"Dee Flint" wrote in message
. ..

"KH6HZ" wrote in message
...
"KC4UAI" wrote:

So, do I consider myself an expert in all things Ham Radio by
virtue of my license class? Nope

Oddly enough, virtually all the "extras" I met during my tenure as a
"non-extra" didn't consider themselves Einsteins either. Now that I'm an
Extra, I do not consider myself an Einstein either.

It seems that only a small subset of hams (and non-hams) who post to this
forum seem to run into these self-proclaimed Einstein Extras.

But then, if you read their postings long enough, you'll begin to
understand that this bias towards Extras really isn't due to the fact
these extras are self-proclaimed Einsteins, but rather the fact that
these Extras passed a 20wpm code test at one point or another.

73
kh6hz



I believe the bias goes even deeper. Even if code were not an issue, that
bias would still exist simply because the Extra has met a higher written
requirement too. In today's society, it seems to be politically incorrect
to have acquired more knowledge than someone else.

Dee, N8UZE

indeed you are corect Dee I conmpltly aggree







--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

On Jan 30, 7:59 pm, "
wrote:
From: on Tues, Jan 30 2007 3:40 am

On Jan 30, 12:28 am, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
When certain Extras tell me how to conduct my amateur life all the
while scarfing up a bunch of "club" calls, DX calls, and vanity calls,
then I see them as thinking they are somehow much more priveleged than
the next guy...

If you're the next guy, I'm much more privileged than you. Pass the
exams, Mr. Cheese. You too can be more privileged.

Mr Deignan's priveleges went beyond those authorized. Riley had to
reel him back in. Put him on the straight and narrow...

but he's still got a big mouth and a Hawaiin callsign.

By the way, I scarfed up a number of DX calls. I hope you don't mind.

Not at all. You were there, Mr DX. I approve.

Mr Deignan was there in PO Box only.

Did you loan out your PO Box to folks who wanted a cool Tanzanian call
sign? Did you get a cool Guam call sign having never been to Guam,
then pretend to Lecture people on how to run their amateur lives?

Mr. DX was able to "scarf up DX calls" courtesy of WORKING
IN THE STATE DEPARTMENT and getting DIPLOMATIC COURTESY from
foreign nations. Any way one slices it, Herr Oberst was
able to do that while being EMPLOYED at work that was NOT
devoted to amateur radio. DIPLOMATIC COURTESY.

Did der Robust Oberst ACTUALLY TAKE THOSE FOREIGN AMATEUR
RADIO TESTS...IN THEIR NATIVE LANGUAGES? Hard to say
but it is likely he will not, nor ever, admit that
DIPLOMATIC COURTESY was the major via for that "scarfing."

That's hard for me to say, and I'm sure Dave won't say.

But if you check out the ARRL web site under operating from foreign
countries, something which all the smartie Extras should do before
they accuse people of being bootleggers, you'll find that a USA
license and a fee is usually enough to obtain a call in many
countries.

It went well beyond the "three hots and a cot" enjoyed by
long-ago military radio operators who've been in here and
bailed...the military that taught them morsemanship.

A skill greater in value than all the rest of amateur radio combined.

The State Department EMPLOYMENT served the government, but
using that as a cover for "scarfing up" foreign callsigns
is not an "achievement" of himself.

C'mon Len. I'm sure Dave did his job to the best of his ability.
Didit?

I agree that it is
less reprehensible than going into collusion with another
amateur extra to falsify the intent, spirit of law to gain
personal emotional advantage of having non-existant club
trusteeships.

Riley has no dominion over Dave when he's operating out of the
country. On the other hand, Riley had his boot on the neck of one RF
Commando! Hi!

But, Heil was with the government and thinks he's here to
"help." Ptui.

LA

He's here when the bands are closed. That's all.

wrote:
On Jan 30, 7:59 pm, "
wrote:
From: on Tues, Jan 30 2007 3:40 am

Mr. DX was able to "scarf up DX calls" courtesy of WORKING
IN THE STATE DEPARTMENT and getting DIPLOMATIC COURTESY from
foreign nations. Any way one slices it, Herr Oberst was
able to do that while being EMPLOYED at work that was NOT
devoted to amateur radio. DIPLOMATIC COURTESY.

Did der Robust Oberst ACTUALLY TAKE THOSE FOREIGN AMATEUR
RADIO TESTS...IN THEIR NATIVE LANGUAGES? Hard to say
but it is likely he will not, nor ever, admit that
DIPLOMATIC COURTESY was the major via for that "scarfing."

That's hard for me to say, and I'm sure Dave won't say.

I've already said in the past. This isn't the first time that Foghorn
Lenhorn has attempted selling the exact same untruth. None of my
overseas licensing was obtained through any "DIPLOMATIC COURTESY". The
Department of State has no one facilitating amateur radio licensing for
its employees.

But if you check out the ARRL web site under operating from foreign
countries, something which all the smartie Extras should do before
they accuse people of being bootleggers, you'll find that a USA
license and a fee is usually enough to obtain a call in many
countries.

Reciprocity is the key. Obtaining a license overseas is normally done
by going to the PTT with a passport containing a valid visa for
residency or for a visit, a notarized photocopy of a U.S. amateur
license. An application is filled out and a fee is paid. Nobody at the
Department of State fills out the application. No embassy staff member
is tasked with filling out the application. The USG does not pay the
licensing fee. Americans working for private companies and American
tourists can do the very same thing.

Len has made a number of factual errors. You've just been witness to
another. Len not only has an ax to grind with amateur radio ops, ARRL
members, Morse Code operators and testing advocates. He doesn't like
the U.S. Department of State for whatever reason.

It went well beyond the "three hots and a cot" enjoyed by
long-ago military radio operators who've been in here and
bailed...the military that taught them morsemanship.

A skill greater in value than all the rest of amateur radio combined.

Aren't you curious about what went well beyond the "three hots and a
cot"? Len never gets around to telling us.

The State Department EMPLOYMENT served the government, but
using that as a cover for "scarfing up" foreign callsigns
is not an "achievement" of himself.

C'mon Len. I'm sure Dave did his job to the best of his ability.
Didit?

Len has made another factual error. Yes, I trotted down the the local
PTT, filled out the application, presented the necessary paperwork and
paid the fees all by myself.

I agree that it is
less reprehensible than going into collusion with another
amateur extra to falsify the intent, spirit of law to gain
personal emotional advantage of having non-existant club
trusteeships.

Riley has no dominion over Dave when he's operating out of the
country. On the other hand, Riley had his boot on the neck of one RF
Commando! Hi!

But you'll note that Leonard uses the term "less reprehensible" about
something which didn't take place the way he said it did and which was
not in any form reprehensible. If it *had* taken place the way he said
it took place, it *still* wouldn't have been reprehensible. He'd rather
ramble on, quizzing you about whether I took foreign radio amateur exams
in their native language. Well, I could have taken a Finnish amateur
radio exam in *English*. All it would have gotten me is a sequentially
issued Finnish call. I could have taken the Sierra Leonean and
Tanzanian exams in their official language--English. What would have
been the point. Reciprocity guaranteed me a license corresponding to
the highest class license each government issued. I was never concerned
that it might cause angst to non-radio amateur retiree on the U.S. West
Coast.

But, Heil was with the government and thinks he's here to
"help." Ptui.

LA

He's here when the bands are closed. That's all.

Careful about getting caught up in the factual errors. I worked quite a
number of Europeans on 160m the past four evenings.

Dave K8MN

On Jan 30, 7:59 pm, " wrote:
From: on Tues, Jan 30 2007 3:40 am
On Jan 30, 12:28 am, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:

When certain Extras tell me how to conduct my amateur life all the
while scarfing up a bunch of "club" calls, DX calls, and vanity calls,
then I see them as thinking they are somehow much more priveleged than
the next guy...

If you're the next guy, I'm much more privileged than you. Pass the
exams, Mr. Cheese. You too can be more privileged.

Mr Deignan's priveleges went beyond those authorized. Riley had to
reel him back in. Put him on the straight and narrow...

but he's still got a big mouth and a Hawaiin callsign.

By the way, I scarfed up a number of DX calls. I hope you don't mind.

Not at all. You were there, Mr DX. I approve.

Mr Deignan was there in PO Box only.

Did you loan out your PO Box to folks who wanted a cool Tanzanian call
sign? Did you get a cool Guam call sign having never been to Guam,
then pretend to Lecture people on how to run their amateur lives?

Mr. DX was able to "scarf up DX calls" courtesy of WORKING
IN THE STATE DEPARTMENT and getting DIPLOMATIC COURTESY from
foreign nations. Any way one slices it, Herr Oberst was
able to do that while being EMPLOYED at work that was NOT
devoted to amateur radio. DIPLOMATIC COURTESY.

Did der Robust Oberst ACTUALLY TAKE THOSE FOREIGN AMATEUR
RADIO TESTS...IN THEIR NATIVE LANGUAGES? Hard to say
but it is likely he will not, nor ever, admit that
DIPLOMATIC COURTESY was the major via for that "scarfing."

That's hard for me to say, and I'm sure Dave won't say.

But if you check out the ARRL web site under operating from foreign
countries, something which all the smartie Extras should do before
they accuse people of being bootleggers, you'll find that a USA
license and a fee is usually enough to obtain a call in many
countries.

Of course, for ordinary USA citizens.

It is naive to assume that Diplomatic Courtesy "did
NOT play a role" in those furrin' calls. Heil was
a USA EMBASSY STATIONED STATE DEPARTMENT EMPLOYEE.
BFD.

Diplomatic Courtesy alone would grease the wheels of
beaurocracy that exist in all governments. Even in
the big, rich, powerful nation of Guinea-Bisseau.

If I remember (from long-ago postings in here), State's
"key list man" was the ONLY amateur radio licensee in
Guinea-Bisseau? Distinct honor?

It went well beyond the "three hots and a cot" enjoyed by
long-ago military radio operators who've been in here and
bailed...the military that taught them morsemanship.

A skill greater in value than all the rest of amateur radio combined.

Ab-so-huckin-lutely! :-) Tension hut.


The State Department EMPLOYMENT served the government, but
using that as a cover for "scarfing up" foreign callsigns
is not an "achievement" of himself.

C'mon Len. I'm sure Dave did his job to the best of his ability.
Didit?

Of course. Amateur radio was a big, tremendous, awesome
HELP to the Department of State. Lord knows that State
is sometimes run amateurishly... :-(

[Look...over to one side...Cranky is wiping off his
Spanky ruler to "admonish" me for felony charges of
"no respect for authority!" :-) ]

I agree that it is
less reprehensible than going into collusion with another
amateur extra to falsify the intent, spirit of law to gain
personal emotional advantage of having non-existant club
trusteeships.

Riley has no dominion over Dave when he's operating out of the
country. On the other hand, Riley had his boot on the neck of one RF
Commando! Hi!

There ya go!

But, Heil was with the government and thinks he's here to
"help." Ptui.

He's here when the bands are closed. That's all.

The bands are closed?!? You mean they aren't open 24/7 so
that any ham anywhere can talk all around the globe with
a teeny QRP rig on HF? Oh, my. That IS sad news. Kinda
goes against what the mighty gods of extra radio were
implying in here while busy giving me a "theory lecture."

Hmmm...maybe there's a "morseman holiday" or something,
like a bank holiday when all the banks are closed?

[now watch all the sirius-minded hop in here to "explain
the ionosphere" thinking I was actually serious above...]

[jes' gotta LOVE some o' them dogged sirius folk sniffing
around their computer hydrants! Arf! :-) ]

Hej,
LA

On Jan 30, 3:48�am, wrote:
On Jan 29, 10:40 pm, "Dee Flint" wrote:
"KH6HZ" wrote in message

...

"KC4UAI" wrote:

So, do I consider myself an expert in all things Ham Radio by
virtue of my license class? *Nope

Oddly enough, virtually all the "extras" I met during my tenure as a
"non-extra" didn't consider themselves Einsteins either. Now that I'm an
Extra, I do not consider myself an Einstein either.

It seems that only a small subset of hams (and non-hams) who post to this
forum seem to run into these self-proclaimed Einstein Extras.

But then, if you read their postings long enough, you'll begin to
understand that this bias towards Extras really isn't due to the fact
these extras are self-proclaimed Einsteins, but rather the fact that these
Extras passed a 20wpm code test at one point or another.

73
kh6hz

I believe the bias goes even deeper. *Even if code were not an issue, that
bias would still exist simply because the Extra has met a higher written
requirement too. *

Dee, I believe you are the first Extra to recognize that not all
writtens are the same. *Since the beginning of the code debate, and
now with the passing of the code exam, we are made to believe that the
writtens are a mere insignificant formality and all the real content
was in the code exam.

Of course that's not true. *Thank you for being and Extra and pointing
that out. *You are a No Code Technician in spirit!

In today's society, it seems to be politically incorrect
to have acquired more knowledge than someone else.

Dee, N8UZE

Never. *Just don't equate the Extra exam or having Extraness as if it
were an engineering degree. *We'll get along Quitefine.

...and if we send like Slow Code... :-)

wrote:
On Jan 30, 7:59 pm, " wrote:
From: on Tues, Jan 30 2007 3:40 am
On Jan 30, 12:28 am, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:

When certain Extras tell me how to conduct my amateur life all the
while scarfing up a bunch of "club" calls, DX calls, and vanity calls,
then I see them as thinking they are somehow much more priveleged than
the next guy...
If you're the next guy, I'm much more privileged than you. Pass the
exams, Mr. Cheese. You too can be more privileged.
Mr Deignan's priveleges went beyond those authorized. Riley had to
reel him back in. Put him on the straight and narrow...
but he's still got a big mouth and a Hawaiin callsign.
By the way, I scarfed up a number of DX calls. I hope you don't mind.
Not at all. You were there, Mr DX. I approve.
Mr Deignan was there in PO Box only.
Did you loan out your PO Box to folks who wanted a cool Tanzanian call
sign? Did you get a cool Guam call sign having never been to Guam,
then pretend to Lecture people on how to run their amateur lives?
Mr. DX was able to "scarf up DX calls" courtesy of WORKING
IN THE STATE DEPARTMENT and getting DIPLOMATIC COURTESY from
foreign nations. Any way one slices it, Herr Oberst was
able to do that while being EMPLOYED at work that was NOT
devoted to amateur radio. DIPLOMATIC COURTESY.
Did der Robust Oberst ACTUALLY TAKE THOSE FOREIGN AMATEUR
RADIO TESTS...IN THEIR NATIVE LANGUAGES? Hard to say
but it is likely he will not, nor ever, admit that
DIPLOMATIC COURTESY was the major via for that "scarfing."
That's hard for me to say, and I'm sure Dave won't say.

But if you check out the ARRL web site under operating from foreign
countries, something which all the smartie Extras should do before
they accuse people of being bootleggers, you'll find that a USA
license and a fee is usually enough to obtain a call in many
countries.

Of course, for ordinary USA citizens.

It is naive to assume that Diplomatic Courtesy "did
NOT play a role" in those furrin' calls.

On the contrary, your lack of information about how things work led you
to a faulty conclusion. You formulated a theory based upon that faulty
conclusion and advanced it as fact. You assumed and you were wrong.
You made another of your factual errors.

Heil was
a USA EMBASSY STATIONED STATE DEPARTMENT EMPLOYEE.
BFD.

You were the party attempting to make a big deal out of it, Len.
Foreign Service folks are "posted", not "stationed".

Diplomatic Courtesy alone would grease the wheels of
beaurocracy that exist in all governments.

Stick to things you know, Len. You'll look less foolish.

Even in
the big, rich, powerful nation of Guinea-Bisseau.

"Guinea-Bissau", Len.

If I remember (from long-ago postings in here), State's
"key list man"...

"Key Officers of Foreign Service Posts", Len. That's the list which you
erroneously stated was a telephone list. You looked foolish then too.

...was the ONLY amateur radio licensee in
Guinea-Bisseau? Distinct honor?

I was for all but four months of my tour. The other fellow was a Swede
who worked with the local maritime radio station. He wasn't a diplomat.

It went well beyond the "three hots and a cot" enjoyed by
long-ago military radio operators who've been in here and
bailed...the military that taught them morsemanship.

A skill greater in value than all the rest of amateur radio combined.

Ab-so-huckin-lutely! :-) Tension hut.

You aren't funny, Len.


The State Department EMPLOYMENT served the government, but
using that as a cover for "scarfing up" foreign callsigns
is not an "achievement" of himself.
C'mon Len. I'm sure Dave did his job to the best of his ability.
Didit?

Of course. Amateur radio was a big, tremendous, awesome
HELP to the Department of State. Lord knows that State
is sometimes run amateurishly... :-(

Thanks so very much in proving the point I made to Brian last night.

[Look...over to one side...Cranky is wiping off his
Spanky ruler to "admonish" me for felony charges of
"no respect for authority!" :-) ]

You continue to be a rude churl, Len. You can't help but fulfill the
well known profile of your behavior.

I agree that it is
less reprehensible than going into collusion with another
amateur extra to falsify the intent, spirit of law to gain
personal emotional advantage of having non-existant club
trusteeships.
Riley has no dominion over Dave when he's operating out of the
country. On the other hand, Riley had his boot on the neck of one RF
Commando! Hi!

There ya go!

But, Heil was with the government and thinks he's here to
"help." Ptui.
He's here when the bands are closed. That's all.

The bands are closed?!? You mean they aren't open 24/7 so
that any ham anywhere can talk all around the globe with
a teeny QRP rig on HF? Oh, my. That IS sad news. Kinda
goes against what the mighty gods of extra radio were
implying in here while busy giving me a "theory lecture."

It means that both you and Brian are mistaken.

Hmmm...maybe there's a "morseman holiday" or something,
like a bank holiday when all the banks are closed?

[now watch all the sirius-minded hop in here to "explain
the ionosphere" thinking I was actually serious above...]

I don't think there'll be much of a splash, Leonard. Folks are used to
you being wrong about things.

[jes' gotta LOVE some o' them dogged sirius folk sniffing
around their computer hydrants! Arf! :-) ]

Do you have a computer hydrant, Len?

Dave K8MN

On Jan 30, 11:35 am, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
On Jan 30, 12:23 am, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
On Jan 29, 2:12 pm, wrote:
On 29 Jan 2007 03:45:35 wrote:
On Jan 29, 12:39 am, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
You gotta wonder which of the regulars are/were posting anonymously.
Really hair-brained stuff.
Hair-brained, was it?
Did your mom ever take the "hare brush" to you?
Dave K8MN
Do you think Ed Hare is back, posting anonymously?
could be I supose but not liked unless his once decent sence has
burned out by his working with BPL
I'm supposed to be bowing to Dave's superior ability at splitting
hairs. I can only hope he didn't skin his knee.
I've split a few hares in my time.
Some think that's all you do.

I think that's only those of you who can't spell.

Dave, do you recall telling us about the relationship between spelling
and leadership, then you misspelled a word?

On Jan 30, 11:50 pm, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:

He's here when the bands are closed. That's all.

Careful about getting caught up in the factual errors. I worked quite a
number of Europeans on 160m the past four evenings.

Dave K8MN

Careful about getting caught up in your own catch-22s.

Did the DXer lower himself to working a contest? I recall one
notorious DXer saying that working DX in a Contest isn't DXing.

BTW, were you using your small loops to recieve?

wrote:
On Jan 30, 11:35 am, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
On Jan 30, 12:23 am, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
On Jan 29, 2:12 pm, wrote:
On 29 Jan 2007 03:45:35 wrote:
On Jan 29, 12:39 am, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
You gotta wonder which of the regulars are/were posting anonymously.
Really hair-brained stuff.
Hair-brained, was it?
Did your mom ever take the "hare brush" to you?
Dave K8MN
Do you think Ed Hare is back, posting anonymously?
could be I supose but not liked unless his once decent sence has
burned out by his working with BPL
I'm supposed to be bowing to Dave's superior ability at splitting
hairs. I can only hope he didn't skin his knee.
I've split a few hares in my time.
Some think that's all you do.
I think that's only those of you who can't spell.

Dave, do you recall telling us about the relationship between spelling
and leadership, then you misspelled a word?

I surely recall making that typo. Did you make a typo?

Dave K8MN

wrote:
On Jan 30, 11:50 pm, Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:

He's here when the bands are closed. That's all.
Careful about getting caught up in the factual errors. I worked quite a
number of Europeans on 160m the past four evenings.

Dave K8MN

Careful about getting caught up in your own catch-22s.

Did the DXer lower himself to working a contest? I recall one
notorious DXer saying that working DX in a Contest isn't DXing.

I hope you aren't going to try to attribute such a statement to me.
I never wrote any such thing. There's plenty of DX to be worked in a
contest. I've been contesting since before I ever chased DX.

BTW, were you using your small loops to recieve?

No.

Dave K8MN