip Tech School because I passed the Bypassed Specialist exam.

Yet in your own words, you were able to pass that exam because of
amateur radio knowledge...

You sure do like to twist things up and smoke them.

Of course it
? ?"doesn't count" sinc AMATEUR RADIO is the ONLY WAY
? ?one can "get experience" according to the snipers and
? ?general cat-callers.
Amateur radio is the only way to get *amateur radio* experience,
Len.
You've got plenty of that, Jim. Probably more than a 4 year old
Extra.
You're right, Brian. Jim has forty years of amateur radio experience.
Len has a few weeks at best.

I'm sure he'll catsup quick.

He'll have forty years experience in forty years.

Poor Dave has to maintain that edge of superiority.

Do you think you know more about amateur radio than someone who has
been an active radio amateur for several decades?
What's to know? Please start a list.
You've held a license for at least a couple of decades. Shouldn't you
have an inkling by now?

You're 59...

That's the sum total of knowledge you've acquired since you obtained an
amateur radio license?

What? You don't like standardized replies that allow for 13 second
QSOs?

And a couple of weeks as a licensed radio amateur. That makes you an
amateur radio neophyte, Len. A beginner, novice, newcomer, wet-behind-
the-ears tyro.Not that there's anything wrong with that.
Right. Are you running for ARRL office as well? Sure sounds like it.
What do you mean "as well?" Do you know someone who is running for an
ARRL elected position?

You've announced a run for the Roanoke Division Directorship.

No, Brian, I have not.

Perhaps it was only wishful typing when you posted your run?

I suspect that you are jealous of K8MN, Len.
He's merely annoying. He knows everything - just ask him.
I will. Len, do you know everything?

Let's see...you bought some manufactured equipment,
put together a basic station, and made a few contacts
using voice modes like SSB and FM. How "revolutionary"
is that?
He did it on HF without a single morse code exam.
Vive le revolucion!
Are you one of the peasants, Len? You act more
like you are one of the arrogant nobility.
Len, nobility? He's merely your peer... your equal.
I can't see how that works, Brian. Len is a guy who became a brand new
radio amateur a few weeks ago.
Len is a guy who holds an Extra license. What class of license do you
hold? ...does Jim hold?

Oh, Len holds a license of the same class.

Indeed. Yet the FCC has no requirement for experience. Len has
gained radio experience via a lifetime of operating in other
services. Weren't you the one who said that amateur experience
allowed you to bypass military comms school?

He's been a radio amateur
for several weeks. He's green. Despite the tenor of some of his posts,
he's a novice in amateur radio. He's just begun.

You're the one who's green - with envy...

Best of Luck

Well, thanks for the kind wishes, Brian. Maybe you'll want to wish Len
some luck in his venture into the world of amateur radio.

Dave K8MN

Sure.

What Revolution?

On Apr 9, 1:17 pm, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
On Apr 9, 2:05 am, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
On Apr 7, 5:31 pm, wrote:
On Apr 3, 1:34?pm, "AF6AY" wrote:
On Mar 29, 6:24?pm, Dave Heil wrote a typical
warm, wonderful "welcome" message of:
Well, Len, you're just reaping what you've sown.
Jim, when life appears to be treating you unfairly, it isn't. You just
reap what you sow.
I wish you guys would start choosing your words more carefully. You'll
have Mark accusing both of you of promoting *reap*.

Ha! Dave makes a funny about Robesin's accusations of rape.

No, Brian, I made no reference to anyone called "Robesin", nor did I
mention the word "rape".

Right. kly explain what you did mean.
Great subject to joke about.

The joke was not about rape. The joke was about one of the great
manglers of language, a person who is a perpetual "victum".

Dave K8MN

*reap*

Please do a word scramble and provide all possible words other than
RAPE which you were referring to. Thanks.

What Revolution?

Dave Heil wrote:

...
Life has in no way bypassed me, "John". Amateur radio is not the sum
total of my existence. Within amateur radio, I am free to use any mode
of operation available to me. You, it seems, are limited in your choices.

It is evident from your postings that it was never about the Morse test
with you. You take it far beyond testing.

Dave K8MN

Absolutely! We know you well from your over-abundant postings. I don't
believe I have EVER seen a smaller-pettier old woman in my life! (and,
I suspect I'd have the best luck looking here!)

Now, others may disagree, and let us hope so--a life without friends is
a lonely life.

JS

What Revolution?

From: on 10 Apr 2007 03:56:54 -0700

Subject: What Revolution?

On Apr 9, 1:05 pm, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
On Apr 9, 2:05 am, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
On Apr 7, 5:31 pm, wrote:
On Apr 3, 1:34?pm, "AF6AY" wrote:
On Mar 29, 6:24?pm, Dave Heil wrote a typical

Welp, according to Heil, he was able to bypass military comms training
as he held an amateur license. He was DDA.
You continue to misquote me.

I see no quote.

You used the words "according to Heil". I never made such a statement.
You are in error.

Yes I did, but that is no substitute for a quote.

:-) All those outraged morsemen bitching and moaning about
EVIDENCE and EXACT WORDS...so that they will have some trivial
thing to argue over in front of some "judge." :-)

My amateur radio license gave me the
knowledge to pass the Bypassed Specialist exams.

Wrong. False. The knowledge comes before the license, otherwise how
could you have passed the amateur exam?

The Bypassed Specialist exam was not an amateur radio exam.

So how could it be that your amateur radio knowledge was useful in
passing such a non-amateur radio exam?

The mystery of the ages... :-)

One slight omission by "Barrister" Heil: His USAF MOS (Military
Occupation Specialty). Was it ever mentioned by him?

Did Heil operate ANY radio (other than a BC receiver) while "in
a country at war?"

During the Vietanm War only two transceiver types made up the
vast bulk of communications. I've not seen Heil mention either
one of them, despite an eighth of a million of those two types
made and operational.

A number of
individuals here have pointed out that an amateur radio license is only
the beginning.

If the exam is only the beginning, then multiple exams and multiple
license classes are superfluous. A number of individuals here have
pointed that out.

True. One ham = one license should be good enough for a hobby
activity.

But...a long time ago the "amateur community" decided it wanted
(terribly) the RANK-STATUS-PRIVILEGES of multiple classes,
especially the morsemen holding on (with dear life) to their
beloved morse code. The "upper" classes could then look down
(and put down) the "lower" classes in great personal glee.

Now IN the electronics industry (where the rest of the radio
world's equipment - and some amateur gear - is designed and
made), the vast majority of those involved do NOT have amateur
radio licenses! Those involved in everyday work with radio
and electronics found it a fascinating, challenging activity
all by itself. No "ham ticket" was necessary...indeed was a
superfluous thing since amateur radio licenses are NOT needed
for the rest of the radio world.

Passing the exams
allowed me to bypass tech school.

So you really did bypass military comms training? Exactly how did I
"misquote" you?

You misquoted me when you wrote "according to Heil" and follow it with
something I've not stated.

Yet it is what you did.

WE just don't know for sure what Heil actually did unless he
states his USAF MOS, what he worked with "in a country at war."

The Air Force did not provide a pass on
training because I held an amateur radio license. The Air Force allowed
me to skip Tech School because I passed the Bypassed Specialist exam.

Yet in your own words, you were able to pass that exam because of
amateur radio knowledge...

You sure do like to twist things up and smoke them.

:-) I think he tries to be a "Johnnie Cochrane" in some "court"
and winds up sounding more like he drank too much Johnnie Walker.

You're right, Brian. Jim has forty years of amateur radio experience.
Len has a few weeks at best.

I'm sure he'll catsup quick.

He'll have forty years experience in forty years.

Poor Dave has to maintain that edge of superiority.

He has a terrible personal NEED for that "superiority."

He MUST be above all others. The Latin phrase "Primus inter pares"
suits him ("first among equals"), a Latin oxymoron of all things.

Notice he is getting to be more like The Robesin all the time?

Do you think you know more about amateur radio than someone who has
been an active radio amateur for several decades?
What's to know? Please start a list.
You've held a license for at least a couple of decades. Shouldn't you
have an inkling by now?

You're 59...

That's the sum total of knowledge you've acquired since you obtained an
amateur radio license?

What? You don't like standardized replies that allow for 13 second
QSOs?

Heil wants His NOW. Instant gratification of his "superiority."

Right. Are you running for ARRL office as well? Sure sounds like it.
What do you mean "as well?" Do you know someone who is running for an
ARRL elected position?

You've announced a run for the Roanoke Division Directorship.

No, Brian, I have not.

Perhaps it was only wishful typing when you posted your run?

Maybe Heil CHANGED HIS MIND? People are allowed to do that,
change their mind, that is...

Oh! But NOT in amateur radio newsgroups! No, NEVER, according
to Miccolis! Once one says something, regardless of how long
ago, to Miccolis that is a LIFE GOAL Never To Be Changed!

Len is a guy who holds an Extra license. What class of license do you
hold? ...does Jim hold?

Oh, Len holds a license of the same class.

Indeed. Yet the FCC has no requirement for experience. Len has
gained radio experience via a lifetime of operating in other
services. Weren't you the one who said that amateur experience
allowed you to bypass military comms school?

Brian, it only works ONE WAY, Heil's Way.

Sort of like "Heil's Way or the highway." :-)

He's been a radio amateur
for several weeks. He's green.

NO, NO, NO...FACTUAL ERROR BY Heil. I am not green. As a
caucasoid
type human racial type I am various shades of PINK commonly
referred
to as "flesh color." Blue eyes, light brown hair (with a little
grey
here and there).

I recycle recyclable trash every week...although the LA City
Sanitation supplied can is colored BLUE. :-)

My specific amateur radio equipment is "basic BLACK" with white
legends and a little chrome and aluminum trim (Icom - LDG - MFJ -
Heil Sound - chosen colors). It sits on a nice desk (melamine
surfaces) of BROWN. The credit card I used to pay for it is
mostly BLUE with RED and White trim.

Despite the tenor of some of his posts,
he's a novice in amateur radio. He's just begun.

You're the one who's green - with envy...

I'm not a tenor. More of a baritone. I do have "perfect pitch"
as far as the standard chromatic scale of musical notes is
concerned.

There is NO "novice" class for new US amateur radio license
class grants. That ended almost seven years ago.

Neither is there any AGE discrimination in FCC regulations,
age low or high. It was perfectly permissible by law to take
and pass ALL test elements in one test session...which is what
I did on 25 Feb 07. The ARRL VEC accepted that, the FCC
accepted that. Heil and Miccolis still can't "accept" that.

I BEGAN in big-time radio in the US Army in 1953 with my first
posting to an HF transmitter site. That involved not just KW
RF output transmitters but VHF, UHF radios, then microwave radio
relay terminals (late 1954), plus HTs and backpack radio use
common to "line" outfits (infantry-artillery-armor). So my
"beginning" happened 54 years ago, not a "month" ago. The
laws of physics applied equally well to radios in that time
(and to fields and waves) as it does NOW.

Heil and Miccolis really OVERWORK their look-down-their-noses
attitude of "beginners." When someone proves that amateur radios
work with "different" laws of physics than all other radios,
I might consider myself as a "beginner." Until then, the REAL
difference between amateur radio and the rest of radio is just
some man-made adminstrative details...and from the ham bigots
busy with self-righteous, I-am-so-important-because-I-know-code
sneering and insulting of new licensees.

73s, Len AF6AY

What Revolution?

AF6AY wrote:
From: on 10 Apr 2007 03:56:54 -0700

Subject: What Revolution?

On Apr 9, 1:05 pm, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
On Apr 9, 2:05 am, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
On Apr 7, 5:31 pm, wrote:
On Apr 3, 1:34?pm, "AF6AY" wrote:
On Mar 29, 6:24?pm, Dave Heil wrote a typical

A number of
individuals here have pointed out that an amateur radio license is only
the beginning.

If the exam is only the beginning, then multiple exams and multiple
license classes are superfluous. A number of individuals here have
pointed that out.

True. One ham = one license should be good enough for a hobby
activity.

I've told you a number of times that the FCC nowhere uses the word
"hobby" in defining or describing amateur radio.

But...a long time ago the "amateur community" decided it wanted
(terribly) the RANK-STATUS-PRIVILEGES of multiple classes,
especially the morsemen holding on (with dear life) to their
beloved morse code. The "upper" classes could then look down
(and put down) the "lower" classes in great personal glee.

That seems to be your version of events and it seems that, despite of
reality, you're sticking to it. You've always had a perceptible
inferiority complex.

Now IN the electronics industry (where the rest of the radio
world's equipment - and some amateur gear - is designed and
made), the vast majority of those involved do NOT have amateur
radio licenses! Those involved in everyday work with radio
and electronics found it a fascinating, challenging activity
all by itself. No "ham ticket" was necessary...indeed was a
superfluous thing since amateur radio licenses are NOT needed
for the rest of the radio world.

If someone wanted to participate in amateur radio, passing an amateur
radio license exam was the only way to gain entry. That is still true
today.

Passing the exams
allowed me to bypass tech school.

So you really did bypass military comms training? Exactly how did I
"misquote" you?

You misquoted me when you wrote "according to Heil" and follow it with
something I've not stated.

Yet it is what you did.

WE just don't know for sure what Heil actually did unless he
states his USAF MOS, what he worked with "in a country at war."

The Air Force does not use that term, Leonard. If you're going to play
Secret Squirrel, at least bone up on the background info.

You're right, Brian. Jim has forty years of amateur radio experience.
Len has a few weeks at best.

I'm sure he'll catsup quick.

He'll have forty years experience in forty years.
Poor Dave has to maintain that edge of superiority.

He has a terrible personal NEED for that "superiority."

Where did you see me writing of myself? You have a terrible personal
case of inferiority.

He MUST be above all others.

JIM has forty years more experience that you. You MUST have seen that.

The Latin phrase "Primus inter pares"
suits him ("first among equals"), a Latin oxymoron of all things.

You aren't Jim's equal in amateur radio or civility. You're a beginner
in one and you have yet to practice the other.

Do you think you know more about amateur radio than someone who has
been an active radio amateur for several decades?

What's to know? Please start a list.

You've held a license for at least a couple of decades. Shouldn't you
have an inkling by now?

You're 59...

That's the sum total of knowledge you've acquired since you obtained an
amateur radio license?

What? You don't like standardized replies that allow for 13 second
QSOs?

Heil wants His NOW. Instant gratification of his "superiority."

*Snicker* Yeah, I've gained instant superiority after only forty-three
years in the game. Stop, Len! You're cracking me up!

Right. Are you running for ARRL office as well? Sure sounds like it.

What do you mean "as well?" Do you know someone who is running for an
ARRL elected position?

You've announced a run for the Roanoke Division Directorship.

No, Brian, I have not.

Perhaps it was only wishful typing when you posted your run?

Maybe Heil CHANGED HIS MIND? People are allowed to do that,
change their mind, that is...

To CHANGE MY MIND, I'd had to have made the statement that
hot-ham-and-cheese attributed to me. His big dilemma is that I didn't
make such a statement. Oh deary me. What will he do now?

Oh! But NOT in amateur radio newsgroups! No, NEVER, according
to Miccolis! Once one says something, regardless of how long
ago, to Miccolis that is a LIFE GOAL Never To Be Changed!

You've been caught with your brogans in your yap on a number of
occasions, "Anderson". A smarter being probably wouldn't bring further
attention to himself by braying about it.

Len is a guy who holds an Extra license. What class of license do you
hold? ...does Jim hold?

Oh, Len holds a license of the same class.

Indeed. Yet the FCC has no requirement for experience. Len has
gained radio experience via a lifetime of operating in other
services. Weren't you the one who said that amateur experience
allowed you to bypass military comms school?

Brian, it only works ONE WAY, Heil's Way.

Sort of like "Heil's Way or the highway." :-)

The Air Force technical schools award one the "3" skill level, an
apprentice level. The Bypassed Specialist is also awarded that same
apprentice level. Further on-the-job training along with bookwork are
the way to the journeyman or "5" level. I completed the same OJT and
study course as every other "5" level candidate. It wasn't my way or
the highway, but the Air Force way.

He's been a radio amateur
for several weeks. He's green.

NO, NO, NO...FACTUAL ERROR BY Heil. I am not green. As a
caucasoid
type human racial type I am various shades of PINK commonly
referred
to as "flesh color."

As a "boot" is to the military, you are to amateur radio. You're
green--a beginner.

Despite the tenor of some of his posts,
he's a novice in amateur radio. He's just begun.

There is NO "novice" class for new US amateur radio license
class grants. That ended almost seven years ago.

Sorry, Len. There was a Novice Class, but no novice class.
I wrote that you're a novice in amateur radio. That is the case.
You're a neophyte, a beginner.

Neither is there any AGE discrimination in FCC regulations,
age low or high. It was perfectly permissible by law to take
and pass ALL test elements in one test session...which is what
I did on 25 Feb 07. The ARRL VEC accepted that, the FCC
accepted that. Heil and Miccolis still can't "accept" that.

I'll let Jim speak for himself on this issue. I fully accept that
you've passed requisite exams currently in place for the Amateur Extra.
You've been issued a license. I couldn't find anything above where I
commented on your age. You now have an amateur radio license. Use it
and gain some experience in amateur radio.

I BEGAN in big-time radio...

snip of irrelevant reruns

Heil and Miccolis really OVERWORK their look-down-their-noses
attitude of "beginners."

I congratulate you on your brand new amateur radio license. Keep your
ears and eyes open and you may learn a great deal.

When someone proves that amateur radios
work with "different" laws of physics than all other radios,
I might consider myself as a "beginner." Until then, the REAL
difference between amateur radio and the rest of radio is just
some man-made adminstrative details...and from the ham bigots
busy with self-righteous, I-am-so-important-because-I-know-code
sneering and insulting of new licensees.

That attitude won't help you in gaining experience in amateur radio.
Amateur radio is not solely concerned with the physics of radio. The
fact is that you are a beginner in amateur radio. You have much to
learn. You aren't an instant expert, Len.

Dave K8MN

What Revolution?

On Apr 10, 11:57 pm, Dave Heil wrote:
AF6AY wrote:
From: on 10 Apr 2007 03:56:54 -0700

Subject: What Revolution?

On Apr 9, 1:05 pm, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
On Apr 9, 2:05 am, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
On Apr 7, 5:31 pm, wrote:
On Apr 3, 1:34?pm, "AF6AY" wrote:
On Mar 29, 6:24?pm, Dave Heil wrote a typical
A number of
individuals here have pointed out that an amateur radio license is only
the beginning.
If the exam is only the beginning, then multiple exams and multiple
license classes are superfluous. A number of individuals here have
pointed that out.

True. One ham = one license should be good enough for a hobby
activity.

I've told you a number of times that the FCC nowhere uses the word
"hobby" in defining or describing amateur radio.
so what?

the ARS is basicaly a hobby or would you care to discuss the service
asspects of the CB service

What Revolution?

On Apr 9, 12:05�pm, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
On Apr 9, 2:05 am, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
On Apr 7, 5:31 pm, wrote:
On Apr 3, 1:34?pm, "AF6AY" wrote:

Welp, according to Heil, he was able to bypass military comms training
as he held an amateur license. *He was DDA.
You continue to misquote me. *

I see no quote.

You used the words "according to Heil". *I never made such a statement.
You are in error.

My amateur radio license gave me the
knowledge to pass the Bypassed Specialist exams. *

Wrong. *False. *The knowledge comes before the license, otherwise how
could you have passed the amateur exam?

The Bypassed Specialist exam was not an amateur radio exam. *A number of
individuals here have pointed out that an amateur radio license is only
the beginning.

Passing the exams
allowed me to bypass tech school.

So you really did bypass military comms training? *Exactly how did I
"misquote" you?

You misquoted me when you wrote "according to Heil" and follow it with
something I've not stated. *The Air Force did not provide a pass on
training because I held an amateur radio license. *The Air Force allowed
me to skip Tech School because I passed the Bypassed Specialist exam.

Dave,

What you're seeing in this and other exchanges with
Len and "hot-ham-and-cheese" is their
attention-getting behavior by means of factual errors.

They're clearly so desperate to get others' attention
that they put obvious errors into the postings in the
hope of getting a reply that corrects the error.

* *Of course it
"doesn't count" sinc AMATEUR RADIO is the ONLY WAY
one can "get experience" according to the snipers and
general cat-callers.

There's another method: name-calling mixed with factual error.

Amateur radio is the only way to get *amateur radio* experience,
Len.
You've got plenty of that, Jim. *Probably more than a 4 year old
Extra.

No such thing as a 4 year old Extra - the youngest
on record was 7 years old. See how it works, Dave?

You're right, Brian. *Jim has forty years of amateur radio experience.
Len has a few weeks at best.

Yup.

I'm sure he'll catsup quick.

He'll have forty years experience in forty years.

Only if he's an active radio amateur for those forty
years.

Do you think you know more about amateur radio than someone who has
been an active radio amateur for several decades?
What's to know? *Please start a list.

You could put my list of operating skills here,
Dave...

You've held a license for at least a couple of decades. *Shouldn't you
have an inkling by now?

You're 59...

That's the sum total of knowledge you've acquired since you obtained an
amateur radio license?

And a couple of weeks as a licensed radio amateur. That makes you an
amateur radio neophyte, Len. A beginner, novice, newcomer, wet-behind-
the-ears tyro.Not that there's anything wrong with that.
Right. *Are you running for ARRL office as well? *Sure sounds like it.
What do you mean "as well?" *Do you know someone who is running for an
ARRL elected position?

You've announced a run for the Roanoke Division Directorship.

No, Brian, I have not.

See? Another factual error from "hot-ham-and-cheese".

I suspect that you are jealous of K8MN, Len.
He's merely annoying. *He knows everything - just ask him.
I will. *Len, do you know everything?

Let's see...you bought some manufactured equipment,
put together a basic station, and made a few contacts
using voice modes like SSB and FM. How "revolutionary"
is that?
He did it on HF without a single morse code exam.
Vive le revolucion!
Are you one of the peasants, Len? You act more
like you are one of the arrogant nobility.
Len, nobility? *He's merely your peer... *your equal.

The funny part about that statement is that it's not
clear whether "hot-ham-and-cheese" is trying to
insult Len, myself, or both...

It clearly got to Len because of the tirade he unleashed about me.

I can't see how that works, Brian. *Len is a guy who became a brand new
radio amateur a few weeks ago.
Len is a guy who holds an Extra license. *What class of license do you
hold? *...does Jim hold?

Oh, Len holds a license of the same class. *He's been a radio amateur
for several weeks. *He's green. *Despite the tenor of some of his posts,
he's a novice in amateur radio. *He's just begun.

Yup. I don't think we have to worry about him
outperforming us anytime soon, Dave. Like making
a higher score in the November Sweepstakes.

Best of Luck

Well, thanks for the kind wishes, Brian. *Maybe you'll want to wish Len
some luck in his venture into the world of amateur radio.

73 de Jim, N2EY