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If you had to use CW to save someone's life, would that person die?
"Woody" wrote in
news:%RJGg.27319$uV.13889@trnddc08: Well there ya have it folks.... 50wpm saves lives. So how does it work? Turn up the speaker really loud and place it [face down] on the person's chest, while an op in South America tapped out universally accepted words that would mimic an atrioventricular rhythm? Did someone drop you on your head at birth? The reason 50wpm can save lives is probably a bit complex for you to get both your functioning neurons around, but believe me, having done CW for a living for some decades I do know that it can save lives. And if you're faster than the average bear at it, you can tell someone on the scene things they need to know all that much faster. Wrong theatre? OK... Maybe if a person is trapped on a sinking ship in the Indian Ocean you, in Siberia, could tap out a message to someone in Madagascar [who happened to be awake at an odd hour] and that person also owned a large SAR chopper, they could jump in it, saving the time of relaying to anyone else, and go pluck them from certain death? OH, or better yet... if your neighbor is also a ham.... and your wife fell over with an AMI, you could call your neighbor, give him a freq, then the two of you get set up and running, then you can send a 50wpm message asking your neighbor to call an ambulance? BTW, if the phones are down, you ask him to get in his car and drive down to the local EMS agency, and bring them to you. Life saved! I'm impressed. rb So apparently YOUR answer to this question is that you couldn't send your name if your own life depended on it. Believe me, I get it. I don't think CW ought to be mandatory and it isn't where I live. I do think people who intend to use it should learn how to use it properly, though. For CW to be effective, both operators must be competent. IF they are, they can often transcend barriers of language that only digital modes can get over. In my own case, the fact that I could read CW and read written Spanish a bit once enabled me to render aid to a burning fishing boat. (There were other more routine examples of where the language barrier was crossed by CW--many messages I copied were not in English at all, but were readable by their end recipients). -- Dave Oldridge+ ICQ 1800667 |
#2
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If you had to use CW to save someone's life, would that person die?
"Dave Oldridge" wrote in message 9... "Woody" wrote in news:%RJGg.27319$uV.13889@trnddc08: Did someone drop you on your head at birth? The reason 50wpm can save lives is probably a bit complex for you to get both your functioning neurons around, but believe me, having done CW for a living for some decades I do know that it can save lives. And if you're faster than the average bear at it, you can tell someone on the scene things they need to know all that much faster. Possibly, because try as I might, I can't really remember much about that day.... I had pyloric stenosis, if that counts? So apparently YOUR answer to this question is that you couldn't send your name if your own life depended on it. Now that's true... I'd require a CW setup of some kind in order to send my name; or anything else for that matter. Or as previously pointed out, hack up a headphone jack and tippy tap the wires together. Either way, I don't see my life depending on it at any time, so I'll just let my CW skills continue to rust. However; your argument does make me wonder how non-hams even have a chance at life in this world... ?? Believe me, I get it. I don't think CW ought to be mandatory and it isn't where I live. I do think people who intend to use it should learn how to use it properly, though. For CW to be effective, both operators must be competent. IF they are, they can often transcend barriers of language that only digital modes can get over. In my own case, the fact that I could read CW and read written Spanish a bit once enabled me to render aid to a burning fishing boat. (There were other more routine examples of where the language barrier was crossed by CW--many messages I copied were not in English at all, but were readable by their end recipients). OK.... so by your own words, CW still didn't save a life... CW mixed with bad Spanish passed a message. So now we'll have to add a Spanish test. Thanks a lot. As for the language thing.... I can copy voice language and hand it off to another native just as easy and they'll figure it out too. No CW necessary. BTW, I noticed you conveniently left out the specific year in which said burning boat was offshore with an obsolete CW outfit, and how your CW expertise put out a fire.... but I'm guessing we're talking many a year ago, so again, a moot point. Actually, The boat thing in general is really killing me... If these numb-nuts are offshore and not on the correct USCG freqs and/or unaware of how to properly tune their radios in an emergency, then it isn't CW saving lives, it's the grace of God that somebody happened to be on their freq at that time. But again, what boats are out there with a CW rig???? That's crazy, bubba. :-) rb |
#3
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If you had to use CW to save someone's life, would that person die?
"Woody" wrote in news:1o2Hg.19713$Te.3938@trnddc07:
"Dave Oldridge" wrote in message 9... "Woody" wrote in news:%RJGg.27319$uV.13889@trnddc08: Did someone drop you on your head at birth? The reason 50wpm can save lives is probably a bit complex for you to get both your functioning neurons around, but believe me, having done CW for a living for some decades I do know that it can save lives. And if you're faster than the average bear at it, you can tell someone on the scene things they need to know all that much faster. Possibly, because try as I might, I can't really remember much about that day.... I had pyloric stenosis, if that counts? So apparently YOUR answer to this question is that you couldn't send your name if your own life depended on it. Now that's true... I'd require a CW setup of some kind in order to send my name; or anything else for that matter. Or as previously pointed out, hack up a headphone jack and tippy tap the wires together. Either way, I don't see my life depending on it at any time, so I'll just let my CW skills continue to rust. However; your argument does make me wonder how non-hams even have a chance at life in this world... ?? Believe me, I get it. I don't think CW ought to be mandatory and it isn't where I live. I do think people who intend to use it should learn how to use it properly, though. For CW to be effective, both operators must be competent. IF they are, they can often transcend barriers of language that only digital modes can get over. In my own case, the fact that I could read CW and read written Spanish a bit once enabled me to render aid to a burning fishing boat. (There were other more routine examples of where the language barrier was crossed by CW--many messages I copied were not in English at all, but were readable by their end recipients). OK.... so by your own words, CW still didn't save a life... CW mixed with bad Spanish passed a message. So now we'll have to add a Spanish test. Thanks a lot. My point is, my bad Spanish might not have recognized the word "fuego" if it was spoken fast among a lot of other words. But on CW it came across loud and clear. As for the language thing.... I can copy voice language and hand it off to another native just as easy and they'll figure it out too. No CW necessary. Except you'll be a lot slower because you'll need phonetic spellings for everything. Believe me, I know. I've done this. For a living for many years. BTW, I noticed you conveniently left out the specific year in which said burning boat was offshore with an obsolete CW outfit, and how your CW expertise put out a fire.... but I'm guessing we're talking many a year ago, so again, a moot point. Not that long ago, really. Early 1990's if I remember. Actually, The boat thing in general is really killing me... If these numb-nuts are offshore and not on the correct USCG freqs and/or unaware of how to properly tune their radios in an emergency, then it isn't CW saving lives, it's the grace of God that somebody happened to be on their freq at that time. But again, what boats are out there with a CW rig???? That's crazy, bubba. :-) rb This was on 500khz (and 484). CW was the mode of operation on those frequencies until well into the 90's. Cheap SSB radios were plentiful. So were some SITOR lashups. But what finally killed it was INMARSAT. So now, instead of getting nailed by solar flares on HF, you get nailed by them on INMARSAT and have to wait 6 to 9 months for a new launch. Meanwhile you're limping along on SSB using a phonetic alphabet to send traffic at a SLOWER rate. -- Dave Oldridge+ ICQ 1800667 |
#4
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If you had to use CW to save someone's life, would that person die?
And ever so slowly we creep up on the *actual* point....
pick a freq, pick a mode, pick a language, pick a moment in time. *Nothing* is perfect and CW or no CW, it's about circumstance, not code. Then again, you can back it up one more and acknowledge the foolishness of the whole CW argument. As it stands, hams are so crazy they somehow think they are the only hope for mankind. I pray that farce never becomes fact! Everything has it's place. Ham radio is a novelty. CW is a novelty within the same. That's all.... As long as there are 40wpm ops out there that can't program a radio, it's just a bunch of ding-dongs arguing amongst each other, looking like a bunch of ding-dongs. And it goes both ways.... no reason to ditch CW but this "my tapper is faster than your tapper" stupidity is just phallic and pathetic. Which finally brings us to the overall problem... As usual, the last word in any hammy hashing is the same. Control freaks needing to feel in control, and the subject matters not. That's why these goofy threads carry on forever. rb "Dave Oldridge" wrote in message 9... "Woody" wrote in news:1o2Hg.19713$Te.3938@trnddc07: "Dave Oldridge" wrote in message 9... "Woody" wrote in news:%RJGg.27319$uV.13889@trnddc08: Did someone drop you on your head at birth? The reason 50wpm can save lives is probably a bit complex for you to get both your functioning neurons around, but believe me, having done CW for a living for some decades I do know that it can save lives. And if you're faster than the average bear at it, you can tell someone on the scene things they need to know all that much faster. Possibly, because try as I might, I can't really remember much about that day.... I had pyloric stenosis, if that counts? So apparently YOUR answer to this question is that you couldn't send your name if your own life depended on it. Now that's true... I'd require a CW setup of some kind in order to send my name; or anything else for that matter. Or as previously pointed out, hack up a headphone jack and tippy tap the wires together. Either way, I don't see my life depending on it at any time, so I'll just let my CW skills continue to rust. However; your argument does make me wonder how non-hams even have a chance at life in this world... ?? Believe me, I get it. I don't think CW ought to be mandatory and it isn't where I live. I do think people who intend to use it should learn how to use it properly, though. For CW to be effective, both operators must be competent. IF they are, they can often transcend barriers of language that only digital modes can get over. In my own case, the fact that I could read CW and read written Spanish a bit once enabled me to render aid to a burning fishing boat. (There were other more routine examples of where the language barrier was crossed by CW--many messages I copied were not in English at all, but were readable by their end recipients). OK.... so by your own words, CW still didn't save a life... CW mixed with bad Spanish passed a message. So now we'll have to add a Spanish test. Thanks a lot. My point is, my bad Spanish might not have recognized the word "fuego" if it was spoken fast among a lot of other words. But on CW it came across loud and clear. As for the language thing.... I can copy voice language and hand it off to another native just as easy and they'll figure it out too. No CW necessary. Except you'll be a lot slower because you'll need phonetic spellings for everything. Believe me, I know. I've done this. For a living for many years. BTW, I noticed you conveniently left out the specific year in which said burning boat was offshore with an obsolete CW outfit, and how your CW expertise put out a fire.... but I'm guessing we're talking many a year ago, so again, a moot point. Not that long ago, really. Early 1990's if I remember. Actually, The boat thing in general is really killing me... If these numb-nuts are offshore and not on the correct USCG freqs and/or unaware of how to properly tune their radios in an emergency, then it isn't CW saving lives, it's the grace of God that somebody happened to be on their freq at that time. But again, what boats are out there with a CW rig???? That's crazy, bubba. :-) rb This was on 500khz (and 484). CW was the mode of operation on those frequencies until well into the 90's. Cheap SSB radios were plentiful. So were some SITOR lashups. But what finally killed it was INMARSAT. So now, instead of getting nailed by solar flares on HF, you get nailed by them on INMARSAT and have to wait 6 to 9 months for a new launch. Meanwhile you're limping along on SSB using a phonetic alphabet to send traffic at a SLOWER rate. -- Dave Oldridge+ ICQ 1800667 |
#5
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If you had to use CW to save someone's life, would that person die?
On Wed, 23 Aug 2006 19:54:37 GMT, "Woody" wrote:
"Dave Oldridge" wrote in message 59... For CW to be effective, both operators must be competent. IF they are, they can often transcend barriers of language that only digital modes can get over. In my own case, the fact that I could read CW and read written Spanish a bit once enabled me to render aid to a burning fishing boat. (There were other more routine examples of where the language barrier was crossed by CW--many messages I copied were not in English at all, but were readable by their end recipients). OK.... so by your own words, CW still didn't save a life... CW mixed with bad Spanish passed a message. So now we'll have to add a Spanish test. Thanks a lot. I think you missed the point. Even if you didn't know "ola" from "adios", you can copy Spanish in CW and hand it to the recipient, who can read it. Try that with a mic. As for the language thing.... I can copy voice language and hand it off to another native just as easy and they'll figure it out too. No CW necessary. Really? You can write a spoken language you don't understand well enough to be read by someone who understands it? Maybe. Maybe not. In CW, you can. |
#6
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If you had to use CW to save someone's life, would that person die?
Al Klein wrote: On Wed, 23 Aug 2006 19:54:37 GMT, "Woody" wrote: "Dave Oldridge" wrote in message 59... For CW to be effective, both operators must be competent. IF they are, they can often transcend barriers of language that only digital modes can get over. In my own case, the fact that I could read CW and read written Spanish a bit once enabled me to render aid to a burning fishing boat. (There were other more routine examples of where the language barrier was crossed by CW--many messages I copied were not in English at all, but were readable by their end recipients). OK.... so by your own words, CW still didn't save a life... CW mixed with bad Spanish passed a message. So now we'll have to add a Spanish test. Thanks a lot. I think you missed the point. Even if you didn't know "ola" from "adios", you can copy Spanish in CW and hand it to the recipient, who can read it. Try that with a mic. I do that firaly well as long as it is a a langauge fro gruop I know I can take down serbian in crylllic even though I don't what they are saying it is simply a skill For that matter I hear and resend Morse as long as I don't try to decipher it As for the language thing.... I can copy voice language and hand it off to another native just as easy and they'll figure it out too. No CW necessary. Really? You can write a spoken language you don't understand well enough to be read by someone who understands it? Maybe. Maybe not. In CW, you can. YOU can and you then claim that you have that skill it is valid your values in the ARS refuse to accept that notion different strokes for different folks If instead of CW testng we had a choice a various tests to take that would stand muster the current value Morse well outside of it value withut even realy testing its abilty to do a QSO were the test based sending and receiveing where the receiveing could send bak pse senf all after ... and before what then take a test to show that he was able to comincate the test would have more vailiity but it doesn't the CW tests do noy even show that the testee can use CW over the air |
#7
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If you had to use CW to save someone's life, would that person die?
"an old freind" wrote in
ps.com: Al Klein wrote: On Wed, 23 Aug 2006 19:54:37 GMT, "Woody" wrote: "Dave Oldridge" wrote in message 59... For CW to be effective, both operators must be competent. IF they are, they can often transcend barriers of language that only digital modes can get over. In my own case, the fact that I could read CW and read written Spanish a bit once enabled me to render aid to a burning fishing boat. (There were other more routine examples of where the language barrier was crossed by CW--many messages I copied were not in English at all, but were readable by their end recipients). OK.... so by your own words, CW still didn't save a life... CW mixed with bad Spanish passed a message. So now we'll have to add a Spanish test. Thanks a lot. I think you missed the point. Even if you didn't know "ola" from "adios", you can copy Spanish in CW and hand it to the recipient, who can read it. Try that with a mic. I do that firaly well as long as it is a a langauge fro gruop I know I can take down serbian in crylllic even though I don't what they are saying it is simply a skill For that matter I hear and resend Morse as long as I don't try to decipher it As for the language thing.... I can copy voice language and hand it off to another native just as easy and they'll figure it out too. No CW necessary. Really? You can write a spoken language you don't understand well enough to be read by someone who understands it? Maybe. Maybe not. In CW, you can. YOU can and you then claim that you have that skill it is valid your values in the ARS refuse to accept that notion different strokes for different folks If instead of CW testng we had a choice a various tests to take that would stand muster the current value Morse well outside of it value withut even realy testing its abilty to do a QSO were the test based sending and receiveing where the receiveing could send bak pse senf all after ... and before what then take a test to show that he was able to comincate the test would have more vailiity but it doesn't the CW tests do noy even show that the testee can use CW over the air We have three tests her in Canada now. The Basic gets you on the air. If you get an 80% or higher score you get HF privileges with that. You're limited in power and must use commercially built, approved gear. If you want to roll your own gear or put up a repeater or something, then write the Advanced. You'll get full HF privileges. If you want to be known as morse proficient, then take the code test. That will get you on HF even if you just PASSED your Basic. But if you already have the Advanced, then it will get you a nic shiny morse endorsement and a sense of accomplishment. And no, the sky didn't fall any further than it already did when we dropped the code requirement for Basic and made it VHF only. -- Dave Oldridge+ ICQ 1800667 |
#8
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If you had to use CW to save someone's life, would that persondie?
Al Klein wrote:
Really? You can write a spoken language you don't understand well enough to be read by someone who understands it? Maybe. Maybe not. In CW, you can. Spanish words are easy to write even if one doesn't understand them. In general, unlike English, there is usually only one possible way to pronounce and to spell a Spanish word. You hear "a-di-os". You write a-d-i-o-s. You don't need to know what it means. -- 73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp |
#9
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If you had to use CW to save someone's life, would that person die?
On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 02:32:01 GMT, Cecil Moore
wrote: Al Klein wrote: Really? You can write a spoken language you don't understand well enough to be read by someone who understands it? Maybe. Maybe not. In CW, you can. Spanish words are easy to write even if one doesn't understand them. Ever try taking dictation at 100wpm spoken speed in a foreign language? I have. Even in one I understand, it's difficult. In one I don't understand it's impossible. Maybe you're better than I am. In general, unlike English, there is usually only one possible way to pronounce and to spell a Spanish word. You hear "a-di-os". You write a-d-i-o-s. You don't need to know what it means. When it's spoken very quickly and in a panic, it's more like "adhyose". Understandable, if weird looking, to a Spaniard. Try some other languages, though - those you've never heard spoken before. See how well you do. Then see how well you do in CW ... oh, you already know that, don't you? -.-. is the same, whether it's hard, soft or unpronounced. Whether you put a cedilla on it or not, a Spaniard will understand it. So will a Turk, even though it sounds more like - -.-. But would you write "Con" for something that sounds like Tchonn? |
#10
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If you had to use CW to save someone's life, would that persondie?
Al Klein wrote:
Ever try taking dictation at 100wpm spoken speed in a foreign language? I have. Even in one I understand, it's difficult. In one I don't understand it's impossible. Maybe you're better than I am. I can certainly write down Spanish spoken at my CW speed of 13 wpm which is the whole point. If one speaks faster, I may not be able to copy it. If one sends CW to me faster than 13 wpm, for sure I cannot copy it even in English. -- 73, Cecil, http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp |
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