"Dee D. Flint" wrote in message
gy.com...
OK Bert, show me where it says that Part 97 mandates public service.
There
is nothing in this quote to that effect.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

Sorry about that, Dee.

While the following is not an actual part of Part 97, I feel it means
something...especially since we were all issued a reminder by a very high
profile FCC employee directly responsible for an aspect of the ARS.

THE AMATEUR'S CREED


The Radio Amateur is:

CONSIDERATE---never knowingly operates in such a way as to lessen the
pleasure of others.

LOYAL---offers loyalty, encouragement and support to other amateur, local
clubs, and the American Radio Relay League, through which Amateur Radio in
the United States is represented nationally and internationally.

PROGRESSIVE---with knowledge abreast of science, a well-built and efficient
station and operation above reproach.

FRIENDLY---slow and patient operating when requested, friendly advice and
counsel to the beginner, kindly assistance, cooperation and consideration
for the interests of others. These are the hallmarks of the amateur spirit.

BALANCED---radio is an avocation, never interfering with duties owed to
family, job, school, or community.

PATRIOTIC---station and skill always ready for service to country and
community.

(Paul M. Segal, W9EEA wrote the original Amateurs Code, in 1928


The PATRIOTIC description pretty much sums it up.

73 de Bert
WA2SI

"Dwight Stewart" wrote in message
.net...
"Dee D. Flint" wrote:

"Dwight Stewart" wrote
Okay, Dee, show me where I said
Amateurs "must" do public service.

your words we

"...There is nothing in part 95 that
mandates public service like that
found in part 97."

tr.v. man·dat·ed, man·dat·ing, man·dates
1. To assign (a colony or territory) to
a specified nation under a mandate.
2. To make mandatory, as by law;
decree or requi mandated
desegregation of public schools.

The way you have used the word
conforms to usage number 2. Therefore,
you have stated that public service is
required even though that may not be
what you meant to say.


I don't have time to waste on this, Dee. You know what Part 97 says, and
what it means (and therefore what I meant). A more complete definition of
"mandate" is...

Noun: mandate ('man'deyt)
1. A document giving an official instruction or command
2. A territory surrendered by Turkey or Germany after World War I and
inhabited by people not yet able to stand by themselves and so put under
the
tutelage of some other European power
3. (politics) the commission that is given to a government and its
policies through an electoral victory

Verb: mandate (man'deyt)
1. Assign under a mandate; of nations
2. Assign authority to

I used mandate in the context that Part 97 assigns authority to Ham
radio
operators to perform public service through ARES, community organizations,
and so on. There is nothing like that in Part 95. Obviously, there is
nothing in "assigns authority to" that is required.



Your usage is still incorrect. There is nothing in Part 97 that assigns
authority to hams to do public service either. I've read part 97 from
beginning to end. Also there was no reason to include noun definitions when
working with the verb.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

"Bert Craig" wrote in message
.net...
"Dee D. Flint" wrote in message
gy.com...
OK Bert, show me where it says that Part 97 mandates public service.
There
is nothing in this quote to that effect.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

Sorry about that, Dee.

While the following is not an actual part of Part 97, I feel it means
something...especially since we were all issued a reminder by a very high
profile FCC employee directly responsible for an aspect of the ARS.

THE AMATEUR'S CREED


The Radio Amateur is:

CONSIDERATE---never knowingly operates in such a way as to lessen the
pleasure of others.

LOYAL---offers loyalty, encouragement and support to other amateur, local
clubs, and the American Radio Relay League, through which Amateur Radio in
the United States is represented nationally and internationally.

PROGRESSIVE---with knowledge abreast of science, a well-built and
efficient
station and operation above reproach.

FRIENDLY---slow and patient operating when requested, friendly advice and
counsel to the beginner, kindly assistance, cooperation and consideration
for the interests of others. These are the hallmarks of the amateur
spirit.

BALANCED---radio is an avocation, never interfering with duties owed to
family, job, school, or community.

PATRIOTIC---station and skill always ready for service to country and
community.

(Paul M. Segal, W9EEA wrote the original Amateurs Code, in 1928


The PATRIOTIC description pretty much sums it up.

73 de Bert
WA2SI


Oh I definitely agree that part of being a ham is doing public service. It
is just that there is a big difference between should and must.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

"N2EY" wrote in message
...

btw, we *don't* test all hams for Morse skill now.

Rephrased then... we DO test all hams that have or want a license
to operate HF for morse skill... but hey, maybe we should
reinstitute waivers again since the treaty is no longer
mandating the 5 wpm which the FCC never waivered before.

Cheers,
Bill K2UNK

"N2EY" wrote


How much Spanish do you hear on the ham bands being used by US hams?


A lot.

Happy Y3K, de Hans, K0HB

"Dee D. Flint" wrote:

Also please let me know which
dictionary you are using. (snip)


Princeton University's WordNet...

http://www.cogsci.princeton.edu/~wn/

Click on "Use WordNet Online," enter "mandate," and scroll down to the
verbs.


(snip) I've checked several and
for the verb meaning your number
2 does not appear.


Then you should perhaps find a better dictionary. WordNet is an online
lexical (dictionary) reference system developed by the Cognitive Science
Laboratory at Princeton University. The project was funded in part by a
grant from the National Science Foundation and has been reviewed positively
by linguistics researchers at MIT, Yale, Cambridge, Oxford, and numerous
other universities.


Language is a tool that must be used
correctly to convey the intended
meaning. One should never operate
on the basis that "you know what I
mean" as sooner or later that gets a
person in trouble.


Thanks for the lecture, Dee. However, I used the correct word for the
intended meaning.


Dwight Stewart (W5NET)

http://www.qsl.net/w5net/

"Dee D. Flint" wrote:

Your usage is still incorrect. There
is nothing in Part 97 that assigns
authority to hams to do public
service either. I've read part 97
from beginning to end. (snip)


Then you either cannot read or cannot understand what you've read.
Regardless, if you truly feel Part 97 does not authorize us to do public
service, then I simply don't have the time to convince you otherwise.


Dwight Stewart (W5NET)

http://www.qsl.net/w5net/

In article , Mike Coslo writes:

N2EY wrote:
In article t, "KØHB"
writes:


"N2EY" wrote


So when you gonna send that proposal to the FCC?

I already did (as you knew perfectly well).


But only as a comment to another's proposal, not as a stand-alone petition.



Hopefully Hans has a ready supply of replies for the FCC to use when
people comment on his petition.

So far, Hans has sent in his ideas only as a comment to others' petitions and
proposals, Mike. He hasn't sent FCC a petition or proposal to FCC.

It just won't seem right to comment on
it there without being called stupid...oops, I mean novel! ;^)

I think that if Hans was really serious about his proposal, he'd send it off to
FCC just like the other 14 petitioners recently did. I say this because it is
highly doubtful that the major and unique features of his proposal would be
adopted by any other group such as ARRL, NCVEC, or NCI. It is also highly
doubtful that his proposal, when submitted as a comment, would have nearly so
much effect nor gather nearly so much attention as if submitted as a proposal.

If and when Hans did submit it as a petition, FCC would then most probably
assign it an RM number and take comments and reply comments on it. Which I
sense is a process that Hans wants to avoid, because there are bound to be both
supporting and opposing comments. It would be fascinating to see the
reactions....

But it's Hans ideas and therefore his call as to whetehr to submit it or not.

73 de Jim, N2EY

"KØHB" wrote in message
ink.net...

"N2EY" wrote


How much Spanish do you hear on the ham bands being used by US hams?


A lot.

Happy Y3K, de Hans, K0HB

Most of the Spanish I hear are Mexican, Central American, and South American
hams not US hams.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

"Dwight Stewart" wrote in message
news
"Dee D. Flint" wrote:

Also please let me know which
dictionary you are using. (snip)


Princeton University's WordNet...

http://www.cogsci.princeton.edu/~wn/

Click on "Use WordNet Online," enter "mandate," and scroll down to the
verbs.


(snip) I've checked several and
for the verb meaning your number
2 does not appear.


Then you should perhaps find a better dictionary. WordNet is an online
lexical (dictionary) reference system developed by the Cognitive Science
Laboratory at Princeton University. The project was funded in part by a
grant from the National Science Foundation and has been reviewed
positively
by linguistics researchers at MIT, Yale, Cambridge, Oxford, and numerous
other universities.


Merriam Webster is a well respected source as are the others that I checked.

However, here you go and Part 97 does NONE of these. Your usage is still
incorrect.

http://www.cogsci.princeton.edu/cgi-...mandate&posnum
ber=2&searchtypenumber=2&senses=&showglosses=1

Results for "Synonyms, ordered by estimated frequency" search of verb
"mandate"


3 senses of mandate

Sense 1
mandate -- (assign under a mandate; "mandate a colony")
= delegate, designate, depute, assign -- (give an assignment to (a
person) to a post, or assign a task to (a person))

Sense 2
mandate -- (make mandatory; "the new director of the schoolbaord mandated
regular tests")
= order, prescribe, dictate -- (issue commands or orders for)

Sense 3
mandate -- (assign authority to)
= delegate, designate, depute, assign -- (give an assignment to (a
person) to a post, or assign a task to (a person))


Even sense 3 would be a requirement as when one is given an assignment, you
are supposed to carry that assigment. It is not just a suggestion or
desireable activity. If a person or group does not carry through on an
assignment, then that assignment is given to a group who will.

I repeat, Part 97 does NOT mandate in any way shape or form that amateurs
participate in public service.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE