""" I know the story, Jim.

Your posts here on the subject don't indicate that.

It's the same one in Vietnam. Only we fared just slightly better in
Korea.

Same mistakes.

(Korean history lesson snipped...But thatnks...)

You also avoid the hard questions."""

As does N2EY.

Regardless, its always good to hear about all of our mistakes from
someone on the safe side of the line. All that "real military
experience" gleaned from Academiatopia. Hi!

What's next?

"""It's ridiculous to think that the lack of GPS is the greater upper
arm than
any other mechanism for our failure in the world. Above, you'll see
references to the US banking system, the US stock market, the US
workforce,
the US companies that degrade our capabilities by putting people out of
work. By the way, look at the lack of shortage for doctors, nurses,
scientists, teachers, etc., that is being quickly ignored right now.
THOSE--not GPS--are greater threats to our security from foreign
measures
and "forces." (Forces that don't wear uniforms)."""

What failure in the world???

People are still flocking to our country to find a better life. As a
matter of fact, the flocking is completely out of control. To be fair
though, I have heard of a couple of gay couples fleeing to Canada to
escape the "opression" in the USA. And you claim we have a shortage of
doctors, nurses, scientists, teachers, etc, but it is not being
ignored. Congress is constantly upping the legal immigration of those
listed careers and ENGINEERS. And we educate untold thousands of
foreigners each years so that they can return home and uplift their own
countries, but then they stay here.

Why is that if we're such a failure in the world?

And this UN approval stuff??? Where does -that- come from? You think
we need the approval of France or Syria? Good grief, you're watching
too much TV, I guess.

I agree that we've got some problems, but when haven't we?

I think our hugest problem is: Illegal immigration driving down wages.
Hell, legal immigration drives down wages, too. Our media is crying
that we need to raise the minimum wage to ~?~ 7.00/hour. Why? That's
a whopping $14, 560/year. Americans won't work for that little, as
they can do absolutely nothing and get that much in welfare, food
stamps, and medicaid. If they're even smarter, they've figured out how
to be disabled and draw benefits. But illegal Mexican labor would be
happy to take $7/hour. And that money goes to slum lords or it goes
back across the border. Shut off the illegal labor, and those jobs
will rise to $9 and $10/hour. That's when the American worker begins
to get interested, and a working couple can hit $40K a year. There are
even GI-bill like programs (without risking hide nor hair) that allows
them home ownership with $0.00 down.

As a side benefit to curbing illegal immigration is homeland security
threat reduction, but we all know that's bogus and no one can harm
America, right?

Anyhow, welcome back to the group.

N2EY wrote:
In article ,
(Steve
Robeson K4YZ) writes:

Many of this Nation's problems today exist because we allow the
lowering
of almost every "standard" to the least common denominator, and that
includes
the manner in which we express ourselves.

Like the VP telling a reporter to "f!@# off".

If it's OK for him, why not for me?

I can't argue with a person bound and determined to lower himself
to the aforementioned lowest common denominator.

What a waste of education.

I am at work and will respond to the rest of the post later...
Steve, K4YZ

vegetable oil
2 large onions
bell pepper
celery
garlic
½ cup red wine
3 Irish potatoes
2 large carrots

This is a simple classic stew that makes natural gravy,
thus it does not have to be thickened.
Brown the meat quickly in very hot oil, remove and set aside.
Brown the onions, celery, pepper and garlic.
De-glaze with wine, return meat to the pan and season well.
Stew on low fire adding small amounts of water and
seasoning as necessary.
After at least half an hour, add the carrots and potatoes,
and simmer till root vegetables break with a fork.
Cook a fresh pot of long grained white rice.



Pre-mie Pot Pie

When working with prematurely delivered newborns (or chicken) use sherry;
red wine with beef (buy steak or roast, do not pre-boil).

Pie crust (see index)
Whole fresh pre-mie; eviscerated, head, hands and feet removed
Onions, bell pepper, celery
½ cup wine
Root vegetables of choice (turnips, carrots, potatoes, etc) cubed

Make a crust from scratch - or go shamefully to the frozen food section
of your favorite grocery and select 2 high quality pie crusts (you
will need one for the top also).
Boil the prepared delicacy until the meat starts to come off the bones.
Remove, de-bone and cube; continue to reduce the broth.
Brown the onions, peppers and celery.
Add the meat then season, continue browning.
De-glaze with sherry, add the reduced broth.
Finally, put in the root vegetables and simmer for 15 minutes.
Allow to cool slightly.
Place the pie pan in 375 degree oven for a few minutes so bottom crust is not soggy,
reduce oven to 325.
Fill the pie with stew, place top crust and with a fork, seal the crusts together

etc) cubed

Make a crust from scratch - or go shamefully to the frozen food section
of your favorite grocery and select 2 high quality pie crusts (you
will need one for the top also).
Boil the prepared delicacy until the meat starts to come off the bones.
Remove, de-bone and cube; continue to reduce the broth.
Brown the onions, peppers and celery.
Add the meat then season, continue browning.
De-glaze with sherry, add the reduced broth.
Finally, put in the root vegetables and simmer for 15 minutes.
Allow to cool slightly.
Place the pie pan in 375 degree oven for a few minutes so bottom crust is not soggy,
reduce oven to 325.
Fill the pie with stew, place top crust and with a fork, seal the crusts together
then poke holes in top.
Return to oven and bake for 30 minutes, or until pie crust is golden brown.



Sudden Infant Death Soup

SIDS: delicious in winter, comparable to old fashioned Beef and Vegetable Soup.
Its free, you can sell the crib, baby clothes, toys, stroller... and so easy to
procure if such a lucky find is at hand (just pick him up from the crib and
he?s good to go)!

SIDS victim, cleaned
½ cup cooking oil
Carrots
onions
broccoli
whole cabbage
fresh green beans
potato
turnip
celery
tomato
½ stick butter
1 cup cooked pasta (macaroni, shells, etc.)

Remove as much meat as possible, cube, and brown in hot oil.
Add a little water, season, then add the carcass.
Simmer for half an hour keeping the stock thick.
Remove the carcass and add the vegetables slowly to the stock,
so that it remains

"Steve Robeson K4YZ" wrote in message
...

YOU don't work for the president. Hans did. I did.


Steve? Are you referring to the military service of many men and women?
They don't "work" for the President, even in figurative terms. They work
for the defense of the United States of America--that means the *people*.
Literally and figuratively.

Don't you agree with that?


What I am saying, is that I find it embarrassing that two
gentlemen of
supposed education and respectability can't express themselves with more
dignity and professionalism.


But, you don't mean that dignity and professionalism would have to mean that
one would say they respect and agree with a President (or anyone else, for
that matter), correct?


What does his academic achievements or lack of have to do with YOUR
use of
profanity or conduct in a open forum, Jim?


Oh, I see...somewhere along the way someone has used some sort of *GASP* bad
word, and now that is what this thread is all about. Well, Hell, then, I'm
out of it...

73/88, Steve! Kim W5TIT

Subject: K0HB Supports Common Sense...NOT!
From: "Kim"
Date: 12/27/2004 6:46 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

"Steve Robeson K4YZ" wrote in message
...

YOU don't work for the president. Hans did. I did.


Steve? Are you referring to the military service of many men and women?
They don't "work" for the President, even in figurative terms. They work
for the defense of the United States of America--that means the *people*.
Literally and figuratively.

Don't you agree with that?

Nope.

"The people" are not in direct control of the Armed Forces. The
President, SecDef, the JCS, and a string of General Officers, on down to the
platoon commanders, are.

Congress, hence "the people" has definite control over long term decisons
the above named persons make, however all it takes is the right "word" from any
of them to move those troopers as needed, the "people's" immediate consent or
dissent notwithstanding.

What I am saying, is that I find it embarrassing that two
gentlemen of
supposed education and respectability can't express themselves with more
dignity and professionalism.


But, you don't mean that dignity and professionalism would have to mean that
one would say they respect and agree with a President (or anyone else, for
that matter), correct?

What does his academic achievements or lack of have to do with YOUR
use of
profanity or conduct in a open forum, Jim?


Oh, I see...somewhere along the way someone has used some sort of *GASP* bad
word, and now that is what this thread is all about. Well, Hell, then, I'm
out of it...

Just trying to poke a very large stick into the ribs of those who at once
decry my aggressive stance with Lennie, Brian, et al, but then go right on
ahead and help lower that denominator themsleves, seemingly impervious to the
same criticism.

Good to "see ya", Kim!

88

Steve, K4YZ

Kim wrote:
"Steve Robeson K4YZ" wrote in message
...

YOU don't work for the president. Hans did. I did.

Steve? Are you referring to the military service of many men and
women?
They don't "work" for the President, even in figurative terms. They
work
for the defense of the United States of America--that means the
*people*.
Literally and figuratively.

Don't you agree with that?

The president is also the Commander-in-Chief of all US military forces.
Not just figuratively but literally - each and every branch of the
national military reports to the president. So anyone who has served in
the Army, Navy, Air Force, Marines or Coast Guard has literally "worked
for the president" who was in office at the time.

What I am saying, is that I find it embarrassing that two
gentlemen of
supposed education and respectability can't express themselves with
more
dignity and professionalism.

But, you don't mean that dignity and professionalism would have to
mean that
one would say they respect and agree with a President (or anyone
else, for
that matter), correct?

Steve took exception to my use of a common term for bovine excrement in
a post some time back. I pointed out to him that Our Illustrious Vice
President Richard Cheney had used an even more offensive term when
speaking to a persistent reporter - in public.

Seems to me that I'm expected (by Steve) to behave to a higher standard
of public verbal expression than the VP. IOW, it's ok for *him* to tell
a reporter to "#@#$ off" but not ok for me to say that a statement is
"b@#$%$(t".

Double standard? You decide.

What does his academic achievements or lack of have to do with YOUR
use of
profanity or conduct in a open forum, Jim?

Oh, I see...somewhere along the way someone has used some sort of
*GASP* bad
word, and now that is what this thread is all about.

Apparently, my BSEE and MSEE somehow preclude my use of the above word
here, but VP Cheney's education does not preclude his use of far more
offensive words in public.

To Steve, anyway.

73 de Jim, N2EY