In article ,
"David Eduardo" wrote:

"Telamon" wrote in message
...


Existing radios are 100% compatible, on both FM and AM.

The way AM and FM are listened to today, there is no loss by adding
HD as an alternative to analog.

Sorry David, IBOC is compatible, but not 100%, as the analog sidebands
are limited and adjacent channels have interference by the digital
sidebands.

As has been shown, even at FCC level, there is no significant usage of
stations adjacent to locals in each market. So there is no loss if there is
what ammounts to unmeasurable listening.

Again the marketing viewpoint. This isn't a radio marketing news group
it is a hobby news group where people listen for other reasons than
tuning in for the programming material. That is not to say that the
programming is not the reason as I have tuned in out of market stations
to get programs not offered in my area.

People reading this news group care and do listen to out of market
stations and that listening is degraded by IBOC. Logically, since this
listening exists and is degraded by IBOC then IBOC becomes incompatible.
The best that you can argue is that IBOC is mostly compatible but that
is not 100% by any means.

Some people including myself do not agree that the existing
level of compatibility is acceptable. If it was 100% nobody would be
complaining about it.

I don't hear listeners complaining. I hear mostly DXers whining.

You don't care about DXers in your job but you should posting to this
news group.

The greater good is trying to preserve the existing free terrestrial
broadcast system, which will not endure unless a digital alternative is
offered.

We got that through numerous posts you have made.

You have well explained the radio
station/marketing perspective on this but that does not change the
listening experience, which has limitations placed on it by IBOC over
the existing long time analog transmission scheme.

However, the only listening being disrupted is the potential to listen to
adjacents... something that, in practice, is just not done.

Well I hate to break it to you but listening to adjacent stations is
"done" by the people reading this news group. How many times does
someone have to post a complaint here that IBOC degrades their
reception? Please don't come back with the marketing perspective because
I get it already.

--
Telamon
Ventura, California

In article ,
dxAce wrote:

dxAce wrote:



David Frackelton Gleason, posing as 'Eduardo' since c.2000 and shameless
shill
wrote:

"RHF" wrote in message
ps.com...
Univision Sold for $13. Billion to a group of private investors.

http://www.hispanicbusiness.com/news...t=Headlines&mo
re=/news/more-news.asp

http://www.nydailynews.com/business/...p-362965c.html

~ RHF

$12.7 billion, including assumption of liabilities. And that news is OLD.

Hopefully they'll can your fake Hispanic ass!

Oh yeah, you must be one of those 'liabilities'.

LMFAO

You mean to say David Eduardo is worth 0.3 Billion?

--
Telamon
Ventura, California

David Frackelton Gleason, posing as 'Eduardo', paid spokesperson for
Univision/iBiquity tried to put on a straight face when he/she/it shamelessly
shilled:

"dxAce" wrote in message
...


David ****elton Gleason, posing as 'Eduardo', the totally whacked boy from
Cleveland wrote:

"dxAce" wrote in message
...


Yes, one must remember it's not about the serious listening that
HD/IBOC
assumes, but rather the serious money that Edweenie and his minions
hope
to make
by selling an unsuspecting public something it doesn't really need.

Those of us in radio do not make any money from HD. In fact, it costs us
in
new equipment and the iBiquity license we have to pay for from now on.

What we get is the additional channel(s) on FM for additional formats,
improved AM and FM quality and an opportunity to prolong the life of
free,
terrestrial radio.

Interesting marketing concept! Declare that something is dying and then
offer up
a fix.

Free terrestrial radio is not dying. It is in, in marketing terms,
maturation and decline. Very old technology (90 years for AM, 60 years for
FM, 45 years for FM stereo) and is slowly losing users. While the impact is
not drastic for FM, yet, it is for AM, with essentially very few listeners
under age 45 and an average listener age that goes up every year.

Almost seem to be a protection racket of sorts.

No, it is a product enhancement to make it useful into the future.

As always, follow the $$$

HD costs money to radio stations, and any payback is more like insurance,
not a profit center.

You're ****ing retarded, Edweenie!

Telamon wrote:

In article ,
"David Eduardo" wrote:

"Telamon" wrote in message
...


Existing radios are 100% compatible, on both FM and AM.

The way AM and FM are listened to today, there is no loss by adding
HD as an alternative to analog.

Sorry David, IBOC is compatible, but not 100%, as the analog sidebands
are limited and adjacent channels have interference by the digital
sidebands.

As has been shown, even at FCC level, there is no significant usage of
stations adjacent to locals in each market. So there is no loss if there is
what ammounts to unmeasurable listening.

Again the marketing viewpoint. This isn't a radio marketing news group
it is a hobby news group where people listen for other reasons than
tuning in for the programming material. That is not to say that the
programming is not the reason as I have tuned in out of market stations
to get programs not offered in my area.

People reading this news group care and do listen to out of market
stations and that listening is degraded by IBOC. Logically, since this
listening exists and is degraded by IBOC then IBOC becomes incompatible.
The best that you can argue is that IBOC is mostly compatible but that
is not 100% by any means.

Some people including myself do not agree that the existing
level of compatibility is acceptable. If it was 100% nobody would be
complaining about it.

I don't hear listeners complaining. I hear mostly DXers whining.

You don't care about DXers in your job but you should posting to this
news group.

The greater good is trying to preserve the existing free terrestrial
broadcast system, which will not endure unless a digital alternative is
offered.

We got that through numerous posts you have made.

You have well explained the radio
station/marketing perspective on this but that does not change the
listening experience, which has limitations placed on it by IBOC over
the existing long time analog transmission scheme.

However, the only listening being disrupted is the potential to listen to
adjacents... something that, in practice, is just not done.

Well I hate to break it to you but listening to adjacent stations is
"done" by the people reading this news group. How many times does
someone have to post a complaint here that IBOC degrades their
reception? Please don't come back with the marketing perspective because
I get it already.

Oh he'll be back. He's getting paid to come back.

dxAce wrote:

David Frackelton Gleason, posing as 'Eduardo' well known fake Hispanic since
c.2000 and paid shill for Univision/iBiquity wrote:

"dxAce" wrote in message
...

Yes, one must remember it's not about the serious listening that HD/IBOC
assumes, but rather the serious money that Edweenie and his minions hope
to make
by selling an unsuspecting public something it doesn't really need.
Those of us in radio do not make any money from HD.

If you're not going to make any money from HD then why the hell do you spend a
good part of your day shilling for it?


Because he's going to make money from RADIO.


I mean, that's what HD is all about....keeping Radio profitable. If
HD benefits Radio, and he draws his paycheck from Radio, he makes money,
whether he gets paid by Ibiquity, or not.

I've worked with consultants in the 80's who had no financial ties to
CRL, who would permit nothing else in their Radio stations. They
benefitted through the increased profitability of the Radio stations
after the CRL hardware was installed. (Although, I've yet to see a knob
marked "Arbitron Share" on any transmitter processing device.)

And if the stations changed consultants, out came the CRL, and in
went the next processors du jour.

CRL faded when alternatives, with better, less crushing audio, came
about...and the loudness wars began to settle into uneasy truce. But
there are some consultants who still swear by CRL.

My last station, we finally ended that insanity, and went with Omnia
FM, that I acquired through a cashless deal with one of my equipment
suppliers outside of the stations supply chain. Omnia is so tuneable,
and so easily firmware upgraded, that it rendered most everything
undesirable for all the hassle.

That didn't keep our consultant from Bitching every day he was in
town about it. But, ****, we were top 3, and #1 in two dayparts, what's
he going to do?

Consultants are paid a retainer, and, depending on the contract, a
bonus pursuant to ratings performance. Many PD's and GM's are paid the
same way: According to performance, especially ratings improvements. But
also sales improvements like improved share conversion, increased
margins.... And most all of them have their pet gimmicks. Some it's
Selector. Some it's the latest computer networking solution. Some it's
audio processing, some the DAM system, some even get snippy about the
type, brand and model of the CD players in the dubbing suite. All with
no financial connections.

Right now the hot ticket is HD. AM or FM. (Which has all but wiped
out ALL AM listening at my home base...but **** me...I'm just an old
fart who sleeps with his dog...why would any radio station be interested
in me? Besides the disposable income, the freedom to spend it as I
please, and my wide ranging tastes, why bother to serve me? Or anyone in
my neighborhood? Or anyone within 10 miles of me?....but I'm no longer
served by Radio. So **** on me. But I digress....) And GM's, PD's
consultants, sales manglers are all signing on to HD....because they
believe it translates to future profits.

The most recent...what's the group, Bridge?....shows Radio revenues
off again this past quarter, alternatives coming on strong. Broadcast
companies are putting large resources behind alternative methods of
delivery, and non traditional revenue stream development, because it's
getting tougher to earn a buck with all the choices emerging.

Radio, in the face of this changing landscape, will do what Radio has
always done: Evolve to meet new market realties. It will surive by
changing. And what it may evolve into, it's very likely we wouldn't
recognize from where we are today. But it will survive, and HD is one,
ONLY one, of the paths influencing that evolution. Even as it trashes
the AM band for listeners in unusual circumstances like me and the
people in my community.

But there are multiple entities at each station signed on to HD.
Because it represents the possibility of future growth, and future
profitibility. Few, if any of them, draw a dime from Ibiquity.

More to topic, it's the same with DRM. There are stations worldwide
that have shown interest in supporting DRM, as the future of shortwave,
even as hit trashes the bands. Few of DRM's proponents draw
compensation from DRM.

That David works for/with/over/under/around/and though Univision (and
so did I for a brief time when they bought a TV station I was working)
and that Univision is a signatory to the Ibiquity agenda, and an
investor in Ibiquity as a company isn't really that big an issue. Many
companies own stock in Ibiquity. Few, if any of their employees benefit
financially from the position, given that almost none of the employees
of the larger media companies get bonuses when the company's holdings
return a dividend.

He's a corporate broadcaster. He's not saying anything here that I've
not heard from anyone I've ever worked with or for.

And I've disagreed with most of them. Personally, I'm thinking HD,
especially on AM is a gamble at best. A sentiment reflected in comments
from WGN's Cheap Engineer, who pulled the AM stereo, what now, 2 years
ago? 3? But hesitated installing HD because he wasn't sure it was 1) the
way to go, technically speaking, or 2) fiscally a responsible investment.

But like I said earlier this week: That I can no longer hear even
some of the big stations due to IBOC hash where I am in the far north
suburbs?...they don't care.

They don't have to.

Telamon wrote:

In article ,
dxAce wrote:

dxAce wrote:



David Frackelton Gleason, posing as 'Eduardo' since c.2000 and shameless
shill
wrote:

"RHF" wrote in message
ps.com...
Univision Sold for $13. Billion to a group of private investors.

http://www.hispanicbusiness.com/news...t=Headlines&mo
re=/news/more-news.asp

http://www.nydailynews.com/business/...p-362965c.html

~ RHF

$12.7 billion, including assumption of liabilities. And that news is OLD.

Hopefully they'll can your fake Hispanic ass!

Oh yeah, you must be one of those 'liabilities'.

LMFAO

You mean to say David Eduardo is worth 0.3 Billion?

Not by a long shot. But Univision obviously thinks his time is well spent shilling
here.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

D Peter Maus wrote:

dxAce wrote:

David Frackelton Gleason, posing as 'Eduardo' well known fake Hispanic since
c.2000 and paid shill for Univision/iBiquity wrote:

"dxAce" wrote in message
...

Yes, one must remember it's not about the serious listening that HD/IBOC
assumes, but rather the serious money that Edweenie and his minions hope
to make
by selling an unsuspecting public something it doesn't really need.
Those of us in radio do not make any money from HD.

If you're not going to make any money from HD then why the hell do you spend a
good part of your day shilling for it?


Because he's going to make money from RADIO.

I mean, that's what HD is all about....keeping Radio profitable. If
HD benefits Radio, and he draws his paycheck from Radio, he makes money,
whether he gets paid by Ibiquity, or not.

I've worked with consultants in the 80's who had no financial ties to
CRL, who would permit nothing else in their Radio stations. They
benefitted through the increased profitability of the Radio stations
after the CRL hardware was installed. (Although, I've yet to see a knob
marked "Arbitron Share" on any transmitter processing device.)

And if the stations changed consultants, out came the CRL, and in
went the next processors du jour.

CRL faded when alternatives, with better, less crushing audio, came
about...and the loudness wars began to settle into uneasy truce. But
there are some consultants who still swear by CRL.

My last station, we finally ended that insanity, and went with Omnia
FM, that I acquired through a cashless deal with one of my equipment
suppliers outside of the stations supply chain. Omnia is so tuneable,
and so easily firmware upgraded, that it rendered most everything
undesirable for all the hassle.

That didn't keep our consultant from Bitching every day he was in
town about it. But, ****, we were top 3, and #1 in two dayparts, what's
he going to do?

Consultants are paid a retainer, and, depending on the contract, a
bonus pursuant to ratings performance. Many PD's and GM's are paid the
same way: According to performance, especially ratings improvements. But
also sales improvements like improved share conversion, increased
margins.... And most all of them have their pet gimmicks. Some it's
Selector. Some it's the latest computer networking solution. Some it's
audio processing, some the DAM system, some even get snippy about the
type, brand and model of the CD players in the dubbing suite. All with
no financial connections.

Right now the hot ticket is HD. AM or FM. (Which has all but wiped
out ALL AM listening at my home base...but **** me...I'm just an old
fart who sleeps with his dog...why would any radio station be interested
in me? Besides the disposable income, the freedom to spend it as I
please, and my wide ranging tastes, why bother to serve me? Or anyone in
my neighborhood? Or anyone within 10 miles of me?....but I'm no longer
served by Radio. So **** on me. But I digress....) And GM's, PD's
consultants, sales manglers are all signing on to HD....because they
believe it translates to future profits.

The most recent...what's the group, Bridge?....shows Radio revenues
off again this past quarter, alternatives coming on strong. Broadcast
companies are putting large resources behind alternative methods of
delivery, and non traditional revenue stream development, because it's
getting tougher to earn a buck with all the choices emerging.

Radio, in the face of this changing landscape, will do what Radio has
always done: Evolve to meet new market realties. It will surive by
changing. And what it may evolve into, it's very likely we wouldn't
recognize from where we are today. But it will survive, and HD is one,
ONLY one, of the paths influencing that evolution. Even as it trashes
the AM band for listeners in unusual circumstances like me and the
people in my community.

But there are multiple entities at each station signed on to HD.
Because it represents the possibility of future growth, and future
profitibility. Few, if any of them, draw a dime from Ibiquity.

More to topic, it's the same with DRM. There are stations worldwide
that have shown interest in supporting DRM, as the future of shortwave,
even as hit trashes the bands. Few of DRM's proponents draw
compensation from DRM.

That David works for/with/over/under/around/and though Univision (and
so did I for a brief time when they bought a TV station I was working)
and that Univision is a signatory to the Ibiquity agenda, and an
investor in Ibiquity as a company isn't really that big an issue. Many
companies own stock in Ibiquity. Few, if any of their employees benefit
financially from the position, given that almost none of the employees
of the larger media companies get bonuses when the company's holdings
return a dividend.

He's a corporate broadcaster. He's not saying anything here that I've
not heard from anyone I've ever worked with or for.

And I've disagreed with most of them. Personally, I'm thinking HD,
especially on AM is a gamble at best. A sentiment reflected in comments
from WGN's Cheap Engineer, who pulled the AM stereo, what now, 2 years
ago? 3? But hesitated installing HD because he wasn't sure it was 1) the
way to go, technically speaking, or 2) fiscally a responsible investment.

But like I said earlier this week: That I can no longer hear even
some of the big stations due to IBOC hash where I am in the far north
suburbs?...they don't care.

They don't have to.

A pox on them all.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

dxAce wrote:

D Peter Maus wrote:

dxAce wrote:
David Frackelton Gleason, posing as 'Eduardo' well known fake Hispanic since
c.2000 and paid shill for Univision/iBiquity wrote:

"dxAce" wrote in message
...
Yes, one must remember it's not about the serious listening that HD/IBOC
assumes, but rather the serious money that Edweenie and his minions hope
to make
by selling an unsuspecting public something it doesn't really need.
Those of us in radio do not make any money from HD.
If you're not going to make any money from HD then why the hell do you spend a
good part of your day shilling for it?

Because he's going to make money from RADIO.

I mean, that's what HD is all about....keeping Radio profitable. If
HD benefits Radio, and he draws his paycheck from Radio, he makes money,
whether he gets paid by Ibiquity, or not.

I've worked with consultants in the 80's who had no financial ties to
CRL, who would permit nothing else in their Radio stations. They
benefitted through the increased profitability of the Radio stations
after the CRL hardware was installed. (Although, I've yet to see a knob
marked "Arbitron Share" on any transmitter processing device.)

And if the stations changed consultants, out came the CRL, and in
went the next processors du jour.

CRL faded when alternatives, with better, less crushing audio, came
about...and the loudness wars began to settle into uneasy truce. But
there are some consultants who still swear by CRL.

My last station, we finally ended that insanity, and went with Omnia
FM, that I acquired through a cashless deal with one of my equipment
suppliers outside of the stations supply chain. Omnia is so tuneable,
and so easily firmware upgraded, that it rendered most everything
undesirable for all the hassle.

That didn't keep our consultant from Bitching every day he was in
town about it. But, ****, we were top 3, and #1 in two dayparts, what's
he going to do?

Consultants are paid a retainer, and, depending on the contract, a
bonus pursuant to ratings performance. Many PD's and GM's are paid the
same way: According to performance, especially ratings improvements. But
also sales improvements like improved share conversion, increased
margins.... And most all of them have their pet gimmicks. Some it's
Selector. Some it's the latest computer networking solution. Some it's
audio processing, some the DAM system, some even get snippy about the
type, brand and model of the CD players in the dubbing suite. All with
no financial connections.

Right now the hot ticket is HD. AM or FM. (Which has all but wiped
out ALL AM listening at my home base...but **** me...I'm just an old
fart who sleeps with his dog...why would any radio station be interested
in me? Besides the disposable income, the freedom to spend it as I
please, and my wide ranging tastes, why bother to serve me? Or anyone in
my neighborhood? Or anyone within 10 miles of me?....but I'm no longer
served by Radio. So **** on me. But I digress....) And GM's, PD's
consultants, sales manglers are all signing on to HD....because they
believe it translates to future profits.

The most recent...what's the group, Bridge?....shows Radio revenues
off again this past quarter, alternatives coming on strong. Broadcast
companies are putting large resources behind alternative methods of
delivery, and non traditional revenue stream development, because it's
getting tougher to earn a buck with all the choices emerging.

Radio, in the face of this changing landscape, will do what Radio has
always done: Evolve to meet new market realties. It will surive by
changing. And what it may evolve into, it's very likely we wouldn't
recognize from where we are today. But it will survive, and HD is one,
ONLY one, of the paths influencing that evolution. Even as it trashes
the AM band for listeners in unusual circumstances like me and the
people in my community.

But there are multiple entities at each station signed on to HD.
Because it represents the possibility of future growth, and future
profitibility. Few, if any of them, draw a dime from Ibiquity.

More to topic, it's the same with DRM. There are stations worldwide
that have shown interest in supporting DRM, as the future of shortwave,
even as hit trashes the bands. Few of DRM's proponents draw
compensation from DRM.

That David works for/with/over/under/around/and though Univision (and
so did I for a brief time when they bought a TV station I was working)
and that Univision is a signatory to the Ibiquity agenda, and an
investor in Ibiquity as a company isn't really that big an issue. Many
companies own stock in Ibiquity. Few, if any of their employees benefit
financially from the position, given that almost none of the employees
of the larger media companies get bonuses when the company's holdings
return a dividend.

He's a corporate broadcaster. He's not saying anything here that I've
not heard from anyone I've ever worked with or for.

And I've disagreed with most of them. Personally, I'm thinking HD,
especially on AM is a gamble at best. A sentiment reflected in comments
from WGN's Cheap Engineer, who pulled the AM stereo, what now, 2 years
ago? 3? But hesitated installing HD because he wasn't sure it was 1) the
way to go, technically speaking, or 2) fiscally a responsible investment.

But like I said earlier this week: That I can no longer hear even
some of the big stations due to IBOC hash where I am in the far north
suburbs?...they don't care.

They don't have to.

A pox on them all.



ROFLMAO! If you only knew some of the people I've worked with, you'd
know how close to the bone that one really is.

Put an old timey Western ranch wooden post assembly by your antenna
(outside) and a sign that says,Lazy Ace.
cuhulin

"dxAce" wrote in message
...


David Eduardo, otherwise known as David Frackelton Gleason, spawn of the
Cuyahoga wrote:

"dxAce" wrote in message
...


Yes, one must remember it's not about the serious listening that
HD/IBOC
assumes, but rather the serious money that Edweenie and his minions
hope
to make
by selling an unsuspecting public something it doesn't really need.

Those of us in radio do not make any money from HD. In fact, it costs us
in
new equipment and the iBiquity license we have to pay for from now on.

No money? Univision owns part of iBiquity, does it not? So therefore
Univision
will be a beneficiary of those licensing fees and by extension, you,
Edweenie,
will also be a beneficiary!

The investments by the broadcasters are minor, and were kind of seed capital
to get the larger investment bankers and private capital sources to finance
the development of HD. The likelihood of any gain from this pales compared
to the cost of converting stations, developing second FM channels,
marketing, etc.