Brian wrote:
Mike Coslo wrote


I think this is one of those cases where some people think that their
membership is a subscription to QST. Its a lot more than that. ARRL does
a lot for Amateurs, even those who hate the organization.

- Mike KB3EIA -



Fair enough.

I dislike some of the policies that the ARRL has promoted in the past,
and felt as if the ARRL did not represent me even though I have been a
member since 1986.

Well, there you go! As a member, I'll pay a lot more attnetion to what
you have to say.

- Mike KB3EIA -

Mike Coslo wrote in message ...
Brian wrote:
Mike Coslo wrote


I think this is one of those cases where some people think that their
membership is a subscription to QST. Its a lot more than that. ARRL does
a lot for Amateurs, even those who hate the organization.

- Mike KB3EIA -



Fair enough.

I dislike some of the policies that the ARRL has promoted in the past,
and felt as if the ARRL did not represent me even though I have been a
member since 1986.

Well, there you go! As a member, I'll pay a lot more attnetion to what
you have to say.

- Mike KB3EIA -


Mike, don't let Dee hear you say that. ;^)

I must hold an official ARRL elected office to have any influence.

I wonder what elected office she holds in an effort to stem the tide of change?

"Brian" wrote in message
om...
Mike Coslo wrote in message
...
Brian wrote:
Mike Coslo wrote


I think this is one of those cases where some people think that their
membership is a subscription to QST. Its a lot more than that. ARRL
does
a lot for Amateurs, even those who hate the organization.

- Mike KB3EIA -



Fair enough.

I dislike some of the policies that the ARRL has promoted in the past,
and felt as if the ARRL did not represent me even though I have been a
member since 1986.

Well, there you go! As a member, I'll pay a lot more attnetion to what
you have to say.

- Mike KB3EIA -


Mike, don't let Dee hear you say that. ;^)

I must hold an official ARRL elected office to have any influence.


Not necessarily. You merely need to convince the majority that your view is
correct so that people who have the same agenda as you will be elected.

I wonder what elected office she holds in an effort to stem the tide of
change?

I choose to vote for officials who have the goals that I believe in. While
I disagree with the probable changes that are coming, they are not so
heinous that I see a need to rearrange my priorities to personally fight
them. They are changes I can live with should they come to pass.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

Dee D. Flint wrote:

"Brian" wrote in message
om...

Mike Coslo wrote in message

...

Brian wrote:

Mike Coslo wrote


I think this is one of those cases where some people think that their
membership is a subscription to QST. Its a lot more than that. ARRL

does

a lot for Amateurs, even those who hate the organization.

- Mike KB3EIA -



Fair enough.

I dislike some of the policies that the ARRL has promoted in the past,
and felt as if the ARRL did not represent me even though I have been a
member since 1986.

Well, there you go! As a member, I'll pay a lot more attnetion to what
you have to say.

- Mike KB3EIA -


Mike, don't let Dee hear you say that. ;^)

I must hold an official ARRL elected office to have any influence.



Not necessarily. You merely need to convince the majority that your view is
correct so that people who have the same agenda as you will be elected.

Good heavens. I appreciate that you believe that people should work for
what they believe in. But I can paraphrase what you are saying is that
if a person isn't willing to get heavily involved, then they are welcome
to shut up.

That isn't democracy, representative or otherwise, it's a virtual
dictatorship.

In my club, I listen to everyone. You would just listen to the other
board members.

I can imagine the response when someone wants to know where the money is
gone, and has some ideas on how it should be spent. I guess you would
tell them it isn't any of their business since they don't care to be a
member of the board?


I wonder what elected office she holds in an effort to stem the tide of

change?

I choose to vote for officials who have the goals that I believe in. While
I disagree with the probable changes that are coming, they are not so
heinous that I see a need to rearrange my priorities to personally fight
them. They are changes I can live with should they come to pass.

Sure. And that's fine. But you seem to be telling Brian that he can't
have his opinion. It may be stronger than your's but that's how some
people are.

- Mike KB3EIA -

"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
et...
Dee D. Flint wrote:

"Brian" wrote in message
om...

Mike Coslo wrote in message

...

Brian wrote:

Mike Coslo wrote


I think this is one of those cases where some people think that their
membership is a subscription to QST. Its a lot more than that. ARRL

does

a lot for Amateurs, even those who hate the organization.

- Mike KB3EIA -



Fair enough.

I dislike some of the policies that the ARRL has promoted in the past,
and felt as if the ARRL did not represent me even though I have been a
member since 1986.

Well, there you go! As a member, I'll pay a lot more attnetion to what
you have to say.

- Mike KB3EIA -


Mike, don't let Dee hear you say that. ;^)

I must hold an official ARRL elected office to have any influence.



Not necessarily. You merely need to convince the majority that your
view is
correct so that people who have the same agenda as you will be elected.

Good heavens. I appreciate that you believe that people should work for
what they believe in. But I can paraphrase what you are saying is that
if a person isn't willing to get heavily involved, then they are welcome
to shut up.

That isn't democracy, representative or otherwise, it's a virtual
dictatorship.

No that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying change doesn't happen without
work. Since Brian chooses only to complain and not dig in and do the work,
then he can't expect change. Brian's approach of changing because Brian
wants the change is the dictatorial approach.


In my club, I listen to everyone. You would just listen to the other
board members.


No, any dues paying member has a right to be heard. They just can't expect
change unless they do more. At the very least they need to convince other
club members and then bring it to a vote of the general membership. But
again this requires WORK.

I can imagine the response when someone wants to know where the money is
gone, and has some ideas on how it should be spent. I guess you would
tell them it isn't any of their business since they don't care to be a
member of the board?



All who pay dues have a right to examine the books. All who do not agree
with where the money is going have a right to bring it up in a general club
meeting and ask for a vote. But guess what. The latter two activities once
again require WORK.

I wonder what elected office she holds in an effort to stem the tide of

change?

I choose to vote for officials who have the goals that I believe in.
While
I disagree with the probable changes that are coming, they are not so
heinous that I see a need to rearrange my priorities to personally fight
them. They are changes I can live with should they come to pass.

Sure. And that's fine. But you seem to be telling Brian that he can't
have his opinion. It may be stronger than your's but that's how some
people are.

- Mike KB3EIA -


No Brian is welcome to his opinion. But if he isn't willing to do the work
to effect a change then he is being unrealistic in expecting that change to
come to pass. That is all. He wants things to change just by saying he
wants them to change. I am challenging that self-centered, simplistic, and
unrealistic expectation.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

"Dee D. Flint" wrote in message igy.com...

No that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying change doesn't happen without
work. Since Brian chooses only to complain and not dig in and do the work,
then he can't expect change. Brian's approach of changing because Brian
wants the change is the dictatorial approach.

Dictator Dee doth protestith too much.

I think I've been persuasive in my arguments with respect to changes
within the ARS. We've even got Hans discussing one full license class
w/o a Morse Code exam requirement, and a learners permit. Gee, where
have we heard that before?

No Brian is welcome to his opinion. But if he isn't willing to do the work
to effect a change then he is being unrealistic in expecting that change to
come to pass. That is all. He wants things to change just by saying he
wants them to change. I am challenging that self-centered, simplistic, and
unrealistic expectation.

No, Dee. Your self-centered, complex, and unrealistic expectation
that I lead a coup at the ARRL so that I can then have the ARRL effect
changes at the FCC is just not going to happen.

Ever heard of working smarter, not harder?

Brian is willing to do the work, but not the work that you have
demanded of me. Trying to change the ARRL is not my goal. They can
bumble along for another century if they so choose. And changing FCC
rules is not within the ability of the ARRL anyway. So where do you
think I've put my efforts?

You can try to maintain the ARRL status quo by spam-botting RRAP at
every opportunity, and I think you've got your work cut out for you.

I'll keep changing the ARS one amateur radio operator at a time.

FWIW, it seems to be working.

"Brian" wrote in message
om...
"Dee D. Flint" wrote in message
igy.com...

No that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying change doesn't happen without
work. Since Brian chooses only to complain and not dig in and do the
work,
then he can't expect change. Brian's approach of changing because Brian
wants the change is the dictatorial approach.

Dictator Dee doth protestith too much.

I think I've been persuasive in my arguments with respect to changes
within the ARS. We've even got Hans discussing one full license class
w/o a Morse Code exam requirement, and a learners permit. Gee, where
have we heard that before?

No Brian is welcome to his opinion. But if he isn't willing to do the
work
to effect a change then he is being unrealistic in expecting that change
to
come to pass. That is all. He wants things to change just by saying he
wants them to change. I am challenging that self-centered, simplistic,
and
unrealistic expectation.

No, Dee. Your self-centered, complex, and unrealistic expectation
that I lead a coup at the ARRL so that I can then have the ARRL effect
changes at the FCC is just not going to happen.

Ever heard of working smarter, not harder?

Brian is willing to do the work, but not the work that you have
demanded of me. Trying to change the ARRL is not my goal. They can
bumble along for another century if they so choose. And changing FCC
rules is not within the ability of the ARRL anyway. So where do you
think I've put my efforts?

You can try to maintain the ARRL status quo by spam-botting RRAP at
every opportunity, and I think you've got your work cut out for you.

I'll keep changing the ARS one amateur radio operator at a time.

FWIW, it seems to be working.

Sorry but haven't seen you change anyone here. From what I've seen, each
and every person here has there own opinion and continues to promote that
idea.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

"Brian" wrote

We've even got Hans discussing one full license class
w/o a Morse Code exam requirement, and a learners
permit. Gee, where have we heard that before?

Don't flatter yourself, Brian. I've been discussing that notion since the
mid 1960's when the FCC and ARRL were busy dreaming up their dis-incentive
licensing fiasco.

Sunuvagun, isn't it a shame I've spoiled another of your organ-grinder dance
tunes.

73, de Hans, K0HB