| Home |
| Search |
| Today's Posts |
|
#152
February 19th 04, 02:11 AM
|
|||
|
|||
In article ,
(Brian Kelly) writes: (N2EY) wrote in message ... In article , (Brian Kelly) writes: "Phil Kane" wrote in message The ultimate class is the GG-1. Someday one will run again..... I went up the guy and asked him if they'd lost their map of the AMTRAK lines or what, Primos is *not* hardly AMTRAK country, right?. Wrong. Daily wee-hours AMTRAK Ballast train. I coulda told ya THAT! I remember walking between 30th Street station in Philly and classes at Penn, and passing under the elevated freight line west of the station while GG-1 pulled trains went overhead. One could look up and see the underside of the train as it went overhead... . . . ya peeping Tom . . ! Got to see all her axles and the quill drive, too..... There are others in museums but those are the best known. 16 of 'em are still out there. Meaning in museums. Which is good, because they're being taken care of. In the 1970s there was a lot of talk about converting the original 11 kV 25 Hz catenary system to 25 kV 60 Hz. Conversion of the older units with their AC traction motors would have been impractical. However, research showed that the NHRR folks who had chosen 11 kV 25 Hz back around the turn of the 19th century knew what they were doing. Changing to 25 kV 60 Hz would have meant increasing clearances at every overpass and tunnel, changing every single insulator in the catenary structure, replacement of every existing substation and installation of at least as many new ones. Plus complete replacement of the signal and electrification system components connected to the track. Simply cost too much and the ROI wasn't there. By the time all this was figured out, the decision to phase out the older equipment had proceeded too far to economically stop. Although capable of 100+ MPH, newer equipment such as the AEM-7 family of rectifier locos could do over 125 MPH, and the new Acela trainsets over 150 MPH, so the die was cast. Further proof of my contention that they never oughta let you damned sparkies anywhere near the railroads. Without us there'd be no Penn Station, no Grand Central, no subway, no Hudson Tubes... but that's apparently not the case, the changeover never happened so operating a GG-1 should still be possible. *IF* they can replace the original PCB-laced transformer oil to an oil which is not as toxic. Actually all of the ones that went to museums had their main transformers removed for the obvious reason. But then they didn't all go to museums did they? Hmmm? One of those might run again. The ones that didn't go to museums were scrapped. Tin cans and house wiring now. The biggest problem would be getting a custom made replacement transformer. Let's see, 4620 x 746 equals about 3500 kVA at 25 Hz - that's a bit larger than the weenie little things used in radio, even "professional" radio. WLW ran 500,000 kVA *OUT*. Plus it had 250,000 kVA worth of modulation xfmrs. No it didn't. WLW ran 500 kW - 500,000 WATTS, not kilowatts. The motors on just one axle of a GG-1 do more than that. And there are six powered axles. It is quite possible that a GG-1 that has been kept indoors could get a new transformer and run again. The main problem is that it's doubtful that any of the electrified railroads left would want a one-of-a-kind unit. It ain't the railroads which run the museum pieces, it's the museums which run 'em. Steamtown, etc. All that's needed is one near some energized wire. ahh, to hear the "duck call" air horn go by at over 100 mph once again... The call of the Ruptured Duck . . Ugliest sound to ever come off the rails until the diesels trumped the GG-1. The rumble/whine of a pair of SD-45s (each rated 3600 Hp with turbocharged 20 cylinder diesel) pulling an intermodal at 79 mph along the Water Level Route.... When was the last time YOU heard a steam whistle played in PRR revenue service like I did? Couple years back when the Strasburg ran an excursion down the Main Line to 30th Street and back. Their two steamers are ex-Pennsy, they were in Pennsy colors and on Pennsy track. Plus they were hauling revenue passengers. Thought so . . When's the last time you were *inside* a GG-1 - not in a museum? Thought so... Oddly enough, above the truck level inside a GG-1 there's not much other than the main transformer and the center cab. The slopin ends are mostly empty space - coupla traction motor blowers, and the steam generator, but not much else. Low envter of gravity. The GG-1 is a great niche piece but that's all it ever was compared with the steamers. One could even say that all any electrics did was move the steam boiler off the wheels and into the power plant... Snippts by recognized authorities on the subject: In 1914 the Pennsylvania Railroad built, what many people believe to be, one of the most famous Locomotives to have ever roamed the rails, the K4 Class 4-6-2 Pacific. It was so successful that the Pennsy had 424 more built. Oh yes, no argument, they built 'em in Altoona as I recall and used 'em for everything. K4s #3678 - This is one of 4 K4s's that was Streamlined in 1940 with the help of Industrial Artist Raymond Loewy. Still not as cool looking as the J-3 Hudsons on the Water Level Route, scooping water from the Tivoli pans at 100+ MPH. (Of course water scoops were perfected by the PRR and copied by Vanderbilt's little collection of branch lines). Or as ungodly powerful as a UP Big Boy or even a Niagara. Another thing PRR pioneered was radio on the RRs, starting with the inductive trainphone system *before* VHF FM radio was used on the rails... 73 de Jim, N2EY |
|
#153
February 19th 04, 02:20 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
In article ,
(Brian Kelly) writes: (N2EY) wrote in message ... In article , (Brian Kelly) writes: "Phil Kane" wrote in message The ultimate class is the GG-1. Someday one will run again..... I went up the guy and asked him if they'd lost their map of the AMTRAK lines or what, Primos is *not* hardly AMTRAK country, right?. Wrong. Daily wee-hours AMTRAK Ballast train. I coulda told ya THAT! I remember walking between 30th Street station in Philly and classes at Penn, and passing under the elevated freight line west of the station while GG-1 pulled trains went overhead. One could look up and see the underside of the train as it went overhead... . . . ya peeping Tom . . ! Got to see all her axles and the quill drive, too..... There are others in museums but those are the best known. 16 of 'em are still out there. Meaning in museums. Which is good, because they're being taken care of. In the 1970s there was a lot of talk about converting the original 11 kV 25 Hz catenary system to 25 kV 60 Hz. Conversion of the older units with their AC traction motors would have been impractical. However, research showed that the NHRR folks who had chosen 11 kV 25 Hz back around the turn of the 19th century knew what they were doing. Changing to 25 kV 60 Hz would have meant increasing clearances at every overpass and tunnel, changing every single insulator in the catenary structure, replacement of every existing substation and installation of at least as many new ones. Plus complete replacement of the signal and electrification system components connected to the track. Simply cost too much and the ROI wasn't there. By the time all this was figured out, the decision to phase out the older equipment had proceeded too far to economically stop. Although capable of 100+ MPH, newer equipment such as the AEM-7 family of rectifier locos could do over 125 MPH, and the new Acela trainsets over 150 MPH, so the die was cast. Further proof of my contention that they never oughta let you damned sparkies anywhere near the railroads. Without us there'd be no Penn Station, no Grand Central, no subway, no Hudson Tubes... but that's apparently not the case, the changeover never happened so operating a GG-1 should still be possible. *IF* they can replace the original PCB-laced transformer oil to an oil which is not as toxic. Actually all of the ones that went to museums had their main transformers removed for the obvious reason. But then they didn't all go to museums did they? Hmmm? One of those might run again. The ones that didn't go to museums were scrapped. Tin cans and house wiring now. The biggest problem would be getting a custom made replacement transformer. Let's see, 4620 x 746 equals about 3500 kVA at 25 Hz - that's a bit larger than the weenie little things used in radio, even "professional" radio. WLW ran 500,000 kVA *OUT*. Plus it had 250,000 kVA worth of modulation xfmrs. No it didn't. WLW ran 500 kW - 500,000 WATTS, not kilowatts. The motors on just one axle of a GG-1 do more than that. And there are six powered axles. It is quite possible that a GG-1 that has been kept indoors could get a new transformer and run again. The main problem is that it's doubtful that any of the electrified railroads left would want a one-of-a-kind unit. It ain't the railroads which run the museum pieces, it's the museums which run 'em. Steamtown, etc. All that's needed is one near some energized wire. ahh, to hear the "duck call" air horn go by at over 100 mph once again... The call of the Ruptured Duck . . Ugliest sound to ever come off the rails until the diesels trumped the GG-1. The rumble/whine of a pair of SD-45s (each rated 3600 Hp with turbocharged 20 cylinder diesel) pulling an intermodal at 79 mph along the Water Level Route.... When was the last time YOU heard a steam whistle played in PRR revenue service like I did? Couple years back when the Strasburg ran an excursion down the Main Line to 30th Street and back. Their two steamers are ex-Pennsy, they were in Pennsy colors and on Pennsy track. Plus they were hauling revenue passengers. Thought so . . When's the last time you were *inside* a GG-1 - not in a museum? Thought so... Oddly enough, above the truck level inside a GG-1 there's not much other than the main transformer and the center cab. The slopin ends are mostly empty space - coupla traction motor blowers, and the steam generator, but not much else. Low envter of gravity. The GG-1 is a great niche piece but that's all it ever was compared with the steamers. One could even say that all any electrics did was move the steam boiler off the wheels and into the power plant... Snippts by recognized authorities on the subject: In 1914 the Pennsylvania Railroad built, what many people believe to be, one of the most famous Locomotives to have ever roamed the rails, the K4 Class 4-6-2 Pacific. It was so successful that the Pennsy had 424 more built. Oh yes, no argument, they built 'em in Altoona as I recall and used 'em for everything. K4s #3678 - This is one of 4 K4s's that was Streamlined in 1940 with the help of Industrial Artist Raymond Loewy. Still not as cool looking as the J-3 Hudsons on the Water Level Route, scooping water from the Tivoli pans at 100+ MPH. (Of course water scoops were perfected by the PRR and copied by Vanderbilt's little collection of branch lines). Or as ungodly powerful as a UP Big Boy or even a Niagara. Another thing PRR pioneered was radio on the RRs, starting with the inductive trainphone system *before* VHF FM radio was used on the rails... 73 de Jim, N2EY |
|
#154
February 19th 04, 02:46 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
In article ,
(Brian Kelly) writes: (N2EY) wrote in message ... In article , (Brian Kelly) writes: "Phil Kane" wrote in message The ultimate class is the GG-1. Someday one will run again..... I went up the guy and asked him if they'd lost their map of the AMTRAK lines or what, Primos is *not* hardly AMTRAK country, right?. Wrong. Daily wee-hours AMTRAK Ballast train. I coulda told ya THAT! I remember walking between 30th Street station in Philly and classes at Penn, and passing under the elevated freight line west of the station while GG-1 pulled trains went overhead. One could look up and see the underside of the train as it went overhead... . . . ya peeping Tom . . ! Got to see all her axles and the quill drive, too..... There are others in museums but those are the best known. 16 of 'em are still out there. Meaning in museums. Which is good, because they're being taken care of. In the 1970s there was a lot of talk about converting the original 11 kV 25 Hz catenary system to 25 kV 60 Hz. Conversion of the older units with their AC traction motors would have been impractical. However, research showed that the NHRR folks who had chosen 11 kV 25 Hz back around the turn of the 19th century knew what they were doing. Changing to 25 kV 60 Hz would have meant increasing clearances at every overpass and tunnel, changing every single insulator in the catenary structure, replacement of every existing substation and installation of at least as many new ones. Plus complete replacement of the signal and electrification system components connected to the track. Simply cost too much and the ROI wasn't there. By the time all this was figured out, the decision to phase out the older equipment had proceeded too far to economically stop. Although capable of 100+ MPH, newer equipment such as the AEM-7 family of rectifier locos could do over 125 MPH, and the new Acela trainsets over 150 MPH, so the die was cast. Further proof of my contention that they never oughta let you damned sparkies anywhere near the railroads. Without us there'd be no Penn Station, no Grand Central, no subway, no Hudson Tubes... but that's apparently not the case, the changeover never happened so operating a GG-1 should still be possible. *IF* they can replace the original PCB-laced transformer oil to an oil which is not as toxic. Actually all of the ones that went to museums had their main transformers removed for the obvious reason. But then they didn't all go to museums did they? Hmmm? One of those might run again. The ones that didn't go to museums were scrapped. Tin cans and house wiring now. The biggest problem would be getting a custom made replacement transformer. Let's see, 4620 x 746 equals about 3500 kVA at 25 Hz - that's a bit larger than the weenie little things used in radio, even "professional" radio. WLW ran 500,000 kVA *OUT*. Plus it had 250,000 kVA worth of modulation xfmrs. No it didn't. WLW ran 500 kW - 500,000 WATTS, not kilowatts. The motors on just one axle of a GG-1 do more than that. And there are six powered axles. It is quite possible that a GG-1 that has been kept indoors could get a new transformer and run again. The main problem is that it's doubtful that any of the electrified railroads left would want a one-of-a-kind unit. It ain't the railroads which run the museum pieces, it's the museums which run 'em. Steamtown, etc. All that's needed is one near some energized wire. ahh, to hear the "duck call" air horn go by at over 100 mph once again... The call of the Ruptured Duck . . Ugliest sound to ever come off the rails until the diesels trumped the GG-1. The rumble/whine of a pair of SD-45s (each rated 3600 Hp with turbocharged 20 cylinder diesel) pulling an intermodal at 79 mph along the Water Level Route.... When was the last time YOU heard a steam whistle played in PRR revenue service like I did? Couple years back when the Strasburg ran an excursion down the Main Line to 30th Street and back. Their two steamers are ex-Pennsy, they were in Pennsy colors and on Pennsy track. Plus they were hauling revenue passengers. Thought so . . When's the last time you were *inside* a GG-1 - not in a museum? Thought so... Oddly enough, above the truck level inside a GG-1 there's not much other than the main transformer and the center cab. The slopin ends are mostly empty space - coupla traction motor blowers, and the steam generator, but not much else. Low envter of gravity. The GG-1 is a great niche piece but that's all it ever was compared with the steamers. One could even say that all any electrics did was move the steam boiler off the wheels and into the power plant... Snippts by recognized authorities on the subject: In 1914 the Pennsylvania Railroad built, what many people believe to be, one of the most famous Locomotives to have ever roamed the rails, the K4 Class 4-6-2 Pacific. It was so successful that the Pennsy had 424 more built. Oh yes, no argument, they built 'em in Altoona as I recall and used 'em for everything. K4s #3678 - This is one of 4 K4s's that was Streamlined in 1940 with the help of Industrial Artist Raymond Loewy. Still not as cool looking as the J-3 Hudsons on the Water Level Route, scooping water from the Tivoli pans at 100+ MPH. (Of course water scoops were perfected by the PRR and copied by Vanderbilt's little collection of branch lines). Or as ungodly powerful as a UP Big Boy or even a Niagara. Another thing PRR pioneered was radio on the RRs, starting with the inductive trainphone system *before* VHF FM radio was used on the rails... 73 de Jim, N2EY |
|
#155
February 19th 04, 02:49 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
In article ,
(Brian Kelly) writes: (N2EY) wrote in message ... In article , (Brian Kelly) writes: "Phil Kane" wrote in message The ultimate class is the GG-1. Someday one will run again..... I went up the guy and asked him if they'd lost their map of the AMTRAK lines or what, Primos is *not* hardly AMTRAK country, right?. Wrong. Daily wee-hours AMTRAK Ballast train. I coulda told ya THAT! I remember walking between 30th Street station in Philly and classes at Penn, and passing under the elevated freight line west of the station while GG-1 pulled trains went overhead. One could look up and see the underside of the train as it went overhead... . . . ya peeping Tom . . ! Got to see all her axles and the quill drive, too..... There are others in museums but those are the best known. 16 of 'em are still out there. Meaning in museums. Which is good, because they're being taken care of. In the 1970s there was a lot of talk about converting the original 11 kV 25 Hz catenary system to 25 kV 60 Hz. Conversion of the older units with their AC traction motors would have been impractical. However, research showed that the NHRR folks who had chosen 11 kV 25 Hz back around the turn of the 19th century knew what they were doing. Changing to 25 kV 60 Hz would have meant increasing clearances at every overpass and tunnel, changing every single insulator in the catenary structure, replacement of every existing substation and installation of at least as many new ones. Plus complete replacement of the signal and electrification system components connected to the track. Simply cost too much and the ROI wasn't there. By the time all this was figured out, the decision to phase out the older equipment had proceeded too far to economically stop. Although capable of 100+ MPH, newer equipment such as the AEM-7 family of rectifier locos could do over 125 MPH, and the new Acela trainsets over 150 MPH, so the die was cast. Further proof of my contention that they never oughta let you damned sparkies anywhere near the railroads. Without us there'd be no Penn Station, no Grand Central, no subway, no Hudson Tubes... but that's apparently not the case, the changeover never happened so operating a GG-1 should still be possible. *IF* they can replace the original PCB-laced transformer oil to an oil which is not as toxic. Actually all of the ones that went to museums had their main transformers removed for the obvious reason. But then they didn't all go to museums did they? Hmmm? One of those might run again. The ones that didn't go to museums were scrapped. Tin cans and house wiring now. The biggest problem would be getting a custom made replacement transformer. Let's see, 4620 x 746 equals about 3500 kVA at 25 Hz - that's a bit larger than the weenie little things used in radio, even "professional" radio. WLW ran 500,000 kVA *OUT*. Plus it had 250,000 kVA worth of modulation xfmrs. No it didn't. WLW ran 500 kW - 500,000 WATTS, not kilowatts. The motors on just one axle of a GG-1 do more than that. And there are six powered axles. It is quite possible that a GG-1 that has been kept indoors could get a new transformer and run again. The main problem is that it's doubtful that any of the electrified railroads left would want a one-of-a-kind unit. It ain't the railroads which run the museum pieces, it's the museums which run 'em. Steamtown, etc. All that's needed is one near some energized wire. ahh, to hear the "duck call" air horn go by at over 100 mph once again... The call of the Ruptured Duck . . Ugliest sound to ever come off the rails until the diesels trumped the GG-1. The rumble/whine of a pair of SD-45s (each rated 3600 Hp with turbocharged 20 cylinder diesel) pulling an intermodal at 79 mph along the Water Level Route.... When was the last time YOU heard a steam whistle played in PRR revenue service like I did? Couple years back when the Strasburg ran an excursion down the Main Line to 30th Street and back. Their two steamers are ex-Pennsy, they were in Pennsy colors and on Pennsy track. Plus they were hauling revenue passengers. Thought so . . When's the last time you were *inside* a GG-1 - not in a museum? Thought so... Oddly enough, above the truck level inside a GG-1 there's not much other than the main transformer and the center cab. The slopin ends are mostly empty space - coupla traction motor blowers, and the steam generator, but not much else. Low envter of gravity. The GG-1 is a great niche piece but that's all it ever was compared with the steamers. One could even say that all any electrics did was move the steam boiler off the wheels and into the power plant... Snippts by recognized authorities on the subject: In 1914 the Pennsylvania Railroad built, what many people believe to be, one of the most famous Locomotives to have ever roamed the rails, the K4 Class 4-6-2 Pacific. It was so successful that the Pennsy had 424 more built. Oh yes, no argument, they built 'em in Altoona as I recall and used 'em for everything. K4s #3678 - This is one of 4 K4s's that was Streamlined in 1940 with the help of Industrial Artist Raymond Loewy. Still not as cool looking as the J-3 Hudsons on the Water Level Route, scooping water from the Tivoli pans at 100+ MPH. (Of course water scoops were perfected by the PRR and copied by Vanderbilt's little collection of branch lines). Or as ungodly powerful as a UP Big Boy or even a Niagara. Another thing PRR pioneered was radio on the RRs, starting with the inductive trainphone system *before* VHF FM radio was used on the rails... 73 de Jim, N2EY |
|
#156
February 19th 04, 03:21 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
In article ,
(Brian Kelly) writes: (N2EY) wrote in message ... In article , (Brian Kelly) writes: "Phil Kane" wrote in message The ultimate class is the GG-1. Someday one will run again..... I went up the guy and asked him if they'd lost their map of the AMTRAK lines or what, Primos is *not* hardly AMTRAK country, right?. Wrong. Daily wee-hours AMTRAK Ballast train. I coulda told ya THAT! I remember walking between 30th Street station in Philly and classes at Penn, and passing under the elevated freight line west of the station while GG-1 pulled trains went overhead. One could look up and see the underside of the train as it went overhead... . . . ya peeping Tom . . ! Got to see all her axles and the quill drive, too..... There are others in museums but those are the best known. 16 of 'em are still out there. Meaning in museums. Which is good, because they're being taken care of. In the 1970s there was a lot of talk about converting the original 11 kV 25 Hz catenary system to 25 kV 60 Hz. Conversion of the older units with their AC traction motors would have been impractical. However, research showed that the NHRR folks who had chosen 11 kV 25 Hz back around the turn of the 19th century knew what they were doing. Changing to 25 kV 60 Hz would have meant increasing clearances at every overpass and tunnel, changing every single insulator in the catenary structure, replacement of every existing substation and installation of at least as many new ones. Plus complete replacement of the signal and electrification system components connected to the track. Simply cost too much and the ROI wasn't there. By the time all this was figured out, the decision to phase out the older equipment had proceeded too far to economically stop. Although capable of 100+ MPH, newer equipment such as the AEM-7 family of rectifier locos could do over 125 MPH, and the new Acela trainsets over 150 MPH, so the die was cast. Further proof of my contention that they never oughta let you damned sparkies anywhere near the railroads. Without us there'd be no Penn Station, no Grand Central, no subway, no Hudson Tubes... but that's apparently not the case, the changeover never happened so operating a GG-1 should still be possible. *IF* they can replace the original PCB-laced transformer oil to an oil which is not as toxic. Actually all of the ones that went to museums had their main transformers removed for the obvious reason. But then they didn't all go to museums did they? Hmmm? One of those might run again. The ones that didn't go to museums were scrapped. Tin cans and house wiring now. The biggest problem would be getting a custom made replacement transformer. Let's see, 4620 x 746 equals about 3500 kVA at 25 Hz - that's a bit larger than the weenie little things used in radio, even "professional" radio. WLW ran 500,000 kVA *OUT*. Plus it had 250,000 kVA worth of modulation xfmrs. No it didn't. WLW ran 500 kW - 500,000 WATTS, not kilowatts. The motors on just one axle of a GG-1 do more than that. And there are six powered axles. It is quite possible that a GG-1 that has been kept indoors could get a new transformer and run again. The main problem is that it's doubtful that any of the electrified railroads left would want a one-of-a-kind unit. It ain't the railroads which run the museum pieces, it's the museums which run 'em. Steamtown, etc. All that's needed is one near some energized wire. ahh, to hear the "duck call" air horn go by at over 100 mph once again... The call of the Ruptured Duck . . Ugliest sound to ever come off the rails until the diesels trumped the GG-1. The rumble/whine of a pair of SD-45s (each rated 3600 Hp with turbocharged 20 cylinder diesel) pulling an intermodal at 79 mph along the Water Level Route.... When was the last time YOU heard a steam whistle played in PRR revenue service like I did? Couple years back when the Strasburg ran an excursion down the Main Line to 30th Street and back. Their two steamers are ex-Pennsy, they were in Pennsy colors and on Pennsy track. Plus they were hauling revenue passengers. Thought so . . When's the last time you were *inside* a GG-1 - not in a museum? Thought so... Oddly enough, above the truck level inside a GG-1 there's not much other than the main transformer and the center cab. The slopin ends are mostly empty space - coupla traction motor blowers, and the steam generator, but not much else. Low envter of gravity. The GG-1 is a great niche piece but that's all it ever was compared with the steamers. One could even say that all any electrics did was move the steam boiler off the wheels and into the power plant... Snippts by recognized authorities on the subject: In 1914 the Pennsylvania Railroad built, what many people believe to be, one of the most famous Locomotives to have ever roamed the rails, the K4 Class 4-6-2 Pacific. It was so successful that the Pennsy had 424 more built. Oh yes, no argument, they built 'em in Altoona as I recall and used 'em for everything. K4s #3678 - This is one of 4 K4s's that was Streamlined in 1940 with the help of Industrial Artist Raymond Loewy. Still not as cool looking as the J-3 Hudsons on the Water Level Route, scooping water from the Tivoli pans at 100+ MPH. (Of course water scoops were perfected by the PRR and copied by Vanderbilt's little collection of branch lines). Or as ungodly powerful as a UP Big Boy or even a Niagara. Another thing PRR pioneered was radio on the RRs, starting with the inductive trainphone system *before* VHF FM radio was used on the rails... 73 de Jim, N2EY |
|
#157
February 19th 04, 03:59 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
In article ,
(Brian Kelly) writes: (N2EY) wrote in message ... In article , (Brian Kelly) writes: "Phil Kane" wrote in message The ultimate class is the GG-1. Someday one will run again..... I went up the guy and asked him if they'd lost their map of the AMTRAK lines or what, Primos is *not* hardly AMTRAK country, right?. Wrong. Daily wee-hours AMTRAK Ballast train. I coulda told ya THAT! I remember walking between 30th Street station in Philly and classes at Penn, and passing under the elevated freight line west of the station while GG-1 pulled trains went overhead. One could look up and see the underside of the train as it went overhead... . . . ya peeping Tom . . ! Got to see all her axles and the quill drive, too..... There are others in museums but those are the best known. 16 of 'em are still out there. Meaning in museums. Which is good, because they're being taken care of. In the 1970s there was a lot of talk about converting the original 11 kV 25 Hz catenary system to 25 kV 60 Hz. Conversion of the older units with their AC traction motors would have been impractical. However, research showed that the NHRR folks who had chosen 11 kV 25 Hz back around the turn of the 19th century knew what they were doing. Changing to 25 kV 60 Hz would have meant increasing clearances at every overpass and tunnel, changing every single insulator in the catenary structure, replacement of every existing substation and installation of at least as many new ones. Plus complete replacement of the signal and electrification system components connected to the track. Simply cost too much and the ROI wasn't there. By the time all this was figured out, the decision to phase out the older equipment had proceeded too far to economically stop. Although capable of 100+ MPH, newer equipment such as the AEM-7 family of rectifier locos could do over 125 MPH, and the new Acela trainsets over 150 MPH, so the die was cast. Further proof of my contention that they never oughta let you damned sparkies anywhere near the railroads. Without us there'd be no Penn Station, no Grand Central, no subway, no Hudson Tubes... but that's apparently not the case, the changeover never happened so operating a GG-1 should still be possible. *IF* they can replace the original PCB-laced transformer oil to an oil which is not as toxic. Actually all of the ones that went to museums had their main transformers removed for the obvious reason. But then they didn't all go to museums did they? Hmmm? One of those might run again. The ones that didn't go to museums were scrapped. Tin cans and house wiring now. The biggest problem would be getting a custom made replacement transformer. Let's see, 4620 x 746 equals about 3500 kVA at 25 Hz - that's a bit larger than the weenie little things used in radio, even "professional" radio. WLW ran 500,000 kVA *OUT*. Plus it had 250,000 kVA worth of modulation xfmrs. No it didn't. WLW ran 500 kW - 500,000 WATTS, not kilowatts. The motors on just one axle of a GG-1 do more than that. And there are six powered axles. It is quite possible that a GG-1 that has been kept indoors could get a new transformer and run again. The main problem is that it's doubtful that any of the electrified railroads left would want a one-of-a-kind unit. It ain't the railroads which run the museum pieces, it's the museums which run 'em. Steamtown, etc. All that's needed is one near some energized wire. ahh, to hear the "duck call" air horn go by at over 100 mph once again... The call of the Ruptured Duck . . Ugliest sound to ever come off the rails until the diesels trumped the GG-1. The rumble/whine of a pair of SD-45s (each rated 3600 Hp with turbocharged 20 cylinder diesel) pulling an intermodal at 79 mph along the Water Level Route.... When was the last time YOU heard a steam whistle played in PRR revenue service like I did? Couple years back when the Strasburg ran an excursion down the Main Line to 30th Street and back. Their two steamers are ex-Pennsy, they were in Pennsy colors and on Pennsy track. Plus they were hauling revenue passengers. Thought so . . When's the last time you were *inside* a GG-1 - not in a museum? Thought so... Oddly enough, above the truck level inside a GG-1 there's not much other than the main transformer and the center cab. The slopin ends are mostly empty space - coupla traction motor blowers, and the steam generator, but not much else. Low envter of gravity. The GG-1 is a great niche piece but that's all it ever was compared with the steamers. One could even say that all any electrics did was move the steam boiler off the wheels and into the power plant... Snippts by recognized authorities on the subject: In 1914 the Pennsylvania Railroad built, what many people believe to be, one of the most famous Locomotives to have ever roamed the rails, the K4 Class 4-6-2 Pacific. It was so successful that the Pennsy had 424 more built. Oh yes, no argument, they built 'em in Altoona as I recall and used 'em for everything. K4s #3678 - This is one of 4 K4s's that was Streamlined in 1940 with the help of Industrial Artist Raymond Loewy. Still not as cool looking as the J-3 Hudsons on the Water Level Route, scooping water from the Tivoli pans at 100+ MPH. (Of course water scoops were perfected by the PRR and copied by Vanderbilt's little collection of branch lines). Or as ungodly powerful as a UP Big Boy or even a Niagara. Another thing PRR pioneered was radio on the RRs, starting with the inductive trainphone system *before* VHF FM radio was used on the rails... 73 de Jim, N2EY |
|
#158
February 19th 04, 09:12 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
(N2EY) wrote in message ...
In article , (Brian Kelly) writes: (N2EY) wrote in message ... In article , (Brian Kelly) writes: "Phil Kane" wrote in message The ultimate class is the GG-1. Someday one will run again..... I went up the guy and asked him if they'd lost their map of the AMTRAK lines or what, Primos is *not* hardly AMTRAK country, right?. Wrong. Daily wee-hours AMTRAK Ballast train. I coulda told ya THAT! I remember walking between 30th Street station in Philly and classes at Penn, and passing under the elevated freight line west of the station while GG-1 pulled trains went overhead. One could look up and see the underside of the train as it went overhead... . . . ya peeping Tom . . ! Got to see all her axles and the quill drive, too..... There are others in museums but those are the best known. 16 of 'em are still out there. Meaning in museums. Which is good, because they're being taken care of. In the 1970s there was a lot of talk about converting the original 11 kV 25 Hz catenary system to 25 kV 60 Hz. Conversion of the older units with their AC traction motors would have been impractical. However, research showed that the NHRR folks who had chosen 11 kV 25 Hz back around the turn of the 19th century knew what they were doing. Changing to 25 kV 60 Hz would have meant increasing clearances at every overpass and tunnel, changing every single insulator in the catenary structure, replacement of every existing substation and installation of at least as many new ones. Plus complete replacement of the signal and electrification system components connected to the track. Simply cost too much and the ROI wasn't there. By the time all this was figured out, the decision to phase out the older equipment had proceeded too far to economically stop. Although capable of 100+ MPH, newer equipment such as the AEM-7 family of rectifier locos could do over 125 MPH, and the new Acela trainsets over 150 MPH, so the die was cast. Further proof of my contention that they never oughta let you damned sparkies anywhere near the railroads. Without us there'd be no Penn Station, no Grand Central, no subway, no Hudson Tubes... but that's apparently not the case, the changeover never happened so operating a GG-1 should still be possible. *IF* they can replace the original PCB-laced transformer oil to an oil which is not as toxic. Actually all of the ones that went to museums had their main transformers removed for the obvious reason. But then they didn't all go to museums did they? Hmmm? One of those might run again. The ones that didn't go to museums were scrapped. Tin cans and house wiring now. The biggest problem would be getting a custom made replacement transformer. Let's see, 4620 x 746 equals about 3500 kVA at 25 Hz - that's a bit larger than the weenie little things used in radio, even "professional" radio. WLW ran 500,000 kVA *OUT*. Plus it had 250,000 kVA worth of modulation xfmrs. No it didn't. WLW ran 500 kW - 500,000 WATTS, not kilowatts. The motors on just one axle of a GG-1 do more than that. And there are six powered axles. It is quite possible that a GG-1 that has been kept indoors could get a new transformer and run again. The main problem is that it's doubtful that any of the electrified railroads left would want a one-of-a-kind unit. It ain't the railroads which run the museum pieces, it's the museums which run 'em. Steamtown, etc. All that's needed is one near some energized wire. ahh, to hear the "duck call" air horn go by at over 100 mph once again... The call of the Ruptured Duck . . Ugliest sound to ever come off the rails until the diesels trumped the GG-1. The rumble/whine of a pair of SD-45s (each rated 3600 Hp with turbocharged 20 cylinder diesel) pulling an intermodal at 79 mph along the Water Level Route.... When was the last time YOU heard a steam whistle played in PRR revenue service like I did? Couple years back when the Strasburg ran an excursion down the Main Line to 30th Street and back. Their two steamers are ex-Pennsy, they were in Pennsy colors and on Pennsy track. Plus they were hauling revenue passengers. Thought so . . When's the last time you were *inside* a GG-1 - not in a museum? Thought so... Oddly enough, above the truck level inside a GG-1 there's not much other than the main transformer and the center cab. The slopin ends are mostly empty space - coupla traction motor blowers, and the steam generator, but not much else. Low envter of gravity. The GG-1 is a great niche piece but that's all it ever was compared with the steamers. One could even say that all any electrics did was move the steam boiler off the wheels and into the power plant... Snippts by recognized authorities on the subject: In 1914 the Pennsylvania Railroad built, what many people believe to be, one of the most famous Locomotives to have ever roamed the rails, the K4 Class 4-6-2 Pacific. It was so successful that the Pennsy had 424 more built. Oh yes, no argument, they built 'em in Altoona as I recall and used 'em for everything. K4s #3678 - This is one of 4 K4s's that was Streamlined in 1940 with the help of Industrial Artist Raymond Loewy. Still not as cool looking as the J-3 Hudsons on the Water Level Route, scooping water from the Tivoli pans at 100+ MPH. (Of course water scoops were perfected by the PRR and copied by Vanderbilt's little collection of branch lines). Or as ungodly powerful as a UP Big Boy or even a Niagara. Another thing PRR pioneered was radio on the RRs, starting with the inductive trainphone system *before* VHF FM radio was used on the rails... 73 de Jim, N2EY .. . Jim . . . good heavens . . seven identical posts . . ? You homebrewed yer own computer right? |
|
#159
February 19th 04, 09:51 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
In article ,
(Brian Kelly) writes: (N2EY) wrote in message ... In article , (Brian Kelly) writes: "Phil Kane" wrote in message The ultimate class is the GG-1. Someday one will run again..... I went up the guy and asked him if they'd lost their map of the AMTRAK lines or what, Primos is *not* hardly AMTRAK country, right?. Wrong. Daily wee-hours AMTRAK Ballast train. I coulda told ya THAT! I remember walking between 30th Street station in Philly and classes at Penn, and passing under the elevated freight line west of the station while GG-1 pulled trains went overhead. One could look up and see the underside of the train as it went overhead... . . . ya peeping Tom . . ! Got to see all her axles and the quill drive, too..... There are others in museums but those are the best known. 16 of 'em are still out there. Meaning in museums. Which is good, because they're being taken care of. In the 1970s there was a lot of talk about converting the original 11 kV 25 Hz catenary system to 25 kV 60 Hz. Conversion of the older units with their AC traction motors would have been impractical. However, research showed that the NHRR folks who had chosen 11 kV 25 Hz back around the turn of the 19th century knew what they were doing. Changing to 25 kV 60 Hz would have meant increasing clearances at every overpass and tunnel, changing every single insulator in the catenary structure, replacement of every existing substation and installation of at least as many new ones. Plus complete replacement of the signal and electrification system components connected to the track. Simply cost too much and the ROI wasn't there. By the time all this was figured out, the decision to phase out the older equipment had proceeded too far to economically stop. Although capable of 100+ MPH, newer equipment such as the AEM-7 family of rectifier locos could do over 125 MPH, and the new Acela trainsets over 150 MPH, so the die was cast. Further proof of my contention that they never oughta let you damned sparkies anywhere near the railroads. Without us there'd be no Penn Station, no Grand Central, no subway, no Hudson Tubes... but that's apparently not the case, the changeover never happened so operating a GG-1 should still be possible. *IF* they can replace the original PCB-laced transformer oil to an oil which is not as toxic. Actually all of the ones that went to museums had their main transformers removed for the obvious reason. But then they didn't all go to museums did they? Hmmm? One of those might run again. The ones that didn't go to museums were scrapped. Tin cans and house wiring now. The biggest problem would be getting a custom made replacement transformer. Let's see, 4620 x 746 equals about 3500 kVA at 25 Hz - that's a bit larger than the weenie little things used in radio, even "professional" radio. WLW ran 500,000 kVA *OUT*. Plus it had 250,000 kVA worth of modulation xfmrs. No it didn't. WLW ran 500 kW - 500,000 WATTS, not kilowatts. The motors on just one axle of a GG-1 do more than that. And there are six powered axles. It is quite possible that a GG-1 that has been kept indoors could get a new transformer and run again. The main problem is that it's doubtful that any of the electrified railroads left would want a one-of-a-kind unit. It ain't the railroads which run the museum pieces, it's the museums which run 'em. Steamtown, etc. All that's needed is one near some energized wire. ahh, to hear the "duck call" air horn go by at over 100 mph once again... The call of the Ruptured Duck . . Ugliest sound to ever come off the rails until the diesels trumped the GG-1. The rumble/whine of a pair of SD-45s (each rated 3600 Hp with turbocharged 20 cylinder diesel) pulling an intermodal at 79 mph along the Water Level Route.... When was the last time YOU heard a steam whistle played in PRR revenue service like I did? Couple years back when the Strasburg ran an excursion down the Main Line to 30th Street and back. Their two steamers are ex-Pennsy, they were in Pennsy colors and on Pennsy track. Plus they were hauling revenue passengers. Thought so . . When's the last time you were *inside* a GG-1 - not in a museum? Thought so... Oddly enough, above the truck level inside a GG-1 there's not much other than the main transformer and the center cab. The slopin ends are mostly empty space - coupla traction motor blowers, and the steam generator, but not much else. Low envter of gravity. The GG-1 is a great niche piece but that's all it ever was compared with the steamers. One could even say that all any electrics did was move the steam boiler off the wheels and into the power plant... Snippts by recognized authorities on the subject: In 1914 the Pennsylvania Railroad built, what many people believe to be, one of the most famous Locomotives to have ever roamed the rails, the K4 Class 4-6-2 Pacific. It was so successful that the Pennsy had 424 more built. Oh yes, no argument, they built 'em in Altoona as I recall and used 'em for everything. K4s #3678 - This is one of 4 K4s's that was Streamlined in 1940 with the help of Industrial Artist Raymond Loewy. Still not as cool looking as the J-3 Hudsons on the Water Level Route, scooping water from the Tivoli pans at 100+ MPH. (Of course water scoops were perfected by the PRR and copied by Vanderbilt's little collection of branch lines). Or as ungodly powerful as a UP Big Boy or even a Niagara. Another thing PRR pioneered was radio on the RRs, starting with the inductive trainphone system *before* VHF FM radio was used on the rails... 73 de Jim, N2EY |
|
#160
February 19th 04, 09:52 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
In article ,
(Brian Kelly) writes: (N2EY) wrote in message ... In article , (Brian Kelly) writes: "Phil Kane" wrote in message The ultimate class is the GG-1. Someday one will run again..... I went up the guy and asked him if they'd lost their map of the AMTRAK lines or what, Primos is *not* hardly AMTRAK country, right?. Wrong. Daily wee-hours AMTRAK Ballast train. I coulda told ya THAT! I remember walking between 30th Street station in Philly and classes at Penn, and passing under the elevated freight line west of the station while GG-1 pulled trains went overhead. One could look up and see the underside of the train as it went overhead... . . . ya peeping Tom . . ! Got to see all her axles and the quill drive, too..... There are others in museums but those are the best known. 16 of 'em are still out there. Meaning in museums. Which is good, because they're being taken care of. In the 1970s there was a lot of talk about converting the original 11 kV 25 Hz catenary system to 25 kV 60 Hz. Conversion of the older units with their AC traction motors would have been impractical. However, research showed that the NHRR folks who had chosen 11 kV 25 Hz back around the turn of the 19th century knew what they were doing. Changing to 25 kV 60 Hz would have meant increasing clearances at every overpass and tunnel, changing every single insulator in the catenary structure, replacement of every existing substation and installation of at least as many new ones. Plus complete replacement of the signal and electrification system components connected to the track. Simply cost too much and the ROI wasn't there. By the time all this was figured out, the decision to phase out the older equipment had proceeded too far to economically stop. Although capable of 100+ MPH, newer equipment such as the AEM-7 family of rectifier locos could do over 125 MPH, and the new Acela trainsets over 150 MPH, so the die was cast. Further proof of my contention that they never oughta let you damned sparkies anywhere near the railroads. Without us there'd be no Penn Station, no Grand Central, no subway, no Hudson Tubes... but that's apparently not the case, the changeover never happened so operating a GG-1 should still be possible. *IF* they can replace the original PCB-laced transformer oil to an oil which is not as toxic. Actually all of the ones that went to museums had their main transformers removed for the obvious reason. But then they didn't all go to museums did they? Hmmm? One of those might run again. The ones that didn't go to museums were scrapped. Tin cans and house wiring now. The biggest problem would be getting a custom made replacement transformer. Let's see, 4620 x 746 equals about 3500 kVA at 25 Hz - that's a bit larger than the weenie little things used in radio, even "professional" radio. WLW ran 500,000 kVA *OUT*. Plus it had 250,000 kVA worth of modulation xfmrs. No it didn't. WLW ran 500 kW - 500,000 WATTS, not kilowatts. The motors on just one axle of a GG-1 do more than that. And there are six powered axles. It is quite possible that a GG-1 that has been kept indoors could get a new transformer and run again. The main problem is that it's doubtful that any of the electrified railroads left would want a one-of-a-kind unit. It ain't the railroads which run the museum pieces, it's the museums which run 'em. Steamtown, etc. All that's needed is one near some energized wire. ahh, to hear the "duck call" air horn go by at over 100 mph once again... The call of the Ruptured Duck . . Ugliest sound to ever come off the rails until the diesels trumped the GG-1. The rumble/whine of a pair of SD-45s (each rated 3600 Hp with turbocharged 20 cylinder diesel) pulling an intermodal at 79 mph along the Water Level Route.... When was the last time YOU heard a steam whistle played in PRR revenue service like I did? Couple years back when the Strasburg ran an excursion down the Main Line to 30th Street and back. Their two steamers are ex-Pennsy, they were in Pennsy colors and on Pennsy track. Plus they were hauling revenue passengers. Thought so . . When's the last time you were *inside* a GG-1 - not in a museum? Thought so... Oddly enough, above the truck level inside a GG-1 there's not much other than the main transformer and the center cab. The slopin ends are mostly empty space - coupla traction motor blowers, and the steam generator, but not much else. Low envter of gravity. The GG-1 is a great niche piece but that's all it ever was compared with the steamers. One could even say that all any electrics did was move the steam boiler off the wheels and into the power plant... Snippts by recognized authorities on the subject: In 1914 the Pennsylvania Railroad built, what many people believe to be, one of the most famous Locomotives to have ever roamed the rails, the K4 Class 4-6-2 Pacific. It was so successful that the Pennsy had 424 more built. Oh yes, no argument, they built 'em in Altoona as I recall and used 'em for everything. K4s #3678 - This is one of 4 K4s's that was Streamlined in 1940 with the help of Industrial Artist Raymond Loewy. Still not as cool looking as the J-3 Hudsons on the Water Level Route, scooping water from the Tivoli pans at 100+ MPH. (Of course water scoops were perfected by the PRR and copied by Vanderbilt's little collection of branch lines). Or as ungodly powerful as a UP Big Boy or even a Niagara. Another thing PRR pioneered was radio on the RRs, starting with the inductive trainphone system *before* VHF FM radio was used on the rails... 73 de Jim, N2EY |
| Reply |
| Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
| Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads
|
||||
| Thread | Forum | |||
| Extra class - question about the test | General | |||
| From the Extra question pool: The dipole | General | |||
| From the Extra question pool: The dipole | Policy | |||
| Low reenlistment rate | Policy | |||
| 1x2 Calls--automatic when upgrading to Extra? | Policy | |||
Linear Mode
