From: "Phil Kane" on Tues,Apr 19 2005 12:15 pm

On Tue, 19 Apr 2005 06:05:03 GMT, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

The radio station at Ft Greely, Ak was built in 1948 as the first
permanent "Armed Forces Radio Network" station. It was the first
site
built with commercial broadcast equipment instead of modified
military
gear used at some sites during WW II. The radio transmitter was a
gates
BC250 In the early '70s AFRTS claimed to be the only all tube
network
in the world.

A former subordinate of mine at the FCC, Don Browne, was an EE and
ROTC-trained AFRTS officer in the late 1960s and after his three
years on active duty with the Signal Corps went Reserve and came to
work for me. He spent several years at the field office and several
more at headquarters. His reserve billet was abolished in an AFRTS
reorganization (even though he was a MAJ) but when a vacancy on the
civilian engineering staff of the AFRTS came up he transferred to
that. He retired as the chief of engineering for AFRTS several
years ago and still hangs around the broadcast business.

Wow. I'm in the presence of Nobility. I am humbled.

FWIW, AFRTS headquarters used to be just about a mile from my
house on a little jog of La Tuna Canyon Road, just before it
gets changed to Penrose. In some "economy move" of about 7
(or was it 6?) years ago, it was emptied out in Sun Valley,
CA, and all staff moved east about 40 miles to a
decommissioned USAF base somewhat close to Ontario, CA. The
old AFRTS buildings haven't been leased to anyone yet after
all this time (one can still read the name in smudges on the
exterior wall where the raised lettering was).

AFRTS IS NOT Amateur Radio

It's SHOW BIZ !!!

AFRTS IS NOT COMMUNICATIONS per se. shrug

Did AFRS or AFRTS ever do morse code? :-)

From: "K=D8=88B" on Tues,Apr 19 2005 6:32 pm

"bb" wrote in message
roups.com...

What was the wash-out rate?

I don't have any statistics, but it was fairly small, probably on the
order of
8-10%. Most washouts were for academic reasons. Very few failed
because of the
code.

Riiiiiight. :-)

What happened to the wash-outs?

They were transferred to the fleet, where most of them were
immediately snapped
up by the Chief Radioman as undesignated strikers. Since we were
chronically
short of operators, any training at all was an asset, and a "second
chance" is a
great motivator.

Geez, yeah...times were TOUGH during the Second World War!

Usually these turned out to be above average sailors.

Morsemen ALWAYS excell at anything they do. Just ask one.


73, de Hans, K0HB
Master Chief Radioman, US Navy

Dankie-shoe-in, 73, 88, and 103,



ex-RA16408336, Microwave Radio Relay Operations and Maintenance
(MOS 281.6) SUPERVISOR (E-5), US ARMY.

"bb" wrote in message
ups.com...

Dee Flint wrote:

Most of the computer programs let you select a pitch you like. Of
course
you would have to arrange with the VE team well in advance of the
test to
have one set up at that pitch for her testing.

Dee, not everyone has a ham-husband to tell them all of the
modifications that the VE may make to an examination


Class instructors should also pass this info to their students if they are
any good at being instructors. Of course there are people who choose to "go
it alone" in becoming hams, but the study guides do mention that
accomodations are possible.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

wrote in message
oups.com...

Geez, yeah...times were TOUGH during the Second World War!

I'll take your word for it, Old Timer. My experience ran from the late 50's to
the early 80's.

ex-RA16408336, Microwave Radio Relay Operations and Maintenance
(MOS 281.6) SUPERVISOR (E-5), US ARMY.

73, de Hans, K0HB
Master Chief Radioman (E-9), US Navy

"bb" wrote in message
ups.com...

cl wrote:
"bb" wrote in message
oups.com...

cl wrote:



[snip]

I disagree. It took a great effort.


What is a great effort? Many times it is a matter of perspective. In other
words what we expect versus reality may make something seem like a "great
effort."

For some - it may! One argument I've heard, is that those musically
inclined
pick it up quicker than others, yet I knew some who "were" musically
inclined and claimed to have a hell of a time with it. Reason? I
don't know.
I can't get inside their head.

Steve can. He can even have them incarcerated with a simple phone
calls.

The biggest problem with most is "laziness".

Was that your problem? If you hadn't been so lazy you could have
learned the code in under a week?

Eh - I had the code down in 2 weeks for the Novice exam. AND I'm now
an
Extra. Been licensed since the early 80s.
Yeah, I probably could have learned it in under a week, if I pushed
myself.

That wasn't my point. My point is that everyone is different, and the
length of time it takes to learn 5WPM varies greatly. The time it
takes to learn 20WPM could be lifetimes. Not everyone is even capable
of 13WPM.


Check out the book "The Art and Skill of Radiotelegraphy." Basically anyone
without a handicap can master 20wpm with the proper training tools if they
are truly motivated to do so. Keep in mind that we all talk faster than
that. We even talk faster than that when we spell out words phonetically!

Most anyone will tell you - it isn't good to do such. Besides, at
that time,
I was chasing rug rats - so study time was premium.

I've been told that is absolutely no excuse. Nothing in your personal
or professional life can be more important than learning the code.


No one has ever said that. We each must choose our activities based on our
personal priorities. But do not whine and cry to change the requirements
simply because it's not high enough on your priority list to put some time
into it. Besides if you haven't time to study code 15 minutes per day, you
don't have time to study the theory either.

Most recommendations are
15 minutes to a half hour a day. That hardly makes it possible in a
week. I
used the words " "AT LEAST" 2 WEEKS". Some are faster learners than
others,
that is a given. BUT my point was, you have to get started to learn
ANYTHING.

The book "Morse Code: The Essential Language" states that the AVERAGE
person is going to need 30 hours of study and practice to get to 5wpm.
Natural there are the "wunderkind" like my daughter who got it in a couple
of weeks and there are others who need many months.

As you said, a person must get started to learn anything.

[snip]


I don't dislike the code. It was difficult for me to make the few
QSO's that I did make as a novice. I'd like to pick it up again
someday.


The first ones are difficult for all of us. Like anything else it takes
time to get good.


Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

"Roger Conroy" wrote in message
...


[snip]


I've recently read somewhere (if only I could remember where) of a totally
deaf ham
who operates cw. He was a no-coder until he became deaf. He uses a
homebrew
gizmo plugged into the headphone socket that flashes a light. Was allowed
to
use it for the test without any problems.
His only problem is that from around 15wpm the light does not come on and
go
out fast enough. IIRC his device uses standard tungsten filament bulb.
What
would be the best alternative, i.e. "switches" faster, LED or neon bulb?
The article had a schematic of the sound-to-light converter - I remember
it
could be adjusted to allow for signal strength, noise and variations in
output characteristics of different radios.

I suppose someone reasonably competent in electronic design, not me ,
could "re-invent" such a thing without raising a sweat.

73
Roger ZR3RC


It might not be possible to go any faster with a flashing light anyway as
"persistence of vision" kicks in somewhere around there and it would look
like a single long light anyway. That's how movies work.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

"Dee Flint" wrote in message
...

We each must choose our activities based on our personal priorities.

Thank you very much, Captain Obvious.

But do not whine and cry to change the requirements simply because it's not
high enough on your priority list
to put some time into it.

I wouldn't characterize it as "whine and cry" (unless I wanted to prejudice the
audience). Seems more like "this is my opinion on the matter".

Besides if you haven't time to study code 15 minutes
per day, you don't have time to study the theory either.

Is that kinda like when you told your child "if you haven't got room for more
green beans, then you don't have room for dessert either"

As you said, a person must get started to learn anything.
The first ones are difficult for all of us. Like anything else it takes time
to get good.

"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something,
learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is
full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant
without having come by their ignorance the hard way."
---Bokonon in "Cat's Cradle"

"Actually, what is being discussed is freedom of choice of modes
in a hobby in a free society. There is absolutely nothing prohibiting
someone who wants to take full advantage of CW's many
advantages from becoming skillful in the mode."
--- CAM in RRAP

Sunuvagun!

73, de Hans, K0HB

K4YZ wrote:
Mike Coslo wrote:

bb wrote:


Mike Coslo wrote:


I've heard of some pretty wild times long before things were

"dumbed

down"!


- Mike KB3EIA -


Mike, I've been meaning to ask. Are you still sore at me for not
giving your grief about the balloon project?

HEH! Now you confused me Brian. But seriously, that you *didn't*

give

me grief was duly noted!

I've been stressing over

Steve's label of "antagonist" for not giving you grief for some

time

now. I'm such a terrible person. Hi!

Ohh, you know how newsgroups are.....


I know how they are, Mike!

They're populated by people who don't have the intestinal
fortitude to sign their names to their posts and they make up
allegations to try and hide behind.

Now that you mention it, I have taken amazing amounts of guff because I
am "stupid enough" to use my own name and callsign. I've only been doing
that since, oh..... the early '90's.

And yet, there is no doubt that the more anonymous the poster, the more
outrageous and profane the posts. Odd how the "smart" people seem to
need to hide themselves. Big deal! Its sooo easy to be a big man when
you hide who you are.

Hey, are you going to be at Dayton this year?

- Mike - KB3EIA -

wrote in message
ups.com...

I've heard some weird tales about how the Signal Corps
used Draconian methods to quickly pound Morse into
the heads of their WW2 radio ops.Stories about
eight-hours-per-day seven days per weeks drills for 2-4
weeks or some such, nasty punishments for those who
"didn't get it", etc. Have you ever heard any of these tales?

I think the operative word is "tale" (civilian "legend"). I don't go back that
far, but seems to me a draftee kid who drew Signal Corps billet would recognize
a cushy job when he saw it and such "motiviation" wouldn't be needed.

73, de Hans, K0HB

KØHB wrote:

"Dee Flint" wrote in message
...


We each must choose our activities based on our personal priorities.


Thank you very much, Captain Obvious.


But do not whine and cry to change the requirements simply because it's not
high enough on your priority list
to put some time into it.


I wouldn't characterize it as "whine and cry" (unless I wanted to prejudice the
audience). Seems more like "this is my opinion on the matter".


Besides if you haven't time to study code 15 minutes
per day, you don't have time to study the theory either.


Is that kinda like when you told your child "if you haven't got room for more
green beans, then you don't have room for dessert either"


As you said, a person must get started to learn anything.
The first ones are difficult for all of us. Like anything else it takes time
to get good.


"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something,
learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is
full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant
without having come by their ignorance the hard way."
---Bokonon in "Cat's Cradle"

Wow, talk about prejudicing the audience! This assumes that those of us
who support Morse testing simply do it because we had to. With my
problems with it, that would make me the meanest SOB in the valley.

Perhaps, just perhaps, some of us believe that it is a good idea simply
because it is a good idea, a mode that cant be performed by picking up a
mic and talking, or typing on a keyboard, and needs to be learned?


"Actually, what is being discussed is freedom of choice of modes
in a hobby in a free society. There is absolutely nothing prohibiting
someone who wants to take full advantage of CW's many
advantages from becoming skillful in the mode."
--- CAM in RRAP

Extended to all modes? Get rid of those darn satellite mode questions
on the tests! I personally have no use for that! For a strict appliance
operator who is going to buy everything they use and have someone else
install it? No one should have to do anything they don't want to do!
Ditch all those unneeded questions.

Sunuvagun!

Huzzanga!

- Mike KB3EIA -